Why were 14 books ripped out of the King James Bible in 1885?

reply to post by halfoldman


The King James Bible is Not a Version / Religion, It is an interpretation of the original form.

Like the "Law", everything is open to interpretation.

ALL Religions interpret the bible differently. With, I think, the exception of the Amish and German Baptist Brethren aka "Dunkards", which only differ in doctrine.

As for the 14 books, .. well, Maybe it was something like editing a movie. You have all of these scenes, and only a limited amount of space/time and you have to decide which ones will or won't "Make The Cut". Maybe they were Way over budget and couldn't afford to add as many pages, so, they had to eliminate some of the books.. .. .

i belief it was because of a rift between king james and the catholic church.

but heres some info:

Why the Apocrypha Isn't in the Bible. Not one of the apocryphal books is written in the Hebrew language which was used in the Old Testament. All Apocryphal books are in Greek, except one which is extant only in Latin. None of the apocryphal writers laid claim to inspiration. The apocryphal books were never acknowledged as sacred scriptures by the Jews, custodians of the Hebrew scriptures (the apocrypha was written prior to the New Testament). In fact, the Jewish people rejected and destroyed the apocrypha after the overthow of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. The apocryphal books were not permitted among the sacred books during the first four centuries of the real Christian church (I'm certainly not talking about the Catholic religion which is not Christian). The Apocrypha contains fabulous statements which not only contradict the "canonical" scriptures but themselves. For example, in the two Books of Maccabees, Antiochus Epiphanes is made to die three different deaths in three different places. The Apocrypha includes doctrines in variance with the Bible, such as prayers for the dead and sinless perfection. The following verses are taken from the Apocrypha translation by Ronald Knox dated 1954: Basis for the doctrine of purgatory: 2 Maccabees 12:43-45, 2.000 pieces of silver were sent to Jerusalem for a sin-offering...Whereupon he made reconciliation for the dead, that they might be delivered from sin. Salvation by works: Ecclesiasticus 3:30, Water will quench a flaming fire, and alms maketh atonement for sin. Tobit 12:8-9, 17, It is better to give alms than to lay up gold; for alms doth deliver from death, and shall purge away all sin. Magic: Tobit 6:5-8, If the Devil, or an evil spirit troubles anyone, they can be driven away by making a smoke of the heart, liver, and gall of a fish...and the Devil will smell it, and flee away, and never come again anymore. Mary was born sinless (immaculate conception): Wisdom 8:19-20, And I was a witty child and had received a good soul. And whereas I was more good, I came to a body undefiled. It teaches immoral practices, such as lying, suicide, assasination and magical incantation. No apocryphal book is referred to in the New Testament whereas the Old Testament is referred to hundreds of times. Because of these and other reasons, the apocryphal books are only valuable as ancient documents illustrative of the manners, language, opinions and history of the East.

peace

reply to post by Druid42


Thanks for posting that link. I've been reading the Books of Adam and Eve and they are very interesting. I didn't know Adam and Eve had daughters along with Cain and Abel! Luluwa and Aklemia were their names and they were twins of Cain and Abel. That's as far as I've gotten though, and I have to log now. I am amazed at how many times they whined and cried about being cast out of the garden, and dying or even committing suicide, and God had to bring them to life again. That's weird to read.

Anyway, I'm glad you posted.

For those of you who would like to read the books that were taken out of the Bible in 1885...here is the link:

www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...

I've read those books and I understand why they are not part of the Bible. They are filled with contradictions and nonsense. If they were still part of the Bible a lot of people would reject it due to just plain silliness. And don't get me started on the lost books of the New Testament. They paint Jesus as a serial killer and just plain evil.

What we have now is the stuff that isn't silly or heretical.

Originally posted by Screwed
Ohhh boy, you have just opened up a can of worms.
Christians are not GENERALLY a group who are open to their holy book or religion being challenged with facts
and logic.

So, you have undoubtedly brought up a subject inspired by the devil to test their faith in God.

I am sorry for all of these facts being exposed.
I have known this for some time now and am poilte enough not to bring it up because
I don't want the devil working thru me in order to mislead the God fearing Christians.


Praise Allah.

sir, you are obviously entitled to your opinions, which if based on fact and logic would bring up some great views and takes, but there is no need to be disrespectful to anyone.

enjoyed reading your post. it would be nice to know why they decided to discard these books. there is no telling what kind of secrets they are sitting on.

