The Thieves of Religion - How to identify them by thier fruit.

The following is my opinion. You can share your own. As we take a look around the world at the mess we are in, we all know that love can solve the problem at the root. Love can only give. Suffering is required to give anything to another person. Pride cannot give. If you feel the urge to bash this thread, realize that you just read the thesis of the thread. Bash away, but don't speak away from the thesis of giving and love. The topic is giving and true religion based on the will to give and receive. Stick to the point.

In the Bible, true religion is outlined in James 1

27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

True religion can be identified by one hallmark: The will to give and receive. Gifts are given at the loss of the one giving. Suffering what is lost as the gift requires the giver to give it away, but work for it first. When we give love away, it returns. If it is not love, it comes back as debt. A simple example is smoking. Smoke and cancer follows. Reward that is taken is the hallmark of a thief. Debt is created by what is taken from the one who earned it. Exercise regularly, give up the smoking, and the health is generated into a longer life? Why? Suffering exercise creates reward that extends to the entire family. Giving always creates reward for the one who gives. No debt is created when a gift is given because the work has already been done. Gifts are positives that are sent forward. God can only give and receive. This is His will for man.

Regardless of your view of Satan, the ideology of the thief is reflected in what Satan did in the Garden to deceive mankind. Satanism is a reflection of making a theology around taking and calling it light. We may not enjoy calling it Satanism, but the Angel of Darkness is the one that reflects the thief within mankind. This is referred to as Theistic Satanism when a theology is based around the desire to take.

Satan can only operate by taking God's image (Giving) and twisting it in a mirror. He is powerless apart from this ability. Unfortunately, it works really well. God's image is the will to give and receive. The mirror to this is the will to take. Religion has never been different around the entire world. All true religion is the will to give. Theistic Satanism is taking the knowledge of religion and twisting it into the lie of the thief. The thief takes, then twists, and calls it a faith. Anyone is welcome, as long as they believe in a God. They must believe. Truth can only be used, but used in a twisted image. Truth is wrapped into a counterfeit. Once the initiate is in the door, the religion they know is then presented in a mirror back to them as the reverse image of God. The hallmark of a thief is taking and then saying nothing was taken. Jesus said, know them by their fruit. The fruit that is produced is war, debt, poverty and theft from one to benefit the other.

It boils down to the will to give and receive against the will to take. Anyone can see the truth within this concept.

Examples of Twisted Religion:

Before I mention these, be clear on one thing. We are all influenced by the Angel of Darkness and the will to take. Overcoming the will to take requires us to give from a heart of love. All of us are thieves as we live. None of us are capable of being a purely giving person. Living in a materialistic society that is crumbling at every corner is the debt that is reflected by our actions over time. Our death is slow, but assured. Unless we cut the problem at the root, the world will die.

Examples:

-----Prosperity Gospel - Based on giving and receiving, but founded on duplicity. The reward is what is sought instead of God. Not all Christians caught up in this gospel are false. Many are true believers.

-----Freemasonry - Founded on taking the fruit of knowledge and the manipulation of law against law. The Experts in the Law were the builders who rejected the Chief Cornerstone. Christ was the example to follow of giving to others. He received nothing, just as God demonstrates with creation. Not all Masons embrace the error. Many are good people. Theurgy is based on ritual magic, which is geared toward taking from the fruit of knowledge. This is the lie of the Garden of Eden. Take the fruit and live forever like a God. Secrets are taken and not shared. By this, an exclusive club is based on private associations that take as a primary means of unequal weights.

-----Secret Societies such as Theosophy - Based on Theosophy and Theurgy. They are truing to build the outer temple of Earth rather than the inner temple of the heart. What is in it for them is the main goal of humanism and Objectivism. Are all secret societies in this false religion? Yes. Secrets are taken and not shared by default.

