Even if evolution isn't true - the evidence still exist ( that a perfect God didn't create us)

Think about it. Even if evolution was disproved tomorrow, that will not change the fact that skeletons of ancient forms of humans still exist. If God is perfect and knows everything, why would he need to experiment with different forms of humans for a certain length of time before creating them as they should be? Shouldn't he have gotten it right the first time?

Also, there are many forms of humans which would mean that "God" would have had to experiment quite a few times on these many different forms of humans...

If the bible is true, why wasn't this mentioned? What type of human was Adam and Eve? All of this is just speculation. The obvious answer is that we need more research not just "God did it". This is an argument of ignorance because for any question in the world people can say "God did it". Imagine if someone said "How does rain happen" and that say "God did it" instead of doing the RESEARCH and actually learning about the rain cycle of precipitation, evaporation, condensation.... we would still be living in the dark ages...


I'm not saying that there is no God, or even there is no God that created the universe, but I highly doubt a PERFECT God would need to experiment with so many differen forms of humans like this.

reply to post by arpgme


How do you know what's perfect? You could run into something that is perfect and say it's imperfect because it's not the way YOU like it. But since you're imperfect, something would have to be imperfect as well, in order to be perfect for you.

So you have no basis on which to say, "This isn't perfect", because you wouldn't know perfection if it slapped you.

Originally posted by arpgme
Think about it. Even if evolution was disproved tomorrow, that will not change the fact that skeletons of ancient forms of humans still exist. If God is perfect and knows everything, why would he need to experiment with different forms of humans for a certain length of time before creating them as they should be? Shouldn't he have gotten it right the first time?

Also, there are many forms of humans which would mean that "God" would have had to experiment quite a few times on these many different forms of humans...

If the bible is true, why wasn't this mentioned? What type of human was Adam and Eve? All of this is just speculation. The obvious answer is that we need more research not just "God did it". This is an argument of ignorance because for any question in the world people can say "God did it". Imagine if someone said "How does rain happen" and that say "God did it" instead of doing the RESEARCH and actually learning about the rain cycle of precipitation, evaporation, condensation.... we would still be living in the dark ages...


I'm not saying that there is no God, or even there is no God that created the universe, but I highly doubt a PERFECT God would need to experiment with so many differen forms of humans like this.

To say that "I exist
but God does not,'
Would be like saying
'mountains do not exist,
only large piles of stone.'

Is the sky ever 'un-perfect?' No. No matter what state it is in, it is always perfect. Yet it is always, constantly changing. And without the fluctuation of night and day, rain and shine, hot and cold, we wouldn't have the perfect, yet ever fluctuating, planet that we live on.

Evolution and God still go together, the ideas don't have to exist independently. Evolution is undeniable. We see bacteria and viruses evolving right before our eyes. Yet how would evolution ever even begin...how would this universe and energy and time and space even exist....if it weren't for a force, a creator of sorts?

God is experiencing itself through us. He isn't a little man in the clouds with a big white beard and a list of people to smite. God is an ever presence energy that permeates and connects all beings, all matter. God is an accumulation of energy, vibration, light and love (and so much more our 3-dimensional minds can't comprehend.)

In short, 'God DID do it. All of it.'
Science is just one way to describe 'how' God did what God did. If we want to understand with the logic and rational that we have been given, then 'science' will be the way to go. Science and God, just like Evolution and Creation, are not separate ideas. The thing with God is...nothing is separate.

reply to post by arpgme


Exactly most of the commonly held beliefs today are not corroborated by any evidence to satiate the vampiric scientific community today.

But that's why this era is so exciting! Endless possibility.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by arpgme

 

How do you know what's perfect? You could run into something that is perfect and say it's imperfect because it's not the way YOU like it.

I wouldn't say it's imperfect just because I don't like - but something doesn't seem right when an all-knowing god has to do "test runs" and "remake" these humans until he reached - from his OWN eyes - the perfect form of human....


reply to post by eleven44

Originally posted by eleven44
To say that "I exist
but God does not,'
Would be like saying
'mountains do not exist,
only large piles of stone.'

I wasn't saying there is no God - I was just saying I don't believe an all-knowing perfect God created us (directly).

If so, why would an all knowing God need to do test runs of different humans and THEN finally make the perfect version of humans after many TRIES?

