How seat belts made a mockery of the Constitution

Do any of you still remember laying down in the back seat of the car and falling asleep? I do. I remember climbing in the rear window and waving at semi trucks trying to get them to honk their horns.Does that make my dad a criminal?

I grew up in Detroit, so I can only speak of what happened in Michigan. My gut tells me that my experience played out in nearly every state, but I can only be sure of Michigan.
In the early 80's the Seat Belt law was put to vote in Michigan, and it was defeated overwhelmingly. Then the Federal Branch told the elected officials to either vote again and pass it, or lose any and all monies entitled to it for the repair, maintenance, and construction of roads. So they re-voted and passed the law the Federal Branch demanded. This is nothing short of extortion.
This was a test, and the results of this experiment took the 10th Amendment and sterilized it. Now the threat of withholding money is used constantly to insure that legislation the Fed wants gets passed. Extortion has become the law of the land.
My parents, and parents all around the state did nothing to tell the Federal Branch that the People of Michigan will not be extorted . That they will not allow any of our fellow Michiganders to labeled a criminal fit for punishment for choosing not to wear a seat belt.
Do you really believe the government cares if someone dies in a car crash? The same government that sends people off by the thousands to die in so many foreign countries care so much that they move heaven and earth to force laws on people to save a couple hundred lives at best. Laws that no one wants.

Force the repeal of your states seat belt laws and cast your gaze at the federal branch. Dare them to withhold your states money or to punish you for being free to live by laws you create for yourselves. Then turn your attention to other laws you know in your heart are wrong.
We have allowed things to get so complicated that no one can be a model citizen anymore, and so we find this why bother trying attitude permeating. Look at your neighbor and think," What would justify me labeling him a criminal?" Is wearing a seat belt when he drives on that list?
The laws governing the citizens have grown to like 10,000 pages. Do we really expect the police to function with that many laws to enforce? Our Founding Father set in place a system to determine that vast majority of circumstances that makes someone a criminal. We have allowed it to become so perverted that even the best cops no longer know if a crime has been committed or not.
If your actions violate with the Bill of Rights, you are guilty of the worst crime possible against your fellow American, this is nothing less than treason. If a law restricts the Bill of Rights, this is a treasonous law.
If someone is on their own property smoking marijuana it is of no concern of anyone until they leave their property. The sanctity of the home along with Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness is supposed to be law above all else. Unless and until a persons actions violate another citizens Rights. To head off those who are thinking of giving me childish responses like, "What if killing someone makes me happy?" Killing someone violates a persons Right to Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness therefor it is a crime.

It is one thing for a government to tell us, "We think you should wear a seat belt.", and present to us the data that led them to this conclusion. What they have done is immoral on a personal level, and a violation of a states right to self determination on a Constitutional level.
My neighbors are supposed to make the laws I live by, not a Supreme Washington Authority.
Start off small. repeal your states seat belt laws and then take a hard look at other things that determine if your neighbor is a criminal or not

I tried to get the gist of the OP, but..

Are you saying kids should not be made to wear seatbelts, or that adults should not?

You start by mentioning kids.. I assume it's kids?

If stupid people want to be thrown out the windshield in an accident, then so be it. But kids? Well, there's a different story.

What ever happened to the "Throw my kids into oncoming traffic" game? We used to love that as kids. Me and old dad. Why I only died once, then he didn't have me as a son anymore... God did.

I hate the seatbelt law primarily because I don't like the government telling me I HAVE to do something.
However, this is not a constitutional issue. Driving is not a right, it's a privilege so if you don't want to wear a seat belt then don't get into a car. Also, this is not a 10th Amendment issue. The state can choose not to implement the seat belt law realizing that they will be forgoing federal government monies for highways.

I used to think this way when I was about 15 and going through my anarcho-hate the world phase.

But this doesn't have anything to do with the constitution. The Constitution doesn't protect you from all tyrannical laws. You don't have to drive a car, you can always ride a bike or walk.

reply to post by ronnieray123

Since we don't have to get into a car if we chose not to, then that invalidates your OP kinda'.

But

If the feederal government MADE you get health insurance, then yes, that would be fascism and the ultimate death of America.

i have been wearing seatbelts before they where mandatory, here in italy. thanks them, i walked away unscathed from a couple of big wrecks. this is the wrong example about liberty, because states don't give a # if you're so idiot to kill yourself. they are concerned in the expenses you are gonna generate, if you're gonna come out alive but badly wounded. the cures cost to the states, to the insurance companies and finally to other motorists.

Whatever your Constitutional views, seat belts save lives. That's all that should matter.

