"Wake-up call" to Egypt or something else?

*mods* there is currently a thread here that mentions one of the following incidents in this post but which, brushes over it's possible significance and does not mention the earlier attack that was equally of importance as I will attempt to explain, but if you want to delete this thread thats fine.

Normally I don't pay much attention to clashes between the various factions within the Sinai Peninsula but the recent two clashes (5th August) between security forces (Egyptian & Israeli) against these 'militants' (within hours of each other) in this area are, imo different and worth highlighting.. Often, what is not openly stated in news reports is more important than the actual story itself.

But first....

A Brief Summery...

Here in Egypt their is currently a power vacuum between the new Islamist President Mohamed Morsi and the Military Regime Supreme Council of the Armed Forces (SCAF) of former Hosni Mubarak that is quite unique, which I am sure both political & military analysts alike around the world will spend years to come studying it's complex and political structure and it's impact on future world events.. President Mohamed Morsi since coming to power has been considered a moderate Islamist, perhaps too moderate according to his more extreme and powerful supporting party's which constitutes a fair proportion of his overall supporters. It would be foolish to speculate on any present or future events here in Egypt or with it's neighbours without first taking into account the political turmoil that exists since the Egyptian Revolution of January 2011.

After the Egyptian Revolution of January 2011 Egypt's main political party, The Muslim Brotherhood ( considered the largest, best-organized political force in Egypt) created a new party in April 2011 called 'The Freedom and Justice Party (FJP)' in order to put forward a candidate on their 'behalf' for the up and coming Elections for a new president. Their own candidate Khairat al-Shater was disqualified from taking part in the elections. In order for The Freedom and Justice Party to take on the interim Goverment which was controlled by the powerful Supreme Council of the Armed Forces they had to seek the support and backing from other, smaller, yet influential party's such as the ultra conservative El-Nour party of which, came second in the 2011–12 Egypt parliamentary elections to the Muslim Brotherhood and others such as the April 6th Youth Movement and many others. Full list of supporters and opposition party's can be found here. When El-Nour's party candidate Hazem Salah Abu Ismail was disqualified from the 2012 presidential elections they then supported The Freedom and Justice Party with Morsi as their candidate.

By the time Morsi was elected president of Egypt he inherited a government that was divided with little political status or a parliament to implement new constitutions and reforms. His 64 election promises for his first 100 days in office, which were designed to appeal to a wide range of voters and satisfy his diverse party supporters have since been posted on the internet as Morsi Meter! and is now increasingly being used as a basis by which his rivals can attack his leadership capabilities.

Since Morsi became president there has been a steady escalation of in-party disagreements over how the new goverment should be represented, with some major party's such as El-Nour sighting in-proportionate representation in Mosi's new government.

El-Nour Party sidelined in cabinet

The El-Nour party has accused the newly appointed Prime Minister of sidelining the salafist party when forming his new cabinet.

Prime Minister Hesham Qandil offered El-Nour party member Gamal Allam El-Din the Ministry of State for Environmental Affairs but dissatisfied with the offer, the party decided to boycott the cabinet.

“The Ministry of Environment doesn’t comply with the size of El-Nour party, the second biggest party in Egypt,” spokesperson for the party Dr Yousry Hammad said.

A statement on the party’s Facebook page said all the political parties and movements collaborated to support Mohamed Morsy in the presidential elections, but since being elected, neither he nor the Freedom and Justice Party had any communication or consultation with El-Nour.

The recent HOAX 'news' from Egypt of cleric calls on President Morsy to destroy Giza Pyramids is one of many examples that have surfaced that demonstrates a hidden agenda to insight outside public opinion in a negative way against the civilian leadership of Egypt.

And Now...

