Do we live in a computer simulation? researchers say idea can be tested!

reply to post by Itisnowagain


In quantum biology the suggestion is that our memories are probably stored outside our brains.

Since the structure of spacetime geometry - what emptiness is made of - is kind of holographic, by quantum processes our retina and brain are able to access and connect to the essential qualities of the rose so that we have it in our head. By quantum processes we have the experience of redness, we have the smell, and we have the essential qualities. Because spacetime is sort of holographic, we're able to access it via quantum processes inside our brain.

Another article that brings us closer to the fact this all could be true..

Is consciousness connected to the fine structure of the universe?

reply to post by 0bserver1


While I think it's a very real possibility we live in a simulation, it's still a very low possibility imo. The reason I think this, is because our Universe is so enormous. Mind numbingly enormous. And every single atom in the Universe is extremely complex. To simulate every single atom in a single living cell with real physics, requires a computer 1000x more powerful than the most powerful supercomputer on Earth. Imagine trying to simulate a whole person, or the entire planet, or even our entire solar system, or our entire galaxy. The amount of power required to achieve such a feat is beyond comprehension... let alone trying to simulate the entire Universe.

Don't even try to imagine how much power that would require because I can tell you that none of us here have the ability to comprehend how much computing power that would require. We have trouble even comprehending the distance to the nearest star in our own galaxy, or the distance between our galaxy and the nearest galaxy. Keep in mind there are billions of galaxies in our Universe. In fact the Universe may be infinite for all we know, we can only see so far, and no matter how far we look there appears to be no end. These facts lead me to believe we are in a "genuine" Universe, and not a simulated one. But I'm not completely convinced either way.

i don't think so...any sim WOULDN'T allow self realization, because of the chance of a non-programmed change to the simulation itself, in other words, it defeats it's own existance.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder

Two things in response to your post. First, size is a matter of perception, and we know how our brains deceive us. Second, computing power is nothing for something operating on the quantum level.

reply to post by 0bserver1


A thought that appears could be called memory but it can only appear presently. Can you tell me what your next thought will be?
It is a common belief that the brain is a storeroom. But has anyone ever seen this 'storeroom'?
Thoughts just happen, they just appear. No one can stop thoughts appearing.

The appearance is just appearing like the scenery in a computer game.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder

To simulate every single atom in a single living cell with real physics, requires a computer 1000x more powerful than the most powerful supercomputer on Earth.

But doesn't "real physics" basically break down to light waves?
(Where did you get 1000x, by the way?)

I do find it interesting that time slows down near gravitational fields, much like a computer slows down when trying to render objects.

Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
reply to post by 0bserver1

 

While I think it's a very real possibility we live in a simulation, it's still a very low possibility imo. The reason I think this, is because our Universe is so enormous. Mind numbingly enormous. And every single atom in the Universe is extremely complex. To simulate every single atom in a single living cell with real physics, requires a computer 1000x more powerful than the most powerful supercomputer on Earth. Imagine trying to simulate a whole person, or the entire planet, or even our entire solar system, or our entire galaxy. The amount of power required to achieve such a feat is beyond comprehension... let alone trying to simulate the entire Universe.

Don't even try to imagine how much power that would require because I can tell you that none of us here have the ability to comprehend how much computing power that would require. We have trouble even comprehending the distance to the nearest star in our own galaxy, or the distance between our galaxy and the nearest galaxy. Keep in mind there are billions of galaxies in our Universe. In fact the Universe may be infinite for all we know, we can only see so far, and no matter how far we look there appears to be no end. These facts lead me to believe we are in a "genuine" Universe, and not a simulated one. But I'm not completely convinced either way.

edit on 11/12/2012 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)

Interestingly, your points for not believing are weak from a computer science perspective. I'm not saying I believe in simulation theory, but the problems you mentioned are not problems we've encountered (i.e., barriers to this theory). I am sure you are familiar with Moore's Law thus far and also the potential of quantum computing wrt performance.

