The Afghanistan Exit Will Humiliate The United States Worse Than Vietnam

"Crack the Sky, Shake the Earth"

— Message to communist forces who were informed that they were "about to inaugurate the greatest battle in the history of our country".

On January 30 1968, The Peoples Army of Vietnam launched the Tet Offensive on South Vietnam,the United States and its allies. The Tet Offensive was the decisive battle that was fought in Vietnam. After the Tet Offensive the United States were forced to change tactics and opted to move towards an orderly exit. An orderly exit was not possible. The last Americans left in Vietnam by 1975 had to scramble onto rooftops kicking off women and children before flying away in helicopters,leaving the South Vietnamese behind to face the advancing communist army outnumbered and alone.

South Vietnamese begging for American Soldiers to let them inside the US Embassy and on a helicopter.






Some managed to escape with the Americans in their Helicopters. Not many though.





The Americans flew away.


And the Communist Army rolled in to Saigon.






It was a glorious victory for the Communists and a humiliating exit for the United States. Luckily,the Communists were pretty decent to their former enemy and most people had nothing to fear. The country was unified and the Vietnamese had liberated themselves from the Imperial United States Government in a stunning victory.

The situation in Afghanistan is very similar to Vietnam. Obama has set an exit date but intends on keeping a small number of troops in Afghanistan forever to guard American interests. They are trying to negotiate with the Taliban but there is no way the Taliban will allow skeleton crew of soldiers to sit in Afghanistan forever. The American military is overstretched. They are looking to move their military bullies primarily into the pacific. In addition to being overstretched,the United States is looking to scale back troop numbers and move towrads more unmanned technology. They are weakening their defences in Afghanistan and it will only encourage the opposition.

Nobody expected the Tet Offensive. People downplay its importance. America should not underestimate the Taliban. I cant see America making an orderly exit from Afghanistan. I think that they are a Tet Offensive away from running back to America with their tails between their legs just like they did in Vietnam. A disorderly exit from the War on Afghanistan would humiliate the United States and further erode its disappearing power.

I wonder what will happen to the low paid Afghani Military that America is training if America is forced to retreat. I wonder if the Taliban is as forgiving as the communists were to most of the South Vietnamese. I think Afghanistan will be better off when they get rid of the United states. Vietnam turned out fine. They stil celebrate the Tet Offensive.

I wonder if Afghanis will be able to celebrate a victory over American occupation some day.

"You know if we'd lost here in Vietnam, I think it might've driven us crazy. Y'know, as a country. But we didn't. Thanks to you."- Edward Blake to dr Manhattan ( The Watchman)

The Watchmen is set in an alternate reality where the United States wins the Vietnam War by using superheros. I think Blake is right. Vietnam had a bad affect on America. Failure in Afghanistan will make the United states look very weak and unstable.

Humiliation? I don't think humiliation could be even factored in...we went in under the impression that we were looking for WMD's...we ended up trying to decocratize a country who could have cared less at the time. I don't think anybody other than perhaps certain military officials give's a hoot that we are embarassed or humiliated in some way. What I do think people feel is snookered or even more distrustful around the government these days regardless if Afghanistan falls apart or prospers. Certain agendas have been reached with respect to certain companies/private security firms/construction/contractors/weapons manufacturers making their money.

You may think that we as Americans are humilitated but it's a constant frustration knowing that we extended ourselves for the good of certain people and not at all in the name of democracy so regardless what happens the same level of frustration is a constant but humiliation will not be one of them.

Originally posted by chrismarco
Humiliation? I don't think humiliation could be even factored in...we went in under the impression that we were looking for WMD's...we ended up trying to decocratize a country who could have cared less at the time. I don't think anybody other than perhaps certain military officials give's a hoot that we are embarassed or humiliated in some way. What I do think people feel is snookered or even more distrustful around the government these days regardless if Afghanistan falls apart or prospers. Certain agendas have been reached with respect to certain companies/private security firms/construction/contractors/weapons manufacturers making their money.

You may think that we as Americans are humilitated but it's a constant frustration knowing that we extended ourselves for the good of certain people and not at all in the name of democracy so regardless what happens the same level of frustration is a constant but humiliation will not be one of them.

edit on 25-5-2012 by chrismarco because: (no reason given)

The WMDs was Iraq. afghanistan was about chasing Osama and making sure afghanistan girls get to go to school apparently. And the public hangings in soccer fields.

And I mean your Government is humiliated and they look weak to other nations. This is important because faith in the US military equals faith in US debt. Once the US military starts to look weak the country looks weak. People stop buying your debt. Your economy collapses. Its all linked. The US Military is the only reason that the US Government maintains its Reserve Currency status.

if you can only articulate your point with tact some readers might not take offense to what you're saying.

anyhow, on topic. why would we be humiliated? we lost our collective ego after vietnam. the worlds opinion of us couldn't be any lower according to some of threads on this site.

needless to say, we're still the country with the most powerful military in existence. there isn't a country out there who will stand up to us and not be reduced to rubble in an all out war.

reply to post by chrismarco


WMD's...huh, wrong conflict. That was Iraq.

