I'm sick of Mexico

Go ahead and blame Mexicans for the dark side of humanity, as if it's only Mexicans that have bad apples, makes sense to notice a bad apple here and there and assume all are the same. If there were no Mexicans everyone blaming Mexicans would just find someone else to blame.

Mexicans ruin Neighborhoods - Yeah, I've seen white neighborhoods ruined by whites, black neighborhoods ruined by blacks, I've also seen white neighborhoods, black neighborhoods and Mexican neighborhoods in pristine condition.

But I guess if it makes you feel better, vent your frustration and blame all of humanities' dark and evil tendencies on one group of people.

Mexico is just another victim of Christianism. Accept it as things do happen.

Yes, sure they are the poor to your eyes. Sure, they are not up to your standard, and what can you do?

The today American has to pay the price for what Spanish did to Mexicans as today the world had to pay the price of what American did to Vietnameses, Afghanistans, and more and much more.

Can you pay the price of what American do to 1.5 billion Chinese tomorrow?

Originally posted by FlySolo
reply to post by Carreau

 

The fact that you would link what illegals spend in the US but not link what they cost the US shows me all I need to know about your position. Why not link the amount of money that is sent back to Mexico to the families, money that leaves the US economy never to return.

I think my link didn't work because you didn't read this either

Most arguments against illegal immigration begin with the premise that the illegal don't pay income taxes, and that they therefore take more in services than they contribute. However, IRS estimates that about 6 million unauthorized immigrants file individual income tax returns each year.[29] Research reviewed by the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office indicates that between 50 percent and 75 percent of unauthorized immigrants pay federal, state, and local taxes.[29] Illegal immigrants are estimated to pay in about $7 billion per year into Social Security.[30] Most illegal immigrants pay sales, federal and state income taxes. In addition they also spend millions per year which support US and helps create new jobs. The Texas State Comptroller report in 2006 that the 1.4 million illegal immigrants in Texas alone added almost $18 billion to the state's budget, and paid $1.2 billion in state services they used

Link

And your worried about a little money being sent home to families?

There is no point continuing a conversation with you. You have ignored every point I've made. You refused to answer questions, stalled in your responses, and over all proven to be denying of the facts.

A bit over-dramatic don't you think? I didn't give you my friend's business info because frankly, that's none of your concern.

The fact that you live in Canada and not the US, let alone the southern border tells me you have no concept of daily life with this problem. Nor do you even have a stake in the fight.

So that means I can't have an opinion? You sir, don't have a proper perspective on the issue. I've pointed out multiple inconsistencies in your reasoning. Including a real-life situation which you arrogantly dismiss. I'm done with you as well.

I've been arguing with him using the exact same points. You're right, his whole perspective is backward a wrought with misinformation.

Originally posted by Night Star
Any illegal with a stolen ID or fraudulent papers can collect welfare in States that don't otherwise allow it. I worked with women who lied saying they were a one income household which they wern't. They worked and their significant others worked under the table. They were above poverty level and recieving benefits through deciet.

And what about all the cases where illegals were claiming kids like neices and nephews that wern't even living in the country so they could get extra money? One person claimed 18 I believe. Every single illegal I ever knew through the years sent a lot of money back home to their own countries, so don't think we'll fall apart if there are no more illegals here. They cost us billions in free schooling for their children, welfare etc.

In any case, we have proper channels to go through and if you don't, you're breaking the law. If I broke a law I would be fined or go to jail. Illegals shouldn't be above the law! It is a slap in the face to every immigrant who is coming here the right way and with respect.

ANY person with fraudulent documents can collect ANYTHING ANYWHERE! What's your point!? Lol

They don't cost us billions in welfare and "schooling". You just picking a number and shootin' from the hip with that one? Again, show me ANYTHING that says illegals collect ANUY kind of federal assistance legally? You won't cause it isn't true. It's something you got off a newsbit. It's a popular one. Do some research.

I like how you use "A woman you knew" as an example. Why don't you use yourself as an example about how you lie on your taxes? a tactic citizens use to literally bilk BILLIONS from the federal government! And considering 90% of us do, (another statistical fact) I'm guessing your one of'em.


