What Muslims think about mocking prophets

Originally posted by khimbar

Originally posted by mideast

Freedom is not equal mocking each other's belief.

Actually it is. It's the freedom to do exactly that, otherwise it's not freedom is it.

I totally mock the Christians, because I grew up on Christian dogma, but I think 'freedom' is not everything you can do, but rather being free to express to the world what you decided not to do. You show the world, by example, that you understand that you were born free to do whatever you wish, yet you choose to get along with other free beings in a community.

It may be an epiphany to understand you're a free being, but it is a realization to understand that that freedom carries with it responsibility. You are free to imagine a world where we all get along. You're free to stop yourself from participating in the banality of error.

Originally posted by steve1709
reply to post by mideast

 

Mideast, in your OP you say that you don't defend the aggression of some of your more radical brothers and sisters, but there's one thing with everything you have written. I take great offence at the need to put the "peace be upon him" whenever your so called hero's name is mentioned. It literally makes my stomach turn. Don't know why, it just does. So, since you expect your hero to have hi name held in high esteme will you reciprocate please by not putting that rediculous "pbuh" etc after this mortal's name? Fair's fair hey?

Respectfully

Steve

I use pbuh , like I say I love him.

I love all the prophets and I should use it for all the saint people. Those people stood strongly and patiently. This is not easy.

Your reply shows me that we agree on many aspects.

So let me show my love and respect.

reply to post by mideast


I am sorry but there is something about this I just cannot buy. I may be jumping the gun or just thinking on a different level than where you intend your audience to be but it does not ring true to me and almost looks as though to make Islam look worse rather then give a real defense of a widely reported sense of rage that is also not adding up.

I have Muslim friends who were all born in America. The idea of them not being Westerners because of their religion does not make any more sense to them than it did to me. To differentiate the two is to attempt to build a wall between parallel lines to prevent them from bumping into each other.

You being oddly; somehow differentiating your own self from the very group you claim to be part of and speaking in perhaps on behalf of.

Originally posted by mideast
As a Muslims , I tell you what the Muslims may be thinking about mocking their special prophet. The one who brought their holy book for them.

Why would "'You' as a Muslim" refer to "them, their book, and their profit?"
Do you as a Muslim have a different profit, holy book, etc? What else is different between your being a Muslim and Muslims who are Muslims?

They think that west is moving to a new age of lust and disbelieving.

This has been started for years ,now.

Those who started mocking religion and prophets. Lets call them disbelieving prophets.

They brought the grammar to daily life of western people.

So what? My Muslim friends are not concerned with who "Westerners" worship. They do not see themselves as a group outside "Westerners" so the very thought of being concerned with whom they pray to is at the very least puzzling.

Originally posted by mideast
They are used to mock everything religious they get , holiness , Mary , Jesus and ... in their entertainment shows.

At the end of the day , a young western teenager may think "who is Jesus who is being mocked ? . This is a joke . the whole religion is a joke. lets make joke. let's do anything bad and see what the consequence is"

Muslims don't want this to happen for them.

Obviously the you as a Muslim speaking to the West has been beaten to death. What is more odd here is your constantly referring to Jesus. If Jesus is their prophet anyway, they are not following your religion. That whole ignoring Mohammed as a prophet kind of kills that, does it not? So why would you both care about their mocking of religion along with the concern for their religion which is obviously not your religion.

If Jesus is their one and only prophet and they are mocking him. The only way to rectify that is to have them show their one prophet- Jesus - respect. So then you are still stuck with the dilemma that they are not following your religion and doing it well.

So now you are concerned that people who practice other religions than your own are not doing it the way you feel that they should. If they all began practicing their religion the way you feel they should, would they not still be in need of your concern for the fact that they are falling for lies and following a false god? Otherwise why care if they pray to or mock their prophet?

Originally posted by mideast
Muslims (generally) have and they will stand for the honor of their special prophet (peace be upon him).

Any place in your post that should have replaced "they" with "we" this really seems like it should have been it. Nice of you as a Muslim to worry about their prophet. And you already missed a few PBUMs anyway so that inconstancy leaps out big time but that is probably my OCD.

