America's Underwater: GDP = $15.606T; Debt = $16.046T

Do the math folks!! We're officially busted!! Remember that when you go to the polls in November.

According to the most recent official estimate by the federal Bureau of Economic Analysis, the Gross Domestic Product for 2012 will be $15.6061 trillion--or about $440.5 billion less than the $16.0466 in debt that the federal government had accumulated as of the close of business on Monday.

The BEA, which is part of the Department of Commerce and which officially calculates GDP, based its current estimate of this year's GDP, published on Aug. 29, on economic data available through the end of the second quarter of this calender year.

Wow! Put you mind around this

If that current estimate is correct, the debt of the United States government eclipsed the value of the Gross Domestic Product of the United States on April 2 of this year.

cnsnews.com...

BTW That's NOT a good thing!!!! We have exceeded the tipping in this nation and its only going to get worse!!!

Moody’s expects to cut US rating without deal to lower debt/GDP ratio

www.forexlive.com...

Bad news. Bad, bad news.

reply to post by beezzer


THanks for the uplifting news!! Now what??

Let's hope all of this comes up during the debates. I want real answers from both candidates. I want see a detailed map not a GD snapshot.

reply to post by jibeho


Do you really think that voting is going to make a difference? Can you not see that this is a well layed out plan by the globalist bankers and that our elected officials are merely puppets in allowing our country to get this far down the crapper in the first place?

Maybe if we had more than the illusion of choice in the two puppets that we have to choose from, we might have a chance, but even then, the lines seem to be already drawn in the sand and us useless eaters are the target reguardless who is voted into office!

Prepare for America to become a third world nation. That is reality........

America has been insolvent for decades. Those numbers are not even close to the truth. University of Chicago profs reckon the debt is actually over 100 trillion.

Kill Justin Bieber and the GDP goes down to about 1 trillion. Biebs is keeping the nations head just above the water through his merchandising. In fact, I would say the entire global economy is pretty much based on Bieber, Twitter and arms dealing.

If Biebs was willing to sell WMDs to lunatic despots, he could rule the world. Raytheon-Bieber Inc. has a nice ring to it

I don't want to hear any solutions from either of them. They lie, that's it. The yearning to power a large country is the only drive they have.

reply to post by seeker1963


We clearly have a current admin. with a massive spending poblem and a severe allergy to balanced budgets. That's the problem!! Obama is the water bearer for those global powers that you speak of. He needs to be cut off from the endless path into the taxpayers pockets. That's dangerous

Thanks for the thread. There simply can't be too much repeating of this right now. People must see and understand the true nature of the situation we're in, beyond the spin and hype BOTH sides are trying to place on the whole matter. Spin Spin Spin...... Well, the political parties are going to spin us right off a cliff and into the abyss of financial ruin. Here is a helpful chart to help illustrate the OP point a bit...



It's big (over 800x800px) but it shows the debt,. deficit, interest and categories of debt between Goverrnment and Public holdings, etc..... Most importantly, this one shows the 2022 projections I didn't extend my own boards to cover on this subject. Over 25 trillion in debt...by 2022, as if we're likely to make it that far either way, anyway.

Hold on to your hats folks, the future is going where the charts don't cover and there be monsters in those waters.

there's two ways of looking at this:

based on folly economics, else as is.

the first suggests these numbers actually represent something tangible in the real world. that they are infallible, and sound. under such assumptions, we're not doing so well.

as is, we've got the third most populous nation, which has the most scientific patents ever produced, and is decades ahead in several departments compared to most nations.

it's not the nation that is screwed, it's the banking-intertwined, economic ideology which will go down the tube.

hopefully in the process, cooler heads prevail.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Ouch!! Seeing that chart just makes the reality so much worse. Thanks for that detail!!

I left without words at the moment...

reply to post by jibeho


You should include a list of debtors, that is, to whom the money is owed.

Why is this important you may ask?

