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Secession of Texas? Is it more than just Republican rhetoric?
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The question is not whether we can legally secede…. The question should be.. will we?
With the “Come and Take It” logo imprinted on his own boots, Texas Gov. Rick Perry was quoted as saying: “Texans have a different feeling about independence. When we came into the nation in 1845, we were a republic, we were a stand-alone nation, and one of the deals was, we can leave anytime we want. So we’re kind of thinking about that again.” Granted, he would rather us remain in the union but is not oppose to other options as things are rapidly getting worse.
I’ve entered this argument a million times with folks that don’t believe we actually have the right to peacefully secede and sometimes its like trying to explain colors to a blind man when talking to overly devoted liberals or disbelievers.
So here it is. First how about we go to the "Texas Bill of Rights", then the Declaration of Independence ,
ARTICLE 1. BILL OF RIGHTS.
That the general, great and essential principles of liberty and free government may be recognized and established, we declare:
Sec. 1. FREEDOM AND SOVEREIGNTY OF STATE. Texas is a free and independent
State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States, and the maintenance of our free institutions and the perpetuity of the Union depend upon the preservation of the right of local self-government, unimpaired to all the States.
Sec. 2. INHERENT POLITICAL POWER; REPUBLICAN FORM OF GOVERNMENT. All political power is inherent in the people, and all free governments are founded on their authority, and instituted for their benefit. The faith of the people of Texas stands pledged to the preservation of a republican form of government, and, subject to this limitation only, they have at all times the inalienable right to alter, reform or abolish their government in such manner as they may think expedient.
Declaration of Independence :
When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
Then there is this…..
"A relatively obscure provision of the 1845 Joint Resolution for Annexing Texas to the United States provides that new States, of convenient size, not exceeding four in number, in addition to said State of Texas, and having sufficient population, may hereafter by the consent of said State, be formed out of the territory thereof, which shall be entitled to admission under the provisions of the federal constitution. This Essay (linked below) argues, building on our earlier work concerning the constitutionality of the creation of West Virginia, that Article IV, Section 3 of the Constitution permits new states to be carved out of existing ones, with the consent of Congress and the states involved. The New States language of the 1845 Joint Resolution, the Texas Tots provision, constitutes the still-operative, legally-valid grant of Congress's consent to Texas's subdivision into five states. All that remains is for Texas to take up Congress's standing offer."
papers.ssrn.com...
Addition of Content*** Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying I fully support it, this thread is not about that. Rather just proving the point it can leagly be done***
With the “Come and Take It” logo imprinted on his own boots, Texas Gov. Rick Perry was quoted as saying: “Texans have a different feeling about independence. When we came into the nation in 1845, we were a republic, we were a stand-alone nation, and one of the deals was, we can leave anytime we want. So we’re kind of thinking about that again.” Granted, he would rather us remain in the union but is not oppose to other options as things are rapidly getting worse.
I’ve entered this argument a million times with folks that don’t believe we actually have the right to peacefully secede and sometimes its like trying to explain colors to a blind man when talking to overly devoted liberals or disbelievers.
So here it is. First how about we go to the "Texas Bill of Rights", then the Declaration of Independence ,
ARTICLE 1. BILL OF RIGHTS.
That the general, great and essential principles of liberty and free government may be recognized and established, we declare:
Sec. 1. FREEDOM AND SOVEREIGNTY OF STATE. Texas is a free and independent
State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States, and the maintenance of our free institutions and the perpetuity of the Union depend upon the preservation of the right of local self-government, unimpaired to all the States.
Sec. 2. INHERENT POLITICAL POWER; REPUBLICAN FORM OF GOVERNMENT. All political power is inherent in the people, and all free governments are founded on their authority, and instituted for their benefit. The faith of the people of Texas stands pledged to the preservation of a republican form of government, and, subject to this limitation only, they have at all times the inalienable right to alter, reform or abolish their government in such manner as they may think expedient.
Declaration of Independence :
When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
Then there is this…..
"A relatively obscure provision of the 1845 Joint Resolution for Annexing Texas to the United States provides that new States, of convenient size, not exceeding four in number, in addition to said State of Texas, and having sufficient population, may hereafter by the consent of said State, be formed out of the territory thereof, which shall be entitled to admission under the provisions of the federal constitution. This Essay (linked below) argues, building on our earlier work concerning the constitutionality of the creation of West Virginia, that Article IV, Section 3 of the Constitution permits new states to be carved out of existing ones, with the consent of Congress and the states involved. The New States language of the 1845 Joint Resolution, the Texas Tots provision, constitutes the still-operative, legally-valid grant of Congress's consent to Texas's subdivision into five states. All that remains is for Texas to take up Congress's standing offer."
papers.ssrn.com...
Addition of Content*** Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying I fully support it, this thread is not about that. Rather just proving the point it can leagly be done***
edit on 21-11-2012 by JBpage76 because: Addition of content
Yeah we'll secede.. Until the wildfires start up again and we demand federal assistance
reply to post by JBpage76
Im a Texas Republican and this comes up every single time a Democrat wins the election. Gets old and makes us sound like the boy who cried wolf.
Will we? No, It will never happen. Come on man, these secession threads finally died down, let it go.:@@
Which we did NOT get and did just fine without it.
The question is not whether we can legally secede…. The question should be.. will we?
Im a Texas Republican and this comes up every single time a Democrat wins the election. Gets old and makes us sound like the boy who cried wolf.
