Own a Gun? Doctors Can Refuse to Treat You: (right on the heels of ObamaCare...)

reply to post by anon72


I guess healthcare isn't a right after all.

If doctors don't treat people who have guns, where are cops going to get their steroids?

reply to post by definity


What is pointless are gun haters.

reply to post by Grifter81

Surely if you're in need of a doctor at your home you're not going to shoot him when he gets there? Seems a bit crazy to me?

Tell that to the paramedics and firefighters in some of the bigger US cities who get shot at trying to put out fires, or trying to give medical aid.

I'm sorry, something seems off about this. Firstly, a doctor can't refuse to give you medical treatment based on gun ownership, that is pure insanity if it is indeed a fact. But it just seems like there is a large part missing, this doesn't add up.

The only thing that could make any sense to me would be:

Mental illness, sorry, your malfunctioning brain and my right to safety, trumps your right to shoot at your TV set.
Home visits. I don't know many north american doctors that make house calls, but if they do, I think it's a pretty damn relevant question.

Yes, 99% of American gun owners are smart, calm, and know how to operate and store their firearms.

Yet, gun crimes in the US still continue, and when you mix in a possible medical condition, a little rage directed at the messenger, and a gun, well, if I was a doctor making house calls, I'd also be thinking about my personal safety.

“Guns in the home are a proven deadly risk,” Gross said in a statement. “The government cannot tell us or our doctors that we are prohibited from discussing the deadly risks posed by guns.”

how can you not agree to that? Think about what you are saying, you demand your right to bare arms, and demand your right to free speech, yet, you want to remove that right if it's someone asking you about a gun? Hypocrisy much?

But again, I only see that question being relevant in a very small number of cases.

Cooke asserted furthermore that the anti-harassment language of the bill is too vague and “does not provide fair notice as to what range of conduct it prohibits.”

Ahh, see, now we get to the kernel of truth. This sounds less like "if you own a gun you ain't seeing a doctor" and more like "the current legislation is too vague and possibly infringes on rights and must be reworked"

Tell you what. Find me someone who is refused medical treatment because of gun ownership that doesn't have a mental illness, and the doctor is not making a house call.

Then my friends, you can start hugging your guns for safety.

Also, way to try to loosely attach this to Obamacare which is has nothing to do with.

True colors and all that

reply to post by Kovenov

I guess healthcare isn't a right after all.

Healthcare was never a right in the US. Healthcare is a private for profit industry. Obama had intentions of trying to get you a socialized system to everyone had equal access and rights to healthcare, but that part was gutted long before this crapfest called Obamacare was passed.

Why?

Because your government and talking heads, the very people on fully socialized healthcare plans YOU are paying for, brainwashed you into thinking it would destroy your country.

No, it would destroy the for profit pharmaceutical industry.

But don't take my word for it, a health Canadian socialist pinko, just go check and world health organization list of best countries for health care, quality of life, life expectancy, infant birth survival, access to medical care, and quality of that care.

Every single country above the US, and I think it's over 20 last time I checked, has socialized healthcare. Not obama you gotta buy insurance crap, actual healthcare for everyone paid with your taxes.

OMFG they are gonna make me pay for some other dudes treatment? forget that.. right?

Well friends, I'd rather have an extra .0006% taken from me each year to ensure I never go homeless to pay for healthcare.

And you also have to remember, and this is a hard pill to swallow, other people would be paying for yours too, that's how it works. And that, my friends, explains the recent flooding of americans with fake canadian ID's coming up here for treatment.

For example.... Lets say you are travelling out of state and don't have insurance coverage and become ill, well, you gotta pay right? Hundreds of dollars, maybe thousands or more.

What happens to socialist old me if I'm out of my province? I pay, I believe, 60 dollars. 60$ processing fee because I don't have a medicare card for that province. And that, my friends, isn't required up front, you get treated regardless.

Hell, in france, the doctors are on call 24/7 and come right to your house.

So don't tell me the average american has a right to healthcare, they don't, they have a right to pay for it if they can afford it.