-----Rome - The Roman Catholic Church is setup around taking from the people and preserving power at the top. Government is mixed into religion for maximum benefit to those at the top of the Priesthood. They have trillions tied up in precious metals, monitory wealth and real-estate. Christ said, "Feed my sheep." Are all Catholics in this mess? Not at all. The Catholic faithful are on the extreme end of exoteric religion and giving.

-----Government - NWO - Based on the religion of Theosophy and the Cult of Reason

-----Petrol Dollar - Ponzi Scheme - Cult of Reason

-----Islam - Based on death and destruction by taking over nations in the name of God. Pure mirror to the will of God.

There are a few off the top of my head. I am sure you can identify more. The hallmark of each is found in the will. We are all thieves. Make no mistake about it. We all need salvation from the error on a daily basis. Christ is that savior and we will not rectify this on our own. His visitation over the next 1000 year reign will deliver this world to the correct polarity. The Government will rest upon his shoulders.

-Good - The Will to give and receive

-Evil - The Will of the thief.

This makes a LOT of sense since Jesus warned us about Satan (the thief) who is also the creator of all false religions:

"The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep." (John 10:10-11)

Satan (the thief) works in a very specific way. He has a set plan--and he works it very effectively. If we look thoughtfully, I believe we will see his wicked plans at work all around us.

His first tactic is to steal. What would he like to steal? Anything and everything that will lead you to Jesus--to Gods love. Satan steals love from people. If we will open our eyes we will see it everywhere around us. Broken families, abuse, hatred, cruelty, murder. The Enemy would like us to think that there is no love in the world. He would like to steal from us even the ability to love and be loved. There are so many hurting people in the world.

So many who don't understand how to give or receive love. The devil will make you feel worthless as a human being--undeserving of love--incapable of receiving love. Why? For one reason--to separate us from God--after all, "God is love..."
Steal Kill And Destroy

You hit the nail on the head with this one.
I am often kicking myself in the butt for not helping this person or that person while wondering who is worthy of my help.
This is my greatest obstacle to being a better giver but i am working on it.
Who wants their efforts to go to what we at the time feel is a waste or lost cause.
Giving without judging is a battle.

I completely agree with giving as a "purpose" in religion but i will stick with this as a guidepost:

"Treat other people exactly as you would like to be treated by them - this is the essence of all true religion"

You have very good heart,i am far from perfect,but see your INTENTION good.
You are scared like me,THE BEST ALARM CLOCK,my heart hurts.

I have to say, that's a problem for me as well. I am a teacher and I see it every day. The kids are reflections of their parents and there are many kids coming in that are abused at home. It's not hard to love the child, but it's often hard to love the parent. That was a struggle for me in past years. The event that turned this around for me was a baritone player that missed a concert 20 years ago. I got bent out of shape because he was the only person on the part. Luckily, the events of this situation worked out in the favor of the child.

He informed me that it had rained that night. Why is this important? His mother would not come to the concerts because of her single parent family situation and work. He walked. When I found this out, I picked him up for the next concert and we even stopped to get some fast food. Not only was I doing something of value for the child, but the mother took notice. She eventually thanked me and was touched that I showed an interest. I could blame the mother for getting pregnant in her teens and so on, but that's not the point. She is where she is and the only thing that can help that is love by example. In her case, the love I showed to the son was a bridge for her to see she wasn't alone.

There are other situations where simple love is not the best answer. Sometime the best love you can show is telling someone what they need to hear from truth. Truth can hurt. There are some people destroying their families by endangering the child within view of a teacher. In this case, I am a mandatory reporter. If I see evidence abuse, I must report it. Not only this, but its often possible to speak the reasons to the parent. Typically, the principal or counselor does this. I've sat in on these meetings before and parents can be belligerent against what we are trying to do to protect the child. It's a mixture of shame and regret lashing out from a chain of horrible choices. The best thing any of us can do is live our lives by truth. This witness alone is love in action.

