Why electricity flows

Originally posted by gmonundercover
As long as we are making mention of A Einstein suppose we take 'things' a step further and say that not only is the electricity that's being transmitted through the copper non material or in-substantial - so is the copper wire that the electrons are said to "be flowing" through.

There is no such thing as a "physical" reality to the copper wire any more than there is a physical reality to the electrical energy within the wire itself. Bold assertion yes - but its also a fact. 'Matter' is just a name for something we cannot so easily explain, but the one who said it best was A Einstein------> In order to comprehend it we must study his writings on the relationship between matter, energy, space, time, and gravity. 'Things' per se, seem real enough but they are mere aggregations of light waves - meeting and crossing one another at certain well defined coordinates. "Things" are electromagnetic vibrations - nothing more - nothing less.

Einstein said it best "matter is light stopped." Vibration is measured in frequencies called Hertz (cycles per second), and all vibrations - including light, sound, and your own physical body are part of the electromagnetic spectrum. Things are light - matter is light - you are a mass of coagulated light !

"When forced to summarize the general theory of relativity in one sentence: Time and space and gravitation have no separate existence from matter." - Albert Einstein

"Physical objects are not in space, but these objects are spatially extended. In this way the concept 'empty space' loses its meaning. ... Since the theory of general relatively implies the representation of physical reality by a continuous field, the concept of particles or material points cannot play a fundamental part, ... and can only appear as a limited region in space where the field strength / energy density are particularly high." Albert Einstein.

"All forms of matter are really light waves in motion." - Albert Einstein

Vibration can be understood with Einstein’s theory of relativity. Matter is simply energy vibrating at a very, very slow frequency (but still in motion). Einstein’s equation defines energy as E=MC2: energy = mass (matter) x the speed of light squared. So matter is energy, and energy is matter; a physical thing (such as your body) is simply an accumulation of energy vibrating at a specific rate. In addition, quantum physics has confirmed that all 'things' in the universe are ultimately a vibration made up of energy, are relatively self-aware, and are communicating through the exchange of information.

reply to post by gmonundercover


Excellent elaboration on the truth of the "matter." I am in full agreement with your premises as so stated.
Vibration is a fundamental characteristic of the Universe as a whole from the very highest vibration of the source, the first cause, GOD, on down to the more mundane world of "physical matter"

Originally posted by Valedictorian
Vibration is an integral component of the great continuum of the Universe, manifesting an infinite number of characteristics. Energy is vibration; human beings consist entirely of pure Energy in the form of a physical body, even though the human body and physical surroundings might appear to be solid in accordance with the five physical senses.

Vibration

The word "frequency" always acts like a red flag to me, as it is for some reason a word woo-woos like a lot, and throw about in absurd ways despite its having a rigid, and not especially thrilling, definition in the scientific world (three others are "energy," "vibration," and "field").

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Valedictorian
Vibration is an integral component of the great continuum of the Universe, manifesting an infinite number of characteristics. Energy is vibration; human beings consist entirely of pure Energy in the form of a physical body, even though the human body and physical surroundings might appear to be solid in accordance with the five physical senses.

Vibration

The word "frequency" always acts like a red flag to me, as it is for some reason a word woo-woos like a lot, and throw about in absurd ways despite its having a rigid, and not especially thrilling, definition in the scientific world (three others are "energy," "vibration," and "field").

edit on 15-11-2012 by buddhasystem because: (no reason given)

Soon enough the corrupted scions of the modern day scientific cabal of atheists and Masons will have to let go of their diabolical stranglehold on western civilization. In doing so they will come to believe in Einstein’s assertion that matter and energy were (are) two expressions of the same thing. In a variety of experiments in particle physics, much evidence has been gathered confirming Einstein's unshakable proposition that all matter is really a frozen form of energy.