I fail to see how it matters to anyone.

For starters lying is easy.

Regarding the housecall danger (do doctors even do that anymore?) wouldnt that apply to every delivery/utility/repair/service call? You'd have to disclose to the pizza delivery boy the presence of a gun in the home.

Even then lying is still easy.

Regarding risks, shouldnt the insurance company be the one concerned not the doctor? And while on the subject of risk all sorts of everyday and more common devices such as pools in the yard or a dog in the house are more dangerous statically than a gun in the house so the concern is not just moot but foolish as well.

And again, lying is easy.

Nothing about this makes any sense on either the "pro" or "con" side whichever is which.

Just more pointless bureaucratic gaming.

I really don't see the problem with this. If health care is not a right then doctors outside hospital emergency rooms can refuse to treat someone for any reason. They are private businesses.

Let me get this right. Doctor will get into a car which kills and/or cripples people inside said car and outside. Although cars kill more than guns I have found researching this question and found stats that in 10 States the stats are that handguns do more harm than cars but cars which use to hold that position is kissing cousin close and will always remain so as car crimes are so over looked as accidents. I was surprised that Jack Klugman did a Quincy MD episode over this which is how years ago I became aware of this. In the Quincy episode A chap hits someone who is causing legal hassles for a client so the lawyer decide to drive over the chap causing the legal headache then drank a pint on whiskey immediately to appear drunk. To be charged with drunk driving accident in those days there was leniency especially to a top grade lawyer! Jack Klugman always did his episodes of Quincy MD on overlooked important issues to bring them to the public attention.This is why MADD (Mothers Against Drunk Drivers) became so political to change these laws. So many stats still state that cars are more dangerous than guns but thats not the argument!

My point is handgun in the house is a danger but then how many chances did the doctor take in driving to his clients and then on to the next or back to the office?

My question is why is the issue ONLY over one of the two deadly sins that threatens a doctor on a home visit? BTW have you seen what some of these middle aged doctors drive these days.... sporty, neat, light, carbon fiber, and 0 - to a billion in less than a heart beat and yes I want one but safe hell no then I used to jump out of planes for a living so thats my excuse for not knowing better!? Even your harmless Corvette is only fiberglass body and engine! If doctors were really that scared for their lives to imped everyones Constitutional rights you would think they would carry this safety issue over to the transportation side of that home visit. Therefore to continue in context a doctor should be driven around by a professional driver in nothing less than a tank!

TPTB has stirred the medical profession on this issue for gun control and not for the medical personal protection since this is looking at only half of the dangers of a doctors life when traveling to a sick client.

Sorry Pain pills robbing me of what little grey matter I have left today LOL so pick on the ideas and not the grammar as t I feel strongly about my right to own a gun. One day I may come home to America and I want my guns back - My Brothers please take note LOL,,,,,

I just don't understand this. If the information is not relevant to the persons condition why does a doctor need to know this. However, I do believe this going in the direction of disarming the public. Also, doctors can refuse treatment as long as a patients condition is not life threatening. That being said, for all you doctors out there, which is more morally wrong, a person owning a weapon that you feel is a dangerous threat to the public, whether it is or is not protected by our constitutional rights, or the doctor who refuses treatment for something petty. And yes, if your patient has not harmed anyone it is petty.

Originally posted by mikelkhall
My doctor never asks me about guns. He does ask me how I'm doing and I usually say "I'm fine". He then asks me what I need and I then proceed to tell him what I feel is wrong and what medication I need and he writes the scripts.

Sounds like you have a good doctor!!
That's the way it's supposed to work

I'm sure if he disagrees with ya, he'd send you for tests, but if it makes sense and is reasonable, there's no reason for them to go on and on and on and try to milk you for more fees.

Your doctor is more likely to kill you than any gun.

According to JAMA, the Journal of the American Medical Association 225,000
deaths a year are directly attributable to doctor malpractice...

According to the "Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence" guns are responsible for about
30,000 deaths per year....

