The RED LINE: Must Watch

Originally posted by TheMaverick
reply to post by dontreally

 

Also why we are on the subject, when can we see Israel have her nuclear weapons regulated ?

Star for that one. I completely forgot that Israel plays by her own rules during wartime as well.

But Israel always plays by the rules right? They would never use something so inhumane as use White Phosphorus on civilians. Nope, that couldn't have been Israeli munitions.

Lima-1, out.

Originally posted by mytheroy

either way they are pushing hard for a WW3

That's like saying "look at how that cart is pushing that team of oxen".
Iran is pushing for war?
Might want to fact check last time Iran invaded another country.

Iran has the right the same as any other nation to pursue nuclear power. I really wouldn't blame them for wanting a bomb as they have every right to defend themselves from an ever-increasingly hostile West.

No doubt there are Muslims over in the Middle East talking about how Christians are pushing for Armageddon so that Jesus can return.

reply to post by dontreally

As to the second thing you mentioned, why Israel can have them? Well, assuming they do have them, they've had them for over 40 years, and not a thing has happened. A liberal democratic nation, which by definition is a moderate state, is quite trust worthy.

Lets not play silly here, you know, i know, the whole world knows israel has nuclear weapons, and quite a few aswell, now the fact they haven't been used yet, means nothing, as you know if israel use these nuclear weapons they claim not to have tomorrow on another nation, russia and china would react with extreme force, and so would most of the west, now as much as zionist israel leaves a bad taste in my mouth, they are far from stupid and know how to play the global chess game very well, and wouldn't use these weapons unless checkmated.

Once again when this war with iran happens that you want so badly, will you and your children be fighting in the frontlines ?

Or is it Zionist israel talk big, and stand be-hide american and british soldiers to fight this war israel wants so badly, as that what will happen, it be american and british soldiers dying for your cause.

Iran don't pose a threat to america or britain, and the only reason iran dislikes israel is because of the way israel has behaved in the last 70 years in the region since it's been a state, its hardly been a good neighbour.

But Iran, not surprisingly (given their obvious ambitions) refuses this compromise.

And this is called ironic.

Originally posted by OperationIraqiFailure
This video does not mention the CIA Coup of 1953. Why not?

Probably because everybody involved is either dead or so old they have to get up to go pee fifteen times a night. But if one insists on bringing up ancient history.....


Xerxes son Darius started it!

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by sensibleSenseless

 

I gave you a star for being about as balanced as is possible.

One objection though.

I wouldn't call them "Assumptions" but rather possible scenarios or concerns to be discussed. It's actually pretty assumptive to assume they are assumptions. Which is part of the problem with attempting to discuss this situation.

Many on both sides Assume what the others intentions are.

Well spoken. You're right. I stand corrected.

Just thought I'd note: Our use of resources and large scale production and expansion, emphasize that the pressures on various types of fuels all over the world are increasing. We are in fact the drivers of China's economy etc.. And they all need access to the same energy resources we do.

I'm not sure how anyone thinks this can go on ad-infinitum without the lid blowing. The rate at which we are finding energy consumption reduction technologies like hybrids etc, don't exactly match our appetite for increasing use of energy resources - and even the emphasis on the expansion of the search for more fossil fuels to burn. (greenhouse gas levels, I suppose, are another discussion).

Does anyone know if the Navy, etc are using all that natural gas (from frakking etc). It does cost only $10/cylinder at Costco. I also heard that the oil companies are burning their natural gas (which comes alongside the oil they drill for, because they find that it is too cheap to sell nowadays. I know the US Navy were looking to use alternative fuels for their ships and carriers.

Originally posted by MamaJ
Op... After watching only 3 minutes and 51 seconds of the video I had to stop. I like spending my time learning new things and frankly not into listening to more lies by people who could care less about the world in general and being "fair".

