There Are LOADS Of Jobs Out There, But People Don't Want To Work!

Originally posted by jerico65

Originally posted by fleabit
I have more than 25 years of experience in my field - you are seriously suggesting that I take the first job that comes along, and forget all about my time and effort working up the ladder, learning my trade? Like I said.. you live in a fantasy world if you think that's the answer.

It all depends on what "profession" you have.

There was an ass-hat that was whining on some Occupy site about all the time and effort he put into his "profession". Spent tons of cash on his Masters degree, the whole nine yards. Now, he couldn't find a job and was stuck with crushing debt.

His profession? He had a Master in Puppetry. Yep, he decided he was gonna be the next Jim Henson or something.

So, if you have that sort of profession, regardless of how many years of experience, maybe it's time to put down Kermit and Fozzie Bear and pick up a wrench.

Indeed. far too many useless MBAs. They are expectant because they spent so much money being tricked by the educational shysters who promised them the world. Tough sh1t. Open your brains and see what's really going on. For example, why do iSheep buy iPhones and iPads? Do you want to follow the herd or be "normal"?

Originally posted by LifeIsPeculiar
reply to post by poet1b

 

In this day and age, with our production capabilities, people shouldn't have to work terrible jobs for lousy pay.

With our production capabilities, companies don't need many people at all for production or office work for that matter. Therein lies the rub. You don't think you should be given a job where you can draw top dollar and surf the net, do you?

It seems to me that people are going to need to find their own way in life with jobs they create for themselves. The alternative is, in fact, terrible jobs for lousy pay. If you want trade jobs like in the "good old days", we'll have to destroy computers and automation.

Sometimes I think civilization may have to be destoyed so that we can have the fulfilling task of rebuilding it. Alas, 2012 will probably come and go just like all of the others. Sigh.

Yes, we have to become self-reliant. That's how it has been for thousands of years, but not the last 20. People became too demanding and expecting. Now it's back to normality.

First of all, why do we even need jobs? Really, ask yourself this question, ponder it. Are jobs not an invention of TPTB largely based off the principals Smith put forth in 1776? Jobs are a consequence of the industrial revolution when society was actually productive. I will make this very simple for everyone… Based on Smith’s view that production (production capacity) is wealth and not actual gold, because without means of production gold has little value. In 2009, one person in the labor force at large could only make 55k per year according to the world’s GDP combined average. Yet, people make millions upon millions per year and it is impossible to be that productive. The point is that economics has been skewed to define materialism and not the science itself. Our system propagates corporations, not citizens.

It all depends on what "profession" you have.

There was an ass-hat that was whining on some Occupy site about all the time and effort he put into his "profession". Spent tons of cash on his Masters degree, the whole nine yards. Now, he couldn't find a job and was stuck with crushing debt.

His profession? He had a Master in Puppetry. Yep, he decided he was gonna be the next Jim Henson or something.

So, if you have that sort of profession, regardless of how many years of experience, maybe it's time to put down Kermit and Fozzie Bear and pick up a wrench.

Ok.. sure, I'll agree if you have a degree in puppetry and are holding out for the golden puppet-wielding job, you perhaps should look for other employment.

But most of the jobs I am talking about are solid jobs. Like I said, my company changed their support model for IT, and laid off some 20% of their IT workforce. A fairly substantial number nationwide. Also, they have been cutting many other "overhead" jobs. They will suffer later for it. They are cutting geologists, financial / Oracle folks, project managers, marketing folks, etc. These are all viable jobs. They may take longer to find new jobs. And I think it's patently ludicrous to suggest if they have plenty of time left for unemployment, for them to just take any job available. They spent years learning their trade. Plumbing, carpentry or anything else, is not any more important than any other job, even if some of you folks think so. They are all viable careers.

Originally posted by fleabit
Also.. as an aside...

Some of you act as if there is a great shortage of electricians, plumbers, etc. There isn't. You are saying it's viable for someone NEWLY out of work, in a short time frame, to learn all they need to know, and purchase what they need to be successful, and then COMPETE with already established businesses. Again.. fantasy. Not reality.