Here it gets deep though, I think?

Originally posted by mideast
Muslims (generally) have and they will stand for the honor of their special prophet (peace be upon him).

I suggest those Christians stand for their belief and respect their special prophet ,too.

We can live in peace with respect boundaries of freedom.

Freedom is not equal mocking each others' belief.

What about the other hundred or so religions? You have reserved no place for them. Atheists seem to be as left out as any Buddhist, Jew, Scientologist, Amish, you get it. I can just go Abrahamic forever here but I cannot pretend to be that well versed on the names of all religions and their respective gods/prophets.

You want peace but just between those two religions? What of all others? Why again would you care if people follow a false religion but do it well?

Why cannot we live in peace and freedom now? Is that a threat? I am free to mock Jesus, Mary, Mohammed, or anyone else I so choose. You are the one suggesting I not be so free because for some reason it bothers you.

Originally posted by rabzdguy
Why do muslims always use the west as an example?

there is many other countries, who arent like the west..who still wont believe in prophets or religion.

Eg. North Korea

Because they don't want to take over the planet and impose what they think.

About your comment about religion.

I just wanna say something honestly.

As I look at my past , I see many points of my life which I have been told about the truth. I was sure 100 %. But I betrayed it.

So , why is it necessary to show me the truth again ? I have betrayed it already. All I maybe get is a mercy from god to show me some part of it. There is no contradiction in truth. Like you said.

Then I can live and ask for more by respecting that piece.

You sent a reply and you showed you care.

So , this is my reply and I show that I care , too.

Peace.

These religions are the most insidious thing to ever exist

Sadly the followers don't realize that if there is a devil surely that is who is behind what we call most religion not God

What a brilliant method of self preservation though, if ever anything arises to challenge essentially retarded and superstitious notions the have a story of the "end times" and in our case the "anti christ"

People come in here and post about what America is doing to Islam but in all reality what does religion do? convince people the world will end, Take credit for every disaster man made or otherwise and claim it's because someone didn't follow some law?

"Islam doesn't want this to happen to them"

What women having orgasms? People freed from demands like marriage that currently overpopulate and enslave? "don't get me wrong it can be nice but not when you feel like you Must...

What kind of philosophy basically manipulates people into destroying every other school of thought? it's sickening

Mohammed says...

No one else cares what Mohammed said , stop with the overly polite speak, it's phony, your like the murder from Serenity always speaking so lovely while explaining why everyone else needs to be purged.

Originally posted by mideast
I started this thread to make some thing clear for other members.

+ I don't defend those who threaten western people.

Love and peace.

edit on 3-10-2012 by mideast because: (no reason given)

Apparently the character limit of posts has a keen sense of timing. So I get to make one more post just to make sure I acknowledge all that you said and not to appear to take you out of context.

I am not clear on what you wanted to make clear.
I also feel somewhat threatened. I feel like you told me (I am a Westerner) should worship Jesus better.
I only feel a tad of a threat due to the huge amount of dishonesty I feel here.

I must admit, and should have been upfront. English is probably not your first language and I am probably reading into that something unintended.

Other than verbs of being coinciding, the point is clear.
You see a world full of Muslims and Westerners. Never the two shall meet but the ones that are not you, are doing what they do wrong and you do not like it.

I find it hard to believe this is sincere. It seems more designed to enflame. Then again, you might just be like part of every other group on the planet.

No matter how you divide and define yourself, every group shares one common thread; that guy. They all have one.

Please take this not as a jab for the fun of jabbing. It aggravates my carpel-tunnel anyway. I mean this all with respect but it the limit of my respect from my perspective that is defined by the reality of what is my perception. Empty words, yadda yadda, nonsense and so on.

I do look forward to seeing where this goes with the amazing representative so of most Western Extremes that exist being here and how your responses progress.

Blessings be upon you.

Originally posted by penninja
No one else cares what Mohammed said , stop with the overly polite speak, it's phony, your like the murder from Serenity always speaking so lovely while explaining why everyone else needs to be purged.

