Colt Commander, finally failed

Originally posted by digital01anarchy
reply to post by Skewed

 

just goes to show you when Americans take pride in building something it works really well too bad its guns. not that im not a gun person i just wish we had more high end American built products sold in america beside just weapons

I am dutch and can only dream of owning a gun.. owning such a fine reliable one like the colt commander. Anyways... what you said is the key to a prosporous USA... start building your own good stuff again and make people aware to buy USA made products. Bit more if not a lot more expensive but hey, ... happiness will follow.

My custom built colt commander in 38 super is and was the finest gun i will ever own.
It was accurate to 100 yds flat shooting with the red dot on a five inch steel plate it would knock em down consistently.
In my opinion, the 38 super is superior to the old 45 round except in wall penetration when you want bullets to stop and not spill over into other rooms.
The penetration of the 38 super far exceeds the stopping power of plaster....
So 45 by the bed
38 super for carry.....
they are fine guns both by Colt, in my opinion, the very best.....
regards s...........

So wait W1ll,

The Colt is a piece of crap because it withstood 50,000 rounds being put through it until a tinsy slide lock blows out finally.

But the Taurus. noooooooooooooooooo. thats an excellent high quality weapon.

And you have Sigs too. But the taurus is the one you favor?

Man that Taurus would be lucky to hit the broad side of a barn.

Taurus > than a Colt? = Fail.

reply to post by BASSPLYR


I agree! It's imcomprehensible that a SIG takes a backseat to a Taurus. Taurus builds a decent weapon for the money, but there is no comparison when you look at dependability, workmanship and the quality of raw materials.

Unless he's talking about the SIG P-250 line...The one made in America. So much for the Made in USA tag, when you talk about that travesty.

No, John Moses Browning got it right back in 1909 and after over 100 years no one has built a pistol that has stood the test of time, to date.

Heck, even the Iraeli made Eagles are higher quality than a Taurus...
Sorry, I have a hard time believing he owns any of those guns other than the Brazilian made, cast, assembly line produced, cookie-cutter of a weapon.

Originally posted by BASSPLYR


Man that Taurus would be lucky to hit the broad side of a barn.

I told myself I would not participate in a debate, but when it comes to a Taurus I want to expand your statement a little further.

A Taurus would be lucky to hit the side of a barn standing inside of it.

yeah I think we busted someone for being an internet wanna warrior. Seriously I too think the guy only has a Taurus and is making everything else up.

The best part is when he talks about jumping into a muddy river and needing the gun to get you out of a tough situation. he counts on the Tuarus to fire reliably? Also who the hell jumps into mud rolls around gets the gun good and grungy then tries to use it. What is he a commando doing a infiltration? Last time I went to the gun range or even participated in hunting I wasn't rolling around in mud. Laying prone shooting a long gun sure but rolling around in the mud? And if I were in the woods and dropped my gun in some mud or got it otherwise dirty to that effect I would just take a few minutes to clean it as best as possible. and then carry on.

Seriously who favors a Taurus over a Sig? Unless price is the only factor.

I recommend that the guy actually goes out and buys one of the guns he's claiming he has.

That Colt is a excellent gun. And obviously made to last.

How does one determine which manufacturer is better?

Statistical track record? Company policies? Who theyve hired as spokesman? Government contracts?

Considering so much of a firearms long-term durability is influenced by factors beyond control such as the temperament of the material, manufacturing process, individual use/abuse, unforeseen weakness in materials, etc... how do you say with any quantitative certainty that a Colt 1911 is better than a Taurus 1911 or vice versa.

Not to mention how many individual models each company produces and has produced.

In every manufactured product there are lemons.

Beyond a shallow reputation spread across the wastelands of the internet and the phenomenon known as "fanboyism" is there really an irrefutable concrete apples to apples measure of which is better?

Especially regarding 1911's. A hundred year old design made by dozens of manufacturers the world over.

Oh no. I've shot the Taurus. A few different ones actually. They suck. Inherently inaccurate. Go to any gun store and ask the manager his opinion of a Taurus.

They are built with lower tolerances than companies like Colt. It's like saying a Ford Focus is built better than a Mercedes S class. But the ford is much better built than the Tuarus.

