How to tell when someone might be tellng lies or is deluded /psychological curiosities

HO HO HO ,
SPECULATION is great fun .
We dont have to beleive all that much , if we dont want to . Why not keep people on their toes and absolutely have a laugh at the same time?
Why not ? Because curiosity killed the proverbial cat ? Question who are the overly curious.
Question who it is that brings things down to a cat-fight .

I wanted to say , yesterday on the curiousity thread , they , those who already beleive there is a lander on mars ,
which is fine , if they so wish to , as in they have actually seen the facts they have used to satisfiy their understanding enough to beleive it , will be available to some , very lucky , individuals .

There should be some validation process here with this type of claim . Its a base affront to all human sensibility
without it . The intended purpose of this runs into an enormous piece of history , mega , so forgive us we dont beleive it for now , and there will certainly be some reading this that know that I havent got a clue what they know really , either. They might know we'd try and guess . Maybe thats why they called it curiosity .

So something like this , after last year ad everything nasa knows about rather foolhardy conspiracy theorists , or those who plumb the depths with an unknown length of line . They also know that these conspiracies can and do exist in some shape or form , just not where we are allowed to see it . Or it wouldnt be a conspiracy.

So maybe it is of use , as it normally is to bring in obvious baseness into the discussion, imo , then we do get somewhere. And get to fine tune the noise. One of these things is a personal matter , when I was asked , having said , @sorry I can't beleive this is happening" then I was asked twice at least ,
they said to me , "It must be hard to live , not having faith in humanity" .

For us o this site thsi point should matter , its very base and applicable to all truth situations between people . The return , "don't you have faith in me ?" will belie a plot or lie or a trap .
So,
A person who beleives the 'truth' they tell you , will beleive it so fully themselves , that in fact , THEY should have faith in YOU , coming to understand it in your_ own terms ,
If at some point you choose to not understand . Never be hurried into accepting something . Never be psychologically manipulated into losing the truth or meaning in life , as is satisfied to you alone , no body else.

Critically , WHEN you understand , is the key issue . If you hold an open mind on just about everything , you cannot be hoodwinked , however that may be. Indefinitely holding this mental attitude , the open mind , means that you retain the meaning and the truth , effectively , you are the judge .

Even if you asking a difficult question , a person who should know the answer should find answering easy , and answers should never be complicated .
Nasa will say , the beleivers in the landings will say , "its ultra-complicated - you wouldnt understand" .
Or they would say "read the notes and the smallprint , we explained it already"
The cheating lover might say , "I told you already , I only love you , DONT you have faith in me ?"

In reality , if you not going to be dragged around like a ragdoll by people in life , then you need a defensive attitude , at least at some times , and at some points . Not always by any means . So as general advice , to myself or anyone , is .. make sure that you keep your _own self respect at all times . Never rely on or need or feel pressured into respecting _anyone . No one . Assert that you are a respectable individual to other peple when you are a respectible person. In that way , you will not be lied to ,or the lies will show themselves up.
Watch someone who says this is 'wierd' - they spend their life lying about stuff.


If they say , "dont you have faith in us" "are you deluded?" "dont be so paranoid" , these are the likely responses of those who dont have faith in you - they dont want or trust your understanding . Sometimes this may be with good reason - know when that is .
its the response of those who are paranoid , about _you understanding _them , thus they will not understand you.
They are the ones who are deluded , not you . You seek , the truth . They do not see the ways that you work , not all the time. Liar s profit nothing from lies but strife .
If they do not present facts and evidence , or expect you to suffer what they accept as fact and evidence , they are the ones who are deluded , or they have no faith in your ability to understand , because they are telling lies, more often than not . And a liar , loves the truth , when and if he gets to use it .
.
ANY how then , just throwing that and this in the pot , that maybe the signal nasa is sending is more serious than we're taking it so far , given the general riot going on . I dont credit them with being that dumb , but then again , nothing gets credit until it is proven somehow .



What we could be getting is warning of some kind ?




What is up there on the northern horizon , as well ?
Thats what I'd like to know , hopefully it'll be something genuine .
And hopefully we get a good old laugh along the way



have a good day people

reply to post by ZIPMATT


Bull# Baffles Brains Bountifully and everything coming out of NASA is bull#. Just don't spend any energy on anything from them.

reply to post by rollsthepaul


Not necessarily brother , its the nasa family i am talking about - and that includes you and me . Like I said , I dont credit them with being that dumb - and i never said it was a heads up or that it wasnt true - just that i am not ready to beleive it yet . When , being the critical issue . When being the point that I choose to accept something or not .