The Operative: I'm sorry. If your quarry goes to ground, leave no ground to go to. You should have taken my offer. Or did you think none of this was your fault?

Capt. Malcolm Reynolds: I don't murder children.

The Operative: I do. If I have to.

Capt. Malcolm Reynolds: Why? Do you even know why they sent you?

The Operative: It's not my place to ask. I believe in something greater than myself. A better world. A world without sin.

Capt. Malcolm Reynolds: So me and mine gotta lay down and die... so you can live in your better world?

The Operative: I'm not going to live there. There's no place for me there... any more than there is for you. Malcolm... I'm a monster.What I do is evil. I have no illusions about it, but it must be done

Originally posted by khimbar
And then explain why muslims should be the exception, other than the numbers you claim

Because they will kill you -

www.thereligionofpeace.com...

Nobody argues against freedom of speech when they like what is being said. It is when mocking, insults, hate is being spewed, when freedom of speech is truly tested.

Also, religion is not special in any way, it is just another ideology. We can mock liberals, conservatives, democrats, republicans, nazis etc. I dont see why we shouldnt also mock atheists, christians and muslims.

Why are you trying to oppress me OP?

Don't you live in Pakistan or something other middle eastern country?

Originally posted by Alxandro
The way I see it God has a sense of humor.
..and yes it is the same God all we believers worship, just under a different name.

May I ask a question as an outsider or observer. I am not claiming to be atheist, Atheist, or of any particular religion. I am just someone looking in from out and I have a few holy books. My library is very empty and needs filling but what I do have I feel I have at least read and understood to a point. I may be wrong.

I count at least 3 different gods in the Christian bible so I am wondering which of those is it that all you believers worship?

Is someone who has a religion or faith that is void any deities to worship, are they not believers?
Sorry I guess that is two questions.

Originally posted by rabzdguy
Why do muslims always use the west as an example?

there is many other countries, who arent like the west..who still wont believe in prophets or religion.

Eg. North Korea

How can islam cater for the koreans?

Can islam unite south and north korea?

If so..it would of been doen long ago..


Religion is a sinking boat on a ocean of lies

I had not really thought it about it as you have put it but it certainly begs the question. If the problems of violence and war in the Middle East are over beliefs then why are Muslim extremists not all over China? Do they have many Muslims in China? Isn't that one of those communist countries.

This thread is far more terrifying than suicide bombers....lol

Originally posted by mideast

Originally posted by muse7
Don't mean to offend but

This whole thing is just childish don't you think? Why do you people care if someone makes fun of the god you worship?

This is a polite reply.

We think that we should respect each other's belief. Those disbelievers can mock prophets anytime they want. But they shouldn't do it in general entertainment and mass mind injection media tools.

There are always boundaries for freedom everywhere.

I think respect is a reasonable boundary of freedom. Specially respecting group of people.

But I have to wonder where the lines become drawn. It is noble to not want to offend groups but what groups are to be considered? You only give us Christians and Muslims. My sister the girls she hangs out with are a group and seem to be offended by anything and everything. They are a a group. At what point are we only able to show respect to any group at all by just never again saying or writing another word?

Originally posted by mideast
reply to post by benrl

 

The christian God says that if you even look at another Human with anger in your eyes you have committed murder.
That when slapped you offer the other cheek to be slapped as well.
The christian Bible also says a time of great apostasy will happen in the Church, where people will fall away from their beliefs.
The christian God says that we should not seek vengeance as it is his to deal out, not ours. 

Be honest with yourself.
Is this what we see west is doing to the world ?
No.
Then we don't see religion ruling western countries.
So , why is that ?
That is because religion has been fading away from people's lives.
They talk about love and they invade and kill.
I said this to confirm my words that religion is fading away generally in west.