Lastly, complex and amazing things can come from simple rule-based cause and effect. In video games, many of my favorite games are the ones that generate "water cooler stories", emergent-gameplay experiences (often the result of the exponential blowup of the interaction of only a handful of simple rules).

Imagine if there is a uinifying theory of everything, as many physicists seek. Would be rather easy to build a simulation from it. Even without such a theory, there are no known limits to simulation.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder

These facts lead me to believe we are in a "genuine" Universe, and not a simulated one. But I'm not completely convinced either way

That I also do hope the tests will result , but sometimes it seems that unexplained things that are happening within our universe, seems so , like flaws in the system. Like maybe the weird sounds in the sky, and the weird hexacon on Saturn and many more stuff like that?

reply to post by PrplHrt

Second, computing power is nothing for something operating on the quantum level.

That's a reasonable point, however if our Universe is a simulation, you have to imagine quantum physics as part of the simulation, and not necessarily something that applies to the "real world". But quantum computers still have their limits, and at this point it's not even perfectly clear whether quantum computers can really do what we expect of them. But the reason I said I'm still not convinced either way, is because of unknown factors which could be game changers, like quantum computers.


reply to post by DeReK DaRkLy

But doesn't "real physics" basically break down to light waves?
(Where did you get 1000x, by the way?)

A lot of it breaks down to light waves, not all of it. But that's irrelevant. And to answer your next question:

The next ORNL supercomputer is to be an exascale, meaning it will be a thousand times more powerful than Titan and capable of doing one quintillion calculations per second. A mindboggling quintillion is a one with 18 zeroes after it. Exascale power is supposed to “provide enough power to simulate every single atom in a whole living cell,” Smith explained.

Meet the fastest, most powerful science machine in the world: Titan supercomputer

reply to post by PrplHrt

size is a matter of perception, and we know how our brains deceive us

The physical size is only relevant to help understand the informational size, and that's what is really important.

Perhaps yours will take off more. So rather than rewrite my posts, will link the thread I started yesterday on a science article.

www.abovetopsecret.com...
The World Is Similar To A Web Page!

www.bottomlayer.com...
A Cybernetic Interpretation of Quantum Mechanics

Relating to the Double Slit experiment, it could be said that all the digital information exists in wave form, but only as we attend to it, does the wave collapse into the pixels, and particles that create images, words, textures, sound and the world around us emerges. So its like opening a web page, the rest is stored information. Earth is already akin to a web page open that we are all joining on in, like entering into a movie already playing.

You havent read my Iridium Thread have you?

To add. Theres a supercomputer called Bluewater supercomputer. pointing.

www.bottomlayer.com...

The computer analogy. The non-locality which appears to be a basic feature of our world also finds an analogy in the same metaphor of a computer simulation. In terms of cosmology, the scientific question is, "How can two particles separated by half a universe be understood as connected such that they interact as though they were right on top of each other?" If we analogize to a computer simulation, the question would be, "How can two pictures at the far corners of the screen be understood as connected such that the distance between them is irrelevant?"

In fact, the measured distance between any two pixels (dots) on the monitor's display turns out to be entirely irrelevant, since both are merely the products of calculations carried out in the bowels of the computer as directed by the programming. The pixels may be as widely separated as you like, but the programming generating them is forever embedded in the computer's memory in such a way that -- again speaking quite literally -- the very concept of separation in space and time of the pixels has no meaning whatsoever for the stored information......



The final computer analogy. An example which literally fits this description is the computer simulation, which is a graphic representation created by executing programming code. The programming code itself consists of nothing but symbols, such as 0 and 1. Numbers, text, graphics and anything else you please are coded by unique series of numbers. These symbolic codes have no meaning in themselves, but arbitrarily are assigned values which have significance according to the operations of the computer. The symbols are manipulated according to the various step-by-step sequences (algorithms) by which the programming instructs the computer how to create the graphic representation. The picture presented on-screen to the user is a world executed in colored dots; the computer's programming is a world (the same world) executed in symbols. Anyone who has experienced a computer crash knows that the programming (good or bad) governs the picture, and not vice versa. All of this forms a remarkably tight analogy to the relationship between the quantum math on paper, and the behavior of the "quantumstuff" in the outside world.

