Disclosure of the moon landing hoax.

a reply to: DJW001

Three astronauts generate over 20,000 BTU's per day of body heat.
If that heat is generated in the vacuum of space its like heating soup in a Thermos.
To this day I haven't heard a reasonable explanation about cooling space capsules for long missions.
Debating space travel without a cooling system you are going to look like a flaming retard.

a reply to: Cauliflower

Perhaps some sort of radiator would be in order...?

a reply to: DJW001

Soup in a thermos eventually cools but it is a very slow process even if you leave the thermos stuck in a snowbank overnight.
Soup doesn't generate much heat like living astronauts.

a reply to: Cauliflower

i guess you are suggesting that astronauts on the ISS have some sort of magic cooling system when they do their several hour long EVA's??

or are they not in a vacuum?

a reply to: Imagewerx

Unless the wallpaper is made of aluminium, it would be an excellent shield. You may be on to something here

a reply to: Cauliflower

Here's a link to one of the first hits I found on google: quest.nasa.gov... it's a very basic description of the sublimation systems used in space, there's even an experiment you can do at home to see how liquid cooling works.

originally posted by: captainpudding
a reply to: Imagewerx

Unless the wallpaper is made of aluminium, it would be an excellent shield. You may be on to something here

Traditional British wallpaper like that was probably painted over with lead based paint sometime in the 1950s,in which case aren't W & G going to be in serious trouble from secondary radiation?

a reply to: captainpudding

Cooling by sublimation requires the release of steam into space.

www.cmmap.org...

Lets do the math.
The capsule is a closed system so the only heat energy removed by sublimation is in the ejected steam.
For every .540 Kcal we sublimate we are going to need to release a gram of water vapor.
Lets say three astronauts heat the space capsule at the rate of ~10,000 Kcal every two days.
So that is about 41 LBS of water that needs to be released as water vapor to cool three astronauts for 2 days.
Could be cooled by filtered urine I suppose.

There is also the issue of the heat pump system used to raise the working fluid to 169C.
Might be over 100 LBS of steam that would need to be released every two days depending on efficiency.

For example according to this link the actual heat content of steam is only 308 BTU's per pound.

www.armstronginternational.com...

I think it would be more efficient for the ISS to use anti stokes cooling for year long missions.

originally posted by: Cauliflower
a reply to: captainpudding

Cooling by sublimation requires the release of steam into space.

www.cmmap.org...

Lets do the math.
The capsule is a closed system so the only heat energy removed by sublimation is in the ejected steam.
For every .540 Kcal we sublimate we are going to need to release a gram of water vapor.
Lets say three astronauts heat the space capsule at the rate of ~10,000 Kcal every two days.
So that is about 41 LBS of water that needs to be released as water vapor to cool three astronauts for 2 days.
Could be cooled by filtered urine I suppose.

There is also the issue of the heat pump system used to raise the working fluid to 169C.
Might be over 100 LBS of steam that would need to be released every two days depending on efficiency.

For example according to this link the actual heat content of steam is only 308 BTU's per pound.

www.armstronginternational.com...

I think it would be more efficient for the ISS to use anti stokes cooling for year long missions.

I'm not going to just hand out the answers here because people don't learn and remember unless they have to do it for themselves, but I'll point you in the right direction here:

Sublimation: evaporation of ice
directly to water vapor
● Take one gram of ice at zero degrees Celcius
● Energy required to change the phase of one gram
of ice to water vapor:
– Add 80 calories to melt ice
– Add 100 calories to heat up to 100 C
– Add 540 calories to evaporate the liquid
● Total energy ADDED for sublimation of 1 gram of
ice:
– 80 + 100 + 540 = 720 calories!

Little clue, water doesn't boil at 100 deg C in space. In fact if you go to the summit of Mount Everest it's only 71 deg C.

Another clue:

We can find an even more severe example of this effect, however, if we put liquid water in a vacuum chamber, and then rapidly evacuate the air. What happens to the water?

It boils, and it boils quite violently at that! The reason for this is that water, in its liquid phase, requires both a certain range of pressure and a certain range of temperatures. If you start with liquid water at a given fixed temperature, a low enough pressure will cause the water to immediately boil.

medium.com...

Hopefully this points out where you're going wrong in these calculations, have a little hunt around and you should find the correct answers ;-)

a reply to: AgentSmith

Steam at a pressure of 100 PSI boils at ~169C and contains only about ~308 BTU's of heat energy per pound at that pressure and temperature. (Any lower working fluid temperature or pressure would release much less heat energy)

A pressure vessel capable of withstanding 4.8 PSI in the vacuum of space would heat up from solar radiation if it were not shielded with a thin reflective foil. That would require additional cooling.

