George Zimmerman to be charged in Trayvon Martin shooting, official says

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
the only crime trayvon was that he looked like a "suspicious thug". i guess some people would like every "suspicious looking thug" followed and harrased. newsflash this is not the wild wild west or the jim crow law south.

No, the crime was if/when Trayvon physically assaulted a man for following him. It is NOT a crime to follow somebody you think is suspicious, it may be stupid but not illegal.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


That was exactly what I was about to say but you said it clearer...All of the media backlash and speculation would've probably still occured but to a smaller extent if the SPD wouldve just arrested him like they shouldve.

reply to post by ButterCookie


Not picking on you or anything. And I say this at the risk of sounding racist (which I am most definitely not.)

But I don't feel sorry for all those black kids being killed... It's a culture issue, and until that issue is solved from within, there is frankly nothing that can be done. This is what happens when you allow your children to think doing anything to make money, including selling drugs, and violent acts is ok, because in the end you made money to put food on the table.

The problem is not with the lack of action by anybody but the parents of these kids that are doing the killing (not always the ones being killed, but some of the time at least.) Is it tragic yes... it's tragic that this particular culture encourages this type of behavior.

Originally posted by votan
reply to post by anon72

 

I am still very confused as to where to stand on this case

Me too! I don't think all the facts have been disseminated yet. Although I'll admit, I haven't followed this as closely as other members have.

reply to post by 27jd


unless of course Zimmerman pushed him first. Or brandished his weapon. If GZ's gun was even slightly exposed, TM like any regular person would try and disarm his stalker. Even if it was by accident, the fact that he was carrying a weapon, following a suspicious character, and didnt listen to the dispatcher proves he was the aggressor and Trayvon was acting in self-defense.

reply to post by GmoS719


Yeah especially when its a child.

Originally posted by Abstrakt305
reply to post by 27jd

 

unless of course Zimmerman pushed him first. Or brandished his weapon. If GZ's gun was even slightly exposed, TM like any regular person would try and disarm his stalker. Even if it was by accident, the fact that he was carrying a weapon, following a suspicious character, and didnt listen to the dispatcher proves he was the aggressor and Trayvon was acting in self-defense.

I agree with you. Kids today are raised from birth to be wary of strangers. Here's this guy (with an SUV - big enough to throw a body in) - - following you at night in the rain. Tell me Trayvon's adrenaline was not "sparking on overload".

I do think it was an accident - - but definitely not one that would have happened if Zimmerman had waited in his car of the police.

Zimmerman did - by his actions - create the situation for all to transpire.

Originally posted by 27jd

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
the only crime trayvon was that he looked like a "suspicious thug". i guess some people would like every "suspicious looking thug" followed and harrased. newsflash this is not the wild wild west or the jim crow law south.

No, the crime was if/when Trayvon physically assaulted a man for following him. It is NOT a crime to follow somebody you think is suspicious, it may be stupid but not illegal.

too bad he lied to the 911 dispatcher when he said he was going to stop following him. its ok the prosecutor believes they have a strong enough case to warrant a 2nd degree murder charge, as did the original prosecutor. so dont go and say they are just trying to appease "black people". i repeat this is not the wild west or jim crow south. armed idiots shouldnt be following "suspicious looking thugs" or "suspicious white power looking thugs" or "suspicious hillbilly looking thugs" or "suspicious cartel looking thugs" or "suspicious gay looking thugs" if you see something get as best of a description as possible and report it. that is all a neighborhood watchmen is supposed to do, he is not supposed to turn into deputy doofus and try and follow and aprehend anyone who hasnt even commited a crime.

zimmerman is an ingnorant idiot. too bad ignorance is no excuse for the law. i dont want to hang the guy, in my opinion he should admit his guilt and reach out to trayvons parents, al sharpton and the black community to ask for forgiveness, but no he reaches out to hannity. think about it for one second if he doe not do this its a lose lose for him, if he gets off the price will still be on his head, if he goes to jail they will have to keep him in solitary confinement.

What is your definition of neighborhood watch? What part of watching the neighborhood do you not get? If I see somebody walking with a hoody up in the rain at night, which you cant even see his race at that point...I would pay attention at least as I went by, to say your all trusting of all people no matter how they look at any time of day and location is well stupid. Maybe alot of you are not old enough to own your own house and appreciate your city and neighborhood, but it takes hard work and community to keep it that way, they had break ins just before. This does not mean he deserved to be shot, so dont even think about twisting it that way. But to say that might, just might not look suspicious is only lying to us and yourself, or just to us. There is lots of room between paranoid and naive, sorry you cant trust everyone and there are tons of deaths and attacks , way more than this self defense type happen every day. If your not smart on the street, and be aware of your surroundings, your asking for trouble. So stop with the whole he didnt even need to even look in his direction crap and work more towards what happened after the fact would be my advice.

