The Behaviour Modification of America

reply to post by beezzer

When you are given freedom you need to be responsible and considerate with it's use, if you don't it seems like the freedom always gets taken away. I don't like others that abuse their freedoms jeopardizing my freedoms.

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by beezzer

 

When you are given freedom you need to be responsible and considerate with it's use, if you don't it seems like the freedom always gets taken away. I don't like others that abuse their freedoms jeopardizing my freedoms.

Freedoms are only in jeopardy when they are used.

If we don't use our freedom of expression, if we don't excercise our freedom of expression, if we never test the limits of our freedoms, then we really don't deserve fthem.

reply to post by rickymouse


I'm just asking a question. Is the internet filtered, or restricted in the ME? I'm lead to believe it is in China.

If the ME is filtered, and someone supplies this silly film to eachother in the ME, do they think that all the americans are sitting around and replaying it over, and, over again and laughing at it.

None, or most, of us wouldn't even know about this film if it wasn't brought to our attention and used as an excuse.

Do they think we spend all of our time laughing and poking fun at Muslims?

reply to post by Happy1


In Iran it's basically cut off and people have to use proxies to get anywhere online. Other countries have similar policies and in many countries all use is tracked.

~Heff

reply to post by beezzer

Very true and very important statements you made there.
I'd like to add that it's not only the U.S.... it's the western world as a whole that caves in to religious wackos IMO.

I often heard people from the ME claim that their cultures are much older than our western civilizations, yet the picture of a spoilt child comes to mind when I watch them going nuts on the news.

We react like overstrained parents in this scenario, caving to every silly complaint that annoying toddler is giving us.

reply to post by Happy1


Hefficide seems to know more of what's going on with that than I do. I have researched a little of their history and diet but not much on the present government structure. I suppose censorship is everywhere, I have more trouble with big corporations censoring our information than the government does. Redir is a word I hate.

reply to post by Hefficide

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Matthew 24:24
Generally Christians know this scriptural passage but sometimes fail to have the discrimination to know who is the false Christ or false prophet. I believe false pastors exist in every religion right now as the evil ones try to mislead the sheep. Yet, the seculars blame all the religious for the evil of the few. This appearing of so many false prophets is considered to be a sign of the End Times.
I truly believe that much of what we see manifesting is that time, and it is also prophesied that there will be a shortening of the days for the "elect".
I know you are likely not too religious, but perhaps you will indulge me this one discussion of it. For New Agers, the End Times represents the end of an era, the passing from Pisces(ruled by Jesus) to Aquarius(ruled by the Seventh Angel).

I love this song as quintessentail New Age

Originally posted by Hefficide
reply to post by Happy1

 

In Iran it's basically cut off and people have to use proxies to get anywhere online. Other countries have similar policies and in many countries all use is tracked.

~Heff

Yes, in Tunisia they are not allowed YouTube but can get facebook. You cannot criticise the govt. They do have a fairly strong telecommunications infrastructure though. They hosted an International Telecommunications summit in Tunis one year and everywhere you can see satellite dishes. My understanding is that Internet access is strong about one week out of the month. It seems strange to us when we can pretty much get bandwidth on a consistent basis.

Beezer, a most intriguing theory about behavior modification. Of course, this is only one aspect of it. It has been going on in the schools since the adoption of the Dewey method. Who do you believe is promoting this modification and on behalf of whom?

Absolutely 100% correct.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

We should be free to do stupid stuff. Freedom isn't extended to only those with IQ's above room temperature.

But OUR freedoms, ALL our freedoms are in jeopardy because of actions by another country, IN another country.

Muslims crash planes into buildings and suddenly WE are the ones entering into a military-like state when we step into an airport to go visit grandma on the holidays. If we follow this line of thinking then I have NO doubt that our freedom of speech will be tampered with because of these riots over an insignificant film depicting Mohammed.
We have to nip this in the bud now before the gov't even thinks of making a move on our freedoms.

A. Spread the word to inform our government (U.S.): Don't touch our freedom of speech!
B. Everyone draw a silly picture of Mohammed and flood the internet with them. (LOL Only half-serious).

it's not like there aren't members of their societies saying things that are offensive to us now, is there???

