I have accurate information from Middle East, Film is just a straw that broke the back

reply to post by Variable

They keep it up and large portions of them will get what they want.

That could be one reason why they want to kill us. That line of reasoning is nothing but a veiled threat.

If God's on their side how come their countries are so messed up?

Because our God told George Bush to bomb them?

Originally posted by Deetermined

Why don't you give us your take on both of these points?

oh ok sure, click on page one of this thread first post of the thread by me

and read the list

Or do something like this, just ignore the facts, settle with the indefinite war, indefinite debt,
indefinite search for solution as people die and will start to die in US too.

Good luck

Originally posted by neo96
Yeah really does irk one that we see all that bigots pandering here on ATS about the evil Isreal and never once,ever say a word about the invasion of illegals in this country, where murder,torture,fraud, and political pandering that circumvents US law all for a vote.

They take "our land",our money and never once a peep out of that crowd it is ridculous.

Are you serious ?

No really........so if you recognize that what Mexico is slowly doing to US borders is bad thing.

Then do you in fact recognize what Israel is doing to Palestinians and other arabs is a bad thing.

You caught yourself into this trap my friend, not me,

Originally posted by Bodhi911

Originally posted by LostPassword
Israel is the ONLY country that literally grows its borders by force and no
one in the western world says they shouldn't do it.

What about America? They are currently building bases all over Europe that will later be used for staging new attacks into the rest of the middle eastern countries having oil.

edit on 15-9-2012 by Bodhi911 because: (no reason given)

What are you talking about?We have closed down and returned almost every airbase in Europe I knew of. Most Army posts also I believe.

Originally posted by 46ACE
What are you talking about?We have closed down and returned almost every airbase in Europe I knew of .Many Army posts also I believe.

Are you kidding me, A multi-billion base has just been built in US sponsored breakaway MUSLIM country of Kosovo

Base so big and advanced they call it a CITY for crying out loud

Do you see Russian embassies attacked worldwide? No, because they haven't been starting foreign battles all over the world and staging coup's etc etc. Sure, Russia deals with terrorism but mostly "blow back" because of what happened in Chechnya .

reply to post by PatriotGames2


Good comments. I agree. It just seems such a stretch on so many levels. The puppet show is definitely in full swing. The sad part is it is so obvious yet some have a giant spoon in both hands and can't shovel it down fast enough. Amazing....

reply to post by LostPassword


Us broadcasts are not simocast in Hebrew are they?

Nope.
Press 2 for Hebrew nope.


Habla espanol

Si.

reply to post by intrptr

I really hope you don't reply an eye for an eye.

Nope, because I actually agree with everything you said in your post.

It doesn't really matter how involved or not involved we are in the Middle East.

It will be a ticking time bomb no matter what.

Originally posted by LostPassword

Originally posted by 46ACE
What are you talking about?We have closed down and returned almost every airbase in Europe I knew of .Many Army posts also I believe.

Are you kidding me, A multi-billion base has just been built in US sponsored breakaway MUSLIM country of Kosovo

Base so big and advanced they call it a CITY for crying out loud

Unfortunately We had to go into there to stop the "genocide"(as Europe twiddled its thumbs;sending in poor defenseless Dutch troops without ammunition...)

Eastern Europe

Air Bases in Bulgaria and Romania negotiated by diplomatic agreements for USAF use not included

Mostar Airport, Bosnia and Herzegovina (Closed 1997)
Taszár Air Base, Hungary (Closed 2010)
Tuzla Air Base, Bosnia and Herzegovina (Closed 2008)

en.wikipedia.org...


Airforce bases I am relatively sure were closed or returned to the host country in the 90's: I'm sure there are more (off the cuff;just places I used to go to. No research involved).
Germany:
Sembach
Spangdahlem (OOps!!!! sorry I guess "spang" is still active)
bitbourg
Ramstien or Rhine main (One of the two was to be closed and operations consolidated to the remaining one)
Wiesbaden

Netherlands:
Soesterberg
Britain:
RAF uxbridge(?)
RAF upper heyford

here's a statistics laden tidbit; Since the 2005 brac:

The Army does not need BRAC to shrink its footprint overseas.

In Europe, it has closed 97 sites and returned 23,000 acres to host countries since BRAC 2005. Another 23 locations, most in Germany, will shut down in the next four years. In South Korea, the Army has closed or will close more than 50 installations.


Read more: Pentagon preps chopping block for next round of base closures - Washington Times www.washingtontimes.com...

www.washingtontimes.com...

Originally posted by LostPassword

Originally posted by Deetermined

Why don't you give us your take on both of these points?

oh ok sure, click on page one of this thread first post of the thread by me

and read the list

Or do something like this, just ignore the facts, settle with the indefinite war, indefinite debt,
indefinite search for solution as people die and will start to die in US too.

Good luck

I must have misunderstood you. I thought your original post was your brother-in-law's point of view and not yours. So, the "accurate" information from the Middle East is only that the film was the straw that broke the camel's back and the rest is your point of view. I get it now.

So, your point of view is that the U.S. and Israel should butt out.

The truth is, if we butt out of the Middle East altogether, way more people are going to die than the other way around. They may not be Americans, and maybe that's all you care about, but that's what would happen. Sounds like you should encourage your brother-in-law to come home either way.

Originally posted by Deetermined
Nope, because I actually agree with everything you said in your post.

It doesn't really matter how involved or not involved we are in the Middle East.

It will be a ticking time bomb no matter what.

Classical argument of the uninformed,

If you are respectful to your trading partner, he will respect you back, if he doesn't the DEAL IS OFF
If he attacks you YOU DEFEND YOURSELF

What the US and Israel have been doing in Middle east is completely opposite of the above stated.