In the beginning of the video it states in text that "everyone is worried about Iran". NOT EVERYONE is worried.... and this was the first lie in the video... right from the start.

I am not concerned with Islamic Law because If I was I would have to be concerned about the "Christian Law" as well as all other religions and their "laws".

What is the concern? Oil. Money. Oil equals money for the big guys and the day we become dependent without oil is the day we will be "free". Money is an enemy and anything having to do with it... Im over it really!

Economically speaking the US is already lost the battle and believe me... its no fault of Iran. We cannot live in fear based on what Iran does with oil and how it will effect our economy. Thats just like we cannot blame China.... these countries have to do what they feel is best within their own rights and their peoples rights. Who are we to say what they can and cant do. What happened to freedom? We cannot continue to dictate to other countries! If what is good for the US.. should be good for another country.

Mr. Iran is no enemy to me... and frankly I enjoy listening to his speeches. I am in no way worried about him as I am more worried about the US wicked leaders these days. Talk about sinister.... man! We have been lead to a place where there may not be much light for a long time... its not Iran's fault.

What do tptb have to say about the Earth given resources? It fills their pockets and they live high on the horse! They are about to come tumbling down though for all to see their weak faces drowning in the depths of poverty! You cannot be greedy, rape and pillage the Earth forever.... it has to stop.

I quoted this entire post. This post is my attitude to it all.

Quit playing with these guys. Live your own life and be good to all the people you know. Forget about rules, lawas, money, oil, new gadgets...

Just feed yourself water yourself. Help others do the same. Grow your mind. Create change. don't react to a hate spewing video with either more hate or maybe more fear...

I love my girl and my little kitty, and my neighbors.. Id rather make them all happy and grow them than I would like to blow up Iranian kids.. I don't want to blow up people. I just don't.

I was in the Army and I knew Iran was sort of next on the list all the way back in 2006.. I warned about this a lot.

Don't fall for the HATE. Listen to Yoda, and know that what ever you fight you become. It all starts with fear. Love is the stronger choice for YOU, and your offspring.


As far as Irans motives go, I guess you guys didn't get the memo. They are resisting the empire. There are only a few countries left who can. History shall show why someone might want a Nuke, and explain why insane sanctions are not working, when logically they should. There are more important things than religion. I as a single person would "pull an Iran" if I could just so that I could make my own laws, and no country and no army or cops would mess with me if I had a nuke.

I don't agree with Irans views, but I do understand them. They are NOT my enemy.

but I think Iran's view of End times and arrival is not related to any nuclear weapon !!! and it is pluralistic. not monopolistic.

ahmadinejad UN speech 2005

Divine knowledge that was carried and disseminated by such prophets as Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus, and Mohammad. Today, agnostic thinking is on the decline and presently humanity is equally enamored with religion, science, knowledge and spirituality. This is an auspicious beginning.

ahmadinejad UN speech 2006

All Divine prophets from the Prophet Adam (peace be upon him) to the Prophet Moses, to the Prophet Jesus Christ , to the Prophet Mohammad , have all called humanity to monotheism, justice, brotherhood, love and compassion. Is it not possible to build a better world based on monotheism, justice, love and respect for the rights of human beings, and thereby transform animosities into friendship?

ahmadinejad UN speech 2007

In the Name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful "Oh God, hasten the arrival of Imam Al-Mahdi and grant him good health and victory and make us his followers and those who attest to his right fullness"

ahmadinejad UN speech 2008

Let us, hand in hand, expand the thought of resistance against evil and the minority of those who are ill-wishers. Let's support goodness and the majority of people who are good and the embodiment of absolute good that is the Imam of Time, The Promised One who will come accompanied by Jesus Christ, and accordingly design and implement the just and humanistic mechanisms for regulating the constructive relationships between nations and governments.