(I only say perfect because this is the human species that is continuing to today, but if we aren't even the perfect human and this "God" will create an even better - that just makes it sound more suspicious - a perfect God should just create the "best" not anything lacking )

Nobody created anybody or anything. The universe exists because I experience it, and will vanish when I die (as far as I'm concerned, which is the only thing that matters). It's always been here. And that makes sense, because time is just an illusion, and there was no "before" or "after" anything. Now is now. The whole notion that you need some kind of "first cause" is flawed from the get-go.

reply to post by eleven44

To say that "I exist
but God does not,'
Would be like saying
'mountains do not exist,
only large piles of stone.'

Who first called the large piles of stone mountains?

reply to post by arpgme


How do we know that other versions of humans weren't perfectly created or didn't serve their full purpose?

reply to post by eleven44


Because supposedly humans (us) were created perfectly in God's image. So a human not in God's image is not perfectly designed.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by eleven44

 

To say that "I exist
but God does not,'
Would be like saying
'mountains do not exist,
only large piles of stone.'

Who first called the large piles of stone mountains?

"What's in a name? that which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet..."

Humans make up sounds to describe the essence of objects/emotions/ideas, even if we do not understand the full essence or magnitude of what that sound describes.
A million people can have a million different ideas or attachments to what a 'mountain' is. But regardless of their interpretation, the essence of the mountain still exists.


****
Or, a more direct answer to your question, "Who first called the large piles of stones 'mountains'?"
The same 'person' who called the self "I" and called others "Them."

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by eleven44

 

Because supposedly humans (us) were created perfectly in God's image. So a human not in God's image is not perfectly designed.

edit on 2-10-2012 by arpgme because: (no reason given)

In this moment, right Now (the only moment that has ever existed) you are created perfectly within God's image.

You will not be the same person tomorrow. You will definitely not be the same person in 15 years. Change happens. But nonetheless, you will always be made perfectly in God's image.

All of existence bubbles out from the heart of God. It is not even enough to say that 'We are in the heart of God,' for we truly ARE the heart of God.

I'm not trying to say I know everything or have all the answers: Far from it. But we must stop looking at "God" as "Something" separate from ourselves.

reply to post by eleven44


Yes, I'm talking about these bible people that believe that disproving evolution somehow proves The Bible (their God) correct...

God made one mistake>>>>>Free will. that was a big blunder.
Just thank we wouldnt have to thank for our self, we could just be his hobby but know he screwed up.

reply to post by madenusa


What if there is no free-will and we ARE being controlled just not aware of it?

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by madenusa

 

What if there is no free-will and we ARE being controlled just not aware of it?

Like the Matrix movie tells us by giving the participants free will is how the machines were able to make the manipulation near perfect.

Just like our reality, we have the freedom of choice however there are limits, when these limits are reached the concept of infinity must be implemented so as to disguise a closed loop the experience r is trapped in.

By introducing infinity it also creates an infinite cycle within a cycle within a cycle within the closed loop.

i generally don't believe in god, but hey, maybe god does exist and he made each race of humans as his playthings, then once he was bored of them he tossed them aside and made some new toys to play with. pretty soon he will get tired of toying with our lives and send some disaster to wipe us of the planet so he can start on a new project.

To 1 it appears to be a environment related situation. Each Creator creation environment suit it designed based on the attributes of the environment that creation will inhabit. So in essence the environment suits are just suitable for the locations the spirits inhabited them within... 1 would imagine if human spirits lived on MARS the spirit bodies were different there. And if humans for hypothetical example came from MARS to EA*RTH more attributes need adjusted.

Further today if humans and non humans were about to experience the entire universe change frequency that is to effect all beings within it then it would be logical to assume that all creator creations spirits/souls/internal energies present would require new bodies to incarnate their spirits/souls/internal energies within.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by arpgme

 

How do you know what's perfect? You could run into something that is perfect and say it's imperfect because it's not the way YOU like it. But since you're imperfect, something would have to be imperfect as well, in order to be perfect for you.

So you have no basis on which to say, "This isn't perfect", because you wouldn't know perfection if it slapped you.

What your argument implies is that if something were "perfect" (which is a total non-sequiter in the context of a god), there is no way anybody could possibly know about it.

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by madenusa

 

What if there is no free-will and we ARE being controlled just not aware of it?

Let's take a step further back still, what IS free will? Someone define it for me please. Because every description I've heard of it is meaningless.

reply to post by Tearman


Free will to 1 means you can accept or deny subjective reality? But as you stated many have their own POV of it.