Religion as a prime control agent

Have i figured this corectely out?

Jewish religion is meant to remain exclusive. It is ploted to be the religion of people who are indoctrinated to run the corporate world. Thats right, the jewish people are actualy slaves too, to the real TPTB.

Jewish people are broadly known as slick and ignorant to other people, behind their normative smile and attitude. But it is not without reason, either. Because their wealth came with a price too.

The jewish people are conditioned to live in a constant fear of the outer world. Their rabbis, perhaps constantly, told them that: once people could get their hands on u, they would rob u, they would rape or murder u! Or even eat ur flesh or do everything unimaginable!

Other people outside the jews are barbarians! They are animals, even they are human, they wont treat jewish people humanly!

I guess, thats how they internalize and inflict fear to the jewish community. Because the best fuel for ambition is fear. Ambition is the child of fear. If they want the jews to work most efficient as their money machine without a soul, they had to keep the jewish people live alienated from the rest of the world. And that is best achieved throught planting the doctrine, that the world is the enemy of the jewish.

Ah, i almost forgot. They were also told that theyre the better race compared to other inhabitants of the planet. The choosen people by god. Gods golden children. On top of the pyramid, right beneth TPTB.

While in the mean time christianity and islam are the religion of the sheeple. Religion of the worker-slave class. Not meant to be rich. In fact indoctrinations exists inside its teaching, for its followers and believers to avoid becoming too rich. And to place their belief and god ubove any worldly affairs. To give themselves completely to the service of their god, including their money and their lives if necessary. The bottomline is to keep the sheeple nice and dumb, like u like ur dog to be. And add fluoride and other kind of chemical intoxications to worsen the cognitive capability of the sheeple, physicaly.

Am i correct to this point, or what?

But whats about the other rest people in the planet? People in parts of asia? Are the majority in India indoctrinated? I personaly believe so, since hinduism is a very old religion. And they prove themselves quite successful in controling their population, curently almost exceeding those chinas.

The other parts of asia is controled through communism, i suppose. But there are still few regions left uncontroled. Some are put under TPTB's thumb through military dictatorship, maybe through ultranationalistic doctrines. Like Japan for example, we know their government is still fascist-like.

The rest is probably controled through organized crime, like the yakuza, hongkong triad, sicilian family, Russian mafia, etc. Reign of fear at street level. Mafias or gangsters are usually disfunctional people, seeking for existance, aknowledgement, and position in society. So they are easily provoked and used by inteligence agencies working for TPTB.

Probably the local nobles are also hopeless to cooperate with TPTB, in fear to be duped and to lose their longstanding social position, plus being pressured by the national government. Psudeo democracy might just work combined with impulsive consumerism, after u brainwashed the youth of a nation before.

I think that was all of it. What do u folks say? Did i miss something?

Oh i want to add something. There are still minor groups in organized religion i ought still maintaining certain degree of freedom.

Like the mistic or esoteric schools, like sufism in islam. Or (a)gnosticism in christianity. Maybe other forms of philosophical teachings to, like existensialism, post-structuralism, etc.

OP "Ah, i almost forgot. They were also told that theyre the better race compared to other inhabitants of the planet. The choosen people by god. Gods golden children. On top of the pyramid, right beneth TPTB.".

How are adherents of the religion of Judaism the "chosen people" of God ? If you still believe that then what else are you mistaken about?

reply to post by coyote66


I would say that religion only seeks to control the masses so far as making sure they lead a good life. I don't think the Church wants to rule the world...unless, of course, the Illuminati has a hand in it.

My problem with the church is it insists upon living a good life for a deity, or for the deity's representative (Jesus) when really, you should be good simply for goodness' sake.

They put the whole wrong light on the matter. It doesn't matter what religion you follow, or what god you believe in, as long as you live a good life for the sake of goodness itself and don't try to impose your religious views on people.

I think you are just generalizing the attributes of some groups ad nauseam.

How about, if religion is hijacking spilituality for the sake of wealth and influence?

I agree if someone says "it doesnt matter what ur religion is". Thus, ur understanding and awareness to what realy matters is much more important than just 'empty labels'.

Yes, religion is just some label of identity whether in which fantasy movie script u put ur belief in. And it is worst when the reason to embrace a particular religion is simply to seek safety in numbers, than u are a truly soulless and tasteless sheeple.

U can also think of religion as a map or manual book. Like when u buy a new gadget and u dont have a clue how to use it, u will read the manuals. Or when u are new in town and dont know the streets to go, u will need a map. But as soon as u have figured it out, u simply dont need the guidiance system anymore. U could simply throw it away if it pleases u. Just dont let the map get in your way, especialy if u are capable to discover/create ways of your own

Cheers.

Your theory would be plausible if Islam was actually an organized religion like Christianity was.