This makes sense of a lot of data, including entanglement theory. For instead of two particles communicating, it would be more akin to the pixels in a picture, programmed to unfold, communicating or being cooperative.

reply to post by Unity_99


Well then I think I'm the main actor , thats of course from my point of view .. .....aaaaaaand it's a wrap!

Computer programmers, question. How do you make the cursor appear on the left side of the screen after disappearing off the right?

If the universe is a simulation we should be able to apply this bit of programming to travel to the other side of it.

Originally posted by 0bserver1
reply to post by Unity_99

 

Well then I think I'm the main actor , thats of course from my point of view ..

.....aaaaaaand it's a wrap!

You might 'think' you are the actor but really you just see the movie moving.
You might 'think' you are the 'thinker' but really thoughts just appear.
What you really are is the screen on with it all appears.

reply to post by PrplHrt


Only if the universe is based on Asteroids. :-P

There would be wrap or an edge (bounds) or instant deallocation into a pool at some point. :-)

Actually, I take that back, there are ways to do it without an edge, but there would still be limits regarding precision and performance bounds that would probably be discoverable.

Is therefore the programmer of this "simulation" a man living in his parents basement?

Simulations are simulations of reality, not reality itself. Simulations exist on computers, not anywhere else. Computers are made by man, not by anyone else. This whole idea is still the idea of intelligent design, only greatly exaggerated for modern understanding.

God is now a computer programmer? What was he before computers were conceived?

The simulation theory defies all logic. We know for fact that we exist outside of computers. We know for fact that we invented computers. We know for fact that we invented simulations. We know for fact that computers cannot harbour life. We know for fact that computers cannot create life. We know that only man puts data into computers. We know only man can program and write simulations. So therefore, the world is a computer simulation? What?

Originally posted by PrplHrt
Computer programmers, question. How do you make the cursor appear on the left side of the screen after disappearing off the right?

If the universe is a simulation we should be able to apply this bit of programming to travel to the other side of it.

edit on 12/11/2012 by PrplHrt because: (no reason given)

We create a worm hole inside your your computer to bend space and time. Shhhhhh, your PC is a stargate .

Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
reply to post by 0bserver1

 

While I think it's a very real possibility we live in a simulation, it's still a very low possibility imo. The reason I think this, is because our Universe is so enormous. Mind numbingly enormous. And every single atom in the Universe is extremely complex. To simulate every single atom in a single living cell with real physics, requires a computer 1000x more powerful than the most powerful supercomputer on Earth. Imagine trying to simulate a whole person, or the entire planet, or even our entire solar system, or our entire galaxy. The amount of power required to achieve such a feat is beyond comprehension... let alone trying to simulate the entire Universe.

Don't even try to imagine how much power that would require because I can tell you that none of us here have the ability to comprehend how much computing power that would require. We have trouble even comprehending the distance to the nearest star in our own galaxy, or the distance between our galaxy and the nearest galaxy. Keep in mind there are billions of galaxies in our Universe. In fact the Universe may be infinite for all we know, we can only see so far, and no matter how far we look there appears to be no end. These facts lead me to believe we are in a "genuine" Universe, and not a simulated one. But I'm not completely convinced either way.

edit on 11/12/2012 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)

200 years ago they thought just like you. I would have been burned alive if I showed them a mini video game console playing the sims.

You people should check out Moore's law and look at applying it to the simulation theory. In the sense that, eventually technological advancements reach a singularity or (infinity) point if you expand the current graph; you can see at one point the line is directly up, hence the infinity point.

Just a thought though because I've been curious as to if it is applicable to this theory and if anyone could add some insight that'd be appreciated.