Originally posted by Abstrakt305
unless of course Zimmerman pushed him first. Or brandished his weapon. If GZ's gun was even slightly exposed, TM like any regular person would try and disarm his stalker. Even if it was by accident, the fact that he was carrying a weapon, following a suspicious character, and didnt listen to the dispatcher proves he was the aggressor and Trayvon was acting in self-defense.

Absolutely, but those are 'ifs'. We'll have to wait and see what facts come out, there's a time period in this case where all we have is speculation from both sides.

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
too bad he lied to the 911 dispatcher when he said he was going to stop following him.

You have evidence to prove that? If so, than you definitely have more info on this case than the rest of the public and should definitely present that to the prosecutor.

so dont go and say they are just trying to appease "black people".

Ummm, when did I say that? I think you may have me confused with somebody else.

Originally posted by Libertygal

Originally posted by pizzanazi75
reply to post by Libertygal

 

1. Is that all you could come up with?

2. Don't talk about things you admittedly don't know about. I do know where the body was. It has been reported. If you followed this case you would know that.

3. Alot of facts are known, you are choosing to ignore them to defend a child killer. You can keep say emotional this and that, it doesn't change the facts or the case or how little you know about it or the fact that you are making all types of assumptions to fit your 'facts' to defend a child killer.

4. He let the others speak for him. You can call that what you want. Still doesn't change the fact you don't know if he trust his new lawyer or not, your assuming that.

Is that all you can come up with?

Personal attacks?

I thought that wasn't allowed?

I answered each of your questions, point for point in a polite fashion, yet in the end all you can do is attempt to insult me?

I think, once again, my words speak for themselves.

I do consider myself to be fairly neutral in this, which is one reason up untill the past few days I have chosen to remain silent, and then chose this thread to articipate in. It seemed rather neutral until you started with the mudslinging.

I have a huge amount of empathy for the Martins, as well as the Zimmermans. Both families are suffering terribly, and I wouldn't wish anyone to have to suffer their pain. Again, I have stated this multiple times, so I couldn't care less how you view me. My words speak for themselves.

I don't take sides.

I am intrigued by the laws involved and how the case will play out in court.

I am interested in the legal findings, and I refuse to play into your emotional blackmail.

Find someone else to play your games, I am done responding kindly to you hence, I am done responding at all to you.

edit on 12-4-2012 by Libertygal because: (no reason given)

If anyone on here has played games its you. You have left your trail for all to see. It is obvious you have picked sides. You can try and sit up on your pedistool and act like you haven't made personal attacks and tried to derail the subject.

I smile that you know longer want to talk to me. That means I am doing something right. You can't defend you ridiculous points so you run.

Run Forest Run.

Originally posted by Annee
I agree with you. Kids today are raised from birth to be wary of strangers. Here's this guy (with an SUV - big enough to throw a body in) - - following you at night in the rain. Tell me Trayvon's adrenaline was not "sparking on overload".

But instead of hanging up with his girlfriend, and calling 9-1-1...he decided to confront the man himself. They both made stupid decisions, from what I can tell, and turned the situation into a life and death struggle for both of them. It's a very unfortunate thing all around, even if Zimmerman gets off on self defense, he's gonna be in danger for a long time to come.

Originally posted by 27jd

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
too bad he lied to the 911 dispatcher when he said he was going to stop following him.

You have evidence to prove that? If so, than you definitely have more info on this case than the rest of the public and should definitely present that to the prosecutor.

so dont go and say they are just trying to appease "black people".

Ummm, when did I say that? I think you may have me confused with somebody else.

911 told him we dont need you to follow him, he says ok. its on the 911 call if you havent heard. please do not twist those words around, zimmerman did not say ok sarcastically he said it like he was going to follow the 911 operators instructions but he didnt. any other explanation for that would be weaseling out of the facts.

as for the second part of my post, you didnt say it i was jumping the gun as to what your response might have been and i apologize for that.