And the worst part is that even the translation is wrong. Years ago a buddy of mine had a book that showed some of the huge mistakes made in the translation from Hebrew since the people who were doing the translation didn't even really speak the language. Some of the words are completely wrong and change the entire meanings in some areas.

I have never been a religious person and for these very reasons. I am not going to blindly follow a book that was translated wrong, is missing a bunch of parts and is so open to interpretation that you have a million factions that all read something else into the same text and have such different values based upon that. Who the hell is right and who is wrong? And are all of the ones that are wrong going to hell? Or at least according to those religions are they?

And its a book, In my 40 years I have not yet seen anything happen that would change my mind on my views. Not once. I believe in what I can touch and see and that can be proven. And this thread is a prime example of why I dont blindly follow anything. Thank you for posting this.

reply to post by gimme_some_truth

Because the bible ( This goes for all versions of it) is manipulated and changed according to the times in an attempt to control people.

A 2000 + year old bunch of books written by men, attempting to understand the way the world works and throwing in political propaganda of the time, was twisted and manipulated to control people.

Could you provide some sources on that first bit, since all the various versions I possess as well as find online are essentially all in unanimous agreement with one other, not counting those that don't include certain books as we're discussing here - which are all readily available regardless?

As well - I've never felt controlled by anything in the faith (granted, I tend not to visit churches often and live from the book directly); can you clarify exactly how the bible has been used to control me?

This is why there are so many versions of the bible. Hey, the King James version exists because the church was telling King James he could not remarry. So he kicked the church out and rewrote the bible creating the King James version...

He manipulated these texts to allow himself to get re-married.

Easy things to say, but hard to substantiate - first off, as I mentioned above, the various versions are effectively all in agreement with one another on any and all matters of substances, exclusions for reasons explained elsewhere aside. They are merely issued as updates for the time to aid readability as well as provide more accurate translations as better or clarifying sources are found and made available (yet all versions also retain footnotes referring to other readings, interpretations, or renderings, so nothing is swept under the rug even then).

As well - how exactly did the KJV help James get around the divorce issue? Clarity on that claim would be appreciated as it still contains the original jewish allowances for divorce (coming from texts MUCH older than any english verisions), as well as Christ's own prohibitions of it (also stemming from much older texts), right here:

31 It hath beene said, Whosoeuer shall put away his wife, let him giue her a writing of diuorcement.
32 But I say vnto you, that whosoeuer shall put away his wife, sauing for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoeuer shall marie her that is diuorced, committeth adulterie.

Some one else decided to change his version again for their own reasons....It comes down to greed and control.

So there is your answer. Is it a disgrace? I suppose, but it's nothing new. The bible has been changed, altered and had parts left out or even added, for centuries....

Popular or not. That is the truth and that is where I stand.

Bash away!

There's not really much to bash here, as you've only stated opinions without anything to back them up? They're definitely popular claims, but I haven't ever been provided much of anything to actually support them, especially as how the various versions don't really offer up any areas of disagreement.

The claim pretty much just falls flat, unless you can provide something else here for us. Little help here?

Take care.

reply to post by halfoldman


Many of the books removed from the Gospels were actually testaments to Jesus' mortality...contradicting the tidbits they 'borrowed' from other faiths to make him look like a god and make the story sound so much better.

reply to post by halfoldman


Many of the books removed from the Gospels were actually testaments to Jesus' mortality...contradicting the tidbits they 'borrowed' from other faiths to make him look like a god and make the story sound so much better.

I wonder if they were removed to usher in the teaching of Darby-ism? I haven't had time to read these 14 books yet but this thread is very interesting.

you all seem to think this is new. How many books were tossed out in 309 AD to 389AD then again in 450 AD. Was it 20 50 or over 100 books that were deemed not worthy of adding in, or contrary to teachings. here is one link that has some of the lost books www.thelostbooks.com... how many know that each one of the 12 had their own books

reply to post by merkej23


I'm being pedantic. It's catamite, not ketamite. Great thread.

Because they did not further the agenda at the time for whomever was ruling.

Pretty simple if you ask me.

Here you can find the Nag Hammadi library ... The Nag Hammadi Library Alphabetical Index

Quite spectacular reading if I do say so myself..

Where Christ explains that it was he, himself in the form of an eagle on the tree in the garden of eden and not the serpent.

Where Christ teaches the "true father" whom no one knew before he arrived.

and explains far more profound teachings than you will ever find in the "bible"

When I first started reading the gnostic scriptures I brought my findings to ATS here ...
It became evident to me that whoever altered the bible didn't want us to know what this particular version of Christ had to say, because to me... it was far more liberating and logical to me than the malarkey they spout in the bible.