So, come out of the restrictive confines of your 'classical' slumber and acknowledge that we humans (and all that surrounds us) are a manifestation of a vast collection of quantum energy oscillating - aka VIBRATING - at different frequencies on many different levels exchanging energy and information with the sub atomic world around us.
Our molecules, DNA and cells all dance and vibrate to their own tune, in concert with our five senses that are highly specialized sensors (our eyes interpret these vibrations into the world we see) enabling us to translate the vibratory world into the congealed physical world as we know it - as we are able to perceive it.

“The visible world is the invisible organization of [vibrational] energy.”- Heinz Pagels

“Everything in life is vibration” – Albert Einstein

The fundamental laws of nature state that everything is in a state of vibratory oscillation. All atoms are in a constant state of motion, and depending on the speed of these atoms, things appear as a solid, liquid, or gas. Everything that manifests itself in your life is there because it is a manifestation of vibrational principles.

Keep in mind that solidity is an illusion. There is no solidity whatsoever in the universe. A form that appears solid is actually created by an underlying vibration. Vibrations express themselves in corresponding geometrical figures and in this way build up crystals that are the expression of said vibration. Crystals collectively form a body of an element according to its particular vibration.

Originally posted by Valedictorian
Soon enough the corrupted scions of the modern day scientific cabal of atheists and Masons will have to let go of their diabolical stranglehold on western civilization. In doing so they will come to believe in Einstein’s assertion that matter and energy were (are) two expressions of the same thing.

Ever heard of nuclear power plants? They operate on the basis of matter-energy equivalence. So I don't know what beliefs you think are going to change.

So, come out of the restrictive confines of your 'classical' slumber and acknowledge that we humans (and all that surrounds us) are a manifestation of a vast collection of quantum energy oscillating - aka VIBRATING - at different frequencies on many different levels exchanging energy and information with the sub atomic world around us.
Our molecules, DNA and cells all dance and vibrate to their own tune, in concert with our five senses that are highly specialized sensors (our eyes interpret these vibrations into the world we see) enabling us to translate the vibratory world into the congealed physical world as we know it - as we are able to perceive it.

Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero. So? What's this about 'classical' slumber? You are presenting common knowledge as if it's some sort of revelation that only you know about.

Originally posted by Arbitrageur Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero. So? What's this about 'classical' slumber? You are presenting common knowledge as if it's some sort of revelation that only you know about.
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Your above comment is scientifically absurd - somewhat like the notion of an "absolute vacuum" would be equally absurd. There isn't any such thing as absolute zero - not even as an arithmetic trick. Its just another of the magical conjurations of and by the same fellows at the Royal Society - those aforementioned Masonic magicians.

Absolute zero doesn't exist in the real world/universe - not even mathematically.

Everything in the universe is in a constant state of vibration. Although Einstein did once hypothesize that, if an when, all matter in the universe reached that hypothetical temperature the universe would cease to exist, but it was merely a little mind game he was playing because he knew full well that that would have been in violation of his own discoveries.

Magical Definition --> of an absurd and patently false premise - Absolute zero is a conceptual invention : Absolute zero is the alleged "lowest possible temperature," at which point the atoms of a substance transmit no thermal energy - they are completely at rest. It is 0 degrees on the Kelvin scale, which translates to -273.15 degrees Celsius (or -459.67 degrees Fahrenheit).

The concept of an "absolute cold" was first presented by Robert Boyle in his 1665 New Experiments and Observations touching Cold. Various physicists explored this phenomenon, until Lord Kelvin derived his thermodynamic temperature scale, extrapolating backward to absolute zero based purely on the laws of thermodynamics.

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero.

Yeah well, anything taken to absolute is bound to become false, you know (of course the woo-woos do precisely that).

Here's the thing, I take an electron and shoot it into the vacuum out of my nifty particle accelerator. And it just flies away. Why do we need to mention "vibrations" here? Yes I know we may need to describe it as a wave function but that's not vibration, really.

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero.

Yeah well, anything taken to absolute is bound to become false, you know (of course the woo-woos do precisely that).
Here's the thing, I take an electron and shoot it into the vacuum out of my nifty particle accelerator. And it just flies away. Why do we need to mention "vibrations" here? Yes I know we may need to describe it as a wave function but that's not vibration, really.