Two separate attacks against Egyptian checkpoints, first at border sign 6 (Sheikh Zuwaid) - Orange Marker, the second at an army checkpoint near Rafah - Pink Marker

The first report by Daily News - Egypt an independent news outlet that I have found to be reliable and unbiased stated on August 5th the following:-

18 Soldiers dead at a security check point – Sheikh Zuwaid

Gunmen attacked a security checkpoint at Sheikh Zuwaid, North Sinai, killing 18 Egyptian soldiers in one of the most brazen attacks on the area in recent history.

“We heard the sound of an enormous explosion coming from the checkpoint, then we saw an armed group driving military tanks towards Karam Abu Salem crossing,” witnesses told The Daily News Egypt.

“The clashes took place at border sign 6, which is mainly secured by military forces. Most of the killed soldiers are military soldiers,” Abdul Rahman Almasry, an activist with the 6th of April (The Democratic Front) movement, told The Daily News Egypt.

Hours later they reported a second attack which most other news outlets also picked on:-

IIDF searching for remaining gunmen from Sinai attack

During an Iftar dinner at an army checkpoint near Rafah last night, a number of gunmen attacked soldiers as they broke fast, reportedly killing 13 and wounding several others as they also stole two military vehicles in the process of one of the most deadly and brazen attacks at the Israeli border in recent history.

Ahmed Abo Thera, a Sinai Bedouin activist said that he had been to the scene.

“I’ve seen a bloodbath. There was a group of 25 soldiers having Iftar when they were attacked. The attackers showed up in “three Land Cruisers and used heavy weapons,” said Abo Thera.

The death toll left behind has varied according to differing reports ranging between 13 and 20.

Continued...

Now here is where things become interesting.. The first attack happens in North Sinai, killing 18 Egyptian soldiers in one of the most brazen attacks on the area in recent history. The fighting (with tanks involved), was continuing as of the initial news report, with clashes erupting near the Karam Abu Salem crossing, witnesses reported, as gunmen attempted to storm the Israeli border.

The early reports of the second attack (shown above) at the Rafah checkpoint mentioned "The attackers showed up in “three Land Cruisers and used heavy weapons,” and from the latest BBC report - Egypt hunts gunmen who raided Israel border in Sinai it states:-

Masked gunmen dressed as Bedouin nomads opened fire on the border post, near the Rafah crossing, with guns and rocket-propelled grenades, killing 16 soldiers and border guards and wounding another seven.

and also:-

The army statement said 35 gunmen had taken part in the attack, suggesting dozens may still be at large.

The story of second attack at Rafah checkpoint starts off as a 'Desert Recon Patrol' with three light, agile Land Cruisers that, using techniques of a disciplined military unit that is no hurry, waits for the exact moment the Egyptian border soldiers/police break their fast (Iftar) with their first meal during the day before attacking them. The 'gunmen' then stop to capture two Amoured personnel carriers. At this point the three land cruisers disappear from the story, the two stolen vehicles with around 39, possibly more gunmen head south directly towards the Israeli border, which is heavily fortified and one vehicle is blown up on route, possibly by the gunmen themselves and the second one is taken out by the Israeli air force. Their is so much wrong with all this.. If Israeli civilians were their primary target then going directly in the Israeli fortified border position (that even google map smears the whole area from prying eyes) makes no sense at all. If they wanted to take out as many security forces as they could before being killed then holding the checkpoint would have succeeded in this objective.

These 'gunmen' were not the usual militants that have attacked one or two soldiers/police in the past then disappeared into the surrounding area to fight another day, these were more organized and in greater force, causing more deaths than in previous border checkpoint attacks. The unanswered question to all this is why attack two military checkpoints then storm the Israeli border with zero chance of success.

Even if the first attack at Sheikh Zuwaid checkpoint turns out to be nothing more than some kids letting off fireworks, the attack at Rafah is the most puzzling of the two incidents.


After these attacks Israel says attack should be "wake-up call" for Egypt

(Reuters) - Israeli Defence Minister Ehud Barak said on Monday he hoped a deadly cross-border assault in the Sinai would serve as a "wake-up call" to Egypt, long accused by Israel of losing its grip in the desert peninsula.

