Trade Professional (RE: Ancient Monuments): "I can not build even one wall. Here's a theory."

Originally posted by Cataclysm
I'm not sure what you mean, Harte, that the King's Chamber ceiling stones were not required to be lifted off the ground completely into the air.

The ceiling stones are estimated to weigh 70 tons.

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The King's Chamber is approximately 150 feet above ground level.

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The Grand Gallery was used as the ramp to move those stones up.

Look at your own posted picture.

Originally posted by Cataclysm

And, in terms of having to be lifted, the three (3) massive foundation stones at Baalbek (estimated to weigh 800 to 1200 tons) were placed on top of other large stones, which require some lifting.

The quarry is at a higher elevation than those stones, which were, BTW, placed there by the Romans.

Harte

I only came across this thread now All the images are gone

Would love to see the OP updated, looks like a great read (200 flags too, wow!)

reply to post by Harte


Hey there Harte.
I know you were talking about obelisks. I was acknowledging the fact that with simple leverage it is possible to get one erected. I was only saying that some ancient monuments have precision fits, which means the assembly was too clean for ropes, straps, wooden or sand ramps.

If there is some misunderstanding, sorry

Originally posted by shadowland8
I only came across this thread now

All the images are gone

Would love to see the OP updated, looks like a great read (200 flags too, wow!)

Yeah, sorry about that. I'm away from my p.c. until later. I'll have all the images back up within 7-8 hours. Sorry for the inconvenience

reply to post by Sahabi


thanks
very good thread
ive been very interested in this subject matter since i was a kid and ive more recently come to many of the same conclusions you have
theres really no avoiding it. there was most likely a more advanced civilization on this planet at some point in the past....i try....and try and try....and i will never say the time was wasted but i have spent a lot trying to conceive some possible explanation as to how ancient man could have built these structures with the lack of technology and knowledge that weve been taught they had

there is a lot of information that has been lost or buried for one reason or another

these are fantastic opportunities being ignored
our predecessors went to fantastic lengths to preserve this information and its incredibly arrogant to assume we know everything better merely because the planet has worked around the sun a few between their rule and ours

if i had the money and resources i know what i would be doing (but i dont so i dig on the web )

Originally posted by Sahabi
reply to post by Harte

 

Hey there Harte.
I know you were talking about obelisks. I was acknowledging the fact that with simple leverage it is possible to get one erected. I was only saying that some ancient monuments have precision fits, which means the assembly was too clean for ropes, straps, wooden or sand ramps.

If there is some misunderstanding, sorry

Using a sand (or dirt, or clay) ramp wouldn't mean that there would be sand (or dirt, or clay) trapped between stones in places like Sacsayhuaman.

Harte

"You remember only one deluge, though there have been many.You and your fellow citizens are descended from the few survivors that remained, but you know nothing about it because so many succeeding generations left no record in writing. the ...change in the rising and setting of the sun and the other heavenly bodies, how in those times they used to set where they now rise, and used to rise where they now set"

- Critias by Plato

reply to post by Harte


The subject being discussed is Baalbek.

The quarry is at a higher elevation than those stones

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The quarry is not located at a higher elevation. It is located in somewhat of a depression.
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In the background, on a slightly higher elevation, portions of the temple can be seen.

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[The stones] were, BTW, placed there by the Romans.

The foundation stones were there when Alexander the Great arrived, long before the Romans built on top of the Greek temple.
vejprty.com...

Originally posted by jlm912
Humans are ancient, indeed. I believe if there were aliens, they were probably us. Or we were them. But not in the genetically engineered species context. If we were the result of something like that, it would bring into question their motives. Make us smarter? More physically developed for manual labor? Neither make sense, unless they miserably failed and then up and abandoned us as such a failure...

www.world-mysteries.com...

based on The Cosmic Code: The Sixth Book of The Earth Chronicles
by Zecharia Sitchin
Events Before the Deluge

450,000 years ago,
On Nibiru, a distant member of our solar system, life faces slow extinction as the planet's atmosphere erodes. Deposed by Anu, the ruler Alalu escapes in a spaceship and finds refuge on Earth. He discovers that Earth has gold that can be used to protect Nibiru's atmosphere.

