A list of already debunked theories, re: Sandy hook

Originally posted by vkey08
reply to post by DarKPenguiN

 

DP: remember one thing.. there is no official story yet, so questioning it is moot. How can you question that which isn't there?

- I am tired of repeating myself in every thread I am asked the same thing.
The lack of an official Story (almost 2 weeks in) s weird, no?

But my problems are on SOP not being followed. Too tired to go into it but here www.abovetopsecret.com... somewhere in there is a post I wrote with just a few of the (many)problems I have .

There is more but I am too tired.

I also respect anyone who disagrees with me and will converse with them civilly (hard to do now as I need sleep soon) but my point is about discussion not conclusions.

reply to post by DarKPenguiN


The SOP they are following here is the exact same SOP they followed with the Cheshire Home Invasion a few years back where 3 people were burned alive after being raped (one was 11, one was 13, one was the mother) in front of the husband/father.

We didn't hear an official explanation for 3 months after that and noone even batted an eyelash that it took so long, so to answer your question, no it is not strange for Connecticut to hold information until they are done with their investigation and not give much if any information out to the press.

So now they should change that just to satisfy ATS?

Civility is valued, but when we fail to question, we fall right into the hands of manipulators.

If someone were sinister enough to kill even one child to further an agenda, such an individual or organization would be relying on the the fact that we were collectively too civil to go down that road and entertain the possibility.

It cannot be questioned that this event is being used to further agendas after the fact. I was watching this event live as it unfolded and the media was talking gun control before they had announced any death totals. Using the line that "surely people would listen" now that kids were involved.

So since using the death of children for political purposes certainly isn't taboo to TPTB, is it an incredible leap to believe they might instigate the whole matter? My opinion is that we do these dead children a huge disservice if we don't pursue all possibilities.

And I will go back to an earlier post...what exactly are intelligence operatives if not "actors?" IF this event was carried out by some sort of government or pseudo-government operatives, then intelligence operatives or actors may have been part of the plot. I don't believe that this has been debunked, and I'm not sure how it can be, without painstakingly examining each individual player in this real life drama.

reply to post by notquitesure


The shear lunacy of the ’actor’ theory would require hundreds, if not thousands of people to be involved as whole generations of families are created and their timelines woven into the fabric of Newtown and across the world. It would mean that the family of one of the kids who died, Dylan Hockley, who live not far from me here in the UK are all ’part of the conspiracy’.

Those subscribing to this inane idea would have to buy into the notion that this has been in making for years. That the lives of those kids were all predestined to end in slaughter and the world timelines of all the people involved (thousands) were all crafted and essentially made up.

Originally posted by LarryLove
reply to post by notquitesure

 

The shear lunacy of the ’actor’ theory would require hundreds, if not thousands of people to be involved as whole generations of families are created and their timelines woven into the fabric of Newtown and across the world. It would mean that the family of one of the kids who died, Dylan Hockley, who live not far from me here in the UK are all ’part of the conspiracy’.

Those subscribing to this inane idea would have to buy into the notion that this has been in making for years. That the lives of those kids were all predestined to end in slaughter and the world timelines of all the people involved (thousands) were all crafted and essentially made up.

All due respect, but no it would not.

If you assume that the entire event is staged, then yes.

But if you entertain the notion that this was some sort of black operation, then a handful of the participants could be actors or agents, imbedded for some period of time, even years. These folks could have been there to participate in the event as well as to control the aftermath, along with the media (many of whom are likely agents themselves).

Hell yea Dis-informant's are always a good kick in the pants! Only give us more reason to NOT believe what you present. YOU have no proof behind your information presented, and are pointing the finger at us for not having ours all together?

I'm gonna kick back with my tin-foil hat and keep looking into things because the evidence you presented was rubbish.

OP:
"1) This happened:
NOPE IT DIDN'T HAPPEN BECAUSE I SAID SO. PREPOSTEROUS. "

reply to post by notquitesure


And I am guessing this is what you believe happened?

It may be months before there is an "official story" for this incident, true. We have some facts - there were a number of slain children and adults discovered in a Connecticut school. After that there are some operating theories authorities are using, mostly centering around the idea of a particular unstable individual going on a shooting rampage. With that we have many unanswered questions that could confirm or reject the theory and perhaps the media to blame for promulgating a number of inconsistencies. With the high-profile of this incident it is no wonder we now have a number of theorists putting forth alternatives to that operating theory of the local authorities investigating this incident.