This will be my final response to you because of your insistence on using the disparaging term "woo woo's" to describe people with whom you disagree and who are obviously more intelligent than yourself.

I think the double clit experiment is yet another red herring. I do not think it possible to isolate and to then load up a single electron as though it were a projectile to be readied for shooting out of a co-called, and aptly named, "electron gun."

While its rather convenient for physicist's to resort to ballistics metaphors, in this case it might be best to think of meteorological analogies instead - as in electron "CLOUD." Or better yet a gynecological simile such as electron "SMEAR" might have been more appropriate.

DEFINITION: A red herring is a figurative expression referring to a logical fallacy in which a clue or piece of information is or is intended to be misleading, or distracting from the actual question or given situation.

Originally posted by Valedictorian
I think the double clit experiment is yet another red herring.

I've never heard of "double clit" experiment. Was it done in the field of medicine?

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Valedictorian
I think the double clit experiment is yet another red herring.

I've never heard of "double clit" experiment. Was it done in the field of medicine?

The double slit pun/JOKE was at your expense and as I suspected you would - YOU FELL FOR IT.........HA HA HA ROTFLMAO

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Im electrical engineer so i guess it was only matter of time before i explored this forum. Here I describe an explanation for why electricity flows in a circuit. The talk explains the concepts of Voltage, Electric Current and Resistance in a electric circuit.


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Voltage is an electrical form of pressure and to understand this concept in the easiest of way is done by
considering its analogy to a fluid system. A simple form of fluid system is found in a rainwater tank. The Pressure inside the tank is greater than the ambient atmospheric pressure surrounding the tank. To release water from the tank into the external environment is controlled by opening a tap on the tank. The flow of water in this manner is analogous to the flow of current. The current flow is commonly referred in everyday terms as electricity.

The flow of electricity is an effect caused by electrical pressure of voltage. To increase the magnitude effect of the flow in electricity (electric current) requires increasing the voltage pressure. The analogy in the fluid system for this is where a tank reservoir is filled with a high fluild level; and possess a greater head of pressure than if the tank level is low.

In a water fluid system the tank pressure is the driving source for the force which pushes the water fluid out of the tap when opened. In the same characteristic manner for an electrical system the electric current flows from a point of high voltage potential to one of low voltage potential in a electric circuit.

The analogy of the water fluid system reveals that electric current is flowing/moving in a direction determined by the fall/drop in voltage potential.

The use of the term Voltage potential is interchangeable with terms Voltage Gradient and Voltage differential and Voltage drop.

The units of Volts are Electro-motive force. Electro simply means electrical energy. The terms motive indicates motion; and force is an effect caused by pressure of voltage as explained in the analogy above. Therefore think of Volts as electrical pressure.

The flow of electricity (electric) current cause by the electrical pressure of the voltage is referred to as in its units of measurement are amperes.

The basic relation ship between Voltage and Current is defined in what is called Ohms law. Mathematically Ohms law defines Voltage = Current x Resistance ( V = IxR). The (x) symbol is a mathematical multiplier like 2 x 2 = 4 for example.

To explain Resistance I will go back to the analogy to a fluid system and a rainwater tank. Imagine now that a hose is connected to the outlet tap on the tank. When the tap opened the water will flow from the tank via the tap and through the hose. The hose itself is physical a Resistance element in the flow path of the fluid; in that it slows down the rate of fluids flow from the tap. Without the hose connected to the tap the water fluid flows out of the tap at a faster rate compared to it the hose is connected.


Therefore Resistance is what limits the electric current flow for a given voltage. The implications of this constraint can be understood for the layman in practical terms by considering the example of a fixed voltage source available from a home wall power socket. The wall socket may be used to connect various electrical appliances. These could be a toaster, TV, computer, electric kettle or hot iron. Each of these appliances have a different value of resistance. The lower the resistance the more current will flow through the electrical circuit within the appliance. A hot iron is the best example as because altering the temperature control has the actual result of altering the resistance in the circuit.