Then you have people on the side of the road begging for money. We can see the story clearly. Like smoking, they have likely taken so many rewards that the debt is caught them. They are out of opportunity for any positive remedy. Of course, there are exceptions. We can feed them, but for how long? The problem is not the food. The food is a symptom of taking from life. Either way, feeding is good but sharing truth with honesty is feeding them true food. They listen. I've had meals with homeless many times and they always welcome anything I can say that is an encouragement. Truth is something they lack. Hearing it is sometimes the first time in their lives a meaningful word has been spoken. Positive can only add to positive. Truth multiplies negative, which doesn't quite make sense until you see the mathematics. Two negatives multiplied equal a positive. Truth is not a negative in the sense that it is in error. Truth is an earned gift that is given by the person who earned it. Giving it reflects the suffering that earned it. It's the same with any gift. Our sin is negative. Christ's death was something he took for us. Multiply them and our debt is cancelled.

Originally posted by deadeyedick
You hit the nail on the head with this one.
I am often kicking myself in the butt for not helping this person or that person while wondering who is worthy of my help.
This is my greatest obstacle to being a better giver but i am working on it.
Who wants their efforts to go to what we at the time feel is a waste or lost cause.
Giving without judging is a battle.

I love your post, but I cannot get over your Avatar. It's the best. We should have an avatar contest. You would win. I think I may have told you that before. Every time I see it, I chuckle.

Originally posted by Murgatroid
This makes a LOT of sense since Jesus warned us about Satan (the thief) who is also the creator of all false religions:

"The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep." (John 10:10-11)

Satan (the thief) works in a very specific way. He has a set plan--and he works it very effectively. If we look thoughtfully, I believe we will see his wicked plans at work all around us.

His first tactic is to steal. What would he like to steal? Anything and everything that will lead you to Jesus--to Gods love. Satan steals love from people. If we will open our eyes we will see it everywhere around us. Broken families, abuse, hatred, cruelty, murder. The Enemy would like us to think that there is no love in the world. He would like to steal from us even the ability to love and be loved. There are so many hurting people in the world.

So many who don't understand how to give or receive love. The devil will make you feel worthless as a human being--undeserving of love--incapable of receiving love. Why? For one reason--to separate us from God--after all, "God is love..."
Steal Kill And Destroy

Originally posted by redbarron626
I completely agree with giving as a "purpose" in religion but i will stick with this as a guidepost:

"Treat other people exactly as you would like to be treated by them - this is the essence of all true religion"

That's a great quote. You are pretty much quoting Matthew 7:12 "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets."

Also:

Confucius said it this way: "Don't do to another what you wouldn't do to yourself."

Shinto: "The heart of the person before you is a mirror. See there your own form" Munetada Kurozumi

It's all the will to give and receive over the will to take.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


I have found much wisdom of our ponderings in reading your signature again and also in redbarron626 post.
I now wonder what life will be like when we are all able to carry our neighbors yoke.
It will happen!
Yet again thank you for your thread and your wise words.

reply to post by EnochWasRight

In the Bible, true religion is outlined in James 1

27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

Strange.
I thought the true religion for Christians is all that stuff about original sin and how one needs to accept that Jesus died on the cross for our sins.

Besides, looking after widows and orphans are "good deeds". I thought Christians didn't believe that good deeds would save anyone?

-----Islam - Based on death and destruction by taking over nations in the name of God. Pure mirror to the will of God.

Please comment on the genocide of the Canaanites and the taking over of their land.... by the Israelites as recorded in the Old Testament.

Originally posted by EnochWasRightTrue religion can be identified by one hallmark: The will to give and receive. Gifts are given at the loss of the one giving. Suffering what is lost as the gift requires the giver to give it away, but work for it first. When we give love away, it returns. If it is not love, it comes back as debt.........Giving always creates reward for the one who gives. No debt is created when a gift is given because the work has already been done. Gifts are positives that are sent forward. God can only give and receive. This is His will for man.