Between that I have definitely got faith in humanity - because i dont lie , am a positive thinker who see the bright side . I listened to the NEO conference2011 webcast , and where there is humour (will never forget laughing that much) , there is humanity I beleive

Woooo wooo I think I spotted one....its the OP cause his thread title is severly misleading. I thought you were gonna tell me how to tell. Not give me some press box opinion about nasa....

See...your method is working great already.

To just boil it down , it does indeed come down to whether it is a worthwhile activity or observation that people are more stupid and careless about actual facts than you or I might think . Thereby nasa mutually dumbs down liability , as per outright jokes . You end up with sympathy for them , or a little squirrelled nut they put for you put there sometime last year. I heard the figure 25 billion somewhere in all this , I guess they'd have to be clever . Or there'd be a even further , maybe further hidden resaons to land on the moon , go to mars , land on asteroids rofl , and its either setting further delusion, or a potentially apology in advance .

Where theres smoke theres fire and things are never senseless unless someones unhooked the sensibility meter .
Its a learning curve

Since any futher than what was commented to me would be useless or could be seen as dangerous in some way , then 0% will probably get added here . Someone will follow th train so its left here . cheers for that

reply to post by Kastogere


If you have time to read then see another thread . Or add some .
Heres a trick from derren brown the phychological manipulation specialist , on tv

A person holds a coin in either hand , without showing you which but presented up front

The first time he doesnt tell you which hand it is in , but the first time , there will be
the giveaway - something he does will be easy to spot .
The next time after you get it right ,
is the 'switch' - you have to work out which sort of person this is - simple enoug to switch , or double cross the switch even twice
The next time after you are correct (practise)
comes 'guilt'
the person becomes conscious , the third time of his own guilt
showing you which hand its in , through his guilt
Lastly , after that , is
tension .
Even the slightest , on the side (of the body) it takes place , will be where the coin is

. So here is a start - take your time in deciding . The literal 'when' you mak your mind up should very rarely actually arrive . Also , silence makes people uncomfortable , forcing mistakes . This, for you
There plenty else to know , keeping it topical or on good links /

Have a couple more while we're on it m there s a question ,
When is a person wrong ?
There are 2 answers to , _when is a person wrong ?
They are

1. When he is wrong
2 .Not when he is not wrong

This particular question is a refernce question for Judges to gain base sensibilities which are applicable in all cases - to remind themselves what's true or not - very sensible . Judges use these formulas for judgements .

Sometimes you need to distill the substance of a person's arguments very carefully and responsibly . It takes thought . And being reminded .

Not just through there being ways to discern truths , we are allowed to use them in our perception and the ways we live life , or build our characters and hone our attitudes , and further the cause of those who will find these things out , on their behalf.

Another feature of Court Judgements (question and answers) is the asking of

"at where is the point ?" for example "at where is the point when child protection measures become the instruments of child abuse ? " - one of the answers without going in to it is 1. When there is abuse , another 3. At where it must stop .

So measurements , the careful taking of such , and knowledge of the many methods of measurement , including estimation , should add up and develop a person's ability to spot liars , or those who delude themselves or attempt to delude others . There's an aspect of herd mentality in delusion , like elephants scattering at a fly , its dangerous world , people should know the facts before pressing buttons . / your right / whatever about the title

Donald Rumsfeld , of all people , decribed the entire battleground on which the politics of truth are fought ;

He said ,

There are known knowns , things that we know we know
There are known unknowns , things that we know we dont know
And there are unknown unknowns , things we dont know we dont know . You could add 'yet' .

Now an onest person will accept these facts - he has to , its the truth , and only wise , foolishness never profits .

But , where does the liar or the deluded come into this ? It s at every point , so we take the original understanding further .
Firstly , reverse the middle point - unknown knowns . These will be the typical lie , do spot how that works .

You have known unknowns , he has unknown knowns .

Any display of these and catching them is possible . Someone might rely on known knowns just as you do , but only when it suits them to . Any pulling of the known knowns by the liar who does know them , is a sign .