Since its the one I know most about, I'm going to reserve my comments to it.

Its true there are groups of people who adhere to certain sects or imams or what not, but as a religion, Islam is generally not under the control of any particular organization. There is no concept of Church or anything similar that gives any one person utter control or say over its members. All that hoohaa about fatwa's also is kind of exaggerated since Muslims aren't even required to follow fatwa's like they're the word of God.

So the prospect of controlling Muslims all around the world with the religion alone is impossible.

Infact, having been a member of Sufi groups myself, I'd say Sufism is a lot more organized than the entirety of Islam. Because to be a Sufi, you HAVE TO HAVE a 'spiritual coach' whom you listen to and do as told.

reply to post by coyote66

Yes, religion is just some label of identity whether in which fantasy movie script u put ur belief in. And it is worst when the reason to embrace a particular religion is simply to seek safety in numbers, than u are a truly soulless and tasteless sheeple.

The irony is that atheists repeat this like a christian repeats a bible passage, who are the "sheeple"?

reply to post by nusnus


Thats exactly how christianity is like. Dont u think there are more churches than there are islamic sects?

I think thats the prime problem with u moslems, u dont even have a clue about the nature of other belief system, but already badmouth them like u are a all knowing being.

No offense, but theres where the brainwash went. Being indoctrinated to be the most perfect, makes u high sometimes. Just like a good old brown nose schmoozola liking ur arse. U tend to like it do u?

Islam not being a organized religion? But still under/believing in the same holly quran, no?

I still dont get it, please explain, what differ the christians and the moslem exactly? And im not asking about different mythologies here, mate. U always think u are so different, while in fact u are so similar. And its because u live in a very small world of fantasy, if i am allowed to conclude. I have met many good through brainwashed, high spirited minions. I hope u are not one poser

Allow me to ask another question, do u think all moslems enjoy the same facility as the one u privilege? Do u even truly view ur moslem brother and sisters equal to u? Do ur brothers view u equaly too? Or are u just being ignorant, living in neverland?

Because i am talking about reality. Pardon my long fairytale.

Yes, i know a little about sufism, and i dont always like the musyrid concept.

But wasnt it said that an attack to a moslem brother means an assault to every moslem in the world? Hypocrispy?

Let me assume furthermore that u are a liberal moslem then, but do u agree with liberal islamism?

PS: forgive me for inappropriate language.

reply to post by coyote66


Okay I'll try to explain this is the best way possible.

What do we mean by organized religion? just a bunch of organized rules to follow off a book? if that was the case then any kind of manual could be characterized as 'organized'. What I mean by organized religion is humans coming to form an organization, a pyramid structure of people, beginning from a base of believers, then upwards where fewer and fewer people get more and more power. And they are all connected by the sheer fact that those on the bottom level, HAVE TO obey those on top. Sort of like a company.

Now historically speaking Christianity did not start off as organized religion. It was simply one man, against corruption of Jews and their friends, treating people like they were items of business etc. Jesus never formed a church, or a structure where people were tied to obey. So where did churches come from? Where did the concept of a Pope come from? Its all in history, so I shall not repeat this here.

Basically over time, Christianity has become a religion where people had to be a part of an organized group i.e. their church. (this is still the case in many places around the world isn't it) They go to their church, and pay tithe, and listen and feel compelled to do as their ministers tell them. And if they were to lets say, want to advance in their religious studies, they would have to study and study and pass exams to become someone higher up.

Allow me to ask you something here, since when did spirituality become something you can earn on a piece of paper? Who has the right to tell you that you are now 'closer to God' because you've passed exams, set by human beings? Isn't there something about only God judging a humans worth in the Bible somewhere?

This is what I mean by organized religion. It puts the power of control of masses, in the hand of one man (or a couple), i.e. an organization. And this is very dangerous, its not something God intended for anyone. Because only God can judge the worth of people. And humans, no matter how amazingly devout they are, cannot be trusted when it comes to their EGO. No body is infallible, and no one is above Gods law. So even creating 'levels' of spirituality through some sort of human interaction is sin, a very grave one at that.

There are people who understand this concept within Christianity but their numbers are few, they come in many different names, gnostics, etc.

But I hope this explains the difference I was referring to. Even though there are Muslims who have tried, and continue trying to create similar organizations to control the masses, they will fail. Because there is not a single verse in the Quran that points at the need for other men, or intercession or taking anyone as a leader in order to reach God. Whereas with the advent of the Trinity in Christianity, the basis for creating organizations led by men, to control men, have been put forward in the past and very few Christians recognize the problem for what it is.

Am I a liberal Muslim? No, I'm simply a Muslim who tries to see what the current world needs, and projects that in there to create balance. A lot of Muslims would not be able to pull so much information out and place them in great sentences. But a lot of people are very average minded, who do not wish to go deeper and deeper and study their religion. They just want to perform the tenets and live the way thats easier to live.

