If the MOON reflects sunlight, why are the moon landing photos so DARK?

Originally posted by thesmokingman

Originally posted by fenceSitter
reply to post by thesmokingman

 

Here's the short answer before everyone else beats me to it-the moon just reflects the sun. It does not generate it's own light.

Facepalm

Dont act like I am an idiot. Instead, learn to comprehend what you read. I said I understand that it is theorized that the light is from the suns reflection........NOW, the question WAS.......Why is this light strong ehough to reflect all the way down here so brightly, yet pics on the moons surface seem very dark? Now do you understand?........

edit on 28-11-2012 by thesmokingman because: (no reason given)

Sorry to be obtuse, But don't contradict your self in your OP and other will comprehend just fine

The moon is a source of pretty bright light is it not? I mean, it produces quite a bit of light WAYYYY down here on earth.

"Source of pretty bright light" and "produces quite a bit of light" contradicts the second part of your OP...

You would think that the brightness of the moons reflection, that it would interfere with the photos being taken. Also, would you not see a lot of reflective light on all the objects in the photos? The light we get here on earth is said to be reflecting off the moon from the sun.

Now you speak of reflection.


I don't understand what you mean by the pictures being very dark,

This was in the 70s and cameras then and now have changed, or do you mean dark as in the background of some of the moon landing photos?

If so that darkness is space

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
reply to post by stumason

 

Okay tell me what is causing this reflective light and where is the source of light, how come we don't see the rays of Sunlight bouncing off the Moon? How come the Moon always stays the same brightness? Wouldn't this change? Your condescension is not enough to make me think you have a clue...explain it to me...What is reflective on the Moon?

The Moon itself is reflect just as your hand is reflective.

We see with our eyes because light reflects of the things we are looking at.

Originally posted by thesmokingman
Nevermind, I thought we were here to collectively deny ignorance, yet all these sarcastic star chasers just destroy any chance of discussion here anymore. Im over it, off to bed I guess......

Your ignorance was denied vehemently, what is the problem?

I read the first page of this thread before attempting to drown myself in my glass of juice. If this is what the world has come to, I don't want to be a part of it!

Really, people are able to use the internet but they are not able to realise that the moon isn't a light source in itself and that it has no atmosphere? What kind of schools exist that don't teach these basics? I bet if I searched it, there would probably a thread proving that the moon is made of cheddar.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
When you are standing in a dark room and there is light coming from another room you see the source of that light...do you not? When something gets in the way of that light source it changes? So tell me how in the world you think the Sun is what causes the Moon to shine and reflect light? Like I said hook line and sinker....hey believe what you want to believe...that's your problem.

If that source of light from the other room was the size of a football oval you would then understand.

Our sun is massive compared to anything in our solar system, all planets put together would still dwarf the sun because of its massive size.

Hopefully someone can include a diagram showing the scale of the planets of our solar system compared to our sun

Originally posted by thesmokingman
Just throwing this out there to all you smart ATSers. I have always had ONE question about the moon landing and the possibility of it being a hoax.....The moon is a source of pretty bright light is it not? I mean, it produces quite a bit of light WAYYYY down here on earth. However, in EVERY single photo from the landing, there sure does not seem to be very much light. You would think that the brightness of the moons reflection, that it would interfere with the photos being taken. Also, would you not see a lot of reflective light on all the objects in the photos? The light we get here on earth is said to be reflecting off the moon from the sun. However, when you look at these pictures of the landing, the atmosphere is not bright near the moons surface. Can anyone shed any "light"(pun very much intended) on this please?

Actually, the Moon reflects very little light, about as much as a piece of coal or graphite. It only appears so bright at night because we see it against the black sky and our eyes get adjusted to the dark. At full moon, there's also the "opposition effect". en.wikipedia.org...

I don't know what you mean about the Apollo landing photos being dark; most of the ones I've seen are fairly bright, with only a couple being underexposed. Some of the photos are even overexposed. Here's a typical Apollo landing photo, with correct exposure:
www.hq.nasa.gov...
As you can see, the terrain and everything on it are brightly lit by the Sun. The only black areas are the sky and the shadows - because there is no atmosphere.

This excellent photo shows the brightness of the lunar surface relative to the white fabric on the rover:
www.hq.nasa.gov...

I'll stress again, the Moon has no atmosphere, so the sky there is always black. The shadows on the Moon are typically pitch-black as well, unless there's some reflected light falling on them, like in this photo:
www.hq.nasa.gov...
The astronaut is in the LM's shadow, but is visible due to light reflected off the lunar surface.