Even if you work for a "mom and pop" store - many require you to have your own tools. You still need to have training. They are not going to let you waltz in without knowing a thing and hire you. That doesn't happen. I don't know what reality some of you are living in, but it's not the same one I live in.

Agreed. In my 25 years of working, I have never seen a shortage. When I was doing construction, the only way you got in was to be a Elec. apprentance for a while (months? year?) but usually could only get in the door if you knew someone. Those jobs were always full, but they payed very well, still, VERY dangerous and not all that easy to find an opening unless you're in a city or town where you'll find less work anyways, for much lower wages. Still, you're better off knowing someone.


It's a gamble. Every trade these days is a gamble. Never should one give up! but I cant ever say that there are jobs aplenty. It simply isnt that cut and dry. Even seeing one of my brothers struggle this last year looking for a job (finaly got one recently, thankfully), It litteraly took him nearly a year to get a dealership job. He was trying for anything that could support he, his fiance and his daughter and supporting his 2 boys. It wasnt always like that for him, he usually had a good job. At some point layoffs were common and well... that's what happens. He's not making much but it's something.

Even when he couldnt find a job, I was always on him because I couldnt accept that he couldnt find work untill I spent a week with him running around dropping applications in companies where I knew people.

Originally posted by jimmyx
minimum wage jobs do not pay enough...
example: minimum wage in 1969 $1.30 an hour...gal of gas...35 cents
minimum wage in 2012 $7.25 an hour...gal of gas...$3.68

in 1969, you could get 4 gal. of gas for a hours worth of work, with change
in 2012, you can get alittle under. 2 gals of gas for an hours worth of work

we are getting F'ed by either the oil companies or the lobbyists for low wage business interests, and i think it's both. so this idea of someone being lazy because they don't want to take backbreaking work for minimum wage, is simply a fallacy.
our motto should be:...."work at minimum wage in america, and you will become poorer every year"...."minimum wage in america, you too can reach the level of poverty only dreamed about by big business"

Ahhh. But here's the rub.....

How many women were in the workforce in 1969?? There is no actual more tangible wealth of the nation since 1969. The fact is, once women entered the workforce in greater numbers, it created more competition for those jobs and resources. The nations 'wealth' had to be watered down to accomodate for the new entries into the workforce.

This is why a household needs 2 incomes to survive these days.

All this 'real' wealth didn't magically appear with this new workforce. It just got diluted over time and now 'household' wealth is determined by 2 jobs.

The problem is that some of the people are waking up to the "lie that was begun in the garden of eden". The knowledge in the garden of eden was technology, we all have the Mark of the Beast. The Mark of the Beast was excepting technology and society.

It's all a farce, and yet we have people fighting tooth and nail to continue it. Just because THEY bought into the illusion and spent so much time and money.

We have people here who actually agree everyone should just shut up and keep their nose to the grind! Just fall in like all the other sheep and keep it moving huh? Never mind trying to fix the mess?

I'm willing to wager that every person looking down on those out of work would identify as being CONSERVATIVE! Conservative people are afraid of change and too selfish to stomach seeing someone else achieve something easier than themselves.

There's a FEAR among a lot of selfish people because they see what's attempting to happen. Our young people aren't as sheepish or compliant as we were. They are asking questions and realizing the illusion. Why should they have to go work on some grunt job for pennies? Why should they spend their young lives slaving in order to make someone else rich?

These are the questions the older generations just said "shut up, and quit complaining". So they're using the wrong label of, "people are lazy" when actually people are smartening up! It's coming to the point where the people will organize and state "WHY...WHY should we slave and toil for YOU?"

The paradigm is going to shift from employers having all the power back to the real driving force the employees having the power! There's been a misconception that employees should be grateful to their employers. Maybe so, but employers should be grateful for their employees as well. Because without a workforce to execute your idea or invention it would be useless!