This is the 21st Century, think realistically. There's more traffic on the roads than ever before, more powerful and faster traffic than ever before, more people driving under the influence of drink or drugs than ever before, more road rage and anti-social/inconsiderate driving than ever before.

And all often taking places on roads that were designed during a much more sedate, polite and traffic free era.

That alone is enough to justfy seatbelt use under simple common sense.

Driving is not a right. It's a privilege in most states and that's why you are required to get a license to drive a vehicle on public roads. By granting you the license the state expects you to follow all of the traffic laws in place, and that means wearing your seatbelt, and obeying the speed limit, etc.

Originally posted by muse7
*snip*

you're right...alot of our laws are written exactly for that reason, because there are alot of those F'in idiots out and about...this isn't about rights, it's about arrogant and stupid people hurting others.
the first thing i research before i agree or disagree with a law, is why was it instituted in the first place, there usually is a damn good logical reason, and the other laws that don't make sense, are usually from people that make money off of it. those are the only 2 reasons i have found.



Mod edit: removed quote of actioned post.

Sigh, It has been a whole two weeks since someone brought this up.


Why do you have to wear a seatbelt? For one, as others have mentioned, driving is a privelage, not a right and you are driving on government roads.

So that means that when you have an accident, it is the fire and ambulance service that comes and gets you. If it is real bad, the case is settled in a government court.

When there is an accident requring an ambulance service, on average it costs your municipality 50,000 for that incident.

When there is a fatality, it is almost a million dollars.

Just the stupid 20 percent who don't wear sealtbelts cost the nations billions a year.

Now, it is silly to compare sending people to war, as they volunteered.

But seatbelts save about 15,000 people per year. The number of fataltiies is also dropping due to increased safety measures in cars.

i noticed no one is crying about how there are unwanted airbags in their cars.

4700 soldiers have died in Iraq. That means in the 9 years since the Iraq war was started, 4700 soldiers have died, but 135,000 people have been saved by seatbelts.

Seatbelts are a state law, like helmets. The feds extorted your state to get the law passed. States have also extorted the Feds to back off laws. Money flows both ways and so does extortion. That is politics.

If you refuse to wear a seatbelt, any insurance funded, public funded treatment should be withheld from you. I will not pay for your stupidity.

reply to post by muse7


the idiot amendment.

Arizona had to come up with the stupid law because despite huge signs saying don't cross a wash when flooding, people try anyways, and than the firedepartment has to pull them and their car out of a flooding wash. So now AZ makes them pay for it. And everybody calls it the stupid law.

reply to post by nixie_nox

Seatbelts are a state law, like helmets.

Helmets are not a state law in all states. In my state they let you decide if you want to wear one or not. That's how the seatbelt law should be. You should be able to decide whether you want to wear one or not if you are an adult.

Seat belts are the very least of our worries.

By choice I had them installed in my '62 Corvair in '63. In '67 I was involved in an accident where the belts probably saved my life. You could make the same argument against the requirement of having a driver's license in order to operate a vehicle.

Let's talk about rights and previliages that we have that really scares TPTB

reply to post by ronnieray123

I am behind you in that wearing seat belts should not be a Federal Mandate, however, having driven a wrecker, and worked in a Funeral Home, I am well aware of what can happen if a human body is thrown from a car in a crash. All said and done, in a car crash, a person have a much better chance of survival if they are strapped in the vehicle, period. This is common sense, look at race cars....all have 5 point seat belts.

I also agree that the Federal Government withholding Highway Funds to further their laws and rules is extortion, and should not be, but sadly, it is the norm. This is why we need to go back to the 1787 Constitution, and write all new Amendments. But seat belt laws? This should be enforced at a State level, like a great many other things the Feds administrate from their lofty perch on Capital Hill.

Educate yourself!

APFN Website

Barefoot's World

reply to post by kennylee


I should of been more clear that the state determines seatbelt and helmet laws.

reply to post by nixie_nox


Exactly, and this is what the fan boys here do not understand. and lots of them. The states voted and rejected it. End of story.
Those of you who have always worn a seat belt, without government telling you do so, are an example of a republic at its finest. You looked at the data and made a choice. You buckled up and exercised free will.
When it becomes, you will buckle up because I said so......then it becomes wrong.
Once you consider it acceptable to force your will on others....we all lose. The path it leads down never ends well.

Sure, seat belts are good for accidents, but it is your life. If you want to enjoy it in the back seat falling asleep or looking out the window, that is your choice. It is your life.

The government allows you to smoke cigarettes but when it comes to seat belts, that is a no-no for some reason. It doesn't affect anyone else.