We originally went in to take out Al-Queda and overthrow the Talibani Government...then we stuck around to...uh, rebuild. That was a mistake in my opinion.

The Germans, Italians and Japanese after WW2 could be worked with by the victors as they saw themselves as a country overall. A Nationalistic mindset.

The Afghanis have a tribal mindset overall, more family oriented, rather than country oriented. That is a hard mindset to deal with when over there.

When dealing with the various leaders, whether Country or village, it's not "What can I and you do to help the country?", but rather, "What can YOU do for ME?"

Rampant corruption does not even begin to describe the politics in that region.

Originally posted by DOADOA
if you can only articulate your point with tact some readers might not take offense to what you're saying.

anyhow, on topic. why would we be humiliated? we lost our collective ego after vietnam. the worlds opinion of us couldn't be any lower according to some of threads on this site.

needless to say, we're still the country with the most powerful military in existence. there isn't a country out there who will stand up to us and not be reduced to rubble in an all out war.

I just think it will affect you governments standing among other nations. I think the decline of your military and the decline in respect for what the United States can achieve will affect peoples confidence in relation to US Bonds. I think the manner in which America leaves Afghanistan will be important for its future.

What's humiliating is the amount of money we spend to stay in Iraq and Afghanistan while our country crumbles at home. It's time to cut our losses and get out.

Originally posted by Germanicus
I think the manner in which America leaves Afghanistan will be important for its future.

We don't agree on much, but this one little sentence said a mouthful.

S&F

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by Germanicus
I think the manner in which America leaves Afghanistan will be important for its future.

We don't agree on much, but this one little sentence said a mouthful.

S&F

Hey man. I bet we agree on more than we think

And yeah,it will set a tone. It will depend alot on whether we get Obama Romney or Paul what happens. They will all have very different ideas on how to do it exactly.

Originally posted by Kaploink
What's humiliating is the amount of money we spend to stay in Iraq and Afghanistan while our country crumbles at home. It's time to cut our losses and get out.

Yrah,I dont know how America thinks they can afford this stuff. All that money could be used for Public Works to create jobs in some way. America should be spending all its money on itself until it recovers. All foreign aid should be stopped.

perhaps some will believe you.

but we both know that the people who would want such a thing to occur...they are missing a very important piece to the puzzle.

i know what that piece is...do you?

Guarantee within a month of the United States and the rest of NATO pulling out, the Taliban will have a re surge and re-take over Afghanistan.

Originally posted by Germanicus

Originally posted by DOADOA
if you can only articulate your point with tact some readers might not take offense to what you're saying.

anyhow, on topic. why would we be humiliated? we lost our collective ego after vietnam. the worlds opinion of us couldn't be any lower according to some of threads on this site.

needless to say, we're still the country with the most powerful military in existence. there isn't a country out there who will stand up to us and not be reduced to rubble in an all out war.

I just think it will affect you governments standing among other nations. I think the decline of your military and the decline in respect for what the United States can achieve will affect peoples confidence in relation to US Bonds. I think the manner in which America leaves Afghanistan will be important for its future.

that's what you think but if our military superiority were ever questioned, it was answered with a country going to sh!t.

it does not matter how the US leave afghanistan, those in power know the true motives for us being there and they'll know exactly why we left. people like you and i can only speculate on the reasons and make assumptions.

reply to post by Germanicus


It is technically not a American occupation, but rather a NATO one. One which seems to crumbling. Yes, the US does have the majority of forces there but there are others who are also sacrificing their sons and daughters as well.

I know, it's nit-picking and I mean no offense by it, but that sounds like people who say the US won WW2. We didn't...it was a team effort that everyone was committed to seeing through till the end. An unconditional surrender by the Axis.

And the Taliban have already shown themselves to be not quite as forgiving as the Vietnamese communists in the ‘70’s.

Originally posted by michaelbrux
perhaps some will believe you.

but we both know that the people who would want such a thing to occur...they are missing a very important piece to the puzzle.

i know what that piece is...do you?

edit on 25-5-2012 by michaelbrux because: (no reason given)

Well the terrorists are backed by Iran and the CIA it would seem. But the Taliban was the ruling force. They want it back. Many Afghanistans like the Taliban because even though they are not perfect they protected commuties.

Vietnam and Afghanistan are just a proxy disigned to waste taxpayer money and fill the pockets of bankers and corporatists but the exit is still important.

What is your mysterious piece?

reply to post by AaronWilson


good. that way Taliban can be hanging from their necks when they screw up those people's lives.

be careful what you ask for.

Originally posted by TDawgRex
reply to post by Germanicus

 

It is technically not a American occupation, but rather a NATO one. One which seems to crumbling. Yes, the US does have the majority of forces there but there are others who are also sacrificing their sons and daughters as well.

I know, it's nit-picking and I mean no offense by it, but that sounds like people who say the US won WW2. We didn't...it was a team effort that everyone was committed to seeing through till the end. An unconditional surrender by the Axis.

And the Taliban have already shown themselves to be not quite as forgiving as the Vietnamese communists in the ‘70’s.

Yeah,I think the Taliban will slaughter all those considered to have conspired with the enemy. The US almost has an obligation to protect these people now that they have involved themselves.