Unknown unknowns s anyones field , so what you're back to is accuracy of accounts and measurement - you're ability to check facts and screen out through deduction any logical fallacy or deliberate reduction in logic / encrryption . So where you're invitation is , there is where the front door is , when it comes to liars . Liars never ever get round the truth .

The last one since they are getting stuck here is very simple .
Very base .

Its the old phrase , ask Why? 3 times and you'll be closer to the truth .
In effect this can work practically in reality , or in a conjectural manner , where you dont have to have the right answers to speculate .

Thereby if we asked , a liar , "Why do I feel there is a mistake or that I am not understanding what you're trying to tell me ?"

Whatever they answer , whatever it is , or whatever the question is you put , your response is think or question them again , "why is that then ?" , even if they answer nothing

Try it - the liar will start gagging or start to consider taking your head off , so watch out too ! Let them do the angrying... Their response will gradually crumble , if they're hard , and you are , because by asking why you are 'peeling layers' away from their argument , and stripping them of defendable points.
And then , just to bang a last nail in here , dont to forget to ask why again . In the end , thats the point to there being any justice at all in the world . Ask the right questions , get the right answers .

note to self , the facts come very quickly with good observation , so keep future conversations of any risky nature as short as possible . The advantage gained is that , facts having slipped already , they cant be taken back , thereby you also retain rights to 'fast-tracked' misunderstandings which were not currently addressed , worrying the liar but not you , until future meetings , when explanations must be plausible , or may offer clues . Not accepting excuse for original behaviour or statements then becomes a lever , which might otherwise be shortened by the liar if he can build that in , to a longer conversation . keep it simple stupid

this is a fluid approach but another obvious base way to remind ourselves about what we try to discover from liars , is their motivation . The likely cause , or 'reasonable doubt' is often used in court decisions , whether there is a proved case or not , and further investigation proceeds on 'accepted' claims in court , not validation of what might be accepted , via evidence or proof , as a claim .
Having respect for people then is the battleground . Its been recognised that for example , non=paying clients , will pay if you ask them , 'do you have a problem with respect here ?' The answer they have to make to themselves horrifies them so much , they just front the money straight away . Very subtle magic principles can work too , but only in this case , if you are or have been respectable .

When they say , 'you can't con an honest man' , thats absolutely true . A honest man has nothing to gain from cheating , so he cannot lose , at any time . He is not trying to get ahead too quickly , so he cannot be offered shortcuts , just because they might suit him . A hornet man can take threats because the law protects him , and his right to free speech . As honest man , who is detatched from delusion , cannot be shown deluded ways , and crucially he cannot accept them as his choices .

So in this way , both truth and honesty - moral honesty , are wrapped together . You cant know one without the other . But , as in a mirror , you can recognise the dark side too , or the shadows on the ground being used . And what I know for certain is that , if you are righteous person , you can know these things , and have them settle your soul , even the righteous shall have hope in his death . but if you are not , then consider the reflection . From outside of your attachments I see them better . And attached to the liars are heavy weights .

Your basing this all on the drivel of another man. Problem is..man has been wrong before....and like lawyers..I don't hold much credence into what a headshrinker says. Man is flawed, as is the study of man by another man. With the exception of physicality as it pertains to what is true and what is not......the mental assertion is a huge grey area where one cannot possibly discern the absolute truth of the matter.

You ever hear there's a sucker born every minute? The same would apply....its a trick of itself.

on an emotional level

there is a parallel function between lies and delusions , so these can become interchangeabl factors when understanding either .
on an emotional level there are paralels and as above , contradiction s of opposing values . what the liar feels in terms of emotion may be much different however , but psycholgical stessors , if you are perceptive , can give you clear signals . by ref to lie detector tests , these are many variable , and leaving the base environment , then multi-tech systems can catch any liar , or bad beahviour , clean caught out . But this is something people and know and their level of 'guardedness' is not necessarily an indicator of lying . Neither , interestingly , s their emotional state if it involvs involuntary outpouring , deep honesty , or other unexpected behaviour . One of these is shouting , and in all fairness , when you can see someone is angry , it is likely they have been wronged .

