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Should Puerto Rico be allowed to Vote?

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posted on Oct, 25 2004 @ 12:33 PM
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Puerto Rico is not a state of the union but if allowed to be would be the 23rd most populous state in between Alabama and Kentucky. Puerto Rico has no voice in the upcoming election. Puerto Rico has suffered 20 casualties in the war on Iraq and Afghanistan yet still does not have the right to vote. Bear in mind that Puerto Ricans pay no federal tax yet benefit from govermental programs including welfare and social security.

So bottom line is that Puerto Rico is not a state and thus does not have the right to vote. But should they?


www.letpuertoricodecide.com...
geography.about.com...
www.englishfirst.org...



posted on Oct, 25 2004 @ 12:43 PM
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*looks around for Ocelot*


Honestly, I think they should be allowed. If policy from Washington affect Puerto Ricans, why shouldn't they have a say in the proccess?



posted on Oct, 25 2004 @ 12:58 PM
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Originally posted by BlackJackal
Puerto Rico is not a state of the union but if allowed to be would be the 23rd most populous state in between Alabama and Kentucky. Puerto Rico has no voice in the upcoming election. Puerto Rico has suffered 20 casualties in the war on Iraq and Afghanistan yet still does not have the right to vote.

Porto Rico has consistently and repeatedly rejected attaining the right to vote and become a state. There is no way it should be allowed to participate in elections. Only states should be allowed, not territories.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 10:42 AM
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Originally posted by intrepid
*looks around for Ocelot*


Honestly, I think they should be allowed. If policy from Washington affect Puerto Ricans, why shouldn't they have a say in the proccess?


*flies in at Blinding speed* SWOOOOOSSSHHHHH!!!!!

Ok Im here.
Frankly I think Puerto Rico should have a say as to who becomes president due to the simple fact that we send our men and women to fight in your wars. So Puerto Ricans are good enough to defend your country but not good enough to choose your president?



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 10:46 AM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
Porto Rico has consistently and repeatedly rejected attaining the right to vote and become a state. There is no way it should be allowed to participate in elections. Only states should be allowed, not territories.


It's not Porto Rico it's Puerto Rico
. Porto Rico was the Old name.

Anyways I understand were your coming from and it's true. The last time puerto ricans had a chance to decided to become a state the majority of the population voted against it.

[edit on 27-10-2004 by Ocelot]



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 10:47 AM
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Not yet...

I think they should be made a "state" if you will, and then could be allowed to particpate in the elections.....

However, I learned something today... I did not know the full relationship of the United States with P.R. they get our welfare and SS .. hmmm

Maybe they should have a vote.....



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 10:55 AM
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We went to war with England over taxation without representation.

Puerto Ricans do not pay taxes, hence no voting.

Plain and simple.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 10:56 AM
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~~

What about a 'non-binding vote'

similar to a poll or a popularity contest?

just to see- where they stand-, and to familiarize
the citizenry with national election cycles...

~~




posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:01 AM
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Brief History of US and Puerto Rico
USA Seizes Puerto Rico

Puerto Rico, by royal decree, was granted autonomy on November 28,1897. The Charter of Autonomy granted Puerto Rico more autonomy than ever before in the history of Puerto Rico. Puerto Rico elected delegates to both houses of the Spanish Courts. Puerto Ricans elected 35 members of the local house of representatives also 8 of 15 members of the local Administration Council. Local legislature set its own budget and taxes. They accepted or rejected commercial treaties concluded by Spain.

General elections were held in March and on July 17,1898 Puerto Rico's autonomous government began to function, but not for long. The Spanish American War broke out in April of 1898. On July 25,1898 Puerto Rico was invaded by the USA. General Nelson A. Miles and 16,000 American troops came in through Guanica located on the island's southwestern shore. The Americans found little opposition. The Spanish forces soon retreated and on October 18, 1898 Puerto Rico's autonomous government was officially changed to an American military government. General John Brooke became the first American governor of Puerto Rico.

The Spanish American War officially ended on December 10, 1898. The Treaty of Paris stated that Spain was to cede Puerto Rico, Guam and Philippines to the USA. Cuba would become a protectorate of the USA.

The military government lasted two years. On May 1, 1900 the US government approved the Foraker Law which changed the military government to a civil government. Under this new government the governor, his cabinet and Higher House of Delegates (something like a senate) were appointed by the President of the USA and approved by the American legislature. A 35 member Local House of Delegates was elected by popular vote. Also Puerto Ricans voted for a Resident Commissioner who represented Puerto Rico in the US House of Representatives but had no vote. Puerto Ricans were distressed with this new government. After having been granted autonomy by Spain, Puerto Rico had now taken a step back to colonialism. The discontent was such that in 1909 the House of Delegates refused to pass any bills.