From the BBC report..

Israel wants tighter security in the Sinai, but it does not want that to be achieved with a large increase in numbers of Egyptian troops near its border, our correspondent adds

Is this the reason for the attacks? to 'push' Egypt into securing the desert peninsula as it used to be under Hosni Mubarak's reign, without breaking the 1979 peace treaty between the two countries?. Or is it just another example to prove to the world that Mosi's government is unable to secure it's own border or, just simply a clash between the security forces and 'militants' where the 'militants' then lost their sense of direction when trying to escape?

What do you think?

Isreali false flag?
What to gain?
Jar the crap out of the egyptian govt and make them more hostile to the Gaza militants?
Tighten the border that suppys Gaza qith a lot of smugged arms and suppies?
The wolesale keilling, at the hour of breaking fast is another clever way of demeaning the gunmen themselves to look so much more calous and inhumane.
The Egyptians lose 2 APCs, and One or two Tanks?
Or was the tank already in militant hands at the start?
The Air force got the APCs, but what of the tanks?
Why would the miitants attack their own sympathetic allies in umiform on the Egyptian border?
This makes more sense as a fase flag i think.
Edit to add the operation went off much more like a commando raid by Isrealis than a jihadi attack.....

reply to post by stirling


Well it looks like I was spot on with my assumption that it was was more likely another ploy to undermine Mosi's command leadership to protecting Egypt's borders..

On the Muslim Brotherhood's Official Website they stated the following:-

Yesterday, a group of criminals and terrorists attacked an Egyptian security checkpoint in Rafah, killing nearly twenty of our brothers, our sons, and stole one car and one truck, and tried to crash their way into Israel.

Immediately, Israeli media linked these attackers to the people of Gaza. Nevertheless, this ‘operation’, at this particular time, aims to achieve several goals:

• Create a major border problem for Egypt in its current critical circumstances, to be added to the many internal problems plaguing the homeland after the collapse of a corrupt system that subverted the country’s interests for decades.

• Endeavor to prove the failure of the new Egyptian government, formed just three days ago.

• Attempt to disrupt the new President’s reform project.

• Drive a wedge between the Egyptian administration and the Egyptian people on the one hand, and between the Palestinian government and the people of Gaza on the other.

Evidently, this crime may well be the work of Israel’s Mossad, which has sought to abort the revolution ever since its launch, and which issued instructions to Israeli citizens in Sinai to leave immediately, just days ago. It is clearly noticeable that every time a warning like this is issued, a terrorist incident takes place in the Sinai.

The updated report by the BBC News stated:-

A statement on the Muslim Brotherhood's website said the incident "can be attributed to the Mossad".

It said Israel had carried out the attack in an attempt to undermine the government of Egypt's Islamist President, Mohammed Mursi.

The allegation was echoed by Hamas, the Palestinian offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood that governs Gaza.

To further 'highlight' my O.P, especially the importance of understanding the complex political situation here the updated BBC Report also contained the following statement which I have highlighted:-

Israeli and Egyptian officials have blamed the attack on Islamist militants.

It stated Egyptian officials blame the Islamist militants for this attack, THEN it follows with the statement from the Muslim Brotherhood, the founders of the Freedom and Justice Party who's candidate, Mosi they backed to become President of Egypt and who's supporters make up the official government. It would seem therefore that the BBC report contradicts itself UNLESS the 'officials' were NOT from the civilian government but from the Supreme Council of the Armed Forces (SCAF).

While it is still early days in the unfolding of events, that I'm sure there will be more, it is highly possible that we will see in the near future, a series of confrontations between SCAF and the civilian government over how the Hamas (the Palestinian offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood that governs Gaza) should be treated. It is possible that SCAF wants to distant themselves from the Hamas in order to curry favour with Israel as Hosni Mubarak did for 30 years and in doing so, gain further support from the USA. On the other hand, the Civilian Goverment will want to maintain strong relations with the Hamas and the Palestinians who they see as fellow brothers & Sisters who are, (as they were once under the old Mubarak Regime), persecuted and victimized for their goal of true Independence and just as importantly, to be international recognized.