Feel free to explore more images at www.hq.nasa.gov...

reply to post by thesmokingman


Do YOU understand the replying ATS'r?

You said..."The moon is a source of pretty bright light is it not?"

Answer. It is NO SOURCE of pretty bright light. Right.

This thread is a perfect example of why everyone should take a high school physics class.
None of this is rocket science.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
What is weird to me is that if the Moon is reflecting sunlight how come we don't see the source of this reflection?

The Moon isn't a mirror. It reflects diffuse light, just like concrete does. When you look at concrete surfaces (roads, buildings, etc.) you see the reflected sunlight. Same thing with the Moon.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
And just what is the Moon made out of that it reflects light in the first place? Moon dust is reflective?

What's so special about the Moon reflecting light? Any physical object or material does, unless it's completely black. The Moon is made of many minerals; some reflect more light, others less.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
Why is only half the moon light and the rest is always dark?

The Sun is the only source illuminating the Moon. However, there is no permanent "dark side"; all of the Moon gets sunlight at one time or another.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
How come we only see one side?

The Moon is tidally locked to the Earth, meaning it makes one full turn on its axis as it makes one full orbit around the Earth.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
When we see the sunshine from Earth we are able to see the source, as the Sun goes down the source of light diminishes, so telling us the Sun is what lights up the moon seems rather impossible.

The Sun doesn't disappear when it goes down. It still shines just as brightly across space, illuminating the Moon and the planets. You just don't see the Sun because you're on the Earth's night side.

Originally posted by InhaleExhale
Our sun is massive compared to anything in our solar system, all planets put together would still dwarf the sun because of its massive size.

Hopefully someone can include a diagram showing the scale of the planets of our solar system compared to our sun

Here's a video showing how large our sun is compared to the planets, then it shows even larger stars.

Star Size Comparison HD

Originally posted by wildespace
The Sun is the only source illuminating the Moon. However, there is no permanent "dark side"; all of the Moon gets sunlight at one time or another.

Almost all. Remember we found ice in a polar crater and one reason is because sunlight never gets in there. But if it wasn't for the crater walls blocking the sun, that area would get sunlight too.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
reply to post by stumason

 

Okay tell me what is causing this reflective light and where is the source of light, how come we don't see the rays of Sunlight bouncing off the Moon? How come the Moon always stays the same brightness? Wouldn't this change? Your condescension is not enough to make me think you have a clue...explain it to me...What is reflective on the Moon?

OK, let's try it step by step:
1. 4^1H+2e^-=> ^4He + 2 neutrino + 6 photon.
2. E=hv.
3. Theta i=rheta r
4. A=(1329X10^-H/5/D)^2
5. 50-80% agglutinitic glass with imbedded Fe^0

If you don't recognize or fully understand the above, your education has not equipped you for an explanation.and I'm afraid you will have to go back to school and find good classes in optics, nuclear physics, quantum electrodynamics (QED) and inorganic chemistry.

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
reply to post by stumason

 

Okay tell me what is causing this reflective light and where is the source of light, how come we don't see the rays of Sunlight bouncing off the Moon? How come the Moon always stays the same brightness? Wouldn't this change? Your condescension is not enough to make me think you have a clue...explain it to me...What is reflective on the Moon?

THe MOON doesn't stay the same brightness what has happened to the education system round the world are people to reliant on technology everyone and their dog can text ,email,video chat go on the net but what used to be BASIC school science seems to be a total mystery to some!

Every surface reflects light to some degree (blackholes excluded) the Earth atmosphere does not increase light as someone tried to claim if anything it absorbs some of the light.

Light rays hit an object and bounce off ie they reflect the light that's how we can see!!!!

The Moon's surface is lit by the Sun the same as the Earth is it really that difficult to understand as for taking picture of the Moon from Earth you have to adjust your cameras exposure depending on the phase of the Moon more here.

Moon Photography

If you look at the chart on the site exposure times for Moon pictures are very quick

For example a Full Moon with a camera with 100 asa film or digital camera set to 100 iso
Aperture set a f16 only needs 1/60 th of a second that's also why stars don't show up on Moon pictures as the would need many seconds at same camera settings!

This subject is not rocket science it should have been BASIC school science!!!!

Originally posted by Arbitrageur

Originally posted by InhaleExhale
Our sun is massive compared to anything in our solar system, all planets put together would still dwarf the sun because of its massive size.

