A question to the vets of Iraq and Afghanistan what are you saving us from?

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep


Because you do make a difference and have a positive influence on the lives of others. Selfless Service my friend. Maybe my country shouldn't have been in Iraq. I volunteered to go there so I could say in good conscious that something good came out of it. And after 18 horrible months...I saw enough good to volunteer and go back. You can have whatever unjustified opinion of what's going on over there that you choose, but as I've said before, you couldn't possible know. Keep picking and choosing what you acknowledge and see.

...we're saving your whiney little pansy @55 from actually having to go out and fight for the freedoms you so casually take for granted.

we may not like the politicians, but we love our country.

reply to post by mademyself1984

Because you do make a difference and have a positive influence on the lives of others. Selfless Service my friend. Maybe my country shouldn't have been in Iraq. I volunteered to go there so I could say in good conscious that something good came out of it. And after 18 horrible months...I saw enough good to volunteer and go back. You can have whatever unjustified opinion of what's going on over there that you choose, but as I've said before, you couldn't possible know. Keep picking and choosing what you acknowledge and see.

Its not about having an "unjustified" opinion of whats going on there mate. Its about what America is doing there in the first place? I am sure even people serving there doesn't know the answer to that question. Just following orders....

Furthermore, I am adressing the question of the OP. Are the soldiers over there saving Americans from terrorism? Fighting people that might invade America? I doubt that. I know you guys are only the soldiers, following whatever orders are given. Yet you chose to go into this willingly.

If a young kid enlists today in America, chances are he will get shipped to the middle east. So saying "I didn't sign up for the war in the middle east" is frankly bs. And just like the OP, I am also not sure what the American people are being saved from.

vvv

Originally posted by acacko
...we're saving your whiney little pansy @55 from actually having to go out and fight for the freedoms you so casually take for granted.

we may not like the politicians, but we love our country.

What freedoms would American people NOT have if the American war machine were to leave the middle east?

vvv

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep


Why is it so difficult to comprehend...I think it stands to reason that the United States is (at this point) fighting for Afghanistan, not the United States. The same could have been said about Iraq. Maybe the circumstances that got the United States involved in those two countries were "muddy"...and I won't disagree with that. Again...selfless service...if you can't decipher what that could possibly mean, and how that could possibly apply to a young soldier enlisting into the service, knowing he will most likely find himself in Afghanistan, than I cannot further answer your question. That is the answer. Again. For about the 5th time.

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep


It's not about the "American War Machine" protecting the freedoms of Americans...September 11th is what got us involved in Afghanistan/Iraq. Right or wrong, that is a different conversation. The reason we are still involved, is because there is an enemy there, and the people of Afghanistan want them out. This isn't about OUR freedom...it's about THEIR freedom...again...you will continue to ask your "rhetorical" question over and over again, and I will continue to give the same answer, and you will ask "but what does it have to do with Americans? How are you helping Americans? How are you protecting Americans". And I will continue to tell you that it is minutely about Americans. And you will continue to not accept that answer as if you have some knowledge about either war (Iraq or Afghanistan) that I do not. I spent nearly 3 years of my life defending those people. Now you can tell me that "I wasn't defending them", or "they didn't want me there", or "I didn't belong there", and I will maintain that you are full of #, because you weren't there, and you couldn't possibly know.

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep


Its a very simple concept, I can't believe you don't understand it. Police are needed to be trained before someone calls 911, sergeans are needed to be trained before people need an operation....etc

Joining the military after a foreign power rapes your homeland is worthless, soldiers take months to train, and longer to gain the valuable experience necessary to wage and win wars. The answer should have been obvious already, it isn't even a jump of logic, it is a very small step.

Your the very people that fail to understand a very simple concept, patriots join to be ready to protect their homeland not kill others in theirs, once you are in however, you don't get to decide which fights are worth your time, the politicians do that, vote in better leaders, and your problem is solved.

Your laying blame on the soldiers, not the decision makers that are forcing good selfless people to do "bad" things, in other countries.

