An Honest Question to Freemasons, page 2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 01:55 PM

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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

Disclaimer: Not a Mason.

After having observed and participated in threads in the Secret Societies forum fairly extensively over the past 7 or so years, I've drawn a conclusion upon which I don't expect universal agreement.

Your opinions and experiences about and with Freemasonry very much depend upon where you are in the world. Best example I can think of is a college fraternity. A particular chapter at a campus in the upper Midwest may be perceived totally differently than the same fraternity in the deep south. Same frat, different member pools.

To a larger extent, I'm quite sure Freemasonry is the same. The experiences someone would have with Freemasonry in the UK are going to be very different than someone would have in Davenport, Iowa.

Any group is only as good (or bad) as the members comprising it. There is nothing evil or satanic or inherently bad with Freemasonry. But I'm pretty convinced that it's a whole other animal depending upon the geographic area.

There's a natural group dynamic associated with any group. Groups can be swayed in one direction or the other dependent upon the alpha players in the group. If some lodge in Liverpool or Seattle is involved in influence peddling or clandestine favor granting, that's not a reflection upon Freemasonry as much as it is the individuals comprising that particular lodge.

There's no real secret that the Catholic church has had its problems. That doesn't mean Christianity, or Catholicism is inherently bad. It means people do bad things. People of all walks of life and from every conceivable group. You don't base your opinions of any one group upon the actions of the worst among them. That's called prejudice, and is ignorant all by itself.

So there's nothing particularly wrong with Freemasonry. Individual Freemasons are capable of doing some very unMasonic things, just like Christians are capable of doing some very unChristian things. Not everything a Christian does is a Christian act. Not everything a Mason does is Masonic.

Of course if you see some inherent evil in the mumbo jumbo rites and rituals, that's a whole other paranoid kettle of fish.

In my opinion.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 01:57 PM

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Originally posted by maes9
reply to post by smyleegrl

how do you know that he was a freemason? did he ever say that what his religion was? and what was his hobbies?

A mans religion makes no difference. If he was a Freemason, he believed in God. A mans personal faith is no ones business but his own.

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:01 PM

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reply to post by yeahright

Very well said, yeahright. Every word rings of truth.

The inherant flaw in any fraternity or private organization, such as a church, is that when one member messes up, the whole group suffers a blow to its reputation. With over six million Freemasons around the globe, there is a chance that some of them may make poor decisions that are UN Masonic.

Its up to the individual to decide wheather or not the group as a whole is bad. Just like religion, after a society has been around for several centuries, we have taken our lumps... We arent going any where though.

maes9

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:02 PM

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reply to post by W3RLIED2

would you explain more on degrees in freemasonary. and why freemasonary? and what are it's basic points?

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:03 PM

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reply to post by maes9

I believe in God, the Divine First Source. The Center. That is not Masonic, but my personal faith. I do not believe in Satan.

My hobbies include, fishing, drinking a cold beer after work, spending time with my lady, and long romantic walk on the beach.

Dreine

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:08 PM

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Lots of information for me to digest and sort through, but I GREATLY appreciate the help all of you have provided. Having far more knowledge about the order now is only making me even more curious so I am going to continue to do some research and talk with Freemasons about these issues.

Glad to see the civil discourse in this thread!

emsed1

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:11 PM

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reply to post by maes9

I thought that's what I just did above?

Brotherly Love, Relief and Truth

Faith, Hope and Charity

Temperance, Prudence, Fortitude, Justice

Yahoo explanation

Brotherhood of mankind under the Fatherhood of God

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:14 PM

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Originally posted by maes9
reply to post by W3RLIED2

would you explain more on degrees in freemasonary. and why freemasonary? and what are it's basic points?

The first degree of Freemasonry is known as the Entered Apprentice. It is an introduction into the Fraternity where a candidate is initiated through ritual for his first time, and taught the finer points of living the lofe of a just, and upright Mason. He is presented with a lambskin apron, an emblem of innocence and the badge of a mason, and taught what it means when he wears it.

The second degree is known as the Fellowcraft. In this degree the candidate, who has been regularly initiated as an Entered Apprentice, goes through the second ritual and is taught about certain aspects king solomans temple. One of my favorite portions of the degree is known as the staircase lecture, where a Mason is taught orders of architecture, and the important arts and sciences that can help Man understand his place in the Universe.

The final degree of Masonry is called the Sublime Degree of Master Mason. In this degree a candidate who has been initiated an entered apprentice, as well as passed to the degree of Fellowcraft, is caused to symbolically represnt the life of Hiram Abiff at the building of King Solomons temple. During the trials and tribulations of Hirams travels, many lessons can be learned, whether they be hidden slightly through allegorical symbols, or whether they be explained as a test of fidelity, the lessons of the third degree will cause a lifetime of reflection on how one can truly live a better life.

