'Dark Knight Rises' shooting: families of deceased to speak

AURORA, Colo. — Family members of some of the 12 people shot to death during a midnight movie showing in Colorado plan to go public Tuesday about some behind-the-scenes events they say need to be discussed.

one of many links

I wonder what this is? The article goes on to talk about Money but it appears they will be talking about the events and feel the need to speak as 'one voice'.

I don't see the conspircy

But anything passes these days right?

reply to post by Sinny


The whole case has been full of conspiracies, as it is a new development I thought I'd share it.

Originally posted by Sinny
I don't see the conspircy

But anything passes these days right?

Have you actually read anything about it? Studied the evidence? Have you read the James Holmes thread? I don't see how even a skeptic can deny that there are a multitude of discrepancies in the case between the evidence and what the police/media have told us.

Really curious to see what they say. Hoping against hope that it is something substantive.

Originally posted by Taggart
reply to post by Sinny

 

The whole case has been full of conspiracies, as it is a new development I thought I'd share it.

No, but people sure have been busy making things up.

reply to post by Consequence


You're right. It's a complete fabrication that the police said they ID'ed him because he was wearing a gas mask and body armor, despite the fact that those things were on the ground and the gas mask was far beyond where Holmes traveled. And all of the witnesses who said immediately after the incident that there were multiple people involved were obviously just telling tall tales for the hell of it. And so on and so on....

reply to post by Consequence


Making things up like what? Which part is made up? Do you have proof to back up your claims?
The conspiracies connected to holmes run deeper than Photo comparisons and "who is James Holmes's Father" ect.

Why is the case closed to the public? he's been caught hasn't he? It's not in the publics interest to find out why a guy flipped, maybe prevent it happening again.

Like I said its full of conspiracies, I'm on neither side but the more you read about the case the fishier it gets.

The only mass shooters that do not kill themselves at the end are generally motivated (almost always politically motivated) the rest suicide or suicide by cop. So why rig the apartment (like nothing the FBI had seen before btw) then tell the police on arrest? Could be regret.. No proof either way though.

Originally posted by Maroboduus

Originally posted by Sinny
I don't see the conspircy

But anything passes these days right?

Have you actually read anything about it? Studied the evidence? Have you read the James Holmes thread? I don't see how even a skeptic can deny that there are a multitude of discrepancies in the case between the evidence and what the police/media have told us.

Really curious to see what they say. Hoping against hope that it is something substantive.

edit on 28-8-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

No, I'm completey suspicious regarding the shooting, as far as families comments are concerned where's the conspiracy? Or are they in on it to?

Originally posted by Maroboduus
reply to post by Consequence

 

You're right. It's a complete fabrication that the police said they ID'ed him because he was wearing a gas mask and body armor, despite the fact that those things were on the ground and the gas mask was far beyond where Holmes traveled.

Clearly this information comes as a compilation from the police, media and witnesses, right? Not a combined legal document to be used in court? A story created here by people with articles and glue?

There are several scenarios:
1. It's perfectly fine by the police to say that they Identified him because he was wearing a gas-mask, but it doesn't physically still have to be on at the time of getting him into custody.
2. It's perfectly fine to throw away your backup gas-mask when you no longer need it.
3. It's perfectly fine by witnesses too see the gas-mask on the floor "in a different place" as they've clearly arrived there after it had been dropped.
4. Whatever was on the ground could have been misinterpreted to be the guy's gas-mask / body-armor by shocked people. In fact, it could have been gear from fleeing visitors that had dressed up for the show (apparently there were such people in the crowd).
5. This information might simply not be true. It's not uncommon with false information (for whatever reason) at chaotic crime-scenes. Usually these things are cleared after the situation has been reconstructed.

6. Yes, it could be the gear of a second shooter. However, if this was some sort of ultra-secret confusing mission, why is it important that one is caught and the other one is not? If this is a very secret op, why throw gear around that shouldn't be there? Who collected this extra pair of gear? Didn't people see that? Did someone also see the arrest of the guy? Was he wearing the mask?

And all of the witnesses who said immediately after the incident that there were multiple people involved were obviously just telling tall tales for the hell of it. And so on and so on....