Well, as one of the debtors, I am inclined to forgive the debt. Just reset what is owed to me to zero.

Remember what Cheney said when he was with Reagan, "defecits don't matter".

Originally posted by blah yada
America has been insolvent for decades. Those numbers are not even close to the truth. University of Chicago profs reckon the debt is actually over 100 trillion.

Kill Justin Bieber and the GDP goes down to about 1 trillion. Biebs is keeping the nations head just above the water through his merchandising. In fact, I would say the entire global economy is pretty much based on Bieber, Twitter and arms dealing.

If Biebs was willing to sell WMDs to lunatic despots, he could rule the world. Raytheon-Bieber Inc. has a nice ring to it

edit on 11-9-2012 by blah yada because: (no reason given)

edit on 11-9-2012 by blah yada because: (no reason given)

edit on 11-9-2012 by blah yada because: (no reason given)

What's even sadder about your above musings, is that the Beibs is Canadian, and has publicly stated he doesn't want to be American, the country is too screwed up....

I'm totally convinced the US government is collapsing the country on purpose - maybe to start over?

Originally posted by jibeho
Do the math folks!! We're officially busted!! Remember that when you go to the polls in November.

According to the most recent official estimate by the federal Bureau of Economic Analysis, the Gross Domestic Product for 2012 will be $15.6061 trillion--or about $440.5 billion less than the $16.0466 in debt that the federal government had accumulated as of the close of business on Monday.

The BEA, which is part of the Department of Commerce and which officially calculates GDP, based its current estimate of this year's GDP, published on Aug. 29, on economic data available through the end of the second quarter of this calender year.

Wow! Put you mind around this

If that current estimate is correct, the debt of the United States government eclipsed the value of the Gross Domestic Product of the United States on April 2 of this year.

cnsnews.com...

BTW That's NOT a good thing!!!! We have exceeded the tipping in this nation and its only going to get worse!!!

edit on 11-9-2012 by jibeho because: add source

You're nuts. You don't even understand what the "national debt" is.

Under a fractional reserve system "money" IS debt..if the national debt was $0...the US dollar wouldn't exist. I don't mean that it wouldn't be worth very much or that it would be scarce...I mean that NO MONEY CAN OR WOULD EXIST.

Think about it this way. In 1913 the Federal Reserve was created and real dollars were replaced with Federal Reserve Notes. The US govt went to the Fed and said "Hey...we want 100 Billion dollars" (or whatever the number was) and in exchange we will give you 100 Billion dollars worth of US BONDS WHICH ARE PAYABLE IN SAY...5 YEARS at let's say 5% interest.

Now it's 1918 and the original 100 billion dollars is due PLUS roughly 26 billion or so in interest. So...even if the US government recalled every single dollar on all of planet earth to become "debt free"...the taxpayers would still owe the feds another 26 billion dollars.

Sooooo....where does the money come from to "pay" the interest? FROM THE FEDERAL RESERVE OF COURSE!! The only option when those original notes are due is to BORROW/CREATE MORE MONEY OUT OF THIN AIR TO COVER THE INTEREST PAYMENTS.

Even if the loan were at 0% interest...the government must STILL ISSUE MORE BONDS TO THE FEDERAL RESERVE every time they want to increase the supply of cash. When too much cash is created we get inflation. If NO CASH is EVER created we have a completely stagnant economy which does not ever grow and instead leaves all 300 million Americans to fight over what was originally issued to 100 million Americans in 1913.

It's a scam...and it's rigged...and it's an excuse to whip everybody into a panic about "The National Debt" which will not and CANNOT ever be eliminated so long as both the Federal Reserve exists and the American Economy is growing.

Shhh...you hear that?

I think I hear a Rockefeller and a Warburg laughing at the peasants who are all panic stricken about the big numbers that exist only as digital dollars anyways and are thus as ethereal and arbitrary as a high score in a Donkey Kong game.