Place blame where it belongs, on the same leaders you keep voting into power, not on those that volunteered to risk their lives to protect you and your family.

reply to post by mademyself1984


Let me refer you to what I was actually answering too :

...we're saving your whiney little pansy @55 from actually having to go out and fight for the freedoms you so casually take for granted. we may not like the politicians, but we love our country.

And now to what you say:

This isn't about OUR freedom...it's about THEIR freedom.

So it would appear not all of the soldiers that fought there, felt like you, or even understood it as deeply as you. You see, this is what causes confusion. Its like all soldiers that served, had a different reason for serving.

and I will maintain that you are full of #, because you weren't there, and you couldn't possibly know.

Mate, keep on calling me whatever you want. I do ask you however, do not make assumptions about me. So far I have been civil. It would appear we see it from different angles, and would be best left as such.

Do you really think the war in Afghan is to help the locals? That America stands nothing to gain from it?

vvv

reply to post by inverslyproportional

Your the very people that fail to understand a very simple concept, patriots join to be ready to protect their homeland not kill others in theirs, once you are in however, you don't get to decide which fights are worth your time, the politicians do that, vote in better leaders, and your problem is solved.

I understand completely the premise you are using. However, if a kid enlist today, he knows, he will be send to the middle east. Saying he doesn't, is just pure ignorance.

vvv

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep


Of course it will help them. No more Taliban harboring in their country/backyards.
Of course America gains from it. As a previous poster stated, it is valuable experience, 1 potential threat is possibly 1 future plot/attack averted, and friendship/allies are gained.
And I maintain that you cannot possibly know what you would like to believe you do regarding America's occupation of Afghanistan or Iraq. Most people don't. Reason: They haven't been there and seen it with their own eyes.It's awfully easy to take snapshots of any situation and build a case for or against it.

reply to post by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep


Um whiskey tango foxtrot over?

So when nobody joins, and they simply stop loss all the current military serving, forcing them to remain in what changes?

So when nobody jins and they don't stop loss anyone, and the military empties out completely, what do we do when another country attacks us?

Your ignorance is pure and simple stupidity, have you even thought more than one sentence ahead of anything your saying, your arguments make no sense at all. People joining or not joining will change nothing, they will just draft Americans if people don't join, the onus is not on the soldiers, it is on the .gov, as I havve stated and others also many times now just in this thread, they will have their wars, until sombody can make them stop.

Originally posted by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep
reply to post by inverslyproportional

 

Your the very people that fail to understand a very simple concept, patriots join to be ready to protect their homeland not kill others in theirs, once you are in however, you don't get to decide which fights are worth your time, the politicians do that, vote in better leaders, and your problem is solved.

I understand completely the premise you are using. However, if a kid enlist today, he knows, he will be send to the middle east. Saying he doesn't, is just pure ignorance.

vvv

Of course those that enlist today know that they are going to be fighting. Selfless Service...like I said...this answer will repeat itself over and over again, and it is the best answer to the question that the OP asked. I knew when I enlisted I was going to eventually find myself in Iraq or Afghanistan. That was why I enlisted. Selfless Service. If you don't understand that concept, then you will not be satisfied with any answer any good American soldier gives you.

reply to post by inverslyproportional

Your ignorance is pure and simple stupidity, have you even thought more than one sentence ahead of anything your saying

Wow, time for the personal attacks now? Carry on.

Your patriotism is blinding you, but that is your choice. We have reached a status quo in this, and I really don't want to stoop to the level of name calling, and insults.

Peace be with you.

vvv

Originally posted by VreemdeVlieendeVoorwep
reply to post by inverslyproportional

 

Your ignorance is pure and simple stupidity, have you even thought more than one sentence ahead of anything your saying

Wow, time for the personal attacks now? Carry on.

Your patriotism is blinding you, but that is your choice. We have reached a status quo in this, and I really don't want to stoop to the level of name calling, and insults.

