"If I had a son, he'd look like Trayvon." - Obama. What the MSM isn't telling you.

reply to post by Kali74


Okay well lets drop the jumped out of a bush part then. How about the rest of my post?

reply to post by Chalupas

Obama himself has come forward and compared Martin to his own children, and even his son if he had one. The MSM is only using his 7th grade graduation photo.

Prove it, I keep hearing it but I see no proof same as with the witness who says Martin was on top of Zimmerman, and even if he was...if some guy was checking you out then you run away and he chases you...wouldn't you defend yourself? Zimmerman provoked the entire thing.

Originally posted by TheOneElectric
reply to post by Chalupas

 

Hey you, I don't care if it was a 42 year old man shot. Zimmerman is clearly wrong and infringed upon another person's personal liberties to the point where a life was lost. There is no defending that. If Zimmerman minded his business and tried not to be The Batman, then one less life would have been lost on that day and the police would have handled the situation.

But no, please do defend this infringement. Because I swear to god, when the illuminati comes for you and sends you to the FEMA camps I don't want to hear any complaints. (humor, folks, humor...but you get the point)

Zimmerman did not infringe upon anyone's personal liberties. Neighborhood watch commitees are set up and agreed upon by the nieghboorhood. It was Zimmerman's duty to question Martin as to why he was out so late on a rainy day. Zimmerman in no way tried to act like Batman; Zimmerman was simply doing his job. Zimmerman tried calling the polie.

No one is talking about FEMA or illuminati -- just you.

Originally posted by xEphon

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon
I agree with the previous posters.

If I was walking alone at night and someone started following me, my first reaction would be "why the hell is this dude following me??"

If the person continued to follow me I would likely attack him considering following a person at night, who is alone, is aggressive behavior!

Being a neighborhood watchman is irrelevant. This person was in no position of authority and thus became the aggressor who ended up murdering someone.

Agressive behaviour would be attacking someone who is curious as to why you are walking alone at night and running from cars.

I would attack anyone who followed me around at night and who wasn't a cop. Sorry, but I just don't have the luxury of chatting up some stalker to find out if he was just 'curious' about me or not.

How about this. Go follow some people in the dead of the night and tell me how that works out for ya.

A normal person would do three of four things. Pick the one that Trayvon Martin did.

A) Stay calm and keep walking
B) Stop and say "Can I help you?"
C) Or go back inside
D) Attack them once they got out of their car

reply to post by mee30


I think Zimmerman was paranoid and had a vigilante complex and possibly subscribed to a racial stereotype and decided this one wasn't going to get away, I think Martin landed a few hits in self defense before the gun went off.

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by Chalupas

 

Obama himself has come forward and compared Martin to his own children, and even his son if he had one. The MSM is only using his 7th grade graduation photo.

Prove it, I keep hearing it but I see no proof same as with the witness who says Martin was on top of Zimmerman, and even if he was...if some guy was checking you out then you run away and he chases you...wouldn't you defend yourself? Zimmerman provoked the entire thing.

I'v told you to go read the official police reports, eye witness accoutns, evidence of assualt. You can't just blow that off.

And every news network is buzzing about what Obama said.

Sorry for double posting

reply to post by Chalupas


I have, and I've listened to the 911 tapes. I've seen interviews with eyewitnesses. What I haven't seen are the things I have called you out on in my last reply to you. Prove them, or are you just trolling and spreading hate?

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon
I agree with the previous posters.

If I was walking alone at night and someone started following me, my first reaction would be "why the hell is this dude following me??"

If the person continued to follow me I would likely attack him considering following a person at night, who is alone, is aggressive behavior!

Being a neighborhood watchman is irrelevant. This person was in no position of authority and thus became the aggressor who ended up murdering someone.

Agressive behaviour would be attacking someone who is curious as to why you are walking alone at night and running from cars.

I would attack anyone who followed me around at night and who wasn't a cop. Sorry, but I just don't have the luxury of chatting up some stalker to find out if he was just 'curious' about me or not.

How about this. Go follow some people in the dead of the night and tell me how that works out for ya.

A normal person would do three of four things. Pick the one that Trayvon Martin did.