Originally posted by BASSPLYR

They are built with lower tolerances than companies like Colt.

Build tolerance is thrown around a lot. Do you have any measurements? Without a micrometer it doesnt really mean much.

From Taurus's product sheet:

Starting with our own hammer-forged -not cast - ordnance grade steel frames, slides and barrels, we machine each and every part to tolerance levels that surpass even today's industry standards. Our skilled pistol smiths hand-fit and tune each gun with the 19 standard features seen below, using quality parts that are built 100% in our state-of-the-art factory.

Is Taurus lying?

From Colt:

These models offer enthusiasts an opportunity to own a handcrafted 1911 type pistol which incorporates some of the most desired features normally associated with the best 1911 custom gunsmiths.

Okay. They dont drop the buzzword "tolerance" but they imply it's a above par gun.

Wilson Combat:

When nothing less than 100% functional reliability, fast handling, rapid shot-to-shot recovery and accuracy is demanded, you want to have a Wilson Combat® Tactical Elite On Your Side®.

So it's perfect then, right?

And at the bottom of the food chain, Para:

Para is now including its new Power Extractor™ technology in all of its pistols - for better feeding and extracting reliability in every shot. Whatever Para pistol you choose, you can be assured that it is the most advanced, best-performing and reliable pistol of its kind... in short, the best pistol you can own!

So which is? The $400 gun? The $1000 gun? The $2000 gun?

They all claim to be the best. Who's lying?

It has nothing to do with who says they have the best (that's really up to their publicist), the pricing (look at savage. their guns are priced cheap and they hold up to rifles costing 3 times as much or more), or even the name of the manufacturer.

It's about what real people who shoot the weapon are saying, and have been saying for the last decade or so. Nobody who shoots the Taurus is going to say. hey that's a nice gun there. (unless they are sparing the gun owners feelings at the time)

This isn't a subjective comparison of who's coffee is better. Dunkin Donuts or Madam Foo Foo le Pedoir's super deluxe coffee. It's about hte actual empirical evidence about the gun.

It's a crappy gun. Sorry to break it to you. It's it more than adequate for putting in your night stand to thwart the guy breaking into your house. Sure. But for a gun it's very much so on the low end of the scale.

Looks like a lot of people own a Taurus in this thread and I've touched a nerve.

Hey I own a Howa 1500 .308 Axiom. (one of a few guns I own at least) They are considered cheap guns, but the thing is still very accurate. (about as accurate as my Savage 110, which is pretty damned accurate) So it's not about the price range. it's literally about the product and how it stacks up. What everybody is saying about the product who are in the know.

Like I said go to your nearest gun store and ask the managers and salesmen what they think of the Taurus.

Originally posted by BASSPLYR
Like I said go to your nearest gun store and ask the managers and salesmen what they think of the Taurus.

Right. Because he isnt trying to sell you anything.

Gun shop clerks and owners and clientele arent exactly unbiased judges. Often they're full of # and riddled with fanboyitis drooling over the object on the cover of last months Handgunner.

I dont own any Taurus' (or is it Tauri?). I'm just not convinced by any measure that there is a definitive end-all-be-all firearm manufacturer.

It's like some grown up version of Nintendo vs. Sega.

I expect Colt to advertise "blast processing" at SHOT 2013.

Of course there is no end all be all firearm manufacturer. However if there is a list of firearms that have a poor reputation in just about all categories except price then Taurus would be in it.

The taurus is fine for home defense. But it's a misnomer that a gun salesman will tell you anything to sell a Taurus or any other gun. yes they can be snobs and bitch about the bedding on my Howa not being as good as the bedding on a Remington 700 or whatever. But they in general will be honest about why it's better to buy a slightly more expensive gun. Even if it's just a cheapo gun needed for the unlikely event you'd have to use it for home defense.

They will argue that it's better to be safe than sorry and buy a gun that's 200 bucks more than a Taurus that will fire more reliably and accurately. Gun stores aren't exactly hurting these days.

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
How does one determine which manufacturer is better?

Let me tell you, from a FFL's perspective...