ahmadinejad UN speech 2009

All this can be attained when humanity reaches its zenith and the last Divine resource, a progeny of the beloved prophet of Islam,Imam Mahdi will appear and so will Jesus,son of Mary and all other righteous people who will assist him in this great global endeavor and this is the very idea of awaiting a savior. Awaiting the government of the good and the righteous which is the hope of all people for the betterment of the world. They shall come and with the aid of the pious and the righteous will fulfill the historical ideals of human beings for freedom, excellence, growth, security and tranquility, peace and magnificence. They shall come to end war and aggression and bestow knowledge, morality and friendship on all humankind. Yes, (and indeed) yes, a bright future lies ahead for humanity.

ahmadinejad UN speech 2010

and Quran names with respect the previous Messengers of God, like Noah, Abraham, Isaaq, Joseph, Moses and Jesus Christ and endorses them. They burned Quran to burn all these truths and good judgments. However, the truth could not be burned. On behalf of the Iranian nation I pay respect to all Divine Books and their followers. This is the Quran and this is the Bible. I pay respect to both of them.In the recent centuries, the human ethics and values have been rejected as a cause for backwardness. They were even portrayed as opposing wisdom and science because of the earlier infliction on man by the proclaimers of religion in the dark ages of the West. The complete human, the true servant of God and the true friend of the mankind whose father was from the generation of the beloved Prophet of Islam and whose mother was from the true believers of the Jesus Christ, shall wait along with Jesus the son of Marry and the other righteous to appear on those brilliant times and assist the humanity.

ahmadinejad UN speech 2011

The creation of a supreme and ideal society with the arrival of a perfect human being who is a true and sincere lover of all human beings, is the guaranteed promise of Allah. He will come alongside with Jesus Christ to lead the freedom and justice lovers to eradicate tyranny and discrimination, and promote knowledge, peace, justice freedom and love across the world.

ahmadinejad UN speech 2012

-The arrival of the Ultimate Savior, Jesus Christ and the Righteous will bring about an eternally bright future for mankind,not by force or waging wars but through thought awakening and developing kindness in everyone. Their arrival will breathe a new life in the cold and frozen body of the world. He will bless humanity with a spring that puts an end to our winter of ignorance, poverty and war with the tidings of a season of blooming.
-God Almighty has promised us a man of kindness, a man who loves people and loves absolute justice, a man who is a perfect human being and is named Imam Al-Mahdi, a man who will come in the company of Jesus Christ (PBUH) and the righteous.
- The current world order is discriminatory and based on injustice.

Originally posted by Sissel
www.ifamericansknew.org...reply to post by TTAA2012

 

The numbers cited above include civilians and combatants killed by members of the opposing nationality (and therefore, do not include Palestinians killed by an explosive device that they set or was on their person, Israelis killed in 'friendly fire' incidents, etc.). The numbers also do not include the sizable number of Palestinians who died as a result of inability to reach medical care due to Israeli road closures, curfews, the Israeli closure of border crossing from Gaza, etc.

Maybe if the Palestinians weren't so anxious to martyr themselves they might be able to take out a few more Jews, even the numbers up a bit for you.

Maybe we could talk about this Palestinian woman, Wafa al-Biri, who was receiving FREE treatment from Israeli doctors for burns she received in a cooking accident.

She tried to murder them all.

Considering the hateful television shows that Hamas airs on al-AqsaTV, I wonder if there is ANYONE in Gaza who doesn't harbor murderous hate for the Jews - children included.



I shed tears for the children in this conflict that are being indoctrinated to hate from the time they can pay attention to a TV, I really do. What is happening to them is CHILD ABUSE, and I hope that every single member of Hamas burns for it.

reply to post by OperationIraqiFailure

Wrong, wrong, and wrong.

What, what, what are you talking about? Where did I mention Ahmadinejads 'wipe israel off the map' statement? And if you have a brain, you will notice that there is little difference between "erase Israel from the annuls of time" and "wipe Israel off the map".