445,000
Led by Enki, a son of Anu, the Anunnaki land on Earth, establish Eridu -Earth Station I - for extracting gold from the waters of the Persian Gulf.

430,000
Earth's climate mellows. More Anunnaki arrive on Earth, among them Enki's half-sister Ninhursag, Chief Medical Officer.

416,000
As gold production falters, Anu arrives on Earth with Enlil, the heir apparent. It is decided to obtain the vital gold by mining it in southern Africa. Drawing lots, Enlil wins command of Earth Mission; Enki is relegated to Africa. On departing Earth, Anu is challenged by Alalu's grandson.

400,000
Seven functional settlements in southern Mesopotamia include a Spaceport (Sippar), Mission Control Center (Nippur), a metallurgical center (Shuruppak). The ores arrive by ships from Africa; the refined metal is sent aloft to orbiters manned by Igigi, then transferred to spaceships arriving periodically from Nibiru.

380,000
Gaining the support of the Igigi, Alalu's grandson attempts to seize mastery over Earth. The Enlilites win the War of the Olden Gods.

300,000
The Anunnaki toiling in the gold mines mutiny. Enki and Ninhursag create Primitive Workers through genetic manipulation of Ape woman; they take over the manual chores of the Anunnaki. Enlil raids the mines, brings the Primitive Workers to the Edin in Mesopotamia. Given the ability to procreate, Homo Sapiens begins to multiply.

200,000
Life on Earth regresses during a new glacial period.

100,000
Climate warms again. The Anunnaki (the biblical Nefilim), to Enlil's growing annoyance marry the daughters of Man.

75,000
The "accursation of Earth" - a new Ice Age-begins. Regressive types of Man roam the Earth . Cro-Magnon man survives.

49,000
Enki and Ninhursag elevate humans of Anunnaki parentage to rule in Shuruppak. Enlil, enraged. plots Mankind's demise.

13,000
Realizing that the passage of Nibiru in Earth's proximity will trigger an immense tidal wave, Enlil makes the Anunnaki swear to keep the impending calamity a secret from Mankind.

Events After the Deluge

11,000 B.C.
Enki breaks the oath, instructs Ziusudra/Noah to build a submersible ship. The Deluge sweeps over the Earth; the Anunnaki witness the total destruction from their orbiting spacecraft.

Enlil agrees to grant the remnants of Mankind implements and seeds; agriculture begins in the highlands. Enki domesticates animals.

10,500 B.C.
The descendants of Noah are allotted three regions. Ninurta, Enlil's foremost son, dams the mountains and drains the rivers to make Mesopotamia habitable; Enki reclaims the Nile valley. The Sinai peninsula is retained by the Anunnaki for a post-Diluvial spaceport; a control center is established on Mount Moriah (the future Jerusalem).

9,780 B.C.
Ra/Marduk, Enki's firstborn son, divides dominion over Egypt between Osiris and Seth.

9,330 B.C.
Seth seizes and dismembers Osiris, assumes sole rule over the Nile Valley.

8,970 B.C.
Horus avenges his father Osiris by launching the First Pyramid War. Seth escapes to Asia, seizes the Sinai peninsula and Canaan.

8,670 B.C.
Opposed to the resulting control of all the space facilities by Enki's descendants, the Enlilites launch the Second Pyramid War. The victorious Ninurta empties the Great Pyramid of its equipment.

Ninhursag, half-sister of Enki and Enlil, convenes peace conference. The division of Earth is reaffirmed. Rule over Egypt transferred from the Ra/Marduk dynasty to that of Thoth. Heliopolis built as a substitute Beacon City.

8,500 B.C.
The Anunnaki establish outposts at the gateway to the space facilities; Jericho is one of them.