Originally posted by JoshF
reply to post by coyote66

 

Yes, religion is just some label of identity whether in which fantasy movie script u put ur belief in. And it is worst when the reason to embrace a particular religion is simply to seek safety in numbers, than u are a truly soulless and tasteless sheeple.

The irony is that atheists repeat this like a christian repeats a bible passage, who are the "sheeple"?

There are 2 kind of sheeples:

- The DISINFO agents: They are serving the lies consciously. They like to live inside a world built upon the foundation of a lie. They found their comfort place in it. So its a choice of their own to side with the lying elite of power.

- The MISINFO agents: Are those who fell for the lies. And siding themselves rather unconsciously with the agenda of lies. But the problem is, they could sound more convincing than the disinfo agents, because they themself are also believing in what they say.

There also exists a gray area between the two.

reply to post by Starchild23


Nope religion is about control. Its a Us vs. Them mechanism, and its been at work for a long time. Hypothetically, ancient humans would have used these tactics to band together against neanderthals and taking them out, now we group together by race, by religion, by sexual orientation, but we forget how we have more similarities than differences. As long as we hace an Us vs. Them mentality there will never be peace, end of story.

Originally posted by nusnus
reply to post by coyote66

 

Okay I'll try to explain this is the best way possible.

What do we mean by organized religion? just a bunch of organized rules to follow off a book? if that was the case then any kind of manual could be characterized as 'organized'. What I mean by organized religion is humans coming to form an organization, a pyramid structure of people, beginning from a base of believers, then upwards where fewer and fewer people get more and more power. And they are all connected by the sheer fact that those on the bottom level, HAVE TO obey those on top. Sort of like a company.

Of course, thats the nature of organization isn't it? They follow a specific rule.

And where does structur/order come from? From money u may say, since u mentioned the company. And how do u make lots of money? By knowledge.

And thats the point of religion, to conceal strategic knowledge. U could also fool followers to gain their trust and approval, to rule over them. So they transfer the mandate to rule over their lives to u, in the hope to get rewarded, or fear of punishment in the afterlife.

Now historically speaking Christianity did not start off as organized religion. It was simply one man, against corruption of Jews and their friends, treating people like they were items of business etc. Jesus never formed a church, or a structure where people were tied to obey. So where did churches come from? Where did the concept of a Pope come from? Its all in history, so I shall not repeat this here.

Basically over time, Christianity has become a religion where people had to be a part of an organized group i.e. their church. (this is still the case in many places around the world isn't it) They go to their church, and pay tithe, and listen and feel compelled to do as their ministers tell them. And if they were to lets say, want to advance in their religious studies, they would have to study and study and pass exams to become someone higher up.

Yes might be right, but isn't islam also the case? And u both have ur holly houses, even both weren't ordered to be built in the hollybooks. CMIIW

Are u saying that following islamic rules and way of life is not mandatory in islamic countries? Especially in a sharia based country? Where in the world do u live? And how much christian do u think still went to the church every sunday, especially in a free country that separates the church from the state?

And u are still saying how different islam is from christianity?

Why am I not too sure u know of what u are talking about...

Allow me to ask you something here, since when did spirituality become something you can earn on a piece of paper? Who has the right to tell you that you are now 'closer to God' because you've passed exams, set by human beings? Isn't there something about only God judging a humans worth in the Bible somewhere?

Yes, its a point I agree very much with u I guess so, since i'm not christian myself. But the similar is also writen in the quran, if i'm not mistaking.

(continued in next post)

reply to post by nusnus

This is what I mean by organized religion. It puts the power of control of masses, in the hand of one man (or a couple), i.e. an organization. And this is very dangerous, its not something God intended for anyone. Because only God can judge the worth of people. And humans, no matter how amazingly devout they are, cannot be trusted when it comes to their EGO. No body is infallible, and no one is above Gods law. So even creating 'levels' of spirituality through some sort of human interaction is sin, a very grave one at that.

What are u talking about? Are u talking about the pope? LOL Are u saying that the orthodoxes and the protestants are hailing the pope too, like the catholics? LOL

And whats about the caliphates? Aren't they happen to be the persons given the mandate to hair the authority of muhammed, to rule over the islamic world? Whats about that? Is that not a form of centralized and monolithic pyramid top?

There are people who understand this concept within Christianity but their numbers are few, they come in many different names, gnostics, etc.

Wait a minute, are u saying that all moslems understands this concept? In contrast to the ignorant majority of christians?

But I hope this explains the difference I was referring to. Even though there are Muslims who have tried, and continue trying to create similar organizations to control the masses, they will fail. Because there is not a single verse in the Quran that points at the need