wife and i saw something... extra-ordinary the other night

What if it was much closer than you perceived it to be? Might that allow for a more mundane explanation?

OP, thank you for sharing your sighting. It seems as though the sightings around the world are beginning to ramp up. I truly believe that we are on the brink of a mass sighting that will prove beyond any shadow of a doubt that we are not alone in this big, beautiful universe.

Originally posted by alfa1
Wasnt there, so I cant say what you saw, but for interests sake, let it be known that meteors can tumble.

Random pic...

It sounds like you are confusing satellites with meteors, if you are suggesting that the flaring along the path of the meteor in the photograph you posted was caused by the meteoroid tumbling.

A tumbling meteoroid does not necessarily flare, although that might be a contributory factor in some extreme cases. Flares are well known to occur when a meteoroid breaks apart and fragments during its flight.

In satellites, tumbling causes flares because different surfaces on the satellite catch the sun and reflect the light back to our eyes, but meteoroids are self-luminous - they don't reflect light.

Originally posted by h4y6d2e
just didn't seem like a meteor.

Exactly those words spring to mind when trying to describe an earthgrazer. They certainly don't look ordinary in my experience. I've seen a few over the years, and even when I have been able to identify them as belonging to a particular shower, they never look anything like the "normal" members of that shower.

Originally posted by h4y6d2e
ive seen plenty of comets and shooting stars. this was very different looking.

This is probably one of the main reasons that keeps meteor shower observers like myself coming back for more. You think you've seen it all, and then you see something that makes you think again.

Consider that there are scores of known meteor showers which occur each year, and on top of all of those sources, we have random meteors from many unknown sources. Each source has meteors that share similar characteristics, but are different to meteors from other sources.

In short, there are so many variables, that no two meteors are exactly the same, and "unusual" meteors may not be common, but they do occur. Science is still learning about certain aspects of the meteor phenomena.

One other possibility, since you described the meteor as being very fast, is that unlike the vast majority of meteors that we see which are due to meteoroids from sources within our solar system, occasionally we see meteors that are caused by meteoroids that have originated outside our solar system. Extra solar meteoroids will always enter the atmosphere at higher relative velocities than meteoroids that are orbiting the sun. A few of these micro-meteoroids hit our atmosphere every day.

Originally posted by h4y6d2e
but I suppose if it skimmed it could produce the effect. like I said - like a rock skipping across the pond.

It's not a bad analogy IMO, and has been used before to describe grazers. I've seen grazers that appeared to completely fade out and then re-appear, just as if you were watching a stone skipping from beneath the surface of a pond, with the stone being visible when it was skimming across the surface of the water, but not when it was up in the air.

reply to post by h4y6d2e


After checking, the wife didn't see the ISS, it passed by us on that night 20-25 minutes before and
in a different direction for only 4 seconds, BUT

she also said she meant the blink was on for 3 inches (arms length), and off for around 3 feet.
So either you both saw the same objects on separate nights, or a very similar phenomenon.

To help if you ever see something unusual again, a place and direction of travel would help
to find out if anyone else saw the same thing. Even if it's just an approximate.

and time of day/night. oops

Originally posted by FireballStorm
You said it took around 1-1.5 seconds to cross the sky. That can only mean a meteor, and you are right when you said "grazer", as a meteor can only travel over a large part of the sky if it's entering the atmosphere at a low angle.

Considering the time-frame involved, it would be extremely difficult for anyone to tell for sure, just by observing, that the flares were exactly at repeating intervals. To tell for sure, a photograph or footage of the event would be needed. Besides, in some cases, "randomness" can result in a pattern. It certainly can't be ruled out.

So, I would say that you probably saw a meteor.

Edit to add - It's not uncommon for earthgrazers to have no tail. This is because they are skimming the outer edges of our atmosphere, which is where the air is extremely thin. The tail of a meteor is made from ionized air molecules, so if there is not much air, there will not be much of a tail, if any at all.

edit on 8-6-2012 by FireballStorm because: (no reason given)

I have to disagree that it "can only be a meteor." A fast booking alien starship --- can fly like a bat out of hell --- so to speak; especially in its bluish-white fusion plasma high-power phase.

Originally posted by Erno86
I have to disagree that it "can only be a meteor." A fast booking alien starship --- can fly like a bat out of hell --- so to speak; especially in its bluish-white fusion plasma high-power phase.