Peace be with you.

vvv

Nobody is "blinded by patriotism". Soldiers are constantly called "sheep", accused of being "brainwashed" and "blind". Explain to me, please, how you, the media, or anyone else for that matter...could possibly be more "enlightened" about either the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan, than the soldiers who fought them. The vast majority of people who criticize the wars, have never served a day in the military, and have no ground to stand on when being critical of soldiers. I am a subject matter expert. You, my friend...are not.

Originally posted by inverslyproportional
One day my friend, one day a conversation just like this will happen again, except this time, it will be more along the lines "I can't believe that people actully used to have wars!" " oh yes they did, over many stupid things and concepts" "no they didn't, that doesn't make sense" " yes they did, they were told it was necessary" " how can killing your own people be necessary" " well back then they weren't a people, they had different countries, and religions" " religions? Countries? What were those? Are you sure they were real?" " oh yes and they didn't trust eachother, and so they would fight and kill millions just out of greed and fear" " what's greed?" " well they used to not have enough for everyone because sme people horded millions of times more than they needed, forcing millions not to have enough, s they would............."

This post you made, inverslyproportional, gave me goosebumps and brought a tear to my eye. I only hope that one day I will have this kind of conversation with my children.

I would stand up and defend my country if we were being invaded. Not if my country decided to invade another country, only if my country was in peril.

reply to post by RecentlyAwaken

It doesn't matter if what you believe is popular or understood by others. What matters is it's something you believe it so deeply you are willing to leave your family, friends and everything you know because you believe you can make a difference.

Sounds like a emotional manipulation.

What are the fruits of these actions ?

IMO ,those suicide bombers think the same. But they are born in a different geography.

Until you do that, you'll never understand what true commitment is, therefore the answer to your question really doesn't matter because it's the question itself that's irrelevent.

Sounds like freemason brotherhood to me

First they involve you in act and then they let you face the results and consequences.

I'm sure you'll reply to my post with some BS about what you believe, why those in the Military are stupid/mindless robots doing a job for the uber elite and not saving any one from anything...and to be totally honest, I could care less what you rant...it's circular logic that only suits your delusion of intelligence.

Seems that you have filled you ears ,too.

To my brothers/sisters in arms - God Speed/Semper Fi - *Salute*

Emotion , pride and arrogance.

Maybe you should had added something more . Like "we invade and kill because we can".

Then you could complete the role of bullying blindly.

It's funny...just last night, a friend told me that he sent a letter to our Senator saying, "Why don't you realize we have enough military power to destroy the world?"

The answer he received from this Senator: "Why don't you realize we have to defend our country?"

Obviously, he agreed with my friend's allegation of such military power - so my question in return: if we have that much power, what are we defending against?!?!

reply to post by AfterInfinity

"Why don't you realize we have to defend our country?"

The most recent hypocrisy made public.

US is defending itself in other countries.

Maybe he meant the one world government ? then his statement could make sense.

Originally posted by mideast
reply to post by RecentlyAwaken

 

It doesn't matter if what you believe is popular or understood by others. What matters is it's something you believe it so deeply you are willing to leave your family, friends and everything you know because you believe you can make a difference.

Sounds like a emotional manipulation.

What are the fruits of these actions ?

IMO ,those suicide bombers think the same. But they are born in a different geography.

Until you do that, you'll never understand what true commitment is, therefore the answer to your question really doesn't matter because it's the question itself that's irrelevent.

Sounds like freemason brotherhood to me

First they involve you in act and then they let you face the results and consequences.

I'm sure you'll reply to my post with some BS about what you believe, why those in the Military are stupid/mindless robots doing a job for the uber elite and not saving any one from anything...and to be totally honest, I could care less what you rant...it's circular logic that only suits your delusion of intelligence.

Seems that you have filled you ears ,too.

To my brothers/sisters in arms - God Speed/Semper Fi - *Salute*

Emotion , pride and arrogance.

Maybe you should had added something more . Like "we invade and kill because we can".

Then you could complete the role of bullying blindly.

"Sounds like. Seems like. IMO." Bottom line, is you haven't served, so you wouldn't know. Keep grasping straws, by all means.