So...being treated by a doctor is SEVEN times more likely to kill you than a gun is....


.....facts and logic can be such hassle

I have a question (I could research it myself but...) What is the justification for having
Doctors ask a person if they own guns?.... I can't see a correlation. Can he refuse to treat
you because you could kill yourself accidentally or something....I don't get it...?

Originally posted by rival


I have a question (I could research it myself but...) What is the justification for having
Doctors ask a person if they own guns?.... I can't see a correlation. Can he refuse to treat
you because you could kill yourself accidentally or something....I don't get it...?

The only thing I could think of is if it involved antidepressants of some sort or medication that could have serious adverse side effects like, I think it's ambian, could be wrong... where you get up in the middle of the night, walk around, do things and have no memory of it. I guess they want to make sure you don't have access to a gun where you could hallucinate and maybe end up shooting someone or yourself.

Otherwise, I don't see how it could be any of their business....just my opinion

Originally posted by buster2010
Unless you shot yourself why would a doctor even ask if you own a gun? Has anyone in this forum had a doctor ask if you own a gun?

I have never had a doctor mention, ask or comment, about guns.
Why would they? If you were both hunters, sport or target shooters, I can see it coming up. But just to come out and ask as a part of the exam?

reply to post by DAVID64


I deal with doctors constantly. My wife is disabled. But I have never heard the gun question until
about 5 months ago when I took my 13 year old for treatment.

The doctor looks at me and asks if there are any guns in the house....and I was stupefied.

"How is (my) having a gun related to you treating her cough?"...I believe I asked...

He side-stepped the questions and said something like..."It's just a question we ask."

And I said something like..."I don't see how it's relevant."

And I remember he said, "You can just say no...it's no big deal."

So I said, "Okay...No"

And that....was that....as they say...

I do recall worrying a little bit about telling a lie, but I hadn't thought of it again until now

reply to post by phishyblankwaters


I ought to have clarified my initial response with a /sarcasm.

the idiocy factor in america rises faster than I can follow these days ...

no way in hell would I open a practice there too many restrictions ... ambulance chasers ... obamacare ... and now they wont treat patients who own firearms .... wouldnt have any patients to treat with how many americans own firearms...

hell even over here with the strict firearms regs over half the patients I treat own / possess firearms ( granted not all are legal but in these parts it gets overlooked unless you shoot someone ... )
its a physicians duty to treat patients illnesses / injuries ... not to refuse treatment to anyone in need.

if hadnt already left that cesspool this would have caused me to shut down and open a practice abroad so that can continue as a physician and not a pillpusher for big pharma or mindless minion of the state to further oppress the people ...

damn glad not in the totalitarian states of amerika ...

Lots of folks here seem to be on a "bash America" crusade. Maybe you don't like Americans. Maybe you think Americans that own guns are idiots. Maybe you believe that Americans who believe in the freedoms that were fought for and won over 300 years ago are just plain stupid.

That's ok. I believe that everyone is entitled to their opinions. I for one love my country even with all it's major faults. I for one will never give up my guns or my freedom willingly. I for one will not hesitate to answer the call to free America from tyrannical rule.

As far as health care, I could care less. If a doctor does not want to treat me I will find one that will. I will find a doctor that still believes in the Hippocratic oath and not the love of money. If I can't find one then by God I will treat myself to the best of my ability. If I am unable then I, at least, will die a free man.

By the way, I am one of those police officers that has multiple guns at home none of which are registered in my name. I guess I'm on some freedom loving DHS terrorist list now.

Originally posted by FissionSurplus
Considering that most doctors are rather worthless money-suckers, who don't listen and are awful at diagnostics, perhaps we should just not visit them for every sniffle, ache and pain.

Having said that, I cannot imagine the local physician's assistant at our local rural clinic asking if I have guns, because everybody has guns out here in Texas. However, if I was asked, I have no qualms about lying. It is none of his business.

This.

F-'em.

I don't use doctors any way, so just F-'em.

If I want a doctor's opinion on firearms ownership, I'll give it to him.