Ohhh, last but not least. What's your overall complaint? Cause you state illegals with fraudulent papers can collect money. But yet further down your stating that illegals in general cost of billions in welfare? Now, forgive me I'f I got this wrong. But why would an illegal use fraudulent paperwork to collect welfare if they can do it legally anyway? Do you see the hypocrisy in your statement yet? Which is it lady? Illegals cost us billions in welfare or illegals with fradulent papers do? Or shall you just admit you have no clue?

I think you need to realize the different conditions they come from. It's probably hard for you to comprehend their situation. You have internet probably a lot of other luxuries they wish they could have. While some have different agendas, I believe that a lot will come seeking salvation with no harm intended. And for a start, television isn't the 100% most up front and accurate provider of information.

Maybe you should reconsider your argument. Or at least try and put up with what they have to for a a week.

Originally posted by foodstamp
"So yes, you can require them to have a background check if they are planning on staying here under the umbrella of amnesty.

Under the Amnesty program as it is set out now, they ARE given the same background checks and have to follow the SAME criteria for citizenship. Just log onto immigration and customs to find out the program info.

Why would I log in to find out what I just stated?
Did you read my post you quoted? I bolded it for you.

I said if they are here then they should be submitted to a background check. I said I was talking about the amnesty program. I am saying this is the process that needs to be done since they aren't leaving and we aren't sending them away.

You said you cannot require illegals to submit to the check, I said you can if they are under the amnesty umbrella.

Now your trying to act like you made my own point?
That is funny.

Originally posted by foodstamp
If you're talking about positions of trust and security, then you've only confirmed my point. I said that same thing you did but in a much simpler way. However, background checks are used for jobs at the grocery store, McDonalds, Factory work, renting a home, renting an apartment, etc etc. And if you live in the REAL world, you already know this is happening where felon's are discriminated against at EVERY level. They can't work, they can't live, they can't eat. Mind you, this is AFTER they've paid their debt to society.

If you are saying a felon cannot rent an apartment or work in this country you are really talking out of the wrong end. I've worked with and lived in housing with people that had a felony in their past. Straight out of jail in fact.

Here's a list of companies that hire felons.
McDonalds is on there, 'Honcho'.

Ranker.com

Jailtojob.com

You could argue that EVERY position is a position of "trust".

Not if you know the definition of the terms.

Position of trust is a legal term that is commonly used in the United Kingdom, the United States, and Canada. It refers to a position of authority over another person or within an organization, for example as a supervisor. Crimes committed by a person in a position of trust may be penalized more severely under the law, and those wishing to occupy positions of trust may be subject to special restrictions such as background checks. Wiki

And I said positions of trust and 'high security'.
Not every position qualifies as such.

Let me let you in on a little secret. You know that line on an application that says "Have you been convicted of a felony?" Then right after, it says "May not necessarily bar you from employment"? Well, let's put it in REAL terms. Joe felon (With 5 yrs exp) files an application, and John non felon (with 3 yrs exp) does too. WHO do you think is getting the job? The one with greater experience?

It's dependent on the employer and the crimes.
You act like the same situation applies to every single case and you have NO evidence to back up such a claim.

Otherwise, please put it up.

The statistical reality is that a felon is NO MORE likely to re offend than a NON OFFENDER is to offend.
That's a statistical fact. So, In that case, checking ones background for everything should have NO bearing on one's decision to consider someone for something.

What utter nonsense.

What's next?

You want to ditch the sex offender registry because even though I am not one, I could possibly be one some day?

If someone has a record of repeated child sexual offenses and another person does not, both should not be treated as if they have a clean record and no restrictions should be applied to the positions they apply for relating to working with children for example.

The fact is, one person is a KNOWN criminal and the other is not. The risk is greater with one employee and NOT the other. Your logic is that since anyone can commit a crime then everyone should be treated as if they hadn't. That’s just plain dumb.

A background check is a starting point to determine risk. It is done so to gauge the possibility of criminal mischief. A repeat offender and a first time offender are NOT the same in the eyes of the law. All cases regarding employment are not the same and all employers have to determine what level of responsibility they are willing to take for any new employee.