Death to America..
Kill the infidels...
We'll drive them into the sea!!!!

and well, some of the actions that have been made seem to suggest that they are serious...
and actions always speak louder than words, cartoon characters, or anything else....

we've had a few followers of Islam come and work in our shop before. They were treated with respect, we even asked about their religion...out of sincere interest. No one threatened them. No one beheaded anyone.....

We didn't mob the workplace till they were gone!!

why should any religion be protected more than the people are, and isn't that what is being suggested???
ya, we can demean the people, we can threaten them, we can say all kinds of things about them, but we can't touch a religion, we can't point out what are really obvious flaws, contradictions, and well, just plain outright barbarism that is contained within their belief systems......Talking about all religions here, since they all have their flaws, contradictions and a bit a barbarism within them...
I kind of think that religions are meant to evolve along with the people, and that isn't gonna happen if the religions are protected from the people's opinions and challenges to those religions....

I think the disconnect is the lack of the truly sacred in America. We value freedom highly, we value tolerance.

Well, Islam values the Koran and Muhammad. I think that should be respected. You burning the Koran and a Muslim finding out about it might be similar to you finding out someone burned your family alive.

Anyway, it wouldn't be such a big issue if there wasn't massive amounts of resentment built up over years toward America.

People should have freedom. People should also have the decency not to use that freedom in a way that grossly disrespects others.

reply to post by beezzer


I think your government could use some behavior modifications, considering you are always in constant conflict and wars. This will never lead to peace, just like your post.

When is the line going to be crossed? When is America going to be to afraid to express themselves for fear of retaliation?

When are the cowards in DC going to create laws to inhibit OUR freedoms for fear of others in another country?

As much as your freedom is not disturbing your neighbors ,you can be free.

When is the time to stop messing with Muslims.

Western countries insult , loot and rape Muslim countries and want them to shut up.

What kind of humanistic behaviour is that ?

Stop insulting other belief and there is nothing coming to you

+ tell your govt to stop supporting Al-qaeda , then there is no al-qaeda threatening you.

Isn't this simple ?

It was told that al-qaeda killed Americans , So what is done to stop them ?

I mean except invading Afghanistan and killing OBL after 10 years.

+ helping them in Syria , Qatar and Turkey.

The freedom was a part of American dream , IMHO.



ETA : you can not do much about your govt, can you ?

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by EvilSadamClone

 

Clinton's statements on the day's events, released through the State Department's website and Twitter feed, condemn "in the strongest possible terms" an attack on the U.S. consulate in Libya in Benghazi that left one American dead, but offer no condemnation of the attack on the U.S. embassy in Cairo.

Instead, Clinton reiterates an apology issued earlier today by the U.S. Embassy in Cairo--now deleted--which said: "We condemn the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims."

"The U.S. deplores any intentional effort to denigrate the religious beliefs of others," Clinton said. "Our commitment to religious tolerance goes back to the very beginning of our nation," she added.

www.breitbart.com...

This is the apology I meant.

If you think that's an apology, I'll just bet that you think that everyone here on ATS has apologized to you personally at one time or another.

For example; I may staunchly disagree with the salary and benefit package being paid to you by your employer and I may even state my opposition to the practice of underpaying employees in general, but that doesn't mean that I'm apologizing for it, it just means that I disagree with it. Do you understand the difference between an apology and a position statement?

I don't know how you were brought up, but I was always taught that an apology included words like; "I'm Sorry," "We're Sorry," "I Apologize," and/or "We Apologize." As a child, when I was told to apologize to someone for something I had done, if my words didn't include the phrase "I'm sorry" or "I apologize," my parents would have spanked my butt and told me keep apologizing until I got it right.

This is no apology! If anything, it's a categorical denial of any involvement on the part of the U.S. government and a clear reaffirmation of our American values with respect to religious freedom.

I will tell you this, you right-wingers sure have a knack for seeing things as the opposite of what they really are and it's no wonder your party has decided not to let fact checkers interfere with their message.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by beezzer

 

That's because we're the ones doing all the stupid stuff. Because we're used to having freedom of speech, other countries don't, and then our stuff makes it over there.

...The only people who really matter are the ones who have the brains and resources to play the big game - what I like to call the "game of thrones", because it reminds me a lot of the novel. Just like a game of high-stakes poker: if you don't have the money, the guts, and the skill, don't bother coming to the table. You'll get stomped, taken for all you're worth, and thrown out with the rest of the garbage. If you're lucky.

edit on 14-9-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

Firstly...about who is doing "stupid stuff", I believe most of the laws that are supposed to govern the minds of these people say you are to distance yourself from things that are considered evil or go against what you are taught is right, not run to it and bash it to pieces like an unrestrained child in a mad tantrum. THAT is ridiculous behavior and anyone condoning it for any reason...well, I have to wonder where those kind of ethics come from.