A) Stay calm and keep walking
B) Stop and say "Can I help you?"
C) Or go back inside
D) Attack them once they got out of their car

Oh really? How many normal people do you know that go around following people at night?
You seem to not have any context here.
This wasn't some guy who was casually following this kid at the mall with tons of people around.
This was the dead of night where Zimmerman could have been just as likely a rapist, killer, or general psychopath, as he could have been a 'neighborhood watch' person.

Being followed when your alone at night but an unknown person, who is not a cop, can be considered aggressive behavior.

And since when are neighborhood watch supposed to chase down people? They're not the freaking police.

Like I said. Go follow some people in the middle of the night and see how they react.

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by Chalupas

 

I have, and I've listened to the 911 tapes. I've seen interviews with eyewitnesses. What I haven't seen are the things I have called you out on in my last reply to you. Prove them, or are you just trolling and spreading hate?

You asked for me to provide evidence of assualt -- I did.

You quoted my last post which said that MSM networks were using his old photo and that Obama has officially came out and compared Trayvon to his own children.

You asked for something different than what you were quoting. Your fault, but I apologize because I couldnt understand.

The proof of the latter is to go watch any MSM network.

reply to post by Chalupas


Well first question was he on the phone with the Cops the "whole" time he was following Martin?

Secondly, if the above is true can the police give the authority to a citizen to actively follow a suspect?

But I guess that second question is moot, due to the fact that the dispatcher told Zimmerman that he was not to follow the suspect. And I would believe a dispatcher is knowledgeable enough to know whether or not it is OK for a private citizen to initiate a police investigation.

So therefore Zimmerman is guilty of stalking and harassment. And possibly interfering with a police investigation.

reply to post by Kali74


Hold tight, you said there was no proof that he jumped out of a bush and I dropped that. Do you have any proof that he was paranoid? Do you have any proof he wanted to be a vigilante? Would a vigilante even call the police? Is there any proof it was racially motivated? Is there any proof that trayvon hit out in self defense? I take self defense as being attacked btw, not just followed. So is there any proof that zimmerman hit out first?

Would you be "paranoid" if you had multiple break ins in your area? Or if someone was standing outside at night staring at you? Would a scared teenager stand there staring at someone? Again that seems odd and doesn't really fit.

Originally posted by xEphon

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon
I agree with the previous posters.

If I was walking alone at night and someone started following me, my first reaction would be "why the hell is this dude following me??"

If the person continued to follow me I would likely attack him considering following a person at night, who is alone, is aggressive behavior!

Being a neighborhood watchman is irrelevant. This person was in no position of authority and thus became the aggressor who ended up murdering someone.

Agressive behaviour would be attacking someone who is curious as to why you are walking alone at night and running from cars.

I would attack anyone who followed me around at night and who wasn't a cop. Sorry, but I just don't have the luxury of chatting up some stalker to find out if he was just 'curious' about me or not.

How about this. Go follow some people in the dead of the night and tell me how that works out for ya.

A normal person would do three of four things. Pick the one that Trayvon Martin did.

A) Stay calm and keep walking
B) Stop and say "Can I help you?"
C) Or go back inside
D) Attack them once they got out of their car

Oh really? How many normal people do you know that go around following people at night?
You seem to not have any context here.
This wasn't like some guy was casually following this kid at the mall with tons of people around.
This was the dead of night where Zimmerman could have been just as likely a rapist, killer, or general psychopath, as he could have been a 'neighborhood watch' person.

And since when are neighborhood watch supposed to chase down people? They're not the freaking police.

Like I said. Go follow some people in the middle of the night and see how they react.

It has happened to me. I went running at midnight (a hobby of mine) and got stopped by a truck that had been following me for half a block. My answer to their question was that I was just running.

Was I scared? Yes

Did I run or attack him? No.

Originally posted by mee30
reply to post by MrWendal

 

I do see your points and they are very good ones... I would also like your perspective given that you are involved in neighborhood watch.

Has your area had multiple break ins? If yes, have the suspects gotten away? Or have they been apprehended?

If no, how would your 'watching' change as a result of multiple break ins?

How would your watching change (if at all) if your neighbors had been broken into and no-one has been apprehended?