I recommend reading.

The Apocryphon of John
On the Origin of the World
The Hypostasis of the Archons (The Reality of the Rulers)
The Gospel of Truth
The Apocryphon of James
The Dialogue of the Savior

These texts have changed my life ...
Sometimes difficult to understand, .. annoying because of all the missing text (in what seems like convenient places for text to be missing)
But a completely different vision of Christ, his message and his mission.

Quote 1

Matthew said, "Tell me, Lord, how the dead die, and how the living live." The Lord said, "You have asked me about a saying [...] which eye has not seen, nor have I heard it, except from you. But I say to you that when what invigorates a man is removed, he will be called 'dead'. And when what is alive leaves what is dead, what is alive will be called upon." Judas said, "Why else, for the sake of truth, do they and live?" The Lord said, "Whatever is born of truth does not die. Whatever is born of woman dies."

Quote 2

Matthew said, "Why do we not rest at once?" The Lord said, "When you lay down these burdens!" Matthew said, "How does the small join itself to the big?" The Lord said, "When you abandon the works which will not be able to follow you, then you will rest."

Mary said, "I want to understand all things, just as they are!"
The Lord said, "He who will seek out life! For this is their wealth. For the [...] of this cosmos is [...], and its gold and its silver are misleading."

Quote 3

Judas said, "Tell me, Lord, what the beginning of the path is." He said, "Love and goodness. For if one of these existed among the governors, wickedness would never have come into existence."

Most people are familiar with the gospel of st. thomas .. because it's much easier to follow, but it is really worth trying to understand the texts that are missing lines and words, if you are familiar with christianity and the jewish faith it will make understanding the gnostic scriptures much easier.

Many things we are continued to be taught in church today are the way things were taught before "Christ" arrived.. in the gnostic scriptures Christ explains a lot of those teachings and reveals the truth behind them.
Even Christ didn't take the Torah literally.

I highly recommend reading the entire library more than once ... you will be astonished and perhaps it will change your views on Christ.

If indeed it was Christ on the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in the form of an eagle.. it makes much more sense why he'd say something like this:

10. Jesus said, "I have cast fire upon the world, and look, I'm guarding it until it blazes."

16. Jesus said, "Perhaps people think that I have come to cast peace upon the world. They do not know that I have come to cast conflicts upon the earth: fire, sword, war. For there will be five in a house: there'll be three against two and two against three, father against son and son against father, and they will stand alone."

Now notice the thoughts and feelings you get when you read those last two quotes, is there any wonder why you would have such a strong response? perhaps because someone wanted you to have a different idea and view of Christ, one that serves THEIR purpose and not his.

I find this very interesting. If they simply removed 14 books wholesale, it makes one wonder how they might have manipulated the 66 books they left in. Does it make sense that 14 books were considered so damaging that they had to hide them and all the others went unmodified? Not bloody likely.

reply to post by Urantia1111


I don't doubt that some texts have been modified over the centuries... especially by the early Roman Catholic Church and by our friend, Emporer Constantine.

However, several of the older texts of the Bible and Old Testament have been found that date back before Jesus...and ironically, they seem to have passed down through the years pretty much intact and word for word correct...

Originally posted by TheTardis
And the worst part is that even the translation is wrong. Years ago a buddy of mine had a book that showed some of the huge mistakes made in the translation from Hebrew since the people who were doing the translation didn't even really speak the language. Some of the words are completely wrong and change the entire meanings in some areas.

I have never been a religious person and for these very reasons. I am not going to blindly follow a book that was translated wrong, is missing a bunch of parts and is so open to interpretation that you have a million factions that all read something else into the same text and have such different values based upon that. Who the hell is right and who is wrong? And are all of the ones that are wrong going to hell? Or at least according to those religions are they?

And its a book, In my 40 years I have not yet seen anything happen that would change my mind on my views. Not once. I believe in what I can touch and see and that can be proven. And this thread is a prime example of why I dont blindly follow anything. Thank you for posting this.

Nice post. Worth repeating.

First off all the people who don't give a rip about the Bible who are suddenly up in arms over extremely old news crack me up! Welcome to the present! I'd be shocked if there are Christians out there who aren't aware of the extra books let alone haven't read them. I know I have. Ask yourself why the Catholics would want the Apocrypha included in the Bible. Would it be because it supports some of there stranger religious activities? Check it out.

Lastly I'd like to add they are not essential to the overall story line of the Bible. God created man, man sinned, Jesus died to save us all.