I thank the good captain OP of this thread for his interest in the matter and his efforts to eliminate the theories that have been already debunked. He is also open to the idea that not all in this matter may be as tidy it some may wish to make it appear. Beyond the scope of his intent the dialog in this thread is exceeding those limits.

The gravity of the incident, along with its mournfully tragic aspects, are being played at all levels to bring about a dialog proposing to disarm America. The consequence of carrying out such action demands we do not accept any conclusions lightly nor act rashly in their behalf yet this incident alone could become the turning point for American liberty. How easily should we accept its early conclusions and possible consequences? Here in this thread we discard the rubbish, and it appears we cannot accept any findings outside those very early and basic facts. And we really have nothing substantial to add to them either.

I will repost, again, what I posted in other threads dealing with Sandy Hook, because I want in know how I -- one of the chief architects of what ATS is today -- thinks of our membership in respect to the subject:

The Tragedy at Sandy Hook

HAS BROUGHT OUT THE WORST

of AboveTopSecret.com


I and our staff have witnessed the most incredible shameless self-absorbed credulous nonsense from our members following one of the worst horrors ever to hit a small community -- much less any community.

And this thread is the absolute worst display of your ludicrous narcissistic conjecture -- outing personal details of a private citizen and mocking him on the pages of our precious ATS for the world to see.


You should be ashamed -- but clearly, you're not capable of that.

This site, and its discussion board, was refashioned between 2003 and 2005 to hold conspiracy speculation to a higher standard and ideal than the typical mayhem and lunacy that was then popular throughout Internet communities dealing with similar subject matter. Our motto of "Deny Ignorance" was a call to action to be skeptical critical thinkers with regard to official stories and the ever worsening mass media. We took a great deal of flak, absorbed consistent criticism, and often saw ourselves smeared simply for holding to our ideals that these subjects deserve better of us. ATS management and staff held strong, never wavered, and grew to one of the most popular discussion boards of any topic.

The wildly foolish self-absorbed conjecture regarding the massacre in Newtown, CT has, in my opinion, thrown the quality of conversation on ATS all the way back to how horrible it was before we started our 6 years of hard work. Posting personal information of private citizens, then casting nasty aspersions on them, is the lowest of lows I've ever seen on this site for which I was once proud.


Those who have the urge to speculate on the minute oddities of the "story line" as is currently known should take fair warning that if the ethical quality of the discussion does not immediately improve, the staff will have no choice but to place a temporary hold on all discussions related to the massacre.

The staff and I will not let you ruin our years of hard work and suffer your ridiculousness.

Well said! inho the hammer needs to fall. I have avoided all threads about the tragedy, except for one to express horror.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
I will repost, again, what I posted in other threads dealing with Sandy Hook, because I want in know how I -- one of the chief architects of what ATS is today -- thinks of our membership in respect to the subject:

The Tragedy at Sandy Hook

HAS BROUGHT OUT THE WORST

of AboveTopSecret.com


I and our staff have witnessed the most incredible shameless self-absorbed credulous nonsense from our members following one of the worst horrors ever to hit a small community -- much less any community.

And this thread is the absolute worst display of your ludicrous narcissistic conjecture -- outing personal details of a private citizen and mocking him on the pages of our precious ATS for the world to see.


You should be ashamed -- but clearly, you're not capable of that.

This site, and its discussion board, was refashioned between 2003 and 2005 to hold conspiracy speculation to a higher standard and ideal than the typical mayhem and lunacy that was then popular throughout Internet communities dealing with similar subject matter. Our motto of "Deny Ignorance" was a call to action to be skeptical critical thinkers with regard to official stories and the ever worsening mass media. We took a great deal of flak, absorbed consistent criticism, and often saw ourselves smeared simply for holding to our ideals that these subjects deserve better of us. ATS management and staff held strong, never wavered, and grew to one of the most popular discussion boards of any topic.

The wildly foolish self-absorbed conjecture regarding the massacre in Newtown, CT has, in my opinion, thrown the quality of conversation on ATS all the way back to how horrible it was before we started our 6 years of hard work. Posting personal information of private citizens, then casting nasty aspersions on them, is the lowest of lows I've ever seen on this site for which I was once proud.