On March 2, 1917 President Woodrow Wilson signed the Jones Law. This law granted Puerto Ricans American citizenship. Also the Jones Law granted such freedoms as liberty of speech, freedom of press, presumption of innocence until proven guilty, the right to a trial before being incarcerated and more. Also it created a Senate of 19 senators and a 39 member House of Representatives which was elected by popular vote. The governor was still appointed by President of the USA. The appointed Governor, the President or the US Congress could veto any law approved by the Puerto Rican Congress. Also Puerto Ricans were now eligible to serve in the American Armed Forces. Puerto Ricans took a major role in all of the USA military conflicts from then on.

The Commonwealth Of Puerto Rico

By 1930 the population in Puerto Rico had grown to more than 1.5 million. Many people still lived in "bohios" (aborigines style huts) and there was a lot of poverty and unemployment. Large US corporations bought most of the flat land in Puerto Rico which was used for the sugar industry. Salaries were very low.
In 1928 Puerto Rico was hit by Hurricane San Felipe, in 1932 it was Hurricane San Cipriano. Many people died, others were left homeless. Most of the sugar, coffee, tobacco and other crops were lost.

In reaction to all the poverty and the American presence the ideal of independence began to grow. Dr. Pedro Albizu Campos, a Harvard graduate who had studied chemical engineering, military sciences, philosophy, law and an X-US military officer, was elected President of the Puerto Rican Nationalist Party. Clashes between protesting Nationalist and police brought deaths to both sides but mostly to Nationalists. Dr. Pedro Albizu Campos was sentenced to jail.
On March 21, 1937, Palm Sunday, the Nationalist Party was to celebrate a march in Ponce (city on the southern coast of the island) in support of Puerto Rican independence. The activity had been authorized by the mayor, but suddenly, pressured by the police chief, he canceled the authorization. The Nationalist decided to go on with the march. Police surrounded the Nationalist and right when the march was to begin there were gun shots. It is not known who shot that first shot, but the toll of the shootout was 18 Nationalist and 2 policemen dead. 200 people, Nationalist and bystanders, were injured. This incident is known as "The Ponce Massacre".

In 1940, headed by Luis Mu�oz Marin, the Popular Democratic Party was formed. Their logo was Bread, Land and Liberty. Although the party favored independence, the need for social and economic reform was the priority, the status was not an issue. In 1946, the Puerto Rico Independence Party was formed by dissidents who saw the Popular Democratic Party shifting away from the ideal of independence for Puerto Rico. Also that same year Harry S. Truman appointed the first Puerto Rican governor, Jesus T. Pi�eiro.

In 1947 the US Congress passed a bill which established that Puerto Ricans could vote every 4 years for governor of the island.

In 1948 the Popular Democratic Party received 64% of the vote and Mu�oz Marin became the first democratically elected governor. After much debate, on July 3, 1950 the federal Government approved the 600 Law authorizing Puerto Rico to draft it's own constitution. The Puerto Rican Constitution was drafted and a referendum was celebrated for approval by the Puerto Rican people. 81% of the voters voted in favor. Afterwards the USA made some changes and approved the Puerto Rican Constitution. On July 25, 1952 the "Estado Libre Asociado" or Commonwealth of Puerto Rico was officially implemented and inaugurated by Governor Luis Mu�oz Marin.

In 1950 though, Nationalist, believed that the "Estado Libre Asociado" was really a colony in disguise. In an attempt to stop the creation of the new government they attacked "La Fortaleza" (the Governors Mansion). In the town of Jayuya the police station was attacked and burnt down. In the town of Utuado, Nationalist used a house as a fort and resisted the Puerto Rico National Guard which had been called out by the Governor Mu�oz Marin. Other suicide attacks took place in other parts of the island. Two days later Nationalist attacked President Truman's home, the Blair House in Washington DC. 14 Nationalist, 4 policemen, one National Guardsman and 4 civilians were killed and around 50 people were wounded before the National Guard took control of the situation. Finally four years later in a suicidal attempt to get the attention of the world, Nationalist attacked the House of Representatives in Washington DC. No one was killed, but five Congressmen were wounded. All of the attackers were arrested and sentenced to long prison terms.

During the years that Mu�oz Marin was in power, he took on the task of developing Puerto Rico's economy into an industrial economy. The infrastructure was improved through government agencies. Tax breaks were offered to companies that would establish themselves on the island. The result was the industrial Puerto Rico of today.

In 1964, after 4 terms and 16 years, Governor Mu�oz Marin decided to step down. Once again that year The Popular Democratic Party won the elections but this time Roberto S�nchez Vilella was elected Governor of Puerto Rico. In 1967 the people of Puerto Rico voted between Statehood, Commonwealth and Independence, resulting in an overwhelming preference for the Commonwealth option.

General elections were held in March and on July 17,1898 Puerto Rico's autonomous government began to function, but not for long. The Spanish American War broke out in April of 1898. On July 25,1898 Puerto Rico was invaded by the USA. General Nelson A. Miles and 16,000 American troops came in through Guanica located on the island's southwestern shore. The Americans found little opposition. The Spanish forces soon retreated and on October 18, 1898 Puerto Rico's autonomous government was officially changed to an American military government. General John Brooke became the first American governor of Puerto Rico.