7,400 B.C.
As the era of peace continues, the Anunnaki grant Mankind new advances; the Neolithic period begins. Demi-gods rule over Egypt.

3,800 B.C.
Urban civilization begins in Sumer as the Anunnaki reestablish there the Olden Cities, beginning with Eridu and Nippur.

Anu comes to Earth for a pageantful visit. A new city, Uruk (Erech), is built in his honor; he makes its temple the abode of his beloved granddaughter Inanna/lshtar.

the story answers all these mysteries around the world

reply to post by Flavian


so what kind of low tech do you suggest could lift a thousand tons? are you saying they had low tech steel cranes or just really big logs?

Opening Post Pictures are back up

Sorry again for the inconvenience

reply to post by bottleslingguy


Unfortunately all that fine Sitchin stuff is just made up. There is nothing in the Sumerian literature (without some serious bending) to support him and certainly no archaeological or other scientific evidence. What evidence there is points against his unevidenced claims

Originally posted by Shadow Herder
Man was as intelligent 10,000 years ago as he is today. There are many levels and modes of civilizations. Many civilizations lived in equilibrium with the earth like the other earthlings (animals) leaving no trace of their existence such as the tribes found in modern south america and Africa.

Today we have 'lost' tribes in brazil that have been living in that mode for thousands and thousands of years with little change. Oblivious that there is a mega city with cars, computers, cell phones, shopping hundreds of miles away.

I had to make this picture for it sums up what happened in the past as well.

When I watch this video I can help but think we are looking through a time warp into our distant past and we are the aliens to the,/

Become aware that super primitive and 'super advanced' civilizations can coexists without ever knowing about eachother for thousands of years. North america can rises and fall these tribes would barely feel a rumble.

What would happen if these people wrote and kept records and in 10000 years after a great destruction of the modern world, these are the only records found? Would they tell a story of sky people that were giants, Gods,

edit on 21-3-2012 by Shadow Herder because: (no reason given)

That story was found to be a hoax. Modern masons can reproduce any of the ancient structures. Masons don't work like machinists.

reply to post by RichieRay


Hey there RichieRay. Thanks for taking the time to reply. It also makes me wonder why and how various synchronicities occur between isolated cultures. Many theories exist to help describe such phenomena, such as a past globally interconnected society, the good old A.A. theory, and even that knowledge is simply hard-wired into our brains. Thanks again.


reply to post by torqpoc


I'm glad that you enjoyed the thread, and that it gave you a break from other topics. Thanks for the reply.

reply to post by kavaron


Atlanteans you say? Slayer69 has done some astoundingly beautiful research of the topic!
Origins of Atlantis/Lemuria Myths Part-1
Origins of Atlantis/Lemuria Myths Part-2

I highly suggest many of his other threads also. His work on ATS is brilliant.

reply to post by old_god


I bet in your engineering days you couldn't wait for them to end


reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


Howdy TruthxIsxInxThexMist. About those isolated tribes and villages.... I often times fantasize about living such a life! A small, tight-knit community where all do their fair share to contribute to the livelihood of the village, and there is a greater sense of trust, respect, and community. Maybe it's one of those "the grass is greener on the other side" kinda day dreams I don't know enough about Mars to make an opinion about its ancient past. but I do believe that there is a wide array of life throughout our universe. Thanks for the reply.


reply to post by old_god


I can definitely understand the fear aspect. For some reason, I find it a little chilling to realize that men living thousands of yours ago were neuron for neuron more intelligent than myself. Sure I have access to massive amounts of knowledge, still, their raw intellect seems to easily surpass that of my own. It is a little intimidating. This is probably one of the reasons that advanced extraterrestrials bring fear to many; the vulnerability of being inferior.


reply to post by lonewolf19792000


Hey there lonewolf19792000. Roger Morneau used to be a Luciferian. When he realized the unhappiness in his heart, he left the occult and became a Christian. He gave his testimony to warn others of the dangers he encountered with the spirit realm.