This brings to attention the last term Power. Electric current flowing in a resistive element produces heat which is Power. Yes Power = Heat.

The mathematical formula for Power heat generated in a purely resistance circuit, P = V x I. I say purely because in actually reality applicances such as TV, Washing machines and Radios will also have inductive and capacitive circuits. These I will cover in separate discussion later.

edit on 6-11-2012 by AthlonSavage because: (no reason given)

oh an electrical engineer....so did designer have to teach how to size a cable tray?
lol...just messing around.

Originally posted by Valedictorian
This will be my final response to you because of your insistence on using the disparaging term "woo woo's" to describe people with whom you disagree and who are obviously more intelligent than yourself.

IMHO it's too rich for anyone who wrote some stone cold stupid stuff like "Osiris, gravity... Black hole!" to claim any kind of intellectual superiority, scratch that, capacity. Osiris. Seriously. Hole.

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero.

Here's the thing, I take an electron and shoot it into the vacuum out of my nifty particle accelerator. And it just flies away. Why do we need to mention "vibrations" here? Yes I know we may need to describe it as a wave function but that's not vibration, really.

what do you mean by an electron? what is an electron? what do you mean by flies away? how does it fly away? what are the characteristics of its path/travel? why is it described in a wave function? what does a wave mean?

Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero.

Here's the thing, I take an electron and shoot it into the vacuum out of my nifty particle accelerator. And it just flies away. Why do we need to mention "vibrations" here? Yes I know we may need to describe it as a wave function but that's not vibration, really.

what do you mean by an electron? what is an electron? what do you mean by flies away? how does it fly away? what are the characteristics of its path/travel? why is it described in a wave function? what does a wave mean?

With all due respect, ATS is a medium of limited bandwidth. You are asking numerous questions which are adequately addressed (through various approaches, i.e. not necessarily in the same manner) in textbooks. I can tell you right away that my sources of knowledge have been:

a) classes, ultimate based on homework
b) actual experimentation in the laboratory, both for fun and professionally

By the time you are asking "what's an electron", I'm compelled to say that you refuse to do your homework.

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero.

Here's the thing, I take an electron and shoot it into the vacuum out of my nifty particle accelerator. And it just flies away. Why do we need to mention "vibrations" here? Yes I know we may need to describe it as a wave function but that's not vibration, really.

what do you mean by an electron? what is an electron? what do you mean by flies away? how does it fly away? what are the characteristics of its path/travel? why is it described in a wave function? what does a wave mean?

With all due respect, ATS is a medium of limited bandwidth. You are asking numerous questions which are adequately addressed (through various approaches, i.e. not necessarily in the same manner) in textbooks. I can tell you right away that my sources of knowledge have been:

a) classes, ultimate based on homework
b) actual experimentation in the laboratory, both for fun and professionally

By the time you are asking "what's an electron", I'm compelled to say that you refuse to do your homework.

i didnt really go to school, and didnt pay enough attention to science when i did...

If you are well versed then certainly you can simply summarize what an electron is...

Also I would like to know your opinions about waves and particles traveling in waves and what that means?
I had an argument with a friend last night ( less of an argument, more of a search for our understandings),, and from his understanding, he thinks that physicists dont actually believe particles move in wave patterns, but that it just a purely mathematical convenience for representation of the particle... I thought that they make their models with waves because they actual travel in a frequency, an oscillating in space vibration of forward travel through space and time mapped over a distance would appear as a consistent wave..

can you please clarify what is meant with these things?

reply to post by Valedictorian


Debate all you want... There is null point (e.g. magnetic reconnection) which reduces to Zero and Zero Sum (null points - all things considered). The math is too simple really.

you know I went back read some explaintions posted by the oringal poster.
Good Job.
As a fellow sparky your explaintions were right on the money. I may have to change my opinion of electircal engineers...but of course most the ones I work with I don't know what a normal open contact on a relay is.

Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero.