Let's get clear about this. The reward Jesus and his one true God promises in the Gospel is eternal life.

Jesus did not mention of any reward you will get while still living on Earth, nor it is of any importance to him, may even become a stumbling block as it can cause people to become reward-driven. We are to uphold the laws against all odds. The fulfillment of the law is a reward in itself. People do hobbies because they love doing something even if a reward is never given.

The only thing good in store for the true followers of Jesus who is still on Earth is the love of God, the Holy Spirit(Spirit of Truth), and whatever they ask for is given...

...Again to clear what I've just said, a true follower of Jesus can ask anything in His name, but a true follower of Jesus won't ask for a nice house, nice car, great careers because a true follower of Jesus would genuinely hate those things, anything of this world.

reply to post by EnochWasRight

Secret Societies such as Theosophy - Based on Theosophy and Theurgy. They are truing to build the outer temple of Earth rather than the inner temple of the heart. What is in it for them is the main goal of humanism and Objectivism. Are all secret societies in this false religion? Yes. Secrets are taken and not shared by default.

Now, let's get it straight here. Isn't it that Christianity teaches about an "out there" God, who is in "Heaven," a Jewish word meaning "Sky?" While Theosophy teaches one that the true Temple is within one's self? And yes, this deep information is held secret.
"Seek, and you shall find" mean anything to you?

The reading, research, and study of the KJV Bible didn't not teach me anything save that I was a slave to an unknown, and unseen God who had already sentenced me to Hell. "Jesus" taught that the Temple of the True God lies within. But he, or his writers, did not include that part about how to find it within, did they?

Originally posted by autowrench
The reading, research, and study of the KJV Bible didn't not teach me anything save that I was a slave to an unknown, and unseen God who had already sentenced me to Hell. "Jesus" taught that the Temple of the True God lies within. But he, or his writers, did not include that part about how to find it within, did they?

In response to your final sentence, here is a clue:

John 8

He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her

And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

In the Bible, true religion is outlined in James 1

27 Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

Strange.
I thought the true religion for Christians is all that stuff about original sin and how one needs to accept that Jesus died on the cross for our sins.

Besides, looking after widows and orphans are "good deeds". I thought Christians didn't believe that good deeds would save anyone?

-----Islam - Based on death and destruction by taking over nations in the name of God. Pure mirror to the will of God.

Please comment on the genocide of the Canaanites and the taking over of their land.... by the Israelites as recorded in the Old Testament.

Christians believe that no man, in his present condition, can ever meet the full potential of God's love and requirements for holiness. Because of this, Christ is the reflection of the law fulfilled. Where there was not way, God made a way. Faith is the path back to God. Love can only give what is earned. This represents the will to give and receive. The will to take is what keeps us here in the first place. Mankind is in debt on every scale devised. Our sin causes this debt and decay. The Earth is near the limit of what it can take on a global scale. Again, the error of sin. The answer can only come from a will to give and receive. Positive is created.

As for the previous generations under the law. Law is designed for the thief. It protects those who follow the law from the thief. God is the law giver and the giver of life. In previous stages of man's development, it was necessary to correct error and require payment for sin. God gives life and the then gives it again. You must be born again. Jesus meant this. You will be born again. Death is transition to new life. The process is part of divine justice. Ultimate, God works with those who love. He has no requirement to those who refuse his truth other than to rectify their error by law. Law protects those who follow it.

What now? Why the sudden change in humanity and law? Baptism is our immersion into the water of this life so that we can be raised to new life. WE are the only ones that can hinder our own progress. The law was a guardian, but now, for those who love God and are called by his name, Faith has come. The law is still there for those who refuse the process.

Galatians 3

Children of God

23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Originally posted by ahnggk

Originally posted by EnochWasRightTrue religion can be identified by one hallmark: The will to give and receive. Gifts are given at the loss of the one giving. Suffering what is lost as the gift requires the giver to give it away, but work for it first. When we give love away, it returns. If it is not love, it comes back as debt.........Giving always creates reward for the one who gives. No debt is created when a gift is given because the work has already been done. Gifts are positives that are sent forward. God can only give and receive. This is His will for man.

