How The United States Was Destroyed.

reply to post by Germanicus


China is not as healthy as many think it is. Who will rise will likely surprise everyone.
And Western economic organization isn't as far removed from China's as many think.
Centralization and elitism dominate both systems. Along with a strong suppressing reaction against individualism. China is relying on imaginary principles that are unsustainable the same way the West is.
The future emerging power may indeed come from the East, but China's role will be transitory at best.

Originally posted by pierregustavetoutant
reply to post by Germanicus

 

China is not as healthy as many think it is. Who will rise will likely surprise everyone.
And Western economic organization isn't as far removed from China's as many think.
Centralization and elitism dominate both systems. Along with a strong suppressing reaction against individualism. China is relying on imaginary principles that are unsustainable the same way the West is.
The future emerging power may indeed come from the East, but China's role will be transitory at best.

I just want to add, Germanicus is pro China, pro China-partner.

I wonder if Tibet would give any recommendatins to Australia?

reply to post by Germanicus

I assure you, lots of us here would not only like to see Greece out of the €Z, but Germany aswell.
Many would like nothing more than to see an end to this whole centralist abomination.
The thing is, no one can kick Greece out of the €uroZone... they have to leave by themselves.

Me *yawning* about your statement was due to us being accustomed to being the bad guys with our history... being German is still pretty neat though.

I don't want to see war inside Europe again, but whoever thinks Germany is defenseless after WW II demilitarization is in for a surprise.

reply to post by ColCurious

I dont want to see trouble either.

It just seems everything is getting to boiling point.

I hope something works out that people are happy with and thats fair.

Originally posted by pierregustavetoutant
reply to post by Germanicus

 

China is not as healthy as many think it is. Who will rise will likely surprise everyone.
And Western economic organization isn't as far removed from China's as many think.
Centralization and elitism dominate both systems. Along with a strong suppressing reaction against individualism. China is relying on imaginary principles that are unsustainable the same way the West is.
The future emerging power may indeed come from the East, but China's role will be transitory at best.

I was reading about China a bit lately and came across the fact that they may have embarked on a Stalinist Two Stage Revolution. It was pretty interesting to consider. Probably not much to it but a planned economy is the end game if it is stagism that they are trying to achieve.

Originally posted by Doalrite
so the simple solutions to solve americas problems would be to ban all corporations....... remove them all from every town and city...

That might actually work... leaving huge voids and starting many small buisness's

nope, you treat them as if they are a junk yard dog, you let them do their thing, but you keep a big steel chain around their neck and have them tied down or walled off, so they can't get loose. corporations are business rules on a piece of paper. the workings and the governance of them can be controlled by countries if those countries choose to do it. the massive amount of bribery and threats of harm by corporations, are the controlling factors.

Originally posted by Germanicus
reply to post by hawkiye

 

Maybe you'd care to provide some evidence for that non-sense? The Bretton Woods agreement in 1944 was the first world wide monetary financial agreement however that was not because we won WWII for it was still raging at the time that was in the works long before then.

A Senior Official of the Bank of England commented: One of the reasons Bretton Woods worked was that the US was clearly the most powerful country at the table and so ultimately was able to impose its will on the others, including an often-dismayed Britain. At the time, one senior official at the Bank of England described the deal reached at Bretton Woods as “the greatest blow to Britain next to the war”, largely because it underlined the way in which financial power had moved from the UK to the US.

en.wikipedia.org...

Before 1944, the world reference currency was the Pound Sterling. After World War II, the international financial system was governed by a formal agreement, the Bretton Woods System. Under this system the United States dollar was placed deliberately as the anchor of the system, with the US government guaranteeing other central banks that they could sell their US dollar reserves at a fixed rate for gold.

en.wikipedia.org...

The key words there are "after WW2". Did you get that? Understand now?

Wow such revisionist history...Sigh Stalingrad was a decisive victory indeed but was not the only one. The reason the Russians did so well was because Hitler opened up more then one front and then had the US to deal with also and spread himself to thin until then he was kicking the Russians ass and Europes too and came dangerously close to winning that war until we stepped in. Here are the major decisive battles of WWII:

saying "sigh" when you are wrong does not make you correct. And that is the most ludicrous version of WW2 that I have ever heard. America saved nobody. They sat back,then swooped in. Of course they helped. Helped. They won nothing. America is not some saviour. And what do you even mean "Europe too"??? You dont seem to understand what happened. It sounds like you read a comic on the subject or something.

No one said we were perfect however the American constitution set the bar for freedom and was a major leap forward from the feudal systems of Europe were everyone was a slave to the monarch

Wrong. The Romans amongst many others had a republic long before you guys. Your grasp of history is shocking. And the Constitution is nothing special. Notice the rest of the world could not care less about it? If its so great why havent we all adopted it? Because we dont think much of it. Americans only go on about it because they are parrots that are filled with propaganda.

Wow I just got through saying incorporation should be banned...sigh! Capitalism has nothing to do with corporatism!