- Lee

Everyone knows the reason why we allow Meixco get to away with its antics and that is so we can get the Latino vote.

And for some reason it cost 400,000 dollars to deport them.

We should have special prisons for Illegal immigrants. First offense, deportation. Second offense. 5 years in prison. They will stop coming. Kids should also not be given amnesty. They should be sent back to Mexico to an orphanage or with a guardian.

If Mexico won't take them, slap penalties on Mexico.

Originally posted by foodstamp
You know how many felon's commited another violent crime last year? 52%. you know who commited the other 48%? Non offenders. That's a difference of 4% And it's remained that statisticaly close to each other Since we began discriminating against felons. That is a negligable difference that means nothing and insinuates nothing! It only proves that a felon is no more likely to re offend than a first time offender is. Because they're not a different class of people! they're like you and me.

There are around 314 million Americans.
40-60 million of them have a criminal record.
Around 7 million of those are felony records or convictions regarding violent crimes.

So your argument is that since 7 million of the 314 million people in the U.S. have a felony record of violent crimes, around 2.3% of the overall whole, committed little more than half of the newer violent crimes, background checks aren't necessary and everyone should be treated as if they haven't committed a crime?

That doesn't seem a bit imbalanced to the other 98% of us that HAVEN'T committed a felony at all?

The fact that more than half the newer violent crimes committed were by those same felons furthers the point that background checks are needed, it doesn't negate it if they prove to have recidivist tendencies.

Again, it's up to the employer and dependent on the crimes but it's certainly a useful tool to determine risk.

- Lee

It's funny no one has mentioned the U.S. governments involvement with the drug cartels. The CIA has been CAUGHT smuggling drugs into the U.S. Fast and Furious- a hope to track where these guns end up, please, more like the U.S. supplying the Sinaloa Cartel with guns to keep fighting for the take over of all drug trade in Mexico. It's been going on for many many years, yet the people refuse to see or believe it.
www.washingtonsblog.com...

No one remembers the Contra scandal?
People just cant be like "Freaking Mexican drug cartel's are destroying this country blah blah blah"
because all the blame is not on them, look at all the U.S. banks that help these cartels launder the money they make
CIA helping drug cartels smuggle, helping arm, help sell these drugs.
just do a little research and you will find what i am saying is true
There is only one way to stop these cartels and there power to make money
not by better border protection, not by trying to creating more and harsher laws but one way only and that's to make drugs legal and letting U.S. corporations make money and grow this economy.
The war on drugs is a FAILED war, it will never be won period.
Trillions of dollars spent and what has been done to stop the drug flow? absolutely nothing.
Making drugs legal and letting corporations sell them will then hurt the cartels because we will be able to sell them cheaper and they will probably be better, then the cartels wont be able to make money and the point of making drugs is lost, just look at the marijuana trade, i live in San Ysidro California, for those of you that dont know it is the most southern tip of California i can walk to the border from where i live. So i saw the impact of our medical marijuana laws affect on the Mexican marijuana drug trade first hand, because everyone wants better stuff for less or equal price everyone went to dispensaries and i no longer saw the usual drug dealers bothering trying to sell Mexican marijuana. For one it was worse quality and it wasn't that much cheaper. So again if you wanna see an end to drug cartels make drugs legal.
The best evidence for my theory is this
youtu.be...
A drug cartel leader "El Chapo Guzman" Thanking the U.S. for keeping drugs illegal.
He is the 701 richest person in the WORLD, billionaire. i mean come on.
end this ridiculous war on drugs that we will never win
enough said.

Where do you think the pot you get wasted with comes from?

reply to post by Merinda


humboldt county. the columbian stuff comes from columbia, the kush usually comes from afghanistan but that was during the late sixties early seventies when citizens of northwestern california wanted to grow the better hash bearing plants. so nowadays you got that really nice kush too. also dutch, thai, "the weed we keep smoking" comes from so many places in the world in places like michoacan acapulco. best place to go is the emerald triangle but you probably knew that it probably grows in the entire pacific theater, europe, asia and not only isolated to just mexico right? no? well the only places it does not grow is the north or south pole

Originally posted by wantsome
I watch TV shows on the National Geographic channel about the stuff going on on our border. Why do we as Americans put up with this stuff? Mexicans smuggling drugs and people in our country. If a Mexican can make it back to the river their home free. Mexican citizens are undermining the security of our nation. The border patrol agents should shoot them on site if caught committing crimes. The constitution does not apply to them. They deserve no due process.