All the people who sell their labor in this society need to organize and lay some demands upon the large businesses! Demands of a living wage and to end this temporary b.s.

I say again, there are selfish people in this country who DO NOT wish to see things change for the better! They see it coming and they're jealous that future generations will have it easier! LOL...they're feeling like they've been bamboozled and they wish for everyone else to fall for that bamboozle!

They are labeling these people who are smartening up and waking up as being lazy in an attempt to discredit them and ostricize them.

The people aren't quite sure how to state their demand (OWS) but they're getting there! The wealth is about to be wrestled from these barrons and tycoons and they are fighting for all they're worth to prevent it. The people just need someone to organize them.

It shouldn't have been Occupy Wall Street, it should have been Occupy the Resource Hoarders. As I said, the people just need a little more organization and direction. They had the general idea however, and look at the way the selfish people reacted. It wasn't just RICH people who ridiculed the movement, it was also SELFISH people who instead of wanting things to get better...desire things to continue getting bad just because THEY were fooled.

Those kids are realizing what a farce college is. I work in employment and there are thousands of college educated individuals who can't find work. They've spent or owe tens of thousands of dollars...and they can't find a job, let alone a decent paying job.

News flash for all the self righteous: IF YOU ARE COLLEGE EDUCATED AND APPLY FOR A FAST FOOD OR DITCH DIGGER JOB...you are denied for being OVER QUALIFIED!!!!

im an unskilled worker, luckily i found a job a year ago but i know loads of people who are still looking. as for getting a trade, how do you suppose people pay for their training if they dont have a job to start with.

also, im good at art, sketching, painting, sculpting but i lack the knowlegde and the confidance to do that as a job.... were would i even start????

Originally posted by DaveNorris

also, im good at art, sketching, painting, sculpting but i lack the knowlegde and the confidance to do that as a job.... were would i even start????

Find a local art institute that would let you apprentice or volunteer your services. Find an artist or a sculptor to mentor with. Or, just make your own stuff and set up a flea market booth or perennial garage sale.

Here in my town you could get your feet wet and make some great contacts at Lemoyne Art Foundation. They always need volunteers, and they offer classes with experts, and they do a lot of community outreach. You could spend money for classes, or participate and volunteer for free, or donate money and merchandise for fundraising.

On another note. There is no such thing as a healthy, and articulate person that is "unskilled." Stop thinking of yourself that way and start finding a way to use buzzwords and talking points for the things you do know. Maybe the only thing you've ever done in your life is man the pie booth at church, that makes you "skilled" in customer service, retail, marketing, food service, and management.

Originally posted by ModernAcademia
How easy is it to get a plumber to your house same day and sometimes same week?
How often does a plumber call you back even?
And how much does it cost?

This market is thirsty for more plumbers
More plumbers is more competition which will be better prices for you as well

What about an electrician?
Are they easy to get at your home same day?

And even more importantly landscapers
You call a landscaper sure they may come same day, but when will they start the project?
Sometimes months or weeks ahead
Sometimes they give you a quote and never call you back
Sometimes they come to do an estimation and they never send you the quote unless they do it onsite

Many of these guys are either irresponsible or they have so many contracts to work on that they don't care
And that's from the horse's mouth

There are plenty of jobs out there
But when people think of jobs they only think about the help wanted ads or monster.com
They never think of starting their own business and THAT is the problem

They wait for a job to come to them instead of them themselves going towards a new business initiative

Come on people!

I realize that this is not universal truth, some areas in ghettos have very little buyers for landscaping and also may live in appartments where the landloard takes care of it.

But in the city and suburbs there's loads of jobs
And if you live in a ghetto maybe you can drive outside of town for such a job and then move out

However let's not say there's no jobs out there
That's just not true

I'm not saying it's easy out there, but you don't jump to "There's No Jobs!!!"

I agree with you. People complain about there not being any jobs, but those same people file for unemployment biweekly, and don't bother getting employed because their unemployment is a large sum of money either way, depending on the situation.