Originally posted by Wiz4769
What is your definition of neighborhood watch? What part of watching the neighborhood do you not get? If I see somebody walking with a hoody up in the rain at night, which you cant even see his race at that point...I would pay attention at least as I went by, to say your all trusting of all people no matter how they look at any time of day and location is well stupid. Maybe alot of you are not old enough to own your own house and appreciate your city and neighborhood, but it takes hard work and community to keep it that way, they had break ins just before. This does not mean he deserved to be shot, so dont even think about twisting it that way. But to say that might, just might not look suspicious is only lying to us and yourself, or just to us. There is lots of room between paranoid and naive, sorry you cant trust everyone and there are tons of deaths and attacks , way more than this self defense type happen every day. If your not smart on the street, and be aware of your surroundings, your asking for trouble. So stop with the whole he didnt even need to even look in his direction crap and work more towards what happened after the fact would be my advice.

do you run out and yell at kids that walk on your grass too? what other kinds of things would make you suspicious of someone? skateboarders? emo kids? gay people? long haired hippy types? tatooed white guys? bearded confederate flag waving types? if a hooded guy walks past your house do you run to the door and stare him down til you are absolutely sure he is not commiting a crime? my definition of neighborhood watch is if you see something suspicious report it. it does not mean canvas your neighborhood while carrying a concealed weapon and following anyone unless maybe if you witness them commiting a crime.

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
911 told him we dont need you to follow him, he says ok. its on the 911 call if you havent heard.

Yes, Zimmerman said okay. And according to him he was headed back to his SUV when Trayvon confronted him. Which seems to correspond with what his girlfriend said, that Trayvon said he was going to confront him. And again, the 9-1-1 rep did not issue a lawful command, he was under no obligation to follow their suggestion anymore than if a credit card customer service rep made it. Saying we don't need you to do something, isn't the same as saying don't do something. Citizens are empowered to make arrests, although according to Zimmerman he was not pursuing him from that point, I wasn't there so I don't know, but what I do know is whomever initiated physical contact first, was who was most responsible for the incident. We don't know who that was for sure one way or the other.

Originally posted by Cosmic911
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

Zimmerman was lawfully in possession of his gun and had the permits required by law in order to carry and conceal it.

Hey X!

I do believe he was in violation of his Neighborhood Watch P&P by carrying a weapon, however, be it gun or knife, or whatever.

A neighborhood watch program can set down policies however they do not trump state law. If the watch policy is no guns and a person who is part of the watch violates it by carrying a gun the person is only violating a watch policy and not a law.

Originally posted by 27jd

But instead of hanging up with his girlfriend, and calling 9-1-1...he decided to confront the man himself.

Too me that is the most ridiculous response ever.

You honestly think a scared 17 year old boy only a few houses from his destination is going to call 911?

A 17 year old boy who's scared - - high on adrenaline - - is suppose to think logically - - hang up on his girlfriend who in his mind is a safety line/connection? He did what his girlfriend told him to do. He ran. And that's when Zimmerman took off after him.

And he did not CHOOSE to confront Zimmerman. He was trying to get away from Zimmerman. Zimmerman confronted him. According to the map and known information.

How old are you? Are you honestly going to tell me - - if you were in Trayvon's position - - - you would have thought logically - - hung up on someone who knew what was going on and dialed 911?

Originally posted by 27jd

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
911 told him we dont need you to follow him, he says ok. its on the 911 call if you havent heard.

Yes, Zimmerman said okay. And according to him he was headed back to his SUV when Trayvon confronted him. Which seems to correspond with what his girlfriend said, that Trayvon said he was going to confront him. And again, the 9-1-1 rep did not issue a lawful command, he was under no obligation to follow their suggestion anymore than if a credit card customer service rep made it. Saying we don't need you to do something, isn't the same as saying don't do something. Citizens are empowered to make arrests, although according to Zimmerman he was not pursuing him from that point, I wasn't there so I don't know, but what I do know is whomever initiated physical contact first, was who was most responsible for the incident. We don't know who that was for sure one way or the other.

weaseling out of it. lets say you call 911 to tell them you found someone choking and they tell you to perform the heimlich you say ok but dont do it because it is not a lawful command? you said ok!!! plus if zim was heading back to his car how the hell was the altercation behind some house far away from his truck? he got out of his car to check a street sign, 911 tells him we dont need you to follow him, he says ok, he supposedly is walking back to his car but somehow ends up fighting for his life behind the building in someones back yard? arguing this and assuming this and that is getting really old, i just cant wait til all the facts are laid out in court. like i said before both prosecutors involved in this case felt they had sufficent evidence to charge zim, i will give them the benefit of the doubt.