They are both metaphors referring to Israels being eliminated. One uses the idea of time, the other a physical map. The fact that people even make such an astronomical difference between the two shows how pathetically stupid they are.

Now, the fact that you jumped on to that, and failed to take awareness of the "death to Israel" chants at Ayatollah Khameini and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad (among others) party gatherings, not only shows your inattention to important and relevant details, but also shows your complete and utter fanaticism.

reply to post by OperationIraqiFailure

Star for that one. I completely forgot that Israel plays by her own rules during wartime as well.

Want to give me an example of that?? Which war? '48, '67, '73??

You are a total fanatic.

Originally posted by thehoneycomb
reply to post by Sissel

 

Right. Just keep your head in the sand. That should provide plenty of cover.

And you choose to overlook the fact that Iran has always said if we are attacked. They have 300 years of not starting a war backing that statement up too bad America and Israel can't say the same.

The video is complete bull# and warmongering at it's worst. The US engages in perpetual war and it's stupid citizens believe it is to protect the USA. Shame on you.

reply to post by TheMaverick

Lets not play silly here, you know, i know, the whole world knows israel has nuclear weapons, and quite a few aswell, now the fact they haven't been used yet, means nothing, as you know if israel use these nuclear weapons they claim not to have tomorrow on another nation, russia and china would react with extreme force, and so would most of the west, now as much as zionist israel leaves a bad taste in my mouth, they are far from stupid and know how to play the global chess game very well, and wouldn't use these weapons unless checkmated.

You guys suffer from a bizarre issue with not being able to reason properly.

You chose to harp on this, instead of understanding that Israel, like America, like France, like Great Britain, like Russia, like China, they are secularists. They are humanists. Do you not understand how this detail is important? Now look at Iran. Do you know anything much about it? Have you read anything on the Iranian revolution? Or Ayatollah Khomeini's Revolutionary political-theology? If you don't, you're ignoring absolutely critical pieces of information.

One of the worse things I find of online internet propaganda is, unlike the 'die hard' supporters of mainstream pro-government news, internet fanatics who get their information through Alex Jones, Mike Riveiro, etc can't see anything but evil in the American government, going in the exact opposite direction, while holding an almost religious naivete for a theocratic regime like the one in Iran. And even Iran's political scientists know how to make use of this! Look at how Ahmadinejad panders to this crowd when he says "9/11 was an inside job". That was mainly FOR YOU people. You guys can help him; you are the 'useless idiots' which Iranian political scientists make clever use of.

We have to assess this rationally, from BOTH sides. The fact is, Islamism is the biggest immediate menace facing the world today. Ron Paul, Libertarian doctrine, none of that ideology takes serious regard of the threat, simply because they close their eyes and hyper-focus on just one issue: the 'domestic' problem of the federal reserve and the IRS and foreign spending etc etc. Essentially disregarding the larger geopolitical context Americans exist in.

This is a very fine example of people who don't apply the logic of philosophy to the problems facing our world. If you look at the Islamic world - 1.5 billion people - you have Shia radicals in government in Iran, Sunni Islamists in government in Egypt, various Islamist groups vying for power in Libya, Syria and Tunisia. You have internecine war in Lebanon and Iraq, both governments could swing into either Sunni or Shia hands.. And nobody cares to read about Sayd Qutb, Hassan Al Banna, Tariq Ramadan, Yosef Al-Qaratawi etc.

Horrible myopic thinking. You need to address the fact and do something to protect yourself from it. We exist in the larger context of a geopolitical cultural struggle between 'secularism' and 'Islamism'. Thus, libertarian' government wouldn't exactly be a wise choice to address such a fact, since a central government rationally needs to be in place in order to gather the resources and ability needed to combat it.

Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by OperationIraqiFailure

 

Star for that one. I completely forgot that Israel plays by her own rules during wartime as well.

Want to give me an example of that?? Which war? '48, '67, '73??

You are a total fanatic.