I live 5 miles from the Canadian border. If Canadians were doing this stuff I myself would be shooting at them. I spend a lot of time on the boarder fishing the great lakes water ways. I've encountered boarder agents on a regular basis. We don't have nearly the amount of illegal activity up here.

Americans need to grow a spine and deal with Mexico. The amount of crime going on down south needs to be delt with.

please tell me this is a joke, tell me you're not being serious.
i don't even know where to start.....
how about you watch some more "TV shows on the National Geographic channel" about drug consumption in the u.s. maybe you will understand how if there is a demand, there must be a supply. furthermore, "el paso" doesn't sound so "american" does it? neither does "laredo", "plano", "california", "nevada", "san antonio", "san francisco", "la paz", "santa cruz", "san fernando", "las vegas" etc, etc, etc. there goes "your nation". finally "they deserve no due process"?, i guess that applies to your government as well, seeing how easily a lot of things have been overlooked/forgotten in recent history, say, Torrijos in Panama, Sandino in Nicaragua, Arbenz in Guatemala, Guevara in Bolivia, Lumumba in the Congo, Gaddafi in Libya, Batista in Cuba, MK Ultra, Hiroshima, Nagasaki, Vietnam, the Panama Canal, the Panama invasion of 89, the Contras in Nicaragua, the United Fruit Company, Martin Luther King Jr., John F. Kennedy, the slave trade; just to name a few. so given your government's track record, i wouldn't be so quick to pass judgment on these people. they are just doing what you guys have been doing for centuries, making a fortune at the expense of others. i'll leave you with that.

reply to post by Merinda


Virginia or canada, back in the day.

Originally posted by Merinda
Where do you think the pot you get wasted with comes from?

Northern California, and here in San Diego, are u trying to say i get my herb from Mexico? HAH! wouldn't touch that dirt.
and you don't get wasted of herb its not alcohol.
you sound rather ignorant to the subject matter. -_-

reply to post by lee anoma


Please for give me If I don't reply to everything. I would love to but the amount of quotes from quotes on top of quotes mixed in with statements have my mind boggled. So I'll choose not to use any from your previous post.

In regards to background checks for illegals. We're clearly just misunderstanding each other on some very small points. You mentioned that illegals SHOULD get background checks under amnesty since they'e NOT going anywhere. I'm telling you that they ARE submitted to background checks and it's also a way from them to NOT QUALIFY for amnesty and be sent back. And in a land like Mexico, where your criminal record is determined by the size of your pocketbook, it's in no way an accurate way to determine a "risk" level for that person. Get it? So, no, I'm not making your statement for you. Close, but no cigar.

As for Felon's concerning housing and jobs, I really don't care if you found McDonald's on a list of felony friendly companies or not. Do I believe you? Sure I do! However, unless your a felon you don't understand the real life implications of how background checks pan out. So, Without "legal terms" of positions of "trusts" or "felony friendly" companies. Let me try to give you an example. Since after all, I've been a "felon" for the last 14 years of my life.

Let's start with McDonalds and felony friendly companies. Because our state dept's have MANY lists of these companies as well ok? First off, There is literally not ONE company on there that starts for more than min wage. Now, you can search your list, maybe you'll find ONE. But not here in Michigan ok?
As far as McDonald's goes, yes McDonalds corporate DOES allows felons to work for Min wage If their McDonald's is corporate owned. Provided your not within 15 ft of a cash register. Which limits you to some kitchen work and cleaning the parking lot. Unfortunately, about 80% or so of ALL McDonalds are actually franchise's and are privately owned. And they, don't hire ANY felons period! Now, what's worse than a corporation that has a blanket policy that states no felons? Well, that would be your average "joe Millionaire". He thinks just like you do. That background checks are a GREAT way to determine "risk" and doesn't allow any of them to work there. So no, in McDonald's case, you're more less, not going to get a job, and if you do, it's at min wage.