So your False Flag by the Israeli's has some 'merit' in this instance, although in my O.P I deliberately left out this phrase.. It doesnt make any sense for Israel to wipe out one of their 'commando' units, just to attack a border checkpoint, they are not generally known for carrying out suicide missions with their own people if there is a better alternative.

I fail to understand here.....was there Isrealis hurt of killed?
The APCs were destroyed well before attacking isreals border no?
The death toll is in egyptians not isreais,,,,,,
The whole pointless operation seems phoney somehow....what was the objective exactly?
Looks like Mossad to me........

Originally posted by Freelancer
Is this the reason for the attacks? to 'push' Egypt into securing the desert peninsula as it used to be under Hosni Mubarak's reign, without breaking the 1979 peace treaty between the two countries?. Or is it just another example to prove to the world that Mosi's government is unable to secure it's own border or, just simply a clash between the security forces and 'militants' where the 'militants' then lost their sense of direction when trying to escape?

What do you think?

It could be mossad as some will speculate. [That's always a possibility] However, it could also be the Muslim Brotherhood as well. Here's why. Why are False Flags only considered to be only the products of the CA,MI5 or mossad? There was a fairly inflammatory speech [Which was wrongly attributed to the new Egyptian President] that later turned out to be a outspoken popular figure stating straight out that Israel will have a new capital under Islamic rule or something to affect....



ATS thread discussion here


The equally legitimate question is does the New Egyptian Government have firm control over certain "MB" activities or is this an example that some areas under the "Wild Wild West" mentality out there?

Originally posted by stirling
I fail to understand here.....was there Isrealis hurt of killed?
The APCs were destroyed well before attacking isreals border no?
The death toll is in egyptians not isreais,,,,,,
The whole pointless operation seems phoney somehow....what was the objective exactly?
Looks like Mossad to me........

Correct...No Israelis were reported injured
Correct.. One vehicle reached 2k in Israeli border before being taken out by their air force.
Correct.. Only Egyptian military were targeted, no reports of civilians involved.

Correct... Everything about this was all POINTLESS. Why attack a checkpoint, kill some soldiers/police (which would have immediate alerted the IDF) only to then head off into the sunset towards a heavily fortified Israeli border where their is no chance surviving. Israel stated they were going for 'civilians', but why stop to attack a 25 man checkpoint, then pick up a couple of vehicles while all the time the element of surprise is lost if civilians were their intended target. This is BS

Not Sure. A 'hit and run' followed by a vanishing act would have been much more effective for Mossad to carry out and then yeah, I would have pointed my finger at Mossad too.. But this didn't happen. I have said this many times already, the official story of this attack doesn't make any sense, it was pointless.

reply to post by SLAYER69

The equally legitimate question is does the New Egyptian Government have firm control over certain "MB" activities or is this an example that some areas under the "Wild Wild West" mentality out there?

More like the other way around. The MB has firm control of the Egyptian government. Morsi is part of the MB and a high ranking official, he'd know all about what's going on. The Entire point of him opening Egypts borders to Gaza is so the MB could sneak weapons into Gaza for Hamas to and some crap with Israel. I have no doubt they have their own cloak and dagger b.s. going down. It's no accident that all the islamic nations since the Arab Spring being flipped ended up in MB hands, theyre trying to resurrect the Caliphate that went down in 1924 and surrounding Israel on all sides, just like the 6 day war. I bet 50 bucks when Syria is flipped the MB will get that too. We got a front row seat to seeing the 8th head of the Beast rising to power.

I thought egypt was supposed to be free and peaceful after mubarak? What happened?

If the soldiers at the Israeli checkpoint killed the marauders, there should be bodies to identify.

Any news on the identities?