Here's the thing, I take an electron and shoot it into the vacuum out of my nifty particle accelerator. And it just flies away. Why do we need to mention "vibrations" here? Yes I know we may need to describe it as a wave function but that's not vibration, really.

what do you mean by an electron? what is an electron? what do you mean by flies away? how does it fly away? what are the characteristics of its path/travel? why is it described in a wave function? what does a wave mean?

With all due respect, ATS is a medium of limited bandwidth. You are asking numerous questions which are adequately addressed (through various approaches, i.e. not necessarily in the same manner) in textbooks. I can tell you right away that my sources of knowledge have been:

a) classes, ultimate based on homework
b) actual experimentation in the laboratory, both for fun and professionally

By the time you are asking "what's an electron", I'm compelled to say that you refuse to do your homework.

i didnt really go to school, and didnt pay enough attention to science when i did...

If you are well versed then certainly you can simply summarize what an electron is...

Also I would like to know your opinions about waves and particles traveling in waves and what that means?

In my day we had to use local library to get insight into things like that. And it worked. Nowadays, it's even simpler since a lot of knowledge is at your fingertips waiting to be found using search engines and portals.

My own views (at the level of your question) do not differ significantly from what woo-woos call "mainstream science". Therefore, I urge you to peruse the readily available references and Wikipedia would be a good start.

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Not to split hair, but there can also Rayleigh scattering in the gaseous medium. So clean air will still scatter radiation. And Delbruck scattering happens in (technically) vacuum, although of course a source of electric field is needed.

I'm trying to keep it readable and easily visualized. For most reasonable light sources, if the air was laboratory pure, you wouldn't be able to notice scattering with your naked eye.

edit to add: when did ATS's comment poster start interpreting greater than/less than signs as legitimate html tags instead of brackets? Did it always do that?

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by ImaFungi

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
Anything in the universe above absolute zero vibrates, and everything in the universe (that we know of) is above absolute zero.

Here's the thing, I take an electron and shoot it into the vacuum out of my nifty particle accelerator. And it just flies away. Why do we need to mention "vibrations" here? Yes I know we may need to describe it as a wave function but that's not vibration, really.

what do you mean by an electron? what is an electron? what do you mean by flies away? how does it fly away? what are the characteristics of its path/travel? why is it described in a wave function? what does a wave mean?

With all due respect, ATS is a medium of limited bandwidth. You are asking numerous questions which are adequately addressed (through various approaches, i.e. not necessarily in the same manner) in textbooks. I can tell you right away that my sources of knowledge have been:

a) classes, ultimate based on homework
b) actual experimentation in the laboratory, both for fun and professionally

By the time you are asking "what's an electron", I'm compelled to say that you refuse to do your homework.

i didnt really go to school, and didnt pay enough attention to science when i did...

If you are well versed then certainly you can simply summarize what an electron is...

Also I would like to know your opinions about waves and particles traveling in waves and what that means?

In my day we had to use local library to get insight into things like that. And it worked. Nowadays, it's even simpler since a lot of knowledge is at your fingertips waiting to be found using search engines and portals.

My own views (at the level of your question) do not differ significantly from what woo-woos call "mainstream science". Therefore, I urge you to peruse the readily available references and Wikipedia would be a good start.

edit on 15-11-2012 by buddhasystem because: (no reason given)

why cant you just discuss this with me? I have a genuine interest and questioning? and you seem to be one who knows,, so i am asking you and want to discuss these topics with you... a few posts back i was worried that you as a person just likes to come on this side to talk down at the woo- woos......

do/can photons interact with on another?

do particles actually travel through space time in a wave pattern?

there are other questions i have asked in my previous posts that i cant recall right now but i believe they were good questions,, you ignore the questions i want you to try and answer... bummer.

Originally posted by ImaFungi

do/can photons interact with one another?

In odd ways, at times. But generally, not to a degree you'd notice. And by that, I mean outside of setups where you're trying to measure aspects of the stress/energy tensor of coherent streams of photons approaching each other head on and the like.

Where you have the means for observing it, streams of photons can interact with each other where they intersect, forming interference patterns through superposition. It should be noted that this does not affect either individual beam, which will propagate away as if nothing has happened.