Emotional violence , is at unprecedented levels , at the level of hardness in character depicts whether somebody gives the truth or not . Advanced people who have high power jobs may be rich , but thats not always because they are rich in spirit . So it paysto protect or recognise . And to learn from even the rich themselves . Another of my former associates , his continual retort , to whatever was told him whenever that was , by whoever , anybody , and everybody was "No , I can't beleive that ..." It was more than just his catchphrase , and money and truth is what you want in life , not losing out . Get on the rich list . When he gives his acceptance , that'll be the day . It pays him everytime he doesnt beleive it . What a genius .

Its like saying to liars , did you just lie to yourself then rofl ?
And to those who speak the truth ..thou shalt respect me . Pure genius , gold dust .

emotional and psychological abuse in workplace settings and domestic environments are commonplace , and normally accepted by most as being accptable abuses of base human rights . This abuse is widespread very common so is ignnored regularly , if not accepted . Having done reasonable research into this topic then it is of note to me on this topic of truth telling that almost all abuse belies dishonesty at its heart . Not facing responsibilities towards people as is morally legally or politically accepted in other ways , is a symptom of deep dishonesty , both within systems and unfortunately the public consciouness . Not that it cant be unwound or will not be . Indian Dynasties did not carry on as long as they still have , without the very old and commonly understood , fact , that dishonesty , when collared as a culprit , is the one you want to put to bed . Every single time .
Some things about politics , which has gone on for a long time with Gods help - the moral law - never change . They never change . Liar might say 'it must be lies' , but not like in the saloon shootouts , in real life you back down . You dont let delusion kill you , if theres too many guns , everyone walks away .
Thats in some ways , a lot of ways , how India survived as log as it has - forever . Because neither enemy can change the facts . Dishonesty is at the root .

So , on the same lines , the honest person will usually be the one who backs down first . who is ready to play politics . Mirroring of this sentiment will always be false , feel false , and a character's reflections can be what catch him out . A person can sneer in virtually an auoral way , no words required ,

such as in the case of King Soloman and the baby he intended (falsely as judge ) to cut in half , and settle two womens claim to it being their child /claim )well known story)
the one woman who was not actually sure it was her baby (there were 2 and 1 died) when hearing this terrible news , simply accepted , this was the judgement of the king , what could she do ?
but the one whose baby it was , upon hearing this , did not care who he was , but launched on him .
Selah! to the King Solomon for he saved a baby and a woman many tears .And there is not much or anything politically we havent seen before with the more ancient , which still is there .

You cant take these things away from us , no one can . And I was there first , absolutely , it was me . This time around . Like Noah saw theres a clear plataeu on which to stand when it comes to being honest . He was anry as hell with his sons when they suddenly thought they might know better than him , even if drunk and naked on the first batch of wine after the flood . So , between those who do keep the truth ,=severely so , and those who are lax on their judgements and low on respect , there;s a great difference . Wat I am saying is that everyone is a liar , a duluded so and so , who thinks for no one but himself or even for the ego of others in his ignorance . Ego being the aspect which soaks up an acceptance of 'liarness' in self and others - its an ugly trait i human beings which oozes , in a way, and spreads itself around .

The building of lies is an easy process to understand and many lies matter more as time proceeds. Guilt builds up in a persons psychology (releasing lies releases guilt) and this temporal process will build up . You can observe certain words and concepts evoking intimate response analysis , with or without watching the person directly or without their consent , knowledge . Making an, one, simple inquisition with implied suspicion or without or with informed knowledge you have just gained lots of about the circumstances , in avery simple answer please , tone , can catch the 'build-up guilty' out big time . you can watch people go to pieces on it .
Liars is as liars does, forest

reply to post by Kastogere


the suckers wont read it , the safe will . if i understand it , so do you

And then there is all the tricks which are the favourites of 'insider-viewers' of productions like morse , or comparatively , Columbo .

What Columbo does is conveniently forget things . the oh I forgot to ask you , approach . This is because he is trying to catch suspects off guard , but also lay thoughts on their plate as the last thing he does . Whether this is induced behaviour from television companies is under debate . Reversal of first impressions count to 'now I have let you know how I dell I am leaving' *door slams* as in eastenders .