Apologies. I should have rephrased what I said : Out of all the possibilities, the only possible "mundane" and reasonably likely explanation for the speed at which the object is said to have crossed the sky, is a meteor.

There is plenty of hard evidence for meteors, and the speeds they are capable of, at the end of the day - but I have yet to see any hard evidence for the existence of "starships" (although I don't dispute that there is a possibility that they exist).

So why should "starship" be a more likely explanation if this is the case? Why could what the OP saw not have been a meteor?

Detection of an intergalactic meteor particle with the 6-m telescope

On July 28, 2006 the 6-m telescope of the Special Astrophysical Observatory of the Russian Academy of Sciences recorded the spectrum of a faint meteor. We confidently identify the lines of FeI and MgI, OI, NI and molecular-nitrogen N_2 bands. The entry velocity of the meteor body into the Earth's atmosphere estimated from radial velocity is equal to 300 km/s.

Source: Cornell University Library

"Normal" meteors hit the atmosphere going at anywhere from 11-73 km/s, which is pretty fast, but objects from outside our solar system will always be traveling faster than this - there are "set" ranges of speeds that are possible depending on what the object is orbiting, just as an object orbiting earth will leave orbit if the velocity goes above 11 km/s, or below around 6 km/s it will start to fall to earth. (See the following links regarding orbital velocity: link link)

If you stop for a moment, and take a look around you, you might see that this universe is amazing and weird enough without the need for aliens or starships.

Originally posted by Yahm16
and
in a different direction for only 4 seconds

Were you referring to the unidentified blinking object your wife saw?

If not, how long were the blinks visible for?

It may have been a satellite or junk glinting in the sunlight that your wife saw - they are surprisingly common, and just like meteors, there is always the chance that the vast majority of the objects flight path is below the naked eye visibility threshold.

Originally posted by Yahm16
To help if you ever see something unusual again, a place and direction of travel would help
to find out if anyone else saw the same thing. Even if it's just an approximate.

Better yet, record which constellation the object was in or passed near by, as well as the direction. This would help when trying to rule out both meteors and satellites. Even better yet, learn to record the position in the sky using the Horizontal coordinate system.

Best of all, keep a tripod mounted DSLR with a fast-wide lens close to hand when you go out, and try to capture the objects track - not always easy to do, but worth it if you do manage to image the object. Very fast and faint objects are hard to photograph however, so don't rely on photographing them.

I agree with the suggestion that it could have been a meteor skipping across the edge of the atmosphere. I have to ask this, how could you tell that it wasn't something much closer?

reply to post by FireballStorm


I'm not saying that a starship is a "more likely explanation," I'am saying that the possibility exists --- however rare --- that the OP could have witnessed the light effect from an alien starship.

Cheers,

Erno86

Originally posted by Tearman
how could you tell that it wasn't something much closer?

Can you think of anything that could fly "much closer" at the kinds pf speeds needed without giving away it's true nature, and fitting the OP's description?

I can't - most possibilities would involve at least some kinds of sounds or sonic-booms.

So, if no sounds were heard, that suggests that whatever is was, was further away. We know that at about 50 km altitude the air becomes too thin for sound waves or sonic booms to propagate, and most meteors become visible at around 100km. Very few make it below 50 km, so we generally don't hear meteors.

Visually alone, it would be hard to tell if an object in the sky is close or far away as I explained in this thread here (scroll down a bit for the section about meteors in particular).

I would suggest that, in the absence of evidence to suggest that it was anything close, we must conclude that it was probably much further away (and going much faster than it would have had to have been if it was quite close), and although we cant prove it was a meteor, a meteor could easily explain everything the OP.

Originally posted by Erno86
I'm not saying that a starship is a "more likely explanation," I'am saying that the possibility exists --- however rare --- that the OP could have witnessed the light effect from an alien starship.

Fair play. Your previous reply suggested otherwise, but thanks for clarifying

Originally posted by FireballStorm

Originally posted by Tearman
how could you tell that it wasn't something much closer?

Can you think of anything that could fly "much closer" at the kinds pf speeds needed without giving away it's true nature, and fitting the OP's description?

Not saying it was this but it could have been a strobe light on an RC plane with its motor turned off. I know I've seen RC planes that are only audible when they are under power, and silent when gliding.

I've never seen this but could there be some kind of firework rocket that burns with a strobe effect? I know those are audible but the sound could easily be drowned out or go unnoticed.

reply to post by h4y6d2e


so you're saying you saw something dipping in and out of our atmosphere..