So if they built a high pressure heat exchanger system with a (well baffled) 1000+ pound water tank maybe they could have stayed cool ejecting steam for 2 weeks.

Given that the moon was once a part of Earth during its molten stage there really wasn't much need to bring those moon rocks back for analysis. My mistake was dreaming that putting a man on the moon might be possible back when I was 6 or 7 years old. Took me a good 30 seconds to place the Apollo mission in the fiction category. My Grandfather bought me a thermos and sent me to school with hot soup and Tang for lunch so turned out OK.

originally posted by: Cauliflower
Lets do the math.

Where does your math account for the type of energy being emitted in this photograph?

Thermal Imaging

here is a thermal snapshot of the Space Shuttle as it landed at Cape Canaveral

a reply to: Arbitrageur

You can actually super cool a receiver front end using Anti stokes cooling.

My estimates for water cooling are probably a little low.
Nasa states that they cool astronauts by ejecting steam into the vacuum of space at the rate of 36 pounds per astronaut per day.

www.hq.nasa.gov...


That means if the ISS is occupied by 6 astronauts over 78,000 pounds of water would have to be shuttled each year just for cooling.

originally posted by: Cauliflower
a reply to: AgentSmith

Steam at a pressure of 100 PSI boils at ~169C and contains only about ~308 BTU's of heat energy per pound at that pressure and temperature. (Any lower working fluid temperature or pressure would release much less heat energy)

the water is turning into vapour not just heated to boiling point, and it is doing so from a solid..

your 308 BTU will only heat water and not turn it into steam.. if you want to turn it into steam you will need to add more energy..

originally posted by: Cauliflower

My estimates for water cooling are probably a little low.
Nasa states that they cool astronauts by ejecting steam into the vacuum of space at the rate of 36 pounds per astronaut per day.

www.hq.nasa.gov...

i guess you are reffering to this statement?

Each of the backpacks could hold about twelve pounds of feedwater, enough to provide cooling for about eight hours of fairly strenuous activity

its not like they were doing 24/7 of strenuous activity now were they?

p.s. wording it the way you did is being intellectually dishonest.

a reply to: choos

its not like they were doing 24/7 of strenuous activity now were they?

My first explanation was for engineers, the second was oversimplified for clarity.

The ISS has a lot more surface area exposed to the sun.
With a Gymnasium a big bay window and 5 bedrooms its would be as big as a house.

originally posted by: Cauliflower

The ISS has a lot more surface area exposed to the sun.

not sure why this is important???

the ISS uses alot of reflective surfaces, sure it still collects heat but the vast majority is reflected away.

With a Gymnasium a big bay window and 5 bedrooms its would be as big as a house.

the ISS is much bigger than a house

originally posted by: Cauliflower
a reply to: Arbitrageur

You can actually super cool a receiver front end using Anti stokes cooling.

My estimates for water cooling are probably a little low.
Nasa states that they cool astronauts by ejecting steam into the vacuum of space at the rate of 36 pounds per astronaut per day.

www.hq.nasa.gov...

I didn't find that exact quote in that link.

That means if the ISS is occupied by 6 astronauts over 78,000 pounds of water would have to be shuttled each year just for cooling.

The ISS uses an ammonia-based radiator system to remove excess heat, kind of like the water and antifreeze-based car radiator system removes excess engine heat.

A major difference is there's no air in space to remove the heat from the ammonia-filled radiator, so the heat is radiated directly into space (thermal radiation), which relates to my previous question that you replied to but never answered.

For every object in bright sunlight, half of that object is in the shade, so that while 50% of a surface is being heated by the sun, the other 50% is losing heat. Apollo also managed the temperature input using a glycol based cooling system in the CSM, as well as the so called 'barbecue roll' - slowly turning the ship so that its (reflective!) surface was heated evenly.

A main heat source in the CSM was actually from the electronics - as shown by the way Apollo 13 cooled down dramatically once it was all turned off.

The astronaut suits use very simple but proven methods of cooling based on high school physics, and while they contain a certain amount of water this does not mean all that water was used.

Claiming it is not possible to cool objects and people in space is just plain wrong.

Guys...i have a questin...it was probably answered somwhere among these 300 + pages...

What about micro meteorites ? Apparently Moon is constantly bombarded by them.

So how did Apolo crew avoid being hit by any...?

Was it blind luck ? I know their suits couldnt take that kind of damage.

What was the plan..? Go and hope for the best ?

I know you guys are cowboys, but that sounds rather risky.

Nasa states that the moon is being hit by 2,8 tons of debree daily...and most of that is apparently micro meteors.