I remember when I got my job I couldn't be happier, especially since my area seems to be a little barren. I think it's the fact that people don't want to stoop so low that they have to work at a fast food joint. My motto? 'It's money, get over it.'

The strong will survive and the weak will suffer. Everyone has the ability to turn something out of nothing, not everyone is willing to do it. To turn something out of nothing is not easy ... it's much easier to just make excuses.

For the people who can't afford to buy a book or even muster up the energy to download the free version of the study guide online ... you don't want it. Almost every study guide for IT related work is online and free and open to all.

There are no excuses for someones situation unless they had a gun to their head and was forced to make a bad decision.

No one told you to have kids before you were financially secure. Every excuse can be met with an answer.

reply to post by blackreign2012


Too bad all that free study stuff doesn't come with the worthless piece of paper that people are going in debt to get from colleges. When people with those pretty pieces of paper are having trouble finding work, what do you think most employer's response to people who are self learned is going to be? Application goes right in the garbage without a second look.

Is it me or does OP sound like he is in need of a compliment? Good for you buddy you made it. Now, are you done bashing people to feel better about yourself?

If jobs were that easy to get then the unemployment rates wouldn't be so high. Where I live 250 people were just let off at a mill where most of them spent 10+ years working. Mentally, how the heck do you recover from something like that? Let me guess, buy a ratchet.

I'm happily employed and going to school but nobody can tell me jobs are easy to come by nor create. If they were then we wouldn't have this ridiculous conversation.

reply to post by captaintyinknots


Some of us have trained put in over 10 years each in more than 1 field, and have seen both of those jobs sent overseas.

So sure, OP -- tell me how a 43 year old man is going to get an apprenticeship with an electrician in today's job market. I'd love to hear it and I'd be willing to do it too.

In the meantime, this thread is about as far from "Academia" as you can get.

reply to post by JRedBeard

Well what's happening is that whether a mexican gets the low-skill job or the american gets the low-skill job, someone is going to lose and there're going to be a lot of them! What do they do?

Well... mexicans are going to come. Lots of em. We have a surplus of low-skill laborers. And it's not just here. It's all across the world. Many many people want work and a modern life. There're many times more people in other countries than in the US. Think: globalization.

It boils down to education.

HS is not enough.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say HS + 2 years of college should be payed for by the country just as HS is payed for right now. This will make low-skill american workers more competitive in high-skill jobs and they won't be left competing with illegal immigrants for jobs. And then they'll be able to add to the economy instead of taking away from it. You'll see much more job creation out of it.

What happened is that HS used to be all a person needed to really get going and get a decent job. In fact, there was a time you could drop out in 4th grade and still get a decent job. You didn't even need grade school! But with all of the technological changes, the need for high-skills has increased. There're just so many things you have to learn to be effective nowadays. So if our goal is to produce a work force as we did 50 years ago, we will have to pay for more college-level education. This means higher taxes. In theory, the higher taxes will be payed in hte longterm as these graduates, instead of competing with illegals or 3rd-worlders, get jobs and pump up the economy. (Their higher skills will yield higher wages and in turn yield more taxes. Do you want somebody making $900/month paying (mostly) zero taxes or somebody making $3500/month contributing 20% to the taxbase?)

So what does a HS-level student do to find work if he's competing with illegals or 3rd-worldlers in another country that create products that're imported? And if he needs that work to pay for more education then what's he going to do if he can't find it? This is the dilemma. So, in effect, we could give "free" loans to HS-level students to go to college or just have the taxbase pay for it.

Remember, if it's cheaper to import from a less developed country then we will. So the low-skill workers in our own country will be out of work. There're a couple billion low-skill people. In fact, the US takes everytying for granted. Much of the world lives in less developed conditions.

We either become more like less developed countries or we increase our skills. Period.