I always judge a product by the condition of the product right out of the box, and the company's Customer Service Department. If a company truly attempts to build and market a quality product, you will hear a difference in the way they deal with a claim, assuming you ever need to call them.

For instance, if the person on the other end exudes embarrassment over their product, they probably strive to sell a superior item.

Companies like SIG, have great customer service, but the person on the other end comes off as arrogant. As if, their products don't have problems and you must have done something to it, to be calling with a claim...

Taurus, again has very good customer service. The difference though, is the number of times we have had to use them. Their turn around time is horrendous, usually months. And a few times they didn't even correct the problem! One customer's rifle had to be sent back 3 times, and they finally just replaced it!

I can't count the times that we have ordered a NEW Taurus, and it failed to function, right out of the box. Heck, just one drunk Brazilian, testing each gun as it comes off of the line, would save them a lot of time and money. Not to mention happier customers, but...

The truth is, if you spend a little time finishing a Taurus, a little buffing, a little polishing, fine-tuning the action, they are actually very good guns. They just leave a bad taste in your mouth, as they come now.

Here's one that will blow your mind...Hi-Point, has the best customer service of all of the companies I have dealt with, over the years. They don't chastise, or make you jump through hoops. Heck you don't even have to send in the gun! Just tell the person on the phone, what part failed, and it's in your mailbox a few days later! FREE!!!

Just a little insight into the glamorous side of being a Federal Firearms Dealer...

Goofyfoot,

Very good points there. My best friend is a manager at a well known los angeles gun store (not turners). Everyday he drops by my place on the way home from work and we talk guns. Your post reminds me of his usual unwinding conversation of how his day went. So your post brings on good memories and rings of the truth.

Yes the Taurus when cleaned up and smithed a little can be a great gun. Sorta like a Dodge Neon given a bunch of aftermarket mods can be a great race car.

doesn't even operate fresh out of the box. thats awesome!

reply to post by thisguyrighthere

So which is? The $400 gun? The $1000 gun? The $2000 gun? They all claim to be the best. Who's lying?

All of them. The most finicky have incredibly high tolerances but are more accurate. Out of those choices I'll take the Wilson. Taurus has upped their game recently in my opinion. I've shot a few and found them to be nice for the money. I have a Sig Scorpion and a Kimber Custom 2. Both accurate, both reliable. I need to go grab my Kimber and take it to the range soon. Been locked away in storage far too long.

For the most part if you're talking above $1k and below $1500 for a combat gun I think 1911 manufacturers are equal. Then it comes to fanboyism. Les Baer and Wilson are probably going to be better (and pricey), some people hate on Kimber, some swear by them (love Kimber). Springfield is always a good bet, I also dig my Sig. My opinion is the looser the better (get your mind out of he gutter) in terms of reliability. Those high tolerances seem to detract from reliability.

Love 1911s, my favorite gun in terms of feel, looks and badassery.

I like your story OP. I found the few posts stating earnestly that you should probably replace that part amusing. Of course you're going to. You love that gun. You probably named her. Oh wait, I know you did. It's good to know that the classics remain. I don't know when the 1911 was invented, but it's been going strong for over one hundred years. Considering all the advancements we've made, that is one helluva testament to the gun. I just got misty.

Envious of your Kimber there.

I want one. Just can't afford to do any gun shopping for a few months. Since I just bought the 110BA in.300
(having a great time with that rifle and beginning to explore the .300 round, which I am beginning to really like.)

The Kimbers are great. Feel great when shooting. very managed recoil on the .45 Look good too in my opinion.

reply to post by Skewed


I'm impressed that your 1992 Colt lasted so long. Those were some dark years for Colt (late 80's and in the early 90's.) Now would be a good time to do a thorough inspection and rebuild. The writing is written clearly on the wall with your first failure and so many rounds fired. It's like the snowball effect when you crack open a car to make it's first major repair...

reply to post by jibeho


That is my plan, my next step is to put Colt to the task on their customer service. I have faith in their product, now lets see how they support it. A product is only as good as its support.

I will be calling them when I get a few minutes to give them my full attention to see about getting a rebuild kit for it, or just ship it back to them and see what they do to fix it. I will get it fixed, no question about that. I do agree, it is about time for its 100,000 mile checkup.