Will we? No, It will never happen. Come on man, these secession threads finally died down, let it go.:@@
:
Originally posted by Hawking
Yeah we'll secede.. Until the wildfires start up again and we demand federal assistance
Which we did NOT get and did just fine without it.
edit on 11/21/2012 by Juggernog because: (no reason given)
I hope Texas does secede.
I also hope that Mexico takes it back by force five minutes after Texas loses the support of the U.S. military.
Brush up on your Spanish!
I also hope that Mexico takes it back by force five minutes after Texas loses the support of the U.S. military.
Brush up on your Spanish!
If Texas does secede, I will likely apply for citizenship unless Florida secedes also.
By the way, the question of whether or not Texas can secede (de facto) was settled in 1865.
No it wasn't. The only thing that got settled was that a more powerful country can beat up a smaller less powerful country. That is it.
Originally posted by DelMarvel
By the way, the question of whether or not Texas can secede (de facto) was settled in 1865.
Originally posted by jtap66
I hope Texas does secede.
I also hope that Mexico takes it back by force five minutes after Texas loses the support of the U.S. military.
Brush up on your Spanish!
The Texas National Guard and our Militias are more than a match for the Mexican "Military" and I use that word lightly.
if the impossible were to happen and Texas did secede the expense of building a national infrastructure would very quickly have everyone clamoring to
re-join the union.
Bleah.
You know what. Obama was democratically elected by the entire country.
Romney conceded defeat.
But because your boy lost your gonna throw a hissy fit and talk about leaving the party?
Come on Texas grow up.
Now if you have some proof that fraud was committed during the elections and Obama was elected illegally then maybe you'd have a leg to stand on.
Just let it go.
You know what. Obama was democratically elected by the entire country.
Romney conceded defeat.
But because your boy lost your gonna throw a hissy fit and talk about leaving the party?
Come on Texas grow up.
Now if you have some proof that fraud was committed during the elections and Obama was elected illegally then maybe you'd have a leg to stand on.
Just let it go.
reply to post by Juggernog
True enough, I added this content to the Original Post to clarify the threads intent....
Addition of Content*** Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying I fully support it yet, just proving the point it can legally be done***
Addition of Content*** Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying I fully support it yet, just proving the point it can legally be done***
edit on 21-11-2012 by JBpage76 because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by jtap66
I hope Texas does secede.
I also hope that Mexico takes it back by force five minutes after Texas loses the support of the U.S. military.
Brush up on your Spanish!
Mexico knows better than to mess with Texas. They tried it once remember?
reply to post by grey580
I understand what your saying and would agree with you on some levels, the intent of this thread is not to pout about Obama, just proving the
legality to an argument that we have been having long before this election.
reply to post by JBpage76
I love Indiana, but if Texas ever leaves this crap country of ours, I am moving to Texas before they close the border.
I love Indiana, but if Texas ever leaves this crap country of ours, I am moving to Texas before they close the border.
Originally posted by whatsecret
Originally posted by jtap66
I hope Texas does secede.
I also hope that Mexico takes it back by force five minutes after Texas loses the support of the U.S. military.
Brush up on your Spanish!
Mexico knows better than to mess with Texas. They tried it once remember?
Haa! Thats awesome! Wish I would have thought of that one!! Thx for posting
Originally posted by grey580
Bleah.
You know what. Obama was democratically elected by the entire country.
Romney conceded defeat.
But because your boy lost your gonna throw a hissy fit and talk about leaving the party?
Come on Texas grow up.
Now if you have some proof that fraud was committed during the elections and Obama was elected illegally then maybe you'd have a leg to stand on.
Just let it go.
You're missing the point... It's not about democrats or republicans it's about surviving. Like Ron Paul said ~The country already fell off the cliff just didn't hit the bottom yet
What would be the difference between the United States and Texas-America?
Texas would still have McDonalds, Coca-Cola etc.. nothing would change except the name.
And then you'd have a big ass unnecessary border between friendly states.
Just remove the Fascists in the central government and your problems will go away.
You don't need to dissolve the Republic.
Texas would still have McDonalds, Coca-Cola etc.. nothing would change except the name.
And then you'd have a big ass unnecessary border between friendly states.
Just remove the Fascists in the central government and your problems will go away.
You don't need to dissolve the Republic.
edit on 21-11-2012 by yourmaker because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by yourmaker
What would be the difference between the United States and Texas-America?
Texas would still have McDonalds, Coca-Cola etc.. nothing would change except the name.
And then you'd have a big ass unnecessary border between friendly states.
Just remove the Fascists in the central government and your problems will go away.
You don't need to dissolve the Republic.edit on 21-11-2012 by yourmaker because: (no reason given)
The difference would be that Texas tax payers would see their money put to good use.
Originally posted by Juggernog
Originally posted by jtap66
I hope Texas does secede.
I also hope that Mexico takes it back by force five minutes after Texas loses the support of the U.S. military.
Brush up on your Spanish!
The Texas National Guard and our Militias are more than a match for the Mexican "Military" and I use that word lightly.
Texas senators ask Obama to help prevent border violence
www.statesman.com...
Texas asks for federal help dealing with 'major' wildfire disaster
www.khou.com...
edit on 21-11-2012 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by yourmaker
.. nothing would change except the name.
There are 15 U.S. military bases in Texas that presumably would all be shut down. The economic hit from that alone would have Texans whining worse than they are now.
edit on 21-11-2012 by DelMarvel because: (no reason given)