Look at Finland. They have high education marks. In fact, in math and science they've been ranked at #1, with asian countries following in the lead. America is somewhere around #20 in the rankings. But even they recognize hte costs of a college-level education. While their tuition is mostly free, students still pay living expenses. This is not altogether different from the US paying through HS-level since parents pay for the living expenses of their children. But non-EU citizens have to prove they can support themselves. Not sure how they afford it, but it's something worht looking at.

reply to post by jonnywhite


I agree with most of what you're saying.
I would take it a step further though and say that it's not a matter of MORE school which is the problem.
The problem in my opinion is the manner in which we go about education.
We can't keep trying to crank out worker drones like we did for the industrial revolution.
The structure and content of our education system seems to be that of a boot-camp for 'real life'.
The world has gotten too complex and we have forgotten about the simple things like the value of common sense and ground-level human production while simultaneously ignoring the details of our evolving world.
For example, I would trust a 17 year old kid to handle installing the 'essentials' on my smartphone or computer before I would a 50 year old engineer.
In the same light I would like to see more young adults with the inclination and opportunity to learn things like farming, meat processing, construction, mechanics etc and feel proud about it rather than feeling like he's a failure for not becoming an engineer...

We've forgotten that young people need to start somewhere and that a fruitful career/niche may take many years to develop. We've exaggerated the idea that someone can spend 4-8 years (HS included) and come out the other side fully primed for their field.

Okay, here we are in 2012 with millions of people out of work and looking for a job.
Funny thing is, have you really looked through the job boards lately? Almost everyone that is posting jobs is a recruiter and they all seem to think that the millions of folks out here have bachelor degrees.
It is the 1st requirement listed on the job description "Bachelors in blablabla" Now here is the funny part. The job really does not require the person to have a degree to do the work. There are people with Masters Degrees that can't find work in their fields of expertise because there jobs market has dried up due to the financial downturn and they are applying for these jobs that require the Bachelors. The folks that have 10+ years doing the work that the job entails will not get an interview because they do not have a bachelors degree. This is a domino effect of greedy corporate owners shipping the majority of our good paying jobs over seas for pennies on the dollar and the shrinkage of available work because the corporations that decided not to ship the jobs over seas have instead decided to outsource the work to temp and contract agencies to avoid paying benefits! WE ARE REALLY SCREWED AMERICA! It is not a matter of if it will happen, but when it will happen > The floor is about to fall out from underneath us my American brothers and sisters. I hope you understand this and are ready for the shock waves that are soon coming.

I have a few points...

1) Alot of jobs aren't given to people who are "over-qualified". For example, I have friends who have had to remove their degrees from their resumes because it was the only way they could get a job.

2) Too many large companies abuse their staff. They hire through agencies, offering 12 week training contracts on a reduced wage offering the possibility of a permanent position, than fire their new staff after the contract expires. Then they repeat the process. Hence, alot of people are reluctant to take these positions, because they want to hold out for something better, and the ones who do take the jobs end up unemployed again 3 months later.

3) Alot of jobs are either underpaid or simply inappropriate for alot of people. For example, I saw a job advertised recently where the hours were 2am-7am on a 4 on 4 off shift (you work for 4 days in a row then have 4 days off), over 25's only, at £7 an hour. That isn't enough money to live off, its virtually impossible to work around a full time job, it's inappropriate for anyone with children, and its not even as if the job is open to students, who, lets face it, would be in the best position to accept a job like that.
Alot (ALOT) of the jobs available involve working nights, which those of us with kids just can't do.

4) This only applies to the UK, but there's a fair bit of xenophobia within the jobs market - alot of companies won't hire Brits, they favour European immigrants.

5) As for setting up a business, speaking as an accountant, its an incredibly stupid thing to do right now unless you're planning on running it part time, and working another job as well. The vast majority of new businesses fail, and the recession isn't quite over, people still aren't spending money, which in turn means new businesses are even more likely to fail.
And there's the Catch 22 of needing money to start a business, needing a job to get the money, needing a business to get a job, rinse and repeat.

Apologies for any bad spelling / grammar, I'm typing this on my phone. Autocorrect sucks.