Let's get clear about this. The reward Jesus and his one true God promises in the Gospel is eternal life.

Jesus did not mention of any reward you will get while still living on Earth, nor it is of any importance to him, may even become a stumbling block as it can cause people to become reward-driven. We are to uphold the laws against all odds. The fulfillment of the law is a reward in itself. People do hobbies because they love doing something even if a reward is never given.

The only thing good in store for the true followers of Jesus who is still on Earth is the love of God, the Holy Spirit(Spirit of Truth), and whatever they ask for is given...

...Again to clear what I've just said, a true follower of Jesus can ask anything in His name, but a true follower of Jesus won't ask for a nice house, nice car, great careers because a true follower of Jesus would genuinely hate those things, anything of this world.

Not at all. Seek ye first the kingdom and his righteousness and ALL THESE THINGS will be added to you as well. It is never His intention to deny us the good things in life. We are to exercise the will to give AND RECEIVE. The will to take makes us a thief. If we give and receive, only positive is created.

The sin and death you see in this world is a direct result of taking. Debt is cause by taking. Our technology takes. This is an error that was written as an outcome, not something we could have avoided. God already knew. It's part of the process from the path we selected. We had two choices. Either we learn the knowledge as a gift from God or we take it and suffer the law as thieves. The error was a choice. Either way, God teaches and we learn. A new Heaven and New Earth is not a hardship on God. The entire purpose of Earth one is for child rearing. We are the children of God. Children are only held accountable until the age of accountability. We are now there. Faith must become fact and God is revealed. When this happens, we are no longer children. The foolish ways are behind us. Not so much at this point. We are still children apart from receiving the Holy Spirit. This comes next over the 1000 reign of Christ.

Salvation comes at the end of the reign of Christ.

Abraham was asked to give up his most cherished possession on Earth. He almost plunged in the knife and God stopped him. The point was not to take the life. God replaced our sacrifice with Christ. If you think you can do it on your own, you are nullifying the work of Christ on the cross. Your works are not the point. It's not about what we can do for ourselves, it's about what has been done for us. Abraham didn't have to give up Issac. He simply had to give it to God first. God gave it back.

Love is the law. Giving and receiving is the point. ALL the best things in this world come by way of love. Until the story is complete, we are still in a fallen world. Love God and all these things are given as well in proper context to truth.

Abraham was a rich man.

Originally posted by autowrench
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

Secret Societies such as Theosophy - Based on Theosophy and Theurgy. They are truing to build the outer temple of Earth rather than the inner temple of the heart. What is in it for them is the main goal of humanism and Objectivism. Are all secret societies in this false religion? Yes. Secrets are taken and not shared by default.

Now, let's get it straight here. Isn't it that Christianity teaches about an "out there" God, who is in "Heaven," a Jewish word meaning "Sky?" While Theosophy teaches one that the true Temple is within one's self? And yes, this deep information is held secret.
"Seek, and you shall find" mean anything to you?

The reading, research, and study of the KJV Bible didn't not teach me anything save that I was a slave to an unknown, and unseen God who had already sentenced me to Hell. "Jesus" taught that the Temple of the True God lies within. But he, or his writers, did not include that part about how to find it within, did they?

I have no way to show you because you reveal so little of your own light. If you have found something within that is an experience or realization, fill a page or two to describe it and I can then give you a proper answer. Is there some hidden truth that we might all benefit from? As far as I know, we have a material world that offers temporary fulfillment. It appears that ALL secret societies rely on this as the foundation for their temple of mankind from a humanistic perspective. As far as I can determine, God is the inner temple and works on the heart of mankind when they seek. This implies that the outer temple is not the point. All of this is overshadowed by which truth we found our faith upon from the two that we can seek:

1) A will to take

2) A will to give and receive

God has always shown a will to give and receive. His ability to give by requiring life back is evident in divine justice and the words, "You must be born again." We cannot fault God for taking the life that was originally His. We are all part of that Spirit that cannot die. Death is not something God takes because He owns it already. His decisions are based on a divine justice that supersedes our own.

