NEWS: Sex at 12 is tradition

A group of women on Pitcairn Island in the South Pacific are standing by their men, who face underage sex charges, saying having sex at age 12 is a tradition dating back to 18th century mutineers who settled on the island. Villagers are worried if the men are convicted, they could lose use of longboats, vital to the island's existence. I think they don't stand a chance.


Seven men, half of Pitcairn's male population and descendants of 18th century mutineers who rebelled against Captain William Bligh aboard the Bounty, face a total of 96 sex charges, some dating back more than 40 years.

96 sex charges, what is wrong with these people? Thats about 14 sex charges each. And the women of the island are fighting the charges because they don't want to lose their longboats. Well, I think the women need to take control of the long boats, because the men belong in jail, for a long, long time.

"I was 13 ... I felt like a big lady. I wanted it," said one lady who is now 26. At 13 you don't know what you want, you don't know what is right, and you don't know what is wrong. At 13 your are still going through puberty, and in some cases, at 13 you are still pubecent. Now you tell me that is a reason to let a grown man do a sexual act to you, because you wanted it.

"The implication all girls are sexually active at 10 or 12 .. that's nonsense!" Of course, she won't give her identity, because she doesn't want to be ostracized. Now that lady has the right attitude, she is probably the mayor of the village because the seems to be the only sane one there. Well, wrong again. The seven men, including the mayor, are charged with having sex with underage girls. The mayor for heavens sake! British law forbids having sex with a girl under 16.

The trial on Pitcairn, with a population of just 47, is due to start on Wednesday, September 29, Pitcairn time. The British government has shipped in judges, police, a jail, court officials and reporters for the trial, which is expected to last for about six weeks.

"It was just the way it was. It goes way back. It's been happening for generations," said Nadine Christian, 32. It is time for this to stop! Some Pitcairn women believe if the seven men, who comprise half the island's adult male population, are jailed then this could force the closure of Pitcairn. Too bad. Move to a more civilized place.

"The men who have been charged, they are all viable men, the ones who run the longboats," said Nadine Christian. "Who is going to do that if they go to jail?" Does it really matter? These guys commited a crime, and they need to pay. I will be happy when each and every single one of these guys (who make up for half of the male population) are in jail... for life.

[edit on 29-9-2004 by John bull 1]

18th century? Don't these people think it's time to modernize a bit? I mean sex with 12 year olds. A child of 12 does not know what she wants. To be violated at that age, I cannot even imagine.

"I was 13 ... I felt like a big lady. I wanted it,"

Who wants to bet that changed the minute they where about to have a baby? I mean they really need to get with the day, thats just wrong.

*putting on asbestose flame suit*
This is where anthropology collides with most modern cultural norms.

Before people become too hysterical, they should keep in mind that the average pre-history human lifespan and even in early history was MUCH MUCH shorter. For the species to survive sex would have probably under many circumstances started at puberty. In Roman times the average Roman lived to be 30.
Do the Math. To have a kid at 15 and raise them to be 15 years old would leave you with an 'adult' child of 15 on your deathbed.

In pre-history while some people lived longer than 30 a great number may have lived shorter lives than that.

I also realize some people due to religious beliefs think we were created by magic aroung 5000 years ago.

I am not saying we should abandon all of our cultural beliefs. As we have become in many places on the globe a far longer lived species it makes sense to extend childhood and assist the young in waiting to have sex until somewhat later. But to start wielding the Moral Meat-axe without some consideration would be a gross display of ignorance.
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My grandmother was born in 1921, at age 8 her marriage was arranged, at age 13 she was married. Now even though we don't discuss sex and my mom was born when granny was 20 years old, I am pretty sure she was having sex with her husband long between ages 13 and 20.

So in essence, sex at an early age, even marriage is a tradition in some cultures. Just because we don't understand it or wouldn't turn to it now, doesn't mean that these men should be prosecuted for something that is acceptable in their culture.

Pitcairn Case
Pitcairn, halfway between New Zealand and Peru, has a population of only 45 � all descendants of English sailor Fletcher Christian and his crew, who mutinied on HMS Bounty in 1789.

Only 45 people on the Island and they want to arrest 7 of them for something that happened several decades ago?

I don't agree with that.

According to this site link, they haven't even had a baby born on that Island for seventeen years.

According to this chart, link, quite a few countries still have 12 -14 as their age of consent.

I have to dissagree, I had sex when I was 13, so does that make me a child molester, or a normal lad who wanted to have sex with his 13 year old girlfriend.... I think I would go with the second answer..... so just out of curiosty how old were some of you lot when you lost your virginity, and then with those answers we will determin weather you knew what you was doing, I know I wanted sex.

Originally posted by slank
*putting on asbestose flame suit*
This is where anthropology collides with most modern cultural norms.

Before people become too hysterical, they should keep in mind that the average pre-history human lifespan and even in early history was MUCH MUCH shorter. For the species to survive sex would have probably under many circumstances started at puberty. In Roman times the average Roman lived to be 30.
Do the Math. To have a kid at 15 and raise them to be 15 years old would leave you with an 'adult' child of 15 on your deathbed.