Both count as means or tools and neither is intended to facilitate manipulation , except in the favour of screening away lies . In domestic settings , the reverse is true . So in this case of Columbo he is the manipulator he is the liar , he is untrustworthy one , he is where the drama comes from .
So in gaining the truth fighting fire with fire is not unacceptable , thinking in the ways liars would then makes you a better liar than them . But as was written before about moral honesty , dont shoot yourself in the foot.
Lies you tell are only a trap for you , should be a liar wishing to understand lies - its a good game that I get to win

























Heres another of his the double visit , he goes away , the suspect thinks he is gone , and then he just comes right back in again . Oh , I forgot to ask you ...
the good excuse , every liars perfect solution

reply to post by ZIPMATT


Very good point, and I like the premise as much of the reactions you lay out are true in the sense that it is how others are programmed to read another. Human interaction has always garnered my interest as I view most people as a science project to begin with.

And much of what you lay out is correct in the reaction sense of how people sub consiously project their answers or image without saying a word...a kind of truthful body laungage of sorts. Only that also can be misread often albeit there would still be some truth in the motion of the emotion.

Emotions are funny things...they drive our every response to what is and what isn't....all the way down to what kind of candy bar we want or like. Its sad really that human kind cannot grow out of that barrier. We are capable of so much more, and lots of these telling emotions that drive us are petty in nature to begin with.

Worst part is, most of us don't even realize we're doing it to begin with. The fact that man can manipulate that as a tell of what to expect from another is merely a sign of spotting a weak mind.

Good thread though...

reply to post by Kastogere


Very good oversight , much appreciated thankyou . Maybe you forced a critical point from me there , because it can be elaborated .
A liar cant trust the future . He cant trust natural processes not to somehow uncover his lies . This is true on many levels and the liar knows this . If he wasnt serving this purpose of defeating natures effects , it wouldnt affect his consciouness in the ways it does . Or his actions .
On the other hand , the truth of matters is always the friend of the honest . Nature is his good friend , he has a deep trust in what will turn out . The honest may have recognsed this defeating force of nature towards sin . Sin being , what you know , that nature disallows you . And that can come from maoral consciounss among the public , or it could come from deep natural urges ie protection of children . An honest person or one using and or allowing the forces of nature to work for him , is handling the truth physically mentally and emotionally every day . As he grows in stature he will gain his trust and understading from nature alone , even if in the form of people .

So by setting this out as truth or existential observation it is unlkely to be used well by liars . Nature , remember , is a powerful force . Life has many asects that are certainly unknown unknowns to us . But to draw up original beginings , is the honest man trusting in nature , while nature has made him trustworthy ? Moving between the concepts of nature and God , for those honestly appraising the human condition including their own , then again , the unknown unknowns are at play . While the atheist writes off the reasons for observations such as this he is writing off his fellow man , personal observations of the truth . The honest man , if he shares with one who has gained from knowledge of truthful and honest ways , as well , then instantly recognises the source of wise observation . Be it from soldier , medic businesman or any informed field dealing with truth . Science is simply an aspect of truth , like accounting , it is employed as a fundamental basis of operation .

The scientific study of truth in terms of human interaction must come in existentialist form . or similar
Therby making it available to one , will have to make it available to the other .

Keeping to the subject of God and the fluidity of personal stances (a person can read honstly , but recognise their own delusions perhaps , or obsiously shared or refernced sources of wise words / that being nature)

Words , are the territory , between truth and liars , those seeking honest gain and those with false balances in the marketplaces .
So words , are also the terittory of personalities . They are the means of exchange taking place before during and after any exchange . Social political , domestic , religious , in every particular .
Words are symbols . Each letter , punctuation , each space between each word , is a communication tool . And with 26 letters in the english alphabet , on the border between man understanding what God is about is symbolism . Symbolism is the means of all our communication , the very basis . So the honest can read a multitude about so called truth , and have to ignore it . With education in symbolism then realisation of variable combinations of offering and means of taking symbols from people , is where we read between the lines and personalities are built . So what is accepted by the truth ful as being naturally true , and easily symbolised as such (dictionary definition/truth/that which is ) ,
can be very easily reversed, or corrected quickly ,
edit switch
or simply be observed , when coming from someone else , as a fallacy of truth, as is presented by nature


So , if God exists , or even might exist, then you accept it . You cant ask nature to change this , for it suddenly to become summer in winter . And you dont be in a hurry . And you change your behaviours for the better , by having some faith iin that what you are seeing is real , and true , going on right now. You study books as if you mean to understand them . When youdo , you find the others who drew the same straws as you . You keep and open mind and faith and respect in yourself . You ascertain facts as an when you observe them to be true . You never let someone else force things on you . Which is just about where this all started , on mars , wasnt it ?