Originally posted by beezzer

Moody’s expects to cut US rating without deal to lower debt/GDP ratio

www.forexlive.com...

Bad news. Bad, bad news.

Nonsense. This is the best news I've heard all day.

All of us Americans are simply too fat, lazy, and stupid to REALLY do anything to fix our broken and corrupt government until the bottom completely falls out and the MAJORITY of the population is living a hand to mouth existence like the bottom rungs of the socioeconomic ladder are doing right now.

The faster we rip the band-aid off the more it will hurt...but the sooner it will be to actually begin the healing process.

Well, Moody's might as well lower the credit rating, I don't see how the government is going to lower the deficit....honestly, I expect trillion dollar deficits for years to come.

reply to post by jibeho


Sorry dude,
If you really believe voting for one over the other is going to change anything your very very naive, or fooled!

Obama or Romney.. you have more chance of solving the economic crisis with a rubix cube.

So if I'm reading that correctly (and im a dunce when it comes to economics) the US debt is now more than 100% of its GDP?

in dumb terms, i have a $10,000 loan but only earn $9900 per year?

Surely there is some mathematical number, some equation that triggers a mass down turn or sluggish increase..

reply to post by jibeho


S&F

Yes, this is terrible news.

I think it’s quite obvious who is to blame - The current Liar-in-Chief.

If everyone could see this video he wouldn’t stand a chance in hell of re-election.

16 Trillion is small potatoes before you add in what the US government owes in liabilities for social security, medicare, and entitlements. If you add it all up, it's over 55 trillion dollars. Several times the 16 trillion dollar number. Saying social security is going to run out of money 20 or so many years from now is a joke. The US government didn't save one penny of those taxes collected. They spent it all. Now the current fools in office are spending money as if it doesn't matter to ordinary Americans if our currency becomes less valuable than toilet paper. It does matter to me and others who have been saving money in our 401K's and retirement accounts. The plan is to rob us of all of our savings by devaluing the currency.

Please don't vote for the same people to finish the job. Of course if it makes you happy to have gas reach $8 a gallon, vote for the incumbent. I'm not saying the alternative is much better but I have hope someone different can make a positive change. Didn't the current guy in the White House say something about hope and change a few years ago? The main change I see is gas prices have doubled or tripled. I read the goal of Obama was to have gas gradually reach $8 a gallon so that some seals somewhere can live in peace and harmony. They don't care about you and your job. Of course so many like a smooth talker. Of course you could just stay home and party like it's 2012. Who knows, the end of the world may come soon.

It doesn't even matter who's running the show when the system we have in place isn't much more then a thinly disguised pyramid scheme. Our money is issued to us with debt already attached. If you issue 100 million, then you have to pay back 105 million - but if there's only 100 million, how can you get that extra 5 million to pay back when it doesn't exist? You can't, and that's the whole point, interest keeps compounding, and wealth is funneled up to the top. It's "wealth" created from nothing - and it's ridiculous, in my opinion. You can try to point your finger at scape goats, but nothing is going to change, unless we change the system - and apparently, no one wants to talk about that (at least in politics). All of this "wealth from nothing" has to come from somewhere, and it comes from those of us who actually produce.

Those with the power are fighting any change to the system, because they lose their control. They have even brainwashed those they live off of, by convincing them that one day, they could be in the position of exploitation. Our value system is completely out of whack - we value consumer goods more then life! We reward those who harm and destroy their own communities! Then we rationalize it to ourselves, telling ourselves that it's just the way of the world, that it would take too much effort to make things better.

There is a very small minority living lavishly off the backs of the majority of the population, and we allow it to happen. There are many, even on this very website of denying ignorance, who fight tooth and nail for their own slavery.

Originally posted by jibeho
Do the math folks!! We're officially busted!!

GDP is annual. Debt is not. Debt is paid back over years.

Two different things being misused.

As an ex British PM Mr Disraeli once uttered "(there are) lies, damned lies, and statistics"

Regards