Also either confusion in the heat of the moment OR that the guy shouted himself that there's a shooter outside. It's been done before (and someone DID shout). The fact that people were hit through the walls in the dark in the middle of a movie in a theater with rooms full of people, getting a grasp of what is going on is not easy. Also, you must take into consideration that a human being who is not in a war has very hard to understand what is actually happening there and then, all of a sudden.

So no, I still don't see any evidence for a second shooter. I see speculation based on an iffy compilation of facts.

sorry to dissapoint but they are saying they dont like the way the donation fund is being handled. thats it, nothing more.

www.9news.com...


really disapointing!!!!

Originally posted by tluna1
really disapointing!!!!

Why?

reply to post by tluna1


That's mentioned in the first link, but the link goes on to say about 'behind the scenes' and appears to be a different subject to the fund. I guess we'll wait and see.

reply to post by Sinny


Who said the families are in on it? If anything they might have MORE information on what has happened.
I didn't realise this was your forum, next time I will ask you for your opinion before posting.

Originally posted by tluna1
sorry to dissapoint but they are saying they dont like the way the donation fund is being handled. thats it, nothing more.

www.9news.com...


really disapointing!!!!

It's always about money, isn't it?

Originally posted by Consequence

1. It's perfectly fine by the police to say that they Identified him because he was wearing a gas-mask, but it doesn't physically still have to be on at the time of getting him into custody.
2. It's perfectly fine to throw away your backup gas-mask when you no longer need it.
3. It's perfectly fine by witnesses too see the gas-mask on the floor "in a different place" as they've clearly arrived there after it had been dropped.
4. Whatever was on the ground could have been misinterpreted to be the guy's gas-mask / body-armor by shocked people. In fact, it could have been gear from fleeing visitors that had dressed up for the show (apparently there were such people in the crowd).

You obviously haven't been following this case very closely.This information does NOT come from sources. It comes from the crime scene photos. I highly recommend you look at them. According to police he was wearing the gas mask. According to police, who arrived within 90 seconds of the first 911 call, Holmes was standing beside his car wearing the gas mask and full body armor. But in the crime scene photos, you can see the gas mask FAR away from his car, and FAR past where he traveled according to the police (his car was immediately outside of the exit).
This is not debatable or open for interpretation, it is a fact. It has been published in numerous media publications. It is in numerous photographs. The gas mask is on the ground at the corner of the theater next to the road. That is at least 50 yards past the car where Holmes was standing. There is also a pool of blood next to that gas mask that is unaccounted for.
Are we to believe that he threw the gas mask over 50 yards at the time of his arrest? Or that police randomly told him to walk over to the exit and drop his gun, walk somewhere else and drop his body armor, walk 50-plus yards to the corner to drop his gas mask, and THEN get in the police car????

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Look where his car is, the car that he supposedly went to and waited out as soon as he exited:
msnbcmedia.msn.com...

Look where the gun is, the gun he was supposedly holding while standing beside his car at the time of his arrest:
2.bp.blogspot.com...

Look how far past his car the gas mask was found. You know, the one they claim he was still wearing when he was arrested:
willyloman.files.wordpress.com...

There are more, but you can find them yourself. There are photos of the body armor strewn across the side walk, etc.

I think that second gas mask that was found on the other end of the building could of been one of the cop's. They needed gas masks to get into the theater and maybe one picked up a victim in the theater and had to run to his car to get the victim to the hospital and just threw the gas mask off. Someone said that if cops left things at the scene it then becomes evidence, not sure if that's true or not.

Although no explanation for the gear by James' car, unless they made him take it off there... which might be odd because they probably would of wanted to put it in evidence bags immediately to preserve gun powder and other evidence.... but they probably are not bothering checking for that type of evidence anyway.

Originally posted by Maroboduus
You obviously haven't been following this case very closely.

You cannot be more right. I haven't followed it because I haven't found it very interesting. It's just sad that people have to die because of a crazy guy.
However, now that some conspiracy-thirsty people still go about that this has to do with something else, I'm simply fascinated by it (not the case).

This information does NOT come from sources. It comes from the crime scene photos. I highly recommend you look at them.

The fact that there's crime scene photos sounds interesting. I will. But I still think it's a compilation of information. I don't expect the photos to say that people in the theater claimed there to be more than one shooter.