Yes I live in an area that has a fair amount of break ins. Just 3 weeks ago I had to call Police because of some suspicious people who I believed were checking places for a future target. The guys I watched were actually walking up to doors and knocking on them. If someone answered, the man was claiming that he was selling magazines. The problem I had was #1. No one goes door to door to sell magazines at 10pm at night. #2. He was ignoring any home with lights on. #3 He passed up my neighbor who was outside working on a truck. #4. He had a car up the street with 2 others in it. #5 He had a look out who was walking with him and farther down the road.

I watched them, I found out what they were doing, then I called the police with all the information they would need to check these guys out. At no time is it wise to approach suspicious people. They could be armed. They could be dangerous. Most importantly, I was suspicious and rightfully so, but they had not committed a crime that would require me to defend anything. The cops did come before they left. He pulled them over when they all were in the car pulling away to leave. The Police did not arrest anyone because there was no crime, but they came to the same conclusion I had come to. They were looking for a future target, and that is also not a crime. Since the would be robbers got checked out by police before they could even get off my street, neither I nor the police expect them to be back. If you get caught looking for a place to rob, you will more than likely get caught when you decide to rob the place. That makes the risk too high. Any robber will tell you, the whole point is to get away afterwards.

There has also been situations where people have successfully robbed some one here. Just last summer the person right across the street from me was robbed, in broad daylight, and I missed it all. However, that changes nothing as far as the watch. You can't catch everyone and you can not see every thing. All you can do is be aware and pay attention. This robbery occurred at a time when I would normally be sleeping. I watch at night, I am up at night due to my work schedule. During the day I sleep. All it meant was others in my area who are up during the day need to pay more attention.

The person who committed this robbery was eventually caught, and the story actually proved that the successful robbery had nothing to do with the neighborhood watch and was more than likely something that would not have been prevented. The person who committed the robbery lived next door to the victim. He also knew I would be asleep. He had parked his truck between the two homes (which was also normal for him) and used the truck as cover while he moved things out of the victims home. The victim and the robber were also good friends. It was common to see them coming in and out of each others homes.

Now couldn't trayvon have ran away if he was a scared teenager? If I had some lump following me I think I'd have just legged it. I certainly wouldn't jump out of a bush and attack the guy! It strikes me as odd behaviour for someone that is scared. As is standing there and staring.

He did run away. Zimmerman at first followed him in a car before eventually getting out and following on foot.

I think if zimmerman just wanted to kill someone he wouldn't have called the police at all... On the audio you provided he also sounded kind of calm but concerned, wouldn't you be if you had multiple break ins in your area?

I do not think Zimmerman went out with the intention to shoot this kid. I do believe Zimmerman was overzealous and forgot that it is not his job to prevent crime. It is his job to report it. It is his duty to watch, gather details, and report it to police. That's it. Zimmerman is a private citizen, so was Trayvon, Zimmerman has no right asking anyone what they are doing in a public place and initiating a confrontation.

In the first scenario I mention with the 4 guys, 2 in a car and 1 lookout. Even if they did break into a home that night, it would have been too dangerous for me to confront them. I would have let them rob the place, but while they did it I would be getting descriptions as well as the license plate number of the get away car. Property can be replaced and recovered. You cant bring back life once it is taken.

reply to post by Chalupas


Until Zimmerman alerted authorities and Mr.Martin of his intent, it fits the definition as far as Mr.Martin could put together.
law.findlaw.com...

With the knowledge of kidnappings and random murders that occur from weirdos following people when they are alone, any reasonable person would be frightened. Mr. Martin was raised in a culture that rightfully taught him to be frightened of pursuing strangers that are not figures of legitimate authority.

www.law.cornell.edu...

Amendment IV The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Yes, it's so that the Government and States (14th) don't infringe on the right...but the spirit is obviously there adn intended for the individual as well.

I'm absolutely sure that we don't have an expected right to privacy. Hell, Zimmerman wasn't even a lawful authority figure. He was following the young man after being INSTRUCTED TO DO OTHERWISE BY THE 911 OPERATOR. He then invaded the youngman's personal space. Anyone knows, and anyone tells their little girls or young boys not to allow your pursuer to get too close or bad things can happen, even if they are just "questioning why you are in a certain place." Never let the pursuer get close. This sticks with you for life after all of those horrible child kidnapping cases became popular. No one wants to end up in the back of a trunk or stabbed because you gave someone the authority to enter your personal space for a nice explanation of why you're walking at night.