reply to post by the2ofusr1


Hello. Thanks for bringing the gap theory to my attention, I've never heard of it before. I'll look into it more when i can. On a side note, I believe the concept of your screen name


reply to post by butcherguy


Thank you for taking the time to reply. You say that what is missing from the animal world is tools, mechinization, and technology? Well, it has taken us roughly 10,000 years to crawl out of the caves and back into the state we find ourselves in today. Primates have created many stone and wooden tools on their own. If by chance they were given enough time and left alone in peace.. perhaps they too would slowly and gradually improve upon the crude tool use we see them using today. You say that ants can not create tanks to store their aphid juice? That may be true, but bees can


reply to post by MDDoxs


You've raised some great points MDDoxs! Thank you for posting. I don't have all of the answers, and neither does academia. Just because our ancestors were intellectually advanced, this doesn't mean that they would have progressed exactly as we have. Take a look at the different cultures around the world prior to colonization and modernization. Though there are similarities, there are also vast differences in their rates of development and what was accomplished by each culture. We have space craft today, but there are still tribesmen living out fully natural lives. Until more evidence is unearthed, all we can do is conjecture and speculate. But one thing I feel for sure is that academia's explanation of the ancient megalithic sites is inaccurate.

reply to post by earthdude


Those people in the photograph are actual indigenous tribesmen living a fully natural life.

The "hoax" part comes in because the researcher who took that picture claimed that this tribe was unknown and has been 100% isolated from any contact with modern civilization. The reason for this false claim is two-fold. One, it would offer an easier solution to protect the tribe and rain forest in the area from clear-cut logging. Two, the researcher would have gained much funding money

No hoax, those are real natives.

reply to post by Cataclysm


Yes a foundation was there but not the stones we're talking about. The DIA has been excavating at Baalbek for over a century

Blackmarketeer report

It is there opinion that the trils are Roman and Roman emplaced

reply to post by Sahabi


Hello sahabi
I myself am a machinist, started cnc programming in1990, became an actual cnc machinist in 95, opend my own shop in 02, shut it down 2 yrs ago an and went to work for one for one of my customers and now run their shop.
So I know of what you speak about in our business, it can be a very difficult trade, but honestly I think you are underrepresenting skill set you have aquired and collectively that of modern industry as a whole.
At the same time over estimating the quality of the work done by the ancients, and that's not to say that the ancients didn't do some fabulously amazing things, they did for sure,but nothing that can't be done with the technology and techniques of the times.
With regards to the fine fits of the stone work of the ancients, various peoples have attained some spectacular things, but they are nowhere near the accuracy or smoothness that you and I achieve on a daily basis.
There is a lot of misrepresented hoopla out there in the world of the interwebnets, don't buy into all of it.

reply to post by Hanslune

thanks for clearing that up for me.

reply to post by punkinworks10


Hello there punkinworks10. Thank you very much for lending us your professional opinion. I didn't mean for the thread to allude to some mysterious superiority of our ancestors over ourselves. These megaliths were built thousands of years ago, but only today are we able to even compare their mathematical and cosmological accuracies and their ability to lift massive amounts of weight. Only recently are we catching up to them. This should say a lot.

The ancients knew about precise cosmological movements and alignments that would have taken multiple generations to observe and comprehend. This was before the invention of the telescope or cosmological calculating software. This was from an era when western civilization thought the earth was the center of the universe. They illustrated hugely advanced mathematical and architectural concepts in the construction of their sites. They precisely cut massively huge stones from distant quarries and transported them hundreds of miles through rough terrain without damaging the stones. And this was supposedly done by people using stone and bronze tools who haven't even created the wheel?

I'm not underrepresenting modern man, I am just making the case that modern man only recently caught up to the ancients. This fact should tell us that it was not cavemen who built the structures.

Thanks again for weighing in.

OP you have to ask yourself, could ancient civilisations operate the modern software you use today? Would they even know how to switch on one of your machines? Hundreds of years makes impossibility inevitable, I am positive I will have no idea how future generations work or even think, older generations have a history of not understanding the younger generations.