The Spanish American War officially ended on December 10, 1898. The Treaty of Paris stated that Spain was to cede Puerto Rico, Guam and Philippines to the USA. Cuba would become a protectorate of the USA.

The military government lasted two years. On May 1, 1900 the US government approved the Foraker Law which changed the military government to a civil government. Under this new government the governor, his cabinet and Higher House of Delegates (something like a senate) were appointed by the President of the USA and approved by the American legislature. A 35 member Local House of Delegates was elected by popular vote. Also Puerto Ricans voted for a Resident Commissioner who represented Puerto Rico in the US House of Representatives but had no vote. Puerto Ricans were distressed with this new government. After having been granted autonomy by Spain, Puerto Rico had now taken a step back to colonialism. The discontent was such that in 1909 the House of Delegates refused to pass any bills.

On March 2, 1917 President Woodrow Wilson signed the Jones Law. This law granted Puerto Ricans American citizenship. Also the Jones Law granted such freedoms as liberty of speech, freedom of press, presumption of innocence until proven guilty, the right to a trial before being incarcerated and more. Also it created a Senate of 19 senators and a 39 member House of Representatives which was elected by popular vote. The governor was still appointed by President of the USA. The appointed Governor, the President or the US Congress could veto any law approved by the Puerto Rican Congress. Also Puerto Ricans were now eligible to serve in the American Armed Forces. Puerto Ricans took a major role in all of the USA military conflicts from then on.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


[edit on 27-10-2004 by Ocelot]



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:12 AM
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Let me see if I got this right.

You pay no federal taxes and you get the majority of the benefits of being US citizens and that is still not enough for you?

Are you kidding me?

Time to put it to a vote again as to whether or not they want to be a state. My guess is that they will vote no again.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:18 AM
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Originally posted by COOL HAND
Time to put it to a vote again as to whether or not they want to be a state. My guess is that they will vote no again.


Well you guess right. But even if we voted 'yes' to become a state in a plebiscite that still doesn't guarantee that we will become a state. You still need approval from the US Congress and The President of the United States which I don't think we would get anyways since they view us as their bastard child.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:23 AM
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Originally posted by Ocelot
Ok Im here.
Frankly I think Puerto Rico should have a say as to who becomes president due to the simple fact that we send our men and women to fight in your wars. So Puerto Ricans are good enough to defend your country but not good enough to choose your president?


That's the dumbest thing that I have ever heard here.

So what your saying is Puerto Ricans are good enough to take our federal dollars but not good enough to pay federal taxes?



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:23 AM
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Personally I think Puerto Rico should get full independence and create their own economy like the Bahamas, or any of the other islands surrounding the US and Latin America.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:26 AM
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Originally posted by Ocelot
Well you guess right. But even if we voted 'yes' to become a state in a plebiscite that still doesn't guarantee that we will become a state. You still need approval from the US Congress and The President of the United States which I don't think we would get anyways since they view us as their bastard child.


Why would they say no to another source of taxable income?

Would a person who claims residency status in Peurto Rico have to pay federal taxes if they move to the states, while keeping the residency in Peurto Rico?



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:27 AM
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Originally posted by COOL HAND
That's the dumbest thing that I have ever heard here.

So what your saying is Puerto Ricans are good enough to take our federal dollars but not good enough to pay federal taxes?


No I think I've actually seen you post dumber stuff COOL HAND.

You have no idea what the federal government does in this island, so dont lecture me on stuff you know nothing about first of all.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:29 AM
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Originally posted by COOL HAND
Would a person who claims residency status in Peurto Rico have to pay federal taxes if they move to the states, while keeping the residency in Peurto Rico?


I Lived in the States for two years and yes we had to pay Federal Taxes while we were living over there.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:35 AM
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Originally posted by Ocelot
No I think I've actually seen you post dumber stuff COOL HAND.


Really, where???



You have no idea what the federal government does in this island, so dont lecture me on stuff you know nothing about first of all.


How do you know I know nothing about it?

Hate to tell you but I have been stationed there. I know exactly what the federal government does on that island.



[edit on 27/10/04 by COOL HAND]



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:36 AM
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From my understanding, any individual from any of the territories that serves four years of federal service is granted U.S. Citizenship and therefore has earned the right to vote. Which from asking voting officers here at my unit, they can do while even having a home of record in Puerto Rico.



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:36 AM
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2 points. First(for Ocelot)- Is PR capable of self sufficiency? Therefore not needing a federal tax.

Second(for everyone else)- If policy coming out of Washington dictates PR policy, why shouldn't they have a say in it?



posted on Oct, 27 2004 @ 11:38 AM
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Originally posted by COOL HAND
BTW do you have Alex Ross's Permisssion to use one of his drawings for your Avatar?


I don't think he'd mind as I've put plenty of money in his pocket by buying his work.



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