And the reason you don't know that is because Mainstream Media goes to great length to
convoluted the issue.

And you are too lazy to inform yourself with alternative Media.

Listen....we can go all day talking who is right, but you don't have time my friend. The sins of the father
are visited upon the son. It is only a matter of time till problems of US leadership and lobbies such
as AIPAC come to your home front door.

At that point this conversation will be mute

Originally posted by 46ACE
Unfortunately We had to go into there to stop the "genocide"(as Europe twiddled its thumbs;sending in poor defenseless Dutch troops without ammunition...)

Yeah you just believe that if you want

US sponsored terrorism in Kosovo goading the Serbs to go with army WITHIN THEIR OWN COUNTRY
and put down the terrorists, so US then said oh look what the serbs are doing, lets bomb them.

And US did this because they care about rights of minorities??

No .......they did it so that they can build another base to threaten Russia

Look I get it, you get your facts on foreign policy from US sources, but don't expect me to go along.

Originally posted by LostPassword

Originally posted by 46ACE
Unfortunately We had to go into there to stop the "genocide"(as Europe twiddled its thumbs;sending in poor defenseless Dutch troops without ammunition...)

Yeah you just believe that if you want

US sponsored terrorism in Kosovo goading the Serbs to go with army WITHIN THEIR OWN COUNTRY
and put down the terrorists, so US then said oh look what the serbs are doing, lets bomb them.

And US did this because they care about rights of minorities??

No .......they did it so that they can build another base to threaten Russia


Look I get it, you get your facts on foreign policy from US sources, but don't expect me to go along

No offense I don't expect to do anything here except vent a little steam. Most peoples minds are made up.
I got my facts from a documentary you might be interested in:"The world without (the) U.S."
www.imdb.com... It goes into the Kosovo civil war.( a real ethnic mess Iam admittedly not qualified to discuss;

I'm not fluent on the history of the balkans.)
I can't tell the players without a map in front of me and a"program".

That part of the world was hidden behind the iron curtain to us. Sorry: Most folks here couldn't spell "Yugoslavia"; much less: "Boznia"; "Herze...errr... "Herzegovina" or "Kosovo". And sadly I could not put my finger on "Albania " on a map today...

I'm not saying they are not building bases.but facts are we are slowly pulling out of our coldwar installations. Globally.

.

Plain and simple these are "thugs" who are protesting and causing the violence. These countries do not have stable governments to help their own people or foreigners in their countries. Unfortunately as our world gets smaller with technology advances, more of what we do in the west, is going to be splashed across their tv's, phones, computers, etc. It is going to "offend" more and more people in the middle east. It is in their faces all the time now, and they don't like it.

So the freedoms we have fought for, for our own country, are going to be challenged. Cultures have to change and move foreward and not backward. They may not like it, but unfortunately we all have to move foreward. Even if some of us have to go kicking and screaming.

Originally posted by LostPassword

Classical argument of the uninformed,

Actually, I think you are the one who is uninformed. You need to do some research on what the radicals are actually saying and not just what you're hearing from others. Last time I checked, the U.S. wasn't dubbing Al Qaeda and Muslim Brotherhood videos to make you think they were saying something different from what they meant.

If you are respectful to your trading partner, he will respect you back, if he doesn't the DEAL IS OFF
If he attacks you YOU DEFEND YOURSELF

What the US and Israel have been doing in Middle east is completely opposite of the above stated.

LOL! Do some research on how many times Iran has stabbed Iraq and Saudi Arabia in the back! Maybe even some research into Pakistan stabbing everyone in the back. The U.S. and Israel aren't doing anything to the Middle East that the Middle East isn't doing to each other. There is no such thing as loyalty and there is no such thing as respect, between any of them.

And the reason you don't know that is because Mainstream Media goes to great length to
convoluted the issue.

Well, that might be true if I read the mainstream media, but I don't. Obviously.

Listen....we can go all day talking who is right, but you don't have time my friend. The sins of the father
are visited upon the son. It is only a matter of time till problems of US leadership and lobbies such
as AIPAC come to your home front door.

I doubt we could go all day discussing the issues because you haven't researched them enough. You've obviously only researched the standpoint of the U.S. and Israel in the Middle East and not the surrounding issues of the entire Middle East.

Just want to put this out there in the interest of general knowledge:
I googled our friends phrase taken from a post above:"US sponsored terrorism in Kosovo "
and found an extensive page about war crimes and the Hague.

As I am woefully remiss in my own history knowledge of this conflict; I think I'll crack a local beer ( New Glarus breweries "fat squirrel")and read it tonight. I don't yet know if its biased pro serb or otherwise...But it looks like an interesting place to start.

serbianna.com...
"Deny ignorance "

reply to post by intrptr

Because our God told George Bush to bomb them?

Bush did not invade Libya, Egypt or Sudan, not to mention the fact, the George Bush isn't the President. We gonna start blaming Teddy for invading Tripoli too? What kind of clap trap is this? Apologizing for crazies killing people who have nothing to do with this movie is the height, the utter height, of banal stupidity.

They want to kill westerners for a movie made by some wacko in California - how do you reason with that? They want a war. Plain and simple. They want us to do what they say or they will kill us. Just ask them. How do you rationalize that logic? I heard an Egyptian say something to the affect of " If you talk about the Profit they (the mob) will KILL."

This isn't about Israel, it isn't about Iraq. It is crazy people who will kill you because of a movie that pisses them off. Well guess what slick, they ain't gonna win this pissing contest.

V

reply to post by LostPassword

"Imagine if Mexico was taking over Texas, and by force pushing Texan
Americans up north, and the rest of the world just kept quiet."

They are- and the rest of the country.

I agree OP we should just pull out period... let them rule themselves!