Hopefully someone can include a diagram showing the scale of the planets of our solar system compared to our sun

Here's a video showing how large our sun is compared to the planets, then it shows even larger stars.

Star Size Comparison HD

Originally posted by wildespace
The Sun is the only source illuminating the Moon. However, there is no permanent "dark side"; all of the Moon gets sunlight at one time or another.

Almost all. Remember we found ice in a polar crater and one reason is because sunlight never gets in there. But if it wasn't for the crater walls blocking the sun, that area would get sunlight too.

Thank you Arbitrageur

Originally posted by BrokenAngelWings33
When you are standing in a dark room and there is light coming from another room you see the source of that light...do you not? When something gets in the way of that light source it changes? So tell me how in the world you think the Sun is what causes the Moon to shine and reflect light? Like I said hook line and sinker....hey believe what you want to believe...that's your problem.

Do you think its a straight line between the Sun, Earth and Moon is that your problem and why you can't understand the ONLY time the Earth is between the Sun and the Moon is partial or total Lunar eclipse!

reply to post by F4guy


At least you could've made them a little more intelligible:

1. 4 1H + 2 e → 4 He + 2 neutrinos + 6 photons
2. E = hv
3. θi = θr
4. A = ((1329 x 10^-H/5)/D)²
5. 50-80% agglutinitic glass with embedded Fe⁰

And I'm not sure that last one is really all that necessary. I have no idea what it is (I'm not a geologist) and I'm fully capable of grasping the reflective properties of the Moon.
Plus, the equation you give for albedo is as it relates to absolute magnitude (H). It's hardly useful for understanding why an object reflects light...just how much.

Originally posted by sprtpilot

Originally posted by Planet teleX
Cameras have the ability to adjust the exposure, via the shutter speed and aperture.
This is how you can cut down on light.

Not the "lunar" cameras. All settings were fixed.

WRONG! they had some adjustment.





That picture show the camera setting the Astronauts could use depending on the location of the sun!

reply to post by thesmokingman


Are you aware of the cameras that were used in those days? There's one reason.

Originally posted by CLPrime
reply to post by F4guy

 

At least you could've made them a little more intelligible:

1. 4 1H + 2 e → 4 He + 2 neutrinos + 6 photons
2. E = hv
3. θi = θr
4. A = ((1329 x 10^-H/5)/D)²
5. 50-80% agglutinitic glass with embedded Fe⁰

And I'm not sure that last one is really all that necessary. I have no idea what it is (I'm not a geologist) and I'm fully capable of grasping the reflective properties of the Moon.
Plus, the equation you give for albedo is as it relates to absolute magnitude (H). It's hardly useful for understanding why an object reflects light...just how much.

Understanding "why" photons are reflected requires a deep understanding of quantum elecrodynamic wavefront interactions and I don't have the necessary fonts on my home computer to discuss solving the Maxwell equations or the Fresnel equations. If you are really interested, and have a really good background in multivariable calculus, get a copy of Feyman's "QED:The Strange Theory of Light and Matter"

reply to post by F4guy


QED is hardly necessary to understand why light reflects. Especially since the OP seems to barely grasp high school science.
My point was, what you wrote looked like nonsense, even to someone who knows what they are...my point was not that I don't understand quantum physics (which shouldn't even need to come up in a topic like this).

reply to post by CLPrime


Over the ages, there have been many theories of why light reflects, probably starting, in historical times, with Epicharmus of Cos, who believed, and taught, that vision by reflection was spiritual. Later, Epicurus denied even the existence of reflected light, stating that we see because everything generates, and emits, particles of light. Plato tok it one step further by holding that the eyes emitted rays that lit objects. Aristotle rejected that theory but didn't really pronounce one of his own.Archimedes' writings on the subject are lost. Ptolomy, in his work on optics dealt with refraction and not reflection. Euclid seemed to be a follower of Plato's "light ray from the eyes"theory. Both Sir Isaac Newton and Albert Einstein theorized about light, but Newton's work concentrated on refeaction and Einstein's on the photoelectric effect. And that is where quantum mechanics became part of the study of light. QM continued on with Schroedinger and deBroglie.
Because light consists of magnetic and electric fields, when it meets, as part of the reflective process, a charged particle such as an electron, it imparts a force against the electron, and there is an interaction between them. In order to correctly treat this interaction, we have to combine the Schroedinger equation for the charged particle and the quantum mechanics of the electromagnetic waves. The formulation for this purpose is quantum electrodynamics. So, in short, to have a modern understanding o flight reflection, one does need QED.