At the end of the three degrees of Masonry, a mason has learned anout the tools of our Craft. The plumb, square, and level. The trowell, the 24 inch gauge, and the gavel. All of these can be used to build that spiritual temple, the house not made with hands.

maes9

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:18 PM

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well it seems you consider freemasonary just a social group. to have link with people and so on but how can a person become a freemason?

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:21 PM

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reply to post by maes9

For many it is a social outlet, for some a spiritual journey, and still for others something different. As I said, there is no singular set path a Freemason must follow, except the one of his choosing. Masonry provides the tools to live a better life, what happens after that is up to the Man.

2B1ASK1

We dont invite any one to join the Order. It must be a choice of freewill.

edit on 25-6-2012 by W3RLIED2 because: Ipads, as usual.

maes9

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:27 PM

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reply to post by W3RLIED2

when you say solomon temple and hirams they are related to magics, are not they?
and the word hiram .do you mean pyramids by that. is it called like this in freemasonary or it is because of your native language.

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:30 PM

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reply to post by maes9

No, there is no refferences to magick in masonic ritual. The temple of King Solomon, and Hiram Abiff are profound symbols in Masonry.

Saurus

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:39 PM

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Originally posted by maes9
reply to post by W3RLIED2

would you explain more on degrees in freemasonary. and why freemasonary? and what are it's basic points?

There are three degrees in Masonry.

The first degree inspires independent thought on the the spiritual self, the second on the meaning of life, and the third degree inspires us to dwell on our own mortality, and to make changes in our life based on our own conclusions of what our mortality means to us.

Freemasonry is a fraternity based on brotherhood. We support each other mentally, emotionally and spiritually. We inspire each other to think about issues pertinent to our lives, and to find truth. This is done without judgement, and rather than trying to pass our own ideas on to others, we listen to what each of our our Brothers have to say, and absorb and process the information and then make our own conclusions.

We help everybody that we can, masons and non-masons alike, and the bonds that are formed while trying to help others are almost unbreakable. For example, spend a month working side by side next to your Brethren installing solar heaters for an old age home that cannot afford electricity - and knowing the difference your team made to their lives, forges friendships that last forever.

The experiences we share with other Masons span oceans, and although I have never met my American counterparts, I would eagerly welcome them into my home should they ever come to my country, and I know they would do the same for me. I trust the character of every Mason, and although I have never met any of the Masons on this site, for example, I trust everything that they tell me, knowing full well that their word is beyond question.

As a non-mason, this may sound bizarre, but every Mason feels the same way, and it is a by-product of how our Fraternity works. It cannot really be explained - it has to be experienced.

Saurus

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 02:52 PM

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Originally posted by maes9
well it seems you consider freemasonary just a social group.

It is so much more...

A friend is someone who, for me, will make time on his calender.
A Mason is someone who, for me, does not consult his calender.

edit on 25/6/2012 by Saurus because: (no reason given)

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 03:04 PM

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reply to post by Saurus

I couldnt agree with you more, Brother.

Proverbial hammer on the nail, my friend.

MDDoxs

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 03:09 PM

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Is your organization a more traditional form of social networking with like-minded individuals within your respective communities?

Such a organization makes sense if your overall goal is to either better the community or the organization itself through the means at the disposal of each unique member with a set of skills, professions or trades.

If my idea is correct, please point it out if i am not, if a fellow member was in need of sound legal advice, could he not request help from his fellow members on advice and even be provided the service if a fellow member is a law professional?.

Thanks in advance for any reponse.

edit on 25-6-2012 by MDDoxs because: (no reason given)

W3RLIED2

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 03:14 PM

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reply to post by MDDoxs

Sure.

Officially, masons are discouraged against self promoting their personal business, and soliciting other brothers for business. However, there is no doubt, and no issue with the fraternity should brothers willingly do business with one another. There is no requirement that a Mason share, or make business connections, though.

maes9

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 04:51 PM

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reply to post by W3RLIED2

just another question. take a look at the top of this site please. are there any freemasonary symbols?

edit on 25-6-2012 by maes9 because: (no reason given)

JoshNorton

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 06:00 PM

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Originally posted by maes9
just another question. take a look at the top of this site please. are there any freemasonary symbols?

What site?

Also, worth noting that while Masonry uses a handful of symbols, there's no trademark on them—there's nothing to stop anybody who's not a Mason from using them in any way, shape or form. So if, for instance, Masons used a triangle as a symbol, that wouldn't mean that every triangle you ever saw anywhere was Masonic.

Furthermore, there are some symbols which many assume to be Masonic, but actually aren't. These include the all-seeing eye capping an unfinished pyramid (as seen on the back of the dollar bill), and the obelisk. Neither of these are Masonic symbols.

theMediator

posted on Jun, 25 2012 @ 06:08 PM

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Even your bad lines and responses get minimum 2 stars W3RLIED2...gee I wonder why?
I guess mason friends hold you up in favoritism, obviously.

Masons, not a single self made man.
Favoritism and elitism are detriments to the evolution of human civilization.

edit on 25-6-2012 by theMediator because: (no reason given)