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Originally posted by BobM88
Originally posted by Wonderer2012
LOL have you ever heard of the PNAC?
I highly recommend 'Rebuilding America's Defenses, September 2000.
www.newamericancentury.org...
Followed by 'Which Path to Persia?, June 2009 from the Brooking's Institute and the Saban Center for Middle East Policy.
www.brookings.edu...
The Neocons were craving for war with Iraq for years, they even wrote to Clinton to push for war with Iraq in 1998-
www.newamericancentury.org...
They make it more than clear in RAD which countries are on the agenda, it is running like clockwork what I add!
Russian plot? LMAO.
Wake up you deluded fool.
What is RAD? I'd like to read that
Originally posted by MrSpad
Originally posted by Wonderer2012
Originally posted by MrSpad
Originally posted by Wonderer2012
Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
The ....realities of...... unconscionable...slaughter of tens of thousands innocent unarmed Syrian men, women and children of the past 14 months...are not staged, despite the whitewashing by HumanSlayer supporters.
If History repeats itself, we can only blame ourselves - the Free World,...for not standing up to the ex KGB agent Putin, a relic of the past, a senile old fool, a throwback of the cannibal Stalin's era, who is still trapped in that cold war mentality, judging by his insane comments of east and west when the world had changed and evolved into shared commonalities to bridge differences, as well as the human butchers CCP of 70+ years.
It is them,. these 2 barbarian group of leaders, whom the world had been appeasing while more and more, and even more fellow humans soon to come are sacrificed on their alters in their insane worshipped of enslavement and destruction of mankind...
What else must the insignificant nobody me, do...to wake up fellow humankind?
Well, the slaughter is 'staged' in the context that it is foreign trained rebels invading a country and killing people- the similarity in the propaganda is that the west is manipulating what is happening to say Syrian military is killing women and children. At no point am I denying people are being killed, it's just you are completely brainwashed to think Assad is going round shooting innocent women and children, it is BS!
Challenge to you-
-Post me some video evidence of Syrian security or military shooting a protestor or civilian. Also, post some video evidence of this in Libya while you are at it.
I'll bet you won't reply because as much as you search, you can never find 100% verifiable evidence-
Syria is fighting a battle against invading terrorists pushing for regime change. Thousands of innocent people are dying and it is a tradegy, that is where our agreement ends however.
So the west sent in rebels to start a civil war that they have no interest in getting involved in, that threatens its allies in Jordan, Turkey, and Israel with instability, war spill over, and refugees, that has allowed in radical elements they do not want in Syria, and that has them ducking from have to do anything about it. Why thats sounds like brilliant plan. The west was perfectly happy with Syria as it was, stable and just strong enough to keep from falling apart. To the West Syria is a distraction and a problem they will talk about and hope they can some how avoid having to do anything beyond make a statement here or there. People rebel, it happens and you either step down or shoot it out. It has happened through out history. This fantasy the the West some how controls evey event is beyond silly. You should go work for the Gov it migh frighten you to find out just how little we can control.
Irony here is strong.
Yeah of course, it sounds ridiculous who would want war- the people certainly don't. This applies to British, Americans, Libyans, Iraqi's, Syrians, hell the whole world. The masses never want war.
But once you realise that the forces controlling the west do not giving a flying # about the west, they hold no nationality or hold no honour to any given country, then you begin to see the real picture.
Given your response, why did they bomb Libya? Did that happen to slip your memory?
You're also forgetting to take into account the west is pushing for intervention- they aren't exactly hiding the fact!
The west bombed Libya because a bunch of people were about to get killed right on the borders of two states who just went through the Arab Spring. If the west had not acted they would be flooded with refugees, full of rebel camps and all of them drug into a long term bloody civil war that would have been a hot bed of radical influence who would have paraded western inaction as proof that the west is the true enemy.
And if the West was pushing for intevetion they would have acted by now. Anyone who follows the international polical scene knows the west has zero interest in intervention. They talk and meet and talk some more but, nobody wants to do anything. The goal of the west right now is to give the appearance of support to the Syrian people without having to do anything. They are kind of hoping things will work themselves out and they can then claim some of the credit for it.