Of course corpoatism is capitalism. Read The Iron Heel. Jack London wrote it over 100 years ago. It is about capitalist 'Trust Monopolies'/corporations. Go back to mercentilism and take a look at the corporations. Go back to Rome. Corporations are a part of capitalism. They are one and the same.

You cheer for your own demise and you dont even know.

edit on 11-6-2012 by Germanicus because: (no reason given)

Sorry but some Bank of England Officials opinion and wiki are not evidence. The Bretton Woods agreement was nothing more then a scheme by the Banking cartels to eventually get rid any and all gold and silver backing of currency so they could print at will. It worked like a charm and today we see the result in spades. Trust me Britain's elites are the driving force behind it all.

LOL at the Roman republic being a bar for freedom are you mental or something? I said the bar for freedom was the US constitution and you refer to the Roman Republic... desperation makes for some bizarre responses from you.

Yeah the propaganda on socialism corporatism fascism being labeld Capitalism started over 100 years ago and ramped up to the idiotic diatribe we hear today of the evils of capitalism...Sigh! The enemies of freedom have been at work for a long time! As soon as you have government intervention, monopolies, etc it ceases to be capitalism however the banking cartels would have everyone believe free market laissez faire capitalism is the cause of the entire economic/financial debacle when nothing could be further from the truth capitalism has not existed for at least 80 years! They are simply trying to protect their power base.

Keep drinking the coolaid or try reading some real history maybe start with Murray Rothbards History of Money and Banking in the US

reply to post by hawkiye

Sorry but some Bank of England Officials opinion and wiki are not evidence. The Bretton Woods agreement was nothing more then a scheme by the Banking cartels to eventually get rid any and all gold and silver backing of currency so they could print at will. It worked like a charm and today we see the result in spades. Trust me Britain's elites are the driving force behind it all.

And you think I am drinking Cool Aid? You want me to trust you? No.

LOL at the Roman republic being a bar for freedom are you mental or something? I said the bar for freedom was the US constitution and you refer to the Roman Republic... desperation makes for some bizarre responses from you.

What you said was this.

No one said we were perfect however the American constitution set the bar for freedom and was a major leap forward from the feudal systems of Europe were everyone was a slave to the monarch

And by bringing up the Roman Republic, I destroy you. The Romans hated monarchy. The Romans were no slaves to a monarch. So what you said is wrong. Again.

reply to post by hawkiye


since you missed my previous post

You say you have studied history for years yet your posts contradict you.
Every heard of the Magna Carter(1225,"the greatest constitutional document of all times – the foundation of the freedom of the individual against the arbitrary authority of the despot") or the original English bill of rights(1689) which inspired the american bill of rights(1789)? During WW2 Australia hated the Americans in there ports.
For a few reasons one of the biggest gripes was the fact that every time the Australians won a victory on there own americans called it a american and allied victory and when the americans won a battle on there own its was a american victory.
Reminds me when ever someone talks to me about how the americans won Independence from the English. If i mention how much help the dutch, spainish and the french gave.
The response i get is that you guys actually didn't need any help or it was minor help at best.
Its just the arrogance that gets me and sadly the rest of the world view it that way too.

reply to post by Germanicus


It's simple really. With government, just like with a private household, you spend more than you earn you eventually loose everything. The government gives it's people more than they have for long enough and keeps borrowing to keep their give me, give me citizens shut up, sooner or later you pay.

Only private business and industry can create wealth. All government can do is redistribute it. Government creates nothing at all, it only takes, wastes and destroys in it's never ending bid to buy votes.

We know the detail about Greece and the unsustainable lifestyle vote buying lead them too. It was good while it lasted, now they pay. We can still turn ours around provided we can get the radical Progressives out of power for a few years.

Depends fully on if the give me, give me crowd gets their way. They are the destroyers. People who take meaningless liberal arts classes, never bother to learn a real skill and participate while they live off the Dole are the enemy. No thinking person is being fooled by them or their nonsense.

reply to post by Blaine91555

Depends fully on if the give me, give me crowd gets their way. They are the destroyers. People who take meaningless liberal arts classes, never bother to learn a real skill and participate while they live off the Dole are the enemy. No thinking person is being fooled by them or their nonsense.

It seems to me that there are no jobs to go around in the US.

And I dont see how America can fix things. It seems that war with China is the only way out for the US. I really do not think the US can deal with China and friends. I also do not think america can survive a war that is drawn out in any way.

Its funnythat you blame poor people though. Very funny.

reply to post by Germanicus

And by bringing up the Roman Republic, I destroy you. The Romans hated monarchy. The Romans were no slaves to a monarch. So what you said is wrong. Again.

So you think the Roman republic was a bastion of freedom comparable to America LOL ! There are republics and there are free republics. Wow it takes all kinds I guess...

Originally posted by hawkiye
reply to post by Germanicus

 

And by bringing up the Roman Republic, I destroy you. The Romans hated monarchy. The Romans were no slaves to a monarch. So what you said is wrong. Again.

So you think the Roman republic was a bastion of freedom comparable to America LOL

! There are republics and there are free republics. Wow it takes all kinds I guess...

edit on 11-6-2012 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

i do not see it as worse than the united states. The Romans were better people for the most part. They valued the common good.