According to police he was wearing the gas mask. According to police, who arrived within 90 seconds of the first 911 call, Holmes was standing beside his car wearing the gas mask and full body armor. But in the crime scene photos, you can see the gas mask FAR away from his car, and FAR past where he traveled according to the police (his car was immediately outside of the exit).

Could you give me a link to the police statements? (I'm sorry to ask, I could probably find them myself, but thinking that you're interested in the case, you might have them all ready, or know where to look).
I'm merely here to give more down-to-earth explanations.
At this point I can't tell if this gas-mask is his, or someone else's. Or if it's a gas-mask (I don't doubt that though, I assume the pictures show that).

This is not debatable or open for interpretation, it is a fact. It has been published in numerous media publications. It is in numerous photographs. The gas mask is on the ground at the corner of the theater next to the road. That is at least 50 yards past the car where Holmes was standing. There is also a pool of blood next to that gas mask that is unaccounted for.

I really need to look at the pictures first. Why is there blood at the gas mask? Is it a costume of a fleeing visitor? Does it belong to a police? Why would a second shooter be bleeding? Where's the rest of the shooter's blood?

Which part is a fact? That there's a gas-mask? Yes. But what it means is highly debatable and not a fact. And that speculation seems to have lead to the most unreasonable path of a conspiracy?

Are we to believe that he threw the gas mask over 50 yards at the time of his arrest? Or that police randomly told him to walk over to the exit and drop his gun, walk somewhere else and drop his body armor, walk 50-plus yards to the corner to drop his gas mask, and THEN get in the police car????

That he threw his gas mask over 50 yards for no particular reason sounds unlikely. Is it certain he was not first observed there, as it's in close proximity to his car?
The little I've heard is that one of his guns malfunctioned. Is this the one he dropped at the door on the way out?
Body armor was probably stripped before he was taken away, as you don't want him to conceal anything unsafe.

I saw that you had another post with links... continuing..

Originally posted by Maroboduus
Look where his car is, the car that he supposedly went to and waited out as soon as he exited:

So are we or are not certain that he did not walk around in close proximity to his car?

Look where the gun is, the gun he was supposedly holding while standing beside his car at the time of his arrest:

Ah, that would be the jammed MP15. Sounds reasonable that he dropped it on the way out?
Where does it say that he was wearing it? It wasn't the Colt they meant?
Also, had he be standing to the left of the car, near the entrance, the approaching police could have told him to throw the gun away. But it seems reasonable he dropped it on the way out.

Look how far past his car the gas mask was found. You know, the one they claim he was still wearing when he was arrested:

If it was his gas-mask, then he would naturally have to been there unless there's a reason why someone would have picked it up. Are we certain he wasn't? As I said before, the police could have said he was wearing the mask because he was wearing the mask when he was first seen. At that location, perhaps?
Or, the gas-mask is not his. Belongs to the police? I guess time will tell.

There are more, but you can find them yourself. There are photos of the body armor strewn across the side walk, etc.

Nah, I still don't see anything "suspicous". A Mickey Mouse mystery-scene to solve might be a bit more organized and make perfect sense. In real life, it's not as easy. Well, at least not if one has to looks at some photos and not knowing whose gear we are looking at, nor being able to talk to the people who were on site.

Regardless, the photos do make quite a lot of sense as they are. Not as chaotic as I thought considering that people made conspiracy theory out of this.

Originally posted by Maroboduus
Look where his car is, the car that he supposedly went to and waited out as soon as he exited:
msnbcmedia.msn.com...

Look where the gun is, the gun he was supposedly holding while standing beside his car at the time of his arrest:
2.bp.blogspot.com...

Look how far past his car the gas mask was found. You know, the one they claim he was still wearing when he was arrested:
willyloman.files.wordpress.com...

There are more, but you can find them yourself. There are photos of the body armor strewn across the side walk, etc.

edit on 28-8-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

Not sure what the official procedure would be in this case of a suspect being in full body armor but one would think, for their own safety, the cops would immediately remove the suspect's body armor and check him for any additional weapons and hidden explosives. Hence, the armor being strewn about as such. Still leaves many strange and unanswered questions about the crime scene though.

Denverpost has the best image collection on the matter i've seen.