This does not imply a God that enslaves you. You are a slaves to the choices you make. Law is for the thief. We are all thieves by choices we make as we are learning. Children need room to grow. They also need to be restricted. God is the love of 1 Corinthians 13 for those who love. For those who do not, the law is the guardian until final judgment. It guards those who love.

reply to post by EnochWasRight

So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith...

But as "faith" means belief in something that does not exist, then is your God real? How do you know this? Does he appear to you, talk to you? Do things in your favor? And sorry but "Jesus" is made up, Christ is the man who came here to teach us how to love each other.
He failed.

reply to post by EnochWasRight

As for the previous generations under the law. Law is designed for the thief. It protects those who follow the law from the thief. God is the law giver and the giver of life. In previous stages of man's development, it was necessary to correct error and require payment for sin.

"Law is designed for the thief. It protects those who follow the law from the thief. "

Well...yes. But the law was more than that.
You would know that the time and time, keeping the law is equated with righteousness.

God says it Himself. So did his prophets and Jesus.

In previous stages of man's development, it was necessary to correct error and require payment for sin.

Payment for sin? what kind of payment? Let me guess...blood sacrifice?
But what do we do with all those verses that call for sincere repentance to God?

Like say, Psalm 51. It does NOT say anything about any "payment" for sin, but rather calls for repentance to God.

Originally posted by EnochWasRight
Love is the law. Giving and receiving is the point. ALL the best things in this world come by way of love. Until the story is complete, we are still in a fallen world. Love God and all these things are given as well in proper context to truth.

Abraham was a rich man.

So what about the 12 disciples then. They were as poor as sparrows during their walk with Jesus. They were not even remotely rich for they severely rebuked Mary when she poured expensive perfume on Jesus. A rich man would not mind such waste. but they did. The disciples died poor and were all martyred.

Does this imply that God broke his promise to the twelve? No, in fact God fulfilled it.

The best thing you can ever have in this world is the Holy Spirit of God, the Spirit of Truth and the Truth itself. But most importantly, the love of God.

You can't have both the Truth and still enjoy the good things of this world. When you have found the truth, all the material things lose their value. They are as despicable as rotting garbage. What do you do to garbage? you throw them out, if you keep them in the house, the whole house will soon stink.

Old Testament God for the most part is NOT the same God Jesus calls Father.

Let the Spirit be your guide. But as I've said, the Holy Spirit only comes when you have truly hated all the inventions of man and the fallen angels.

With all the information around here in ATS, it should be not hard to now hate such things, jobs, businesses, gadgets, House, cars, hobbies, recreation, etc. These things only help to sustain the evil world system that puts the very poor people under a heavy yoke, and kills/abuses a lot of animals and nature.

It doesn't matter if opportunities to make more money or material blessings falls on your lap, you think it's a miracle, yes it's a miracle from the Devil himself. Jesus never said said anything good about money and the things of this world. It is to be hated, despised, thrown out like a rotting garbage literally. You are to carry your cross. To enjoy this world other than God's love in it's purest form and the Holy Spirit, is the gospel of the antichrist.

Biggest deception hounding Christians today is that God loves them through material blessings. The truth is the opposite. God's love is shown even through extreme poverty and suffering. That you can still rejoice in these desperate times, now that is true love of God! A lot of people come crashing down to million pieces when suddenly their little world is taken from them. This only shows they love their wealth a lot more than God.

You can't preach God and wealth together as being good. In fact, money and things in this should never be preached, except to only say how despicable and how relatively useless it is for serving God and following Jesus. It usually does more harm than good even for the most devout Christian.