I've seen that too, once and I was not the only one who saw it too.. my mother also caught a glimpse.

it looked just how you described, like it was hoping in and out of our atmosphere at a very fast rate.

I believe it was where-ever HAARP beams 1-4 billion Watts of power into a single spot to heat up the atmosphere.

at first I thought it might be extraterrestrial, then maybe one of our ships, then I realized it was more of a ball of light more than anything, an amber/orange almost red color.

Originally posted by FireballStorm

Originally posted by Tearman
how could you tell that it wasn't something much closer?

Can you think of anything that could fly "much closer" at the kinds pf speeds needed without giving away it's true nature, and fitting the OP's description?

I can't - most possibilities would involve at least some kinds of sounds or sonic-booms.

So, if no sounds were heard, that suggests that whatever is was, was further away. We know that at about 50 km altitude the air becomes too thin for sound waves or sonic booms to propagate, and most meteors become visible at around 100km. Very few make it below 50 km, so we generally don't hear meteors.

Visually alone, it would be hard to tell if an object in the sky is close or far away as I explained in this thread here (scroll down a bit for the section about meteors in particular).

I would suggest that, in the absence of evidence to suggest that it was anything close, we must conclude that it was probably much further away (and going much faster than it would have had to have been if it was quite close), and although we cant prove it was a meteor, a meteor could easily explain everything the OP.

Some of the alien starship sighting's in the Earth's atmosphere, occur with no telltale sonic boom's of an approx. 5,000 thru 15,000 mph flying craft. The possibility of the magnetic shield surrounding the starship, could have the ability to absorb sonic booms, as to make it silent running thru our atmosphere.

I'm sorry people....double post.

reply to post by FireballStorm


The ISS would've been visible for 4 seconds for her, and passed low from the NW, but the ISS
had already passed 20-25 minutes before what she saw.

The object she saw came from the SW travelled to NE, and the "blink" was around 1 second
in time, 3 inches at arms length for distance.

The "no blink" was about 3 feet in distance, she has no idea about time wise (maybe 4-5 seconds
if she was to guess)

Her sighting was around midnight EST on the 7th onto the 8th, and at that time of night in our little
corner the only light pollution we have is from the stars, moon , or cigarette.

sorry, best I can do for you since I wasn't the viewer, but your "stone-skipper" meteorite sounds
the same to me.

reply to post by Yahm16


If that's 4-5 seconds in total, then its more likely that what she saw was a meteor. Either way, 3 feet at arms length is a significant portion of sky to travel across in such a short time.

If you take the ISS as an example - it orbits the earth at a speed of 27,743 km/h (or 7.7 km/s), which is not far of the fastest satellites (as I mentioned before - about 11 km/s). The ISS takes a few minutes (as many as 10+ in extreme cases where it passes close to or directly overhead) to cross the sky from horizon to horizon.

From your description, what your wife saw would have easily crossed the sky in under a minute, which pretty much rules out satellites as a possibility.

It does sound like it may well have been an earthgrazer. If it traversed more than around 40 degrees of sky, then I think you could be confident it was one.

Regarding earthgrazers, there's section on them here if you scroll down towards the bottom: The Meteor Meniscus: Meteor Distance verses Meteor Zenith Angle

Originally posted by Tearman
Not saying it was this but it could have been a strobe light on an RC plane with its motor turned off. I know I've seen RC planes that are only audible when they are under power, and silent when gliding.

I've never seen this but could there be some kind of firework rocket that burns with a strobe effect? I know those are audible but the sound could easily be drowned out or go unnoticed

I agree, those are possibilities.

However, who risks flying an RC plane at night over other peoples property (I assume?), and with the engine off? Just seems a bit strange, unless it 's an attempt at a hoax?

I think if it were a rocket, it would have to have been quite a ways off not to be heard, even with significant ambient noise, but from the OP's description, I don't think it could have crossed the sky in that time, and be far enough away to not be heard. Again, it just seems a bit unlikely.

The best Idea I can come up with is a sub-sonic tracer fired from a silenced firearm, but I don't think that's very likely either, although it might be possible.

If the ambient background noise was low, I think it would be fair to say that with most of the above possibilities, something would be heard, if the object was close enough to cross the sky with significant speed.

I think a meteor is still the most likely possibility.