In pre-history while some people lived longer than 30 a great number may have lived shorter lives than that.

I also realize some people due to religious beliefs think we were created by magic aroung 5000 years ago.

I am not saying we should abandon all of our cultural beliefs. As we have become in many places on the globe a far longer lived species it makes sense to extend childhood and assist the young in waiting to have sex until somewhat later. But to start wielding the Moral Meat-axe without some consideration would be a gross display of ignorance.
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I was going to bring that opinion to the table as well, but I see you've already done so slank...culture has to be taken into consideration here...this isn't America we're talking about, we have different laws that govern our society...

On a similar note, MacKiller - I'm kind of curious as to where this story came from...I don't see any links our sources...

[edit on 9/29/2004 by EnronOutrunHomerun]

Maybe it's just me but it looks we are mixing apples and oranges here. The girl in the article is quoted as saying "I was 13...I felt like a big lady." To me this is saying that it was akin to playing house or pretend and that this girl was manipulated into the act. I hear common statements from victims of pedophilia who are conditioned similiarly.

This does not appear to be a cultural tradition but more of "no other options." My great grandmother was a 13 year old bride as the result of an arranged marriage (worldwatcher mentions this also). They key difference seems to be marriage - this story seems to be more like an organized pedophilia ring.

With that said is the practice still on-going?
Doesn't the UK have a statute of limitations for prosecuting old crimes?
Why now?

Interesting.

But even in the US, this happens, maybe not from tradition though.


Example,.. Every Day in Georgia ...

40 school age girls (age 10-17) get pregnant
30 school age girls (age 10-17) have babies (meaning 25% of these girls end up having an abortion.)

health.state.ga.us...
(5 year old report, but I doubt the numbers change much today.)

Several years ago, I heard a reported stat that suggested a particular county with a large population, over 70% of High School age females either had a child, or an abortion.

I think what makes the numbers stand out so much in Pitcairn is the reletive small size of the community, and the historical notoriety. I would also think that maybe the adult men should of had a higher level of morality. But on the other side, sex and pregnancy at those ages seems to occur at alarming numbers worldwide.

Originally posted by Bleys They key difference seems to be marriage - this story seems to be more like an organized pedophilia ring.

With that said is the practice still on-going?
Doesn't the UK have a statute of limitations for prosecuting old crimes?
Why now?

There's only nine people on the Island who are under 18 and six of them are age 7 or younger. It won't be hard to interview everyone and find out if it's still happening.

Here's a list of all the people on the Island (less than 50) Who's who on Pictairn

Only about 5 different families on this island, seems like everybody is related, some way or another. This is sick, I can only imagine (and I don't wish to) the other sick and disturbing things that do down on this island.

96 sex charges, what is wrong with these people? Thats about 14 sex charges each. And the women of the island are fighting the charges because they don't want to lose their longboats. Well, I think the women need to take control of the long boats, because the men belong in jail, for a long, long time.

Wow, now i know that i'm still imature. Women......longboats....lol..errrrrrr never mind.

This is quite the atrophy and these men should face harsh punishment; reverting to "cultural relativism" is a copout.

Deep

Maybe I belong on an Island, I was in the 4th grade when I made it with the Nugent Sisters in a corrugated metal lumber shack in the field next to the house. We all loved it, lasted about four hours as I recall.
We never talked about the incident after that, strange. I wonder what they are doing now
I should tell you about after WOODSTOCK, Oh Man

Obviously sex at an early age is wrong in a society like ours where the goal is to become economically independent and educated by about age 22 and then think about family, but for the past 300,000 years people have traditionally been married at the onset of puberty.

Actually, I just re-read the article. What a crock of #! It's the British government about to wipe out the island's population. And look at all the people cheeing them on. Man I hate this modern world sometimes.

[edit on 29-9-2004 by taibunsuu]

Do any governments even own this Island? If it does do the residents even pay taxes? Recieve government funding? Have access to modern civilization? If this is some isolated island that is primitive in culture and whatnot, what business is it of the modern global community to invade their culture and judge their traditions? They arent living off of taxpayer money or destabalizing a modern community. I say let them be. I am not supporting pedophila or whatever but I think we really have no business in these peoples lives.
I assume some nice natural resources in profitable quantities were probably discovered on this island and they had to get rid of the inhabitants in order to exploit them. I suggest we watch any activity on the island after this case is over.

i have to agree w/DYepes...........what is to become of the island after the men get tried and most presumably are found guilty? do the women get relocated if they cant run the island? are others allowed to move there who arent originally from there and help to keep the island going? or does the govt come in seize the island (maybe in the name of its own security) and set up shop. hmmmm.......this will be interesting to see what happens

I want to know how the men cannot be tried if the 'victims' are not pressing charges. It sounds like a load of BS to me. And how old were these guys at the times of the alleged crimes? These people are not living in the type of society we are used to here in the States.

"""""British law forbids having sex with a girl under 16. """"

If your an adult you shouldn't be having sex with a 16 year old child either.