Who was Zimmerman to engage in this activity that infringed upon personal sovereignty? Who was Zimmerman to take this to the length that it resulted in the death of a living breathing human being.

You all forget what happened here. A person died...not over money, not over food, but over "maybe he's doing something wrong because he doesn't look like he belongs here"

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon

Originally posted by Chalupas

Originally posted by xEphon
I agree with the previous posters.

If I was walking alone at night and someone started following me, my first reaction would be "why the hell is this dude following me??"

If the person continued to follow me I would likely attack him considering following a person at night, who is alone, is aggressive behavior!

Being a neighborhood watchman is irrelevant. This person was in no position of authority and thus became the aggressor who ended up murdering someone.

Agressive behaviour would be attacking someone who is curious as to why you are walking alone at night and running from cars.

I would attack anyone who followed me around at night and who wasn't a cop. Sorry, but I just don't have the luxury of chatting up some stalker to find out if he was just 'curious' about me or not.

How about this. Go follow some people in the dead of the night and tell me how that works out for ya.

A normal person would do three of four things. Pick the one that Trayvon Martin did.

A) Stay calm and keep walking
B) Stop and say "Can I help you?"
C) Or go back inside
D) Attack them once they got out of their car

Oh really? How many normal people do you know that go around following people at night?
You seem to not have any context here.
This wasn't like some guy was casually following this kid at the mall with tons of people around.
This was the dead of night where Zimmerman could have been just as likely a rapist, killer, or general psychopath, as he could have been a 'neighborhood watch' person.

And since when are neighborhood watch supposed to chase down people? They're not the freaking police.

Like I said. Go follow some people in the middle of the night and see how they react.

It has happened to me. I went running at midnight (a hobby of mine) and got stopped by a truck that had been following me for half a block. My answer to their question was that I was just running.

Was I scared? Yes

Did I run or attack him? No.

Was I scared? Yes

Thank you for proving my point.

If this was a Gated Community wouldn't people there have some kind of "Pass" to get in?

Also, as to the voice screaming for help......
The Voice can be analyzed to determine whose voice it is.
Have they done that?

Trayvon is not such and innocent "child", it seems.

What really bothers me is Obama commenting about this at all. He should have said, "Yes I heard about the story and it's a tragedy, that's all I am going to say about that." Anytime a black person is involved the media flocks to Al Sharpton, Obama, Spike Lee, etc. Who do they go to when the blacks gun down a White person for "being in the wrong neighborhood"?

Originally posted by Openeye
reply to post by Chalupas

 

Well first question was he on the phone with the Cops the "whole" time he was following Martin?

Secondly, if the above is true can the police give the authority to a citizen to actively follow a suspect?

But I guess that second question is moot, due to the fact that the dispatcher told Zimmerman that he was not to follow the suspect. And I would believe a dispatcher is knowledgeable enough to know whether or not it is OK for a private citizen to initiate a police investigation.

So therefore Zimmerman is guilty of stalking and harassment. And possibly interfering with a police investigation.

The dispatcher has no authority. Therefore, Zimmerman was not obligated to listen, no matter how knowledgeable either party is. Zimmerman only called the police after Martin begun to flee. No investigation was underway, so your last point is invalid. Zimmerman is not guily of stalking because it was his duty as watchman to investigate any suspicous activity, and the only harassment Zimmerman commited was asking Trayvon what he was doing out so late.

reply to post by Irish614


It doesn't even matter at this point because that's MSM bull#. The most important fact is that Zimmerman played Batman and infringed on someone's rights to personal sovereignty and privacy to the point where he stalked and eventually killed the individual.

It shouldn't have happened. It goes against the spirit of our nation. Zimmerman must be brought to some arbitrary idea of justice where in which he atones for his actions.

reply to post by Chalupas


Self appointed watchmen. I swear to, you people are going to regret your words in the future. Watch it, buddy. Watch your words and see how fascist they sound.

abcnews.go.com...-qAg

Gated Community. Gated Community. His father lived there. Jesus Christ. This isn't even about race, the law, or anything else. This is now about individual liberties. This is about right and wrong. Zimmerman was wrong. There is no if ands or buts about it. I don't care about anything else, but if you all defend these self appointed committees you're on a slippery slope towards nonsense.