Now that's been my firsthand experience. You may wanna ask yourself, "why's this idiot doing trying to get a job at McDonalds? I mean, I don't agree with him, but he can't be a TOTAL idiot!" Well, The reason is, I was a Mortgage Broker for 9 years making 75k a year. When the bottom fell out in '04, new licensing laws went into effect. And guess what? You're right! No Felon's allowed! No "grandfathering" in either. So now I'm INSTANTLY left without a career in 2004. I lost my house, Two beautiful lincoln's, A pregnant whore girlfriend, (whom was pregnant at the time and quickly decided to abort and run) and my business. Which, by the way is still online at buymi.org, check it out). I quickly fell behind on child support for my daughter, after all I was paying 280 a week. And ended up homeless and in jail after 3 months. Because of new policy.

That was 2004. It's 2012 now, Since then I've managed here and there to take temp jobs in factories as a hi-lo driver for 10 an hour. You know how? Well, most temp jobs here do background checks through OTIS. Which basically means, if you don't have a prison number, your not going to show up as having a felony. Which is good for me, I can get into the temp service and into a plant. But after 6 months or so the plant will want to hire me. BUT you guessed it! I either get booted or have to switch to ANOTHER factory because I have a felony and they don't take felons!

Now! let's talk housing, there's a certain strategy behind this because damn near ALL (or so it would seem) Apartment complex's that are incorporated have ABSOLUTELY "no felon" policies. So, that restricts me to privately owned homes located to the east side of Grand Rapids (all hood) ran by slumlords. So that's where I'm stuck. Until recently, because my mother and my current GF have decided to apply for me at an apartment fradulently and sneak me in. So we can raise our newborn due in Jan in a decent neighborhood. And guess what the irony is? In Michigan, fradulently signing rental or purchase agreements is a FELONY!

That's real life bud, a CONSTANT "duck n' dodge" game of tricks and lies just to not be discriminated against. And believe me, it's worse than I mentioned and I got many more stories. But I don't have the time or the space.
That's life for an felon. Oh you know what the charge is? A fight in 1999 when I was 17. I pushed a girl down who stole my girlfriends weed. And I took it back from her. That's it.That's your felony. 72 days in jail and marked 4 life

Originally posted by Sinfulknowledge

Originally posted by Merinda
Where do you think the pot you get wasted with comes from?

Northern California, and here in San Diego, are u trying to say i get my herb from Mexico? HAH! wouldn't touch that dirt.
and you don't get wasted of herb its not alcohol.
you sound rather ignorant to the subject matter. -_-

I am so sick of this argument "Your weed comes from the Mexican cartels!!" NO it does not! 'Nuff said.

Originally posted by lee anoma

Originally posted by foodstamp
You know how many felon's commited another violent crime last year? 52%. you know who commited the other 48%? Non offenders. That's a difference of 4% And it's remained that statisticaly close to each other Since we began discriminating against felons. That is a negligable difference that means nothing and insinuates nothing! It only proves that a felon is no more likely to re offend than a first time offender is. Because they're not a different class of people! they're like you and me.

There are around 314 million Americans.
40-60 million of them have a criminal record.
Around 7 million of those are felony records or convictions regarding violent crimes.

So your argument is that since 7 million of the 314 million people in the U.S. have a felony record of violent crimes, around 2.3% of the overall whole, committed little more than half of the newer violent crimes, background checks aren't necessary and everyone should be treated as if they haven't committed a crime?

That doesn't seem a bit imbalanced to the other 98% of us that HAVEN'T committed a felony at all?

The fact that more than half the newer violent crimes committed were by those same felons furthers the point that background checks are needed, it doesn't negate it if they prove to have recidivist tendencies.

Again, it's up to the employer and dependent on the crimes but it's certainly a useful tool to determine risk.