18 December 1947 Al Khisas, Safed
31 December 1947 Balad al-Shaykh massacre, Haifa
14 Feb 1948 Sa'Sa', Safed
13 & 16 March 1948 Al-Husayniyya, District of Safed
9 April 1948 Deir Yassin, Jerusalem
29 October 1948 Saf Saf, Safed

Now let's talk about Israels use of White Phosphorus on a UN school which is also a war crime.

Israel accused of indiscriminate phosphorus use in Gaza

Israel's military fired white phosphorus over crowded areas of Gaza repeatedly and indiscriminately in its three-week war, killing and injuring civilians and committing war crimes, Human Rights Watch said today. In a 71-page report, the rights group said the repeated use of air-burst white phosphorus artillery shells in populated areas of Gaza was not incidental or accidental, but revealed "a pattern or policy of conduct". It said the Israeli military used white phosphorus in a "deliberate or reckless" way. The report says: • Israel was aware of the dangers of white phosphorus. • It chose not to use alternative and less dangerous smoke shells. • In one case, Israel even ignored repeated warnings from UN staff before hitting the main UN compound in Gaza with white phosphorus shells on 15 January.

Gaza white phosphorus: 'They say that Israel used white phosphorus in a way that killed civilians'

reply to post by dontreally


you should be mindful of Israels Samson option. fire up the google and have a peak at Isreals threat to destroy the civilized world if it does not get its way.

Why waste a perfectly good nuke on Israel when the US is available? Has anyone ever thought that perhaps Iran is preparing for a major Jihad against the US? And in the end will be sacrificing their entire country for the good of Allah? It takes much more than small isolated terrorist attacks to destroy America.. This would be the untilmate in terrorism. But likely never considered by our weak Obama regime.

reply to post by dontreally

to want nuclear energy THIS MUCH, to sacrifice your entire economy, to let your currency drop 80% (so far) to bring this needless suffering on your population - it just doesn't make rational sense

At first I thought you were talking about the US as it really matched our circumstances.....but then I saw Iran....and the thread devolved into ATS's most favorite topic: Islam vs Judaism....

...going away now...

reply to post by thehoneycomb


How is that Anti-Semetic? There are Jews, and there are Zionist Jews. The Zionists are the ones who are causing the problems, because they think they are entitled to that land.

They are not. Most of Israel's population i.e. the Zionists is made up of Eastern European Jews called Khazars, who are not even remotely ethnically Hebrew...just a Turkic race who's leader adopted Judaism in the Middle Ages, wanting to be a Jewish kingdom and thus control the world based from an idea appropriated from ethnic Hebrews- that they are God's Chosen people.


Sauce/Source

Originally posted by dontreally

One need merely be mindful of the messianic anticipations of Shia Islam to take the videos warnings seriously.

The video says at one point: "Should Iran be so suicidally insane", and that made me think: to want nuclear energy THIS MUCH, to sacrifice your entire economy, to let your currency drop 80% (so far) to bring this needless suffering on your population - it just doesn't make rational sense. There is something inexorable and monomaniacal about Iran's pursuit of nuclear technology that counters any rational desire to 'challenge' world opinion, and it seems no economic deterrent will make them stop. A democratic nation would have stopped long ago. It's people would have brought it to an end; but no Iran.

The only possible, plausible, and indeed, likely explanation, is that Iran's Shia Islamic revolutionary doctrine of 'preparing the way for the the 12th imam' involves destabilizing the world. And they will go to whatever extent to do it. Including, building, transporting, and deploying a bomb in Israel.

edit on 23-10-2012 by dontreally because: (no reason given)

You make a pretty good point.

Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by beezzer

 

In another thread, I likened nuclear weapons to fire arms.

Or, perhaps in a delusion, you killed someone because you believed he posed a threat.

Haha! That makes me think of US police officers!!

They do it all the time these days! Maybe we should re-check their mental illness statuses?

Peace out