And you said that you were the first country to break from a monarchy. That is ludicrous. i just threw out an example off the top of my head. I dont want to spend much more time on you. Its exhausting.

So no,you were not the first to break from a monarchy and no, you did not invent freedom. Far from it.

The South will rise again dude,you couldnt even get along with each other. You still cant.

Originally posted by Germanicus

Originally posted by hawkiye
reply to post by Germanicus

 

And by bringing up the Roman Republic, I destroy you. The Romans hated monarchy. The Romans were no slaves to a monarch. So what you said is wrong. Again.

So you think the Roman republic was a bastion of freedom comparable to America LOL

! There are republics and there are free republics. Wow it takes all kinds I guess...

edit on 11-6-2012 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

i do not see it as worse than the united states. The Romans were better people for the most part. They valued the common good.

And you said that you were the first country to break from a monarchy. That is ludicrous. i just threw out an example off the top of my head. I dont want to spend much more time on you. Its exhausting.

So no,you were not the first to break from a monarchy and no, you did not invent freedom. Far from it.

The South will rise again

dude,you couldnt even get along with each other. You still cant.

I said no such things. I said we broke from the feudal system that pretty much ruled Europe and the world for thousands of years. The Roman republic was anything but free it was an oligarchy and it devolved into monarchy also. To say it was comparable to American freedom is laughable. America has been a light to the world (in the past) despite our problems which is why most European and western countries have adopted at least some of our tenants. To deny this is just ignorance. That does not mean we were perfect and don't have a long ways to go but it is a far better then anything in history accept for perhaps the ancient anarchic Celts in some ways.

reply to post by hawkiye


Well,I guess we just have different opinions in relation to capitalism/america.

We cant all agree all the time I guess hey.

reply to post by Germanicus


You cant talk to someone who refuses to acknowledge some facts

Originally posted by Bixxi3
reply to post by hawkiye

 

since you missed my previous post

You say you have studied history for years yet your posts contradict you.
Every heard of the Magna Carter(1225,"the greatest constitutional document of all times – the foundation of the freedom of the individual against the arbitrary authority of the despot") or the original English bill of rights(1689) which inspired the american bill of rights(1789)? During WW2 Australia hated the Americans in there ports.
For a few reasons one of the biggest gripes was the fact that every time the Australians won a victory on there own americans called it a american and allied victory and when the americans won a battle on there own its was a american victory.
Reminds me when ever someone talks to me about how the americans won Independence from the English. If i mention how much help the dutch, spainish and the french gave.
The response i get is that you guys actually didn't need any help or it was minor help at best.
Its just the arrogance that gets me and sadly the rest of the world view it that way too.

Sorry I missed this somehow...

Why would you say i contradict anything there? The Magna Carta was a great document and definitely a fore runner to our founding documents the founders pulled from heavily. no argument that is a foundational freedom document! Still it did not establish a free country free of monarchical or dictatorial rule. It did not prevent the King from ignoring it and doing as he pleased. etc. Which is exactly why the American colonies separated from England eventually. They all had charters granted by the King granting them certain rights and privileges etc. After refusing to honor those charters for decades and becoming increasingly tyrannical the colonist had enough and decided to split from the Monarch. What good is a document if the King or ruling body will not honor it? Now we have the same problem with the American Constitution the ruling bodies will not honor it.

The level of freedom established by America in that time and even now is unprecedented in history. The Magna Carta Articles of Confederation and Constitution illustrated it, America went to work and established it through the separation of powers as the ruling principles of a nation which was a huge leap forward for human kind. We are due for another leap forward IMO.

reply to post by hawkiye


Sorry but the King was a figurehead when America declared independence. Power had rested with Parliament since the civil war (and still does).

Think you made some very good points but just thought i should point out this error.

In actual fact, the Magna Carta was ground breaking in many ways, principally that it was enshrined in written law. It was, after all, simply a rehashing of the Saxon Councils (rehashings of the Viking meetings / Celtic meetings, etc) where everyone got their say and the King could, in theory, be over ruled.

During the Hundred Years war, one of the things often thrown at the English was that they were godless as they had overturned the natural order by implementing the Magna Carta into written law.

Originally posted by Flavian
reply to post by hawkiye

 

Sorry but the King was a figurehead when America declared independence. Power had rested with Parliament since the civil war (and still does).

Think you made some very good points but just thought i should point out this error.

In actual fact, the Magna Carta was ground breaking in many ways, principally that it was enshrined in written law. It was, after all, simply a rehashing of the Saxon Councils (rehashings of the Viking meetings / Celtic meetings, etc) where everyone got their say and the King could, in theory, be over ruled.

During the Hundred Years war, one of the things often thrown at the English was that they were godless as they had overturned the natural order by implementing the Magna Carta into written law.

"In theory" are the key words. In reality the King ruled with an iron fist for the most part. Americans appealed to Parliament and the king to honor their charters with the colonies and were only met with increasing tyranny. I'd say Parliament was the real figure head to appease the people while the King rode roughshod over the people at will.