Hypnotics is an aspect of lying and involves liars . This is a very dangerous phenomenon . Education provides protection , understanding a threat is a primary means of necessary defence. In terms of personality and cherrypicking of known and unknowns combinations , then the traits are understandable through Freuds observations from example . Its a science . And so are truth serums .
So ID here of again the base facts for simplicity remains a key , there is a difference b/cont

This thread needs more flags.....dammit people....this is good insight......LOL

At least someone reads it....

between states of mind , sometimes observable in han characters through response analysis . A person will let you know , by questioning , whether they are currently operating in any mode . These would relate to can and cant , will and wont , do and dont , have and havent .

These combinations are a key to understanding hypnosis / a multfacteted tool . For example a person cant be hypnotised (like me ) or they can be , therefore they wont be hypnotised , and therefore they dont get hpntised and they havent been .
Consider te opposite - they can be so they will , they do get hypnotised , and they have been hypnotised .

Normal life , or the literal choices you make , every minute , come down to these questions . You might want either in any situation . In terms of self determination , we should kow how these factors operate . With liars, or deluded/hypntically governed (adverts) it makes them driven by lies , it makes the fundamenta basis of their lives into dealing with more lies of their own or those of others .

Can you or cant you can be a trick against the truth , eg the lie , "come and pick up this great product.."
and its a terrible thing .
The offering of opportunities , which effectively lead to one or many's great loss and anothers great gain , is a key area of in the politics of control . To the honest , lies at official level are not intolerable but never go unmissed . An honest person ends up with forgiveness , given the circumstances . The one thing they can do , and learn they must , in the end .
But can you or cant you is a sword cutting both ways , and from any perspective at all , the answer to any offer for the honest , is , no thanks . We cant do that , and no , we dont beleive it . No conning honest men .

God , life and nature are man friends , along with his companions through the times . As has life has proven to many a deluded or lying individual or unsupported invading army , will or wont you is a magic slide.
Nature abolutely determines for everyone , without exception , whether they will or wont , in every minute of every day . So the wise who is honest and uses the truth , will know when will or wont can happen or not .
And that is anytime of day . This , fact , is no friend of liars . But then , would we have life at all without the facts of it ? These are the home ground s of the enlightened . Nobody fouls the referee . They shalt not .

When it comes to do or dont , the liar loses his options . Dont lie - so simple . Because how many things will you have to _ do to keep letting that lie happen ? The same runs - dont delude yourself . you'l tie yourself up in knots . If you do lie , you do get in trouble . And then you dont , want to have to own up or admit it - you'll be seen as a liar . The double edged sword - did you do what you dont do ?
For liars , what is it . As finished on before , heavy weights , the liar now has to do that job of work, and that is while , he is not enjoying doing anything else . He has slid the scale from dont to do , and he didnt want to do that. Never mind what he desires or deludes himself he can cover up . (Old saying - be sure your sins will find you out)
Liars have to do things to cover up the facts , one enlightened from these burdens having releived himself through honest conduct , will have no need to unrelax himself he is blessed of God and Nature . The liar failed to see this fork in the road , that he was warned to not take . Perhaps more than once .

So having and not having is a symptom of someone who has chosen a big lie , or many little lies , dishonest choices , untrustworthy acts . And reiterated , honesty vs dishonesty is at the base of these , hence truth and lies , and personalities . A dishonest person who hides themselves as being weaker by far than what they would portray to others is then symptomatic potentially for life without correction . Where the state nannies and cossets the choice makers , or coerces and forces them , these are related to the have havenot slide . A liar does not have in general , or he does - he has information he is covering , or he is making an omission . Either or , not neither . Which is where sides come in-- have and have not is a polically ending environment , even ones life physical food and home , not only temporal condition as in do and dont , but death does cross all the measurements and tools .

Leaving the paradigm conditionalities of mental judgement to these four factors , is not possible either because a build up of wisdom regarding matters of truth and life disallows it . The honest man looks for bypass mechanisms to reach a proper understanding as is according to the facts of any circumstances . The complex approach of these on their own , and the basest boilings of the residues , mean that an honest mans assessment of life in clairity reveals the ways of liars and cheats to be so cheaply false he will never accept them . He wont waste his time with it either