I made a challenge- POST SOME EVIDENCE GADDAFI FORCES WERE KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE- PROTESTROS OR WOMEN OR CHILDREN. POST THE EVIDENCE IF YOU CLAIM WE INTERVENED THERE TO PROTECT PEOPLE!! You live in a dream world mate.
Originally posted by Recollector
Sooo...arab apologists that live confy in western countries, being happy about their freedoms, want to get rid of them?
Be my guest, MOVE THERE (in any arab country) but pls, do NOT want West to crumble just because you people are fed with commies propaganda.I still wanna live here in a bad NATO country.
The difference between me, a guy that spent 17 years of his life in communism (Romania), 4 of those years being in a military school, I should be 110% infested with red propaganda, which is also Anti-Israel propaganda (so, pro arab propaganda) and a teenager or even much more mature person that lives in US or West EU or Australia or WHEREVER wasn't a communist regime is obvious.
I cannot cave in their propaganda because its pure BULL.S.HIT.I remeber how I spent nights in line for some food or fruits or whatever the RUSSIANS beleive it is OK for their colonies to have.And i also remeber how best pals were the russians with palestinians (that does not exist nor did existed as nation),Ghadafi, Assad, etc.
It all comes down to PROPAGANDA.I beleive NATO one (based on real life PROVED facts) while some delusionals beleive otherwise (based on conspiracy thoeries and known leftists).
Some of you might even thing that in Gaza is bad...keep thinking the lies.The gazans live 12 times better than half of African countries and some of the former USSR countries.But you just prefer to eat the "bad Israel" propaganda.I respect that.
Just respecty my right to eat "bad arabs" propaganda.edit on 29-6-2012 by Recollector because: *
Originally posted by Dragonfly79
The Nazis had the intention of pemanently occupying different countries, the US or Nato do not have those intentions. Not to mention the obvious difference in ideology, the US and Nato might have strong Christian roots historically but they never say anything about waging a holy war against other religions, unlike the Nazis who stated for example Jews should be eradicated along with any one else who they thought didn't meet their standards. At least I missed the state address by the president how they must go against the heretics worldwide.
Hitler was an expansionist, he called for things like Lebensraum, to have space to live. But it also included a demand for a position in the world's economics, after Germany had lost many of it's colonies and with it valuable resources. Lebensraum meant the Germans wanted more and instead of dealing or improving on it's doing business, it wanted to take it by force.
While the US and Nato both use force in other countries in conflicts which have strong connections to the resources, I still don't see them rounding up people and putting them on trains to gas them, just because they are Muslim, or from a certain area or culture. It appears to me they do this because they can't do business with the regimes against whom they have used to force or the deals were unequal in their views and they took the risk to change the odds. But even then, they don't intent on occupying the areas and they try to introduce things like basic education, improved infrastructure and sanitary. In Hitlers view I'm sure he viewed the conquered nations' inhabitants as mere slaves to the aryan race.
I could go on all day about the differences, the only thing ww2 Germany and the current West have in common is that there are conflicts and casualties because of this. Neither side was "Good" imho though, more like "less bad". Almost every country, culture or religion in the world has their own skeletons in the closets. It's almost ironical that in this day and age of information people still have distorted beliefs about history and some countries even manage to brainwash their citizens by deliberately teaching a false history.edit on 30/6/2012 by Dragonfly79 because: (no reason given)
Hitler was an expansionist, he called for things like Lebensraum, to have space to live. But it also included a demand for a position in the world's economics, after Germany had lost many of it's colonies and with it valuable resources. Lebensraum meant the Germans wanted more and instead of dealing or improving on it's doing business, it wanted to take it by force.
Originally posted by Recollector
Seriously OP, if you cannot see the GOD DAMN BIG DIFFERENCES between Nazis and NATO you must be blind.Or sick.Or crazy.Or whatever you can call someone who cannotsee those big differences.
-Nazis did MASS KILLING (as in millions).NATO "failed" yet to do that.
-Nazis started WW2, with over 50 million dead (and countless maimed, wounded, deported, refugees).NATO "failed" yet to do that.
-Nazis had force labor camps and gas chambers.NATO "failed" yet to do that.