Those who have the urge to speculate on the minute oddities of the "story line" as is currently known should take fair warning that if the ethical quality of the discussion does not immediately improve, the staff will have no choice but to place a temporary hold on all discussions related to the massacre.

The staff and I will not let you ruin our years of hard work and suffer your ridiculousness.

You are the owners and can dictate what you want on your own site, but if you feel the need to restrict certain discussions on subject matter, then you should just close all threads that deal with that subject matter.

Originally posted by MidnightTide
You are the owners and can dictate what you want on your own site, but if you feel the need to restrict certain discussions on subject matter, then you should just close all threads that deal with that subject matter.

I think it would be better if we tried a little of the critical thinking that SO was talking about. No one is saying don't question anything, they're saying "use your head". Earlier in the thread I saw a poster claim that the facebook url mystery was yet unsolved. Sounds compelling, so I took 5 seconds, looked it up, and guess what? It was patently false. The poster had obviously not done even the slightest bit of research into the topic, they just blindly started repeating something they heard. From someone.

I don't pretend to know what the owners think or want, but besides leaking personal info and mudslinging (shame on anyone who participated in that) if I had to wager a guess, it would be that type of behavior that they are looking to put an end to.

reply to post by captaintyinknots


You did a terrible job debunking these 'theories'. You just inserted your own opinion or made the opposite claim. This debunked nothing. If you're going to attempt to counter compiled evidence, compile evidence of your own. Don't just say, "that's impossible, that's unlikely, that didn't happen".

Sandy Hook looks like a cover up to me. I am very afraid that these ignorant people are OKAY with being kept in the dark. How can you justify information being withheld? "It's sensitive." "They have to investigate it first."

When did keeping America in the dark become the precedent? When did it become the norm? An open flow of information is necessary on all ends for situations like this

Originally posted by MidnightTide
You are the owners and can dictate what you want on your own site, but if you feel the need to restrict certain discussions on subject matter, then you should just close all threads that deal with that subject matter.

I think what he's referring to, and he can correct me if I am wrong is the blatant horrific statements by people on here that some of the parents must be actors because they didn't look perfectly anguished, or like one person had suggested that the ME was on heroin because he was really shaken up by the sight of 18 dead children, stuff like that is very upsetting to us here in Connecticut that are trying to cope with and deal with the aftermath of this..

reply to post by MidnightTide


I don't know if they want to restrict subject matter as much as they want to restore civility to the discussions. Apparently personal information of victims has been shared, that's a no go. I read yesterday that there were some that were saying that the parents "aren't grieving correctly"—that's silly.

The staff wants such subject matter to go away. Those are the sorts of comments and actions that make the general public scoff at conspiracy theorists. Being completely honest seeing the way things have been going with big events within the last year or so here on ATS, I sadly expected that such nonsense would pop up on the site.

boyy

have i missed something?

arnt most threads about gun ownership???

i dont think iv seen one actually about the massacre!!

but i hate to guess what some people have been saying

anyway..merry christmas,,,,god bless the fallen

peace

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Sorry my post appears to have prompted your warning. Or just poor juxtapositioning??

Then I suggest modifying the TOS (I know reddit will not allow the posting of personal information), notify the membership then start moderating the threads and issue bans / deletion of posts.


reply to post by octotom


ATS, like any other internet / conspiracy community is going to have a wide range of personalities. Try at best to administrate it.

Dear SkepticOverlord:

Thank you sir for the U2U. Dont count all of us in this. Many like myself have avoided all comment and opinions on this subject for the most obvious of reasons.

We too are saddened that this has transpired the way it has at ATS. Still, we support you and ATS and it's integrity. Please dont blame us all for the actions of some.

You and your direction are much appreciated! Thanks for being there for us all...Mysterioustranger

Originally posted by MidnightTide
Then I suggest modifying the TOS (I know reddit will not allow the posting of personal information), notify the membership then start moderating the threads and issue bans / deletion of posts.


reply to post by octotom

 

ATS, like any other internet / conspiracy community is going to have a wide range of personalities. Try at best to administrate it.

edit on 25-12-2012 by MidnightTide because: (no reason given)

No modification of the T&C is needed. This part has always been there since before I was a member:

15). Posting: You will not Post any material that is knowingly false, misleading, or inaccurate. You will not solicit personal information from any member. You will not use information gathered from this website to harass, abuse or harm other people.