As far as your PEOPLE who REALLY matter statement...eh, seriously, what are you talking about? Yur "game of thrones" is a load of crap. It is an elusive thing that so many people year after year fall into, including the ones deluded into thinking that anything they actually obtain is ANY real power. Put these people next to an exploding volcano and...well, it becomes rather clear what REAL power is. Just because some people think that being on top of some stinking pile of humanity is POWER need to wake up...Look below, your foundations are climbing up your legs.... There is always someone ready to climb on top of you to get to the top of the #pile they've created. It's nothing more than a mountain of ego they are climbing. The rest of it is simply living with the consequences then we move on after we shed this earth suit...then where is their frigging power gone? PFFT.

Originally posted by beezzer
*Mods, if you feel this belongs in a rant/trash/Pulitzer Prize section, then by all means. . . .

Recent events have brought to mind a disturbing ideation.

Someone burns a Koran and people riot, America apologises, things calm down.

Someone draws Mohammed, people riot, America apologises, things calm down.

Someone makes a video, people riot, America apologises, . . . . . . . .

It brings to mind a Pavlovian Response. People, free people, express themselves (by burning, drawing, filming) and islamic extremists riot and burn and kill, and America apologises.

When is the line going to be crossed? When is America going to be to afraid to express themselves for fear of retaliation?

When are the cowards in DC going to create laws to inhibit OUR freedoms for fear of others in another country?

It appears, at least to me, that islamic extremists are creating an environment where we are afraid to express ourselves.

We are, in a sense, following Sharia Law out of fear of riots and anger.

When are we going to stand up to this?

When are we going to say, "I won't be dictated to, like this!"?

When are we, as a nation, going to say, "Go to hell!" (C. Krauthammer)

I really fear for our nation when we spend more time formulating apologies than finding out who killed Americans.

Thank you for providing me the freedom and forum to express my opinion.

beez

I take it you don't know much psychology.
you're understanding of Pavlovian response is completely wrong.
What do I know, it's not like I have a degree in psychology or anything.....oh wait, I do.


"We are, in a sense, following Sharia Law out of fear of riots and anger."
This is an extremely asinine comment. some might say delusional.

you assume people are cowering in fear of the possibility they upset a Muslim. This isn't true at all.

Sorry, but when people upset other people, they apologize. This is the normal thing to do.
You have freedom of speech. But people will naturally respond negatively if you say certain things. Call a black person the 'n-word' see what happens. It's called decency. If you want to be an asshat, and go around saying extremely negative things, so be it. But just remember people will respond negatively, and many times with violence.

You drawing the conclusion that the elimination of free speech is just around the corner, based off of natural human responses, is absurd.

Don't worry, Americans will keep saying moronic insulting things for as long as this country is around.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
Beezer, a most intriguing theory about behavior modification. Of course, this is only one aspect of it. It has been going on in the schools since the adoption of the Dewey method. Who do you believe is promoting this modification and on behalf of whom?

Who do I believe is promoting this?

I wish I could point a finger, and if I had to it would be on every single one of us that doesn't stand for freedom, those of us that kneel in false security, who sacrifice our freedoms on the altar of government assurances.

Freedom isn't something that can be taken away by others.

It has to be given away freely by those who held it.

Originally posted by jiggerj

Muslims crash planes into buildings and suddenly WE are the ones entering into a military-like state when we step into an airport to go visit grandma on the holidays. If we follow this line of thinking then I have NO doubt that our freedom of speech will be tampered with because of these riots over an insignificant film depicting Mohammed.
We have to nip this in the bud now before the gov't even thinks of making a move on our freedoms.

A. Spread the word to inform our government (U.S.): Don't touch our freedom of speech!
B. Everyone draw a silly picture of Mohammed and flood the internet with them. (LOL Only half-serious).

Knee-jerk reactions are the bread and butter of government. Shooting in a theatre? Talk of gun laws.
People too fat?
Laws against large sodas.

I agree that we hae to be vigilant.

As for drawing a picture of their prophet? I'm with ya!