-Nazis OCCUPIED entire countries.As in ADMINISTRATION.As in RULING.NATO "failed" yet to do that.
You maybe believe that another world war will dwarf the others.And you are completely right here.Maybe you believe that that war could be started by NATO - you could be right.Maybe Russia and China are the "good ones" and NATO the "bad ones".Could be, tho is STRONGLY belive that a former DICTATORIAL state -Russia- and a current DICTATORIAL state -China- could be a better option instead US and West.
Maybe you think every state have the right to do w/e it wants inside their borders.Maybe yes, as long as it is human.If not, sooner or later, that state and their leaders must be hold accountable.Peacefuly preferabily.If not, a war MUST start.
You canoot accept, as a HUMAN beign, the other HUMAN beigns are KILLED in other countries because their leaders cannot understand FREEDOM and LIBERTY.We know this (well, i know partialy, since my first 17 years were lived under a dictatorship) and we want this for everyone else.And if some guy like Assad, and Putin, and Ahmadinejad, and Mubarak, and Ghadafi, and Saddam, and any Kim are in the way, sooner or later we will be dealt with them.I say we, because most here are living in countries that are democracies.
If there have to be a WOLRD WAR for us to understand why a guy like Assad cannot escape unpunished, so be it.If Russia and China are defending HIS CRIMES, so be it, we will have a world war.If Russia and China CANNOT UNDERSTAND this, so be it, we will have a world war that will dwarf the first ones.
But I CANNOT blame NATO, USofA and the West being responsable for the next world war.I know that WHOEVER will start it, USofA and the West will finish it.edit on 30-6-2012 by Recollector because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Wonderer2012
What a surprise!
No one can post evidence of Gaddafi forces killing innocent women and children or innocent protestors!!
This forum has become a joke where people will oppose, ridicule your POV then just sign off and stop posting once you ask the questions that matter.
Originally posted by detachedindividual
reply to post by Wonderer2012
I see suspicions, accusations, theories and stories about it from people who claim that outside forces have done everything from arrange the Egyptian revolution to the Syrian revolution too. Yet they still can't provide any credible evidence that this is actually the case. Perhaps in twenty years we will have that, but right now there is no evidence for it.
Originally posted by detachedindividual
reply to post by Wonderer2012
The biggest hole in your theories is that these are proven events, researched and documented after decades.
Where is the evidence of the same tactics being used in Libya?
I see suspicions, accusations, theories and stories about it from people who claim that outside forces have done everything from arrange the Egyptian revolution to the Syrian revolution too. Yet they still can't provide any credible evidence that this is actually the case. Perhaps in twenty years we will have that, but right now there is no evidence for it.
I have no doubt at all the Western nations have involvement in these events. But I also fully accept that Russia, China and numerous other nations are equally involved too.
None of it changes the very fact that the people of Poland were attacked, and it doesn't change the fact that the people of Libya, the people of Egypt and the people of Syria were/are attacked and defending themselves against their own dictatorial regimes.
Given the choice, I would gladly have my government assisting rebels to overthrow their dictator than see us bombing the hell out of their nation as happened in Iraq and Afghanistan.
I agree with your premise of history repeating. But I tend to see it as a general "economic collapse leads to war" kind of thing.
Originally posted by Shminkee Pinkee
Originally posted by Wonderer2012
What a surprise!
No one can post evidence of Gaddafi forces killing innocent women and children or innocent protestors!!
This forum has become a joke where people will oppose, ridicule your POV then just sign off and stop posting once you ask the questions that matter.
There is this, although you'll probably say it's fake, because it's a British newspaper
www.guardian.co.uk...
Published on 30 Jun 2012 by FreeSyrien0
Assad will fall, make dua, and donate and help, the Propaganda of the dicator assad is like hitlers, he claims in his tv that every thing is ok, but every one hates assad. Assad and his wife are killing innocent children, worse than animals.
* terrorist scumbags... i hope u all die... go do ur jihad in Saudi Arabia and Qatar...and leave Syria the * alone!
Eretz Zen 4 hours ago
* u... terrorist in damascus
maks3000 4 hours ago