Religion isn't fading away in the west, but faith and obedience to Christ Jesus is fading away. Why? It's been deceptively killed off through the introduction of the love of sin and new religions in a secular age which promote no eternal judgement for their sins - atheism, humanism, ufology, eastern mysticism etc. Each of these promote a "creation story", new morals and ethics and unbeknownst to it's adherents, spiritual death by the rejection of the Creator's only provision for salvation - Christ Jesus. And by doing so, the western nations are destroying their wall of protection which held back the forces of paganism and Satan for countless centuries. Israel, the people, live in Babylon. That's the west. But just as Cyrus, the king of Persia, destroyed physical Babylon releasing Judah, so will another King of Persia rise and attack Babylon, destroying it. This will bring the House of Israel's physical captivity in Babylon to an end once and for all. 

Unfortunately for the unsaved world, the rise of the king of Persia not only means their death but signals the return of their rejected Saviour, Christ Jesus,  and His impending wrath upon a disbelieving world. The Islamic faith and the return of paganism in the east is simply a tool of God's wrath to destroy this world. The world is clearly demonstrating the rise of the East, yet the children in the west, Godless, have no understanding that their very rejection of the Saviour of many of their forefathers is the very method by which the chains of the destroying angels of the Euphrates are loosened. 

Islam, with it's affinity and ties to paganism and eastern mysticism, is but a force of Satan that will be allowed by the Creator to carry out the destruction of Babylon so that His people can go home and to inflict His wrath upon a world sunk into pure evil, violence and wickedness. The Iranian President stood at the UN last week telling this world of the impending return of the Mahdi, yet to the Godless west, they laughed never once understanding that his rise signals the arrival of the son of perdition (destruction). The dark knight rises. Aurora (dawn). Phosphorus - Venus - the "light bringer". The Masonic god of chaos. Death to the world in full rebellion to it's Creator. But more importantly, the imminent return of the true Light, Christ Jesus, who will gather those in Him still alive and resurrect all of the dead to either life with Him or to destruction. This world's death sentence will be carried out, and the stay of exucution obtained by Christ Jesus, will end after 2,000. His blessed salvation will end. Looking at the world today, there is a choice to be made quickly - good and life or evil and death.

This thread was made to inform some people about the truth.

People better get some time to think about it instead of rushing to send replies.

+ I am getting some time to think about other's comments , myself.

There are many boundaries and limits in freedom of other aspects of life.

Social respect can be a good boundary for freedom of speech.

specially for the ones who choose to believe.

Originally posted by mideast
This thread was made to inform some people about the truth.

People better get some time to think about it instead of rushing to send replies.

+ I am getting some time to think about other's comments , myself.

There are many boundaries and limits in freedom of other aspects of life.

Social respect can be a good boundary for freedom of speech.

specially for the ones who choose to believe.

edit on 3-10-2012 by mideast because: (no reason given)

You are the only one suggesting boundaries to freedom and you are suggesting to other people. I do not see you being at all concerned that Wahabi terrorism is a huge slap in the face of your god. Instead all you have posted is how you feel people of a completely different culture should practice one particular religion to your satisfaction.

I do not even understand any more why you started. At first it seemed like misguided compassion mixed with my original suspicion of more or less being a mock post.

Now that I see you are way to worried about Westerners not giving Mary proper respect but not a peep about all the Muslims that are not being good Muslims.

Shouldn't you as a Muslim be far more worried about bad Muslims than bad Christians?

Originally posted by mideast
There are many boundaries and limits in freedom of other aspects of life.

Then it isn't freedom.

reply to post by Andcoulter

Shouldn't you as a Muslim be far more worried about bad Muslims than bad Christians?

This is simple.

Wahhabis are not Muslims

And those who call them selves Christian + they know the lessons of Jesus + they don't do as Jesus did = they are not Christian.

They are a shell of Christian + I wanna do what I please . Like wahhabis.

West created Wahhabis to achieve it's goal. It is clear in history.

+ What that I don't talk about , doesn't mean that I am satisfied with it + I am concerned with many other facts but I don't discuss them in this thread.

peace.

Originally posted by khimbar

Originally posted by mideast
There are many boundaries and limits in freedom of other aspects of life.

Then it isn't freedom.

Then , it is a value that people accept despite their freedom.

That is what makes human beings valuable.

They can choose to do or not to do what they know. They are born free. But that is not all the challenge.

being good and doing it is the challenge.

There are many good values in western laws , and this can be a good value ,too.