- Lee

edit on 19-11-2012 by lee anoma because: (no reason given)

edit on 19-11-2012 by lee anoma because: (no reason given)

So you're idea is "let's discriminate against the 60 million felons in order to weed out the 2.3% of re offenders"? Lol, Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

You treat 60 million people like criminals, deny them housing, jobs, and a way to live and provide for their children... You WILL find yourself with MANY REAL criminals eventually.

reply to post by lee anoma


Ohh yeah, by the way. Do you even know what a felon is? Because it's not the felons of old anymore! In fact, just about ALL of us have committed ONE felony in our life. Here's a quick list.

Got a Vicodin from grandma? = Felony possession of Narcotics
Ever gave Vicodin to someone? = Felony sale and manufacture of Narcotics
Bar fight where you hit someone in the face or head = Felony assault w/ intent to do great bodily harm
Thrown a shoe or another object at someone? = Felony assault with a deadly weapon
Thrown a friend or girlfriends phone on the ground = Felony Communications
Used a friends license plate? = Felony Transfer
Lied on your taxes? = Felony fraud
Wrote a check before you had money in the bank? = Felony utter and publishing
Told your girlfriend to go F herself? = Misdemeanor Diomestic Violence (Lose your guns for life)
Told your GF or BF to go F themselves over a cellphone? = Felony Terrorist threat

The list goes on and on. But you get the picture... We're all felons....

reply to post by Sinfulknowledge


people being ignorant tsk tsk

Originally posted by foodstamp

Originally posted by Night Star
Any illegal with a stolen ID or fraudulent papers can collect welfare in States that don't otherwise allow it. I worked with women who lied saying they were a one income household which they wern't. They worked and their significant others worked under the table. They were above poverty level and recieving benefits through deciet.

And what about all the cases where illegals were claiming kids like neices and nephews that wern't even living in the country so they could get extra money? One person claimed 18 I believe. Every single illegal I ever knew through the years sent a lot of money back home to their own countries, so don't think we'll fall apart if there are no more illegals here. They cost us billions in free schooling for their children, welfare etc.

In any case, we have proper channels to go through and if you don't, you're breaking the law. If I broke a law I would be fined or go to jail. Illegals shouldn't be above the law! It is a slap in the face to every immigrant who is coming here the right way and with respect.

ANY person with fraudulent documents can collect ANYTHING ANYWHERE! What's your point!? Lol

They don't cost us billions in welfare and "schooling". You just picking a number and shootin' from the hip with that one? Again, show me ANYTHING that says illegals collect ANUY kind of federal assistance legally? You won't cause it isn't true. It's something you got off a newsbit. It's a popular one. Do some research.

I like how you use "A woman you knew" as an example. Why don't you use yourself as an example about how you lie on your taxes? a tactic citizens use to literally bilk BILLIONS from the federal government! And considering 90% of us do, (another statistical fact) I'm guessing your one of'em.


Ohhh, last but not least. What's your overall complaint? Cause you state illegals with fraudulent papers can collect money. But yet further down your stating that illegals in general cost of billions in welfare? Now, forgive me I'f I got this wrong. But why would an illegal use fraudulent paperwork to collect welfare if they can do it legally anyway? Do you see the hypocrisy in your statement yet? Which is it lady? Illegals cost us billions in welfare or illegals with fradulent papers do? Or shall you just admit you have no clue?

edit on 11/19/1212 by foodstamp because: (no reason given)

I never said 'A woman I knew..." I said 'women'. I have never ever lied on my taxes. I didn't say that illegals cost us billions in welfare alone. Don't put words in my mouth, and pay attention!

Illegal immigration costs the taxpayers of California — which has the highest number of illegal aliens nationwide — $10.5 billion a year for education, health care and incarceration, according to a study released yesterday.

This is in California alone.

www.washingtontimes.com...

"Undocumented workers have been taking advantage of a loophole called the Additional Child Tax Credit, a fully-refundable credit of up to $1,000 per child that was intended to help working families with children living at home. Not only are they claiming children within the U.S., they are also claiming children in Mexico."
Read more: dailycaller.com...


How does this happen? All Americans, whether legal or illegal, who earn income are required by law to file taxes, but doing so requires having a social security number which illegal immigrants aren’t supposed to have. The IRS remedied this by created the individual taxpayer identification number. This well-intentioned remedy has backfired, however, and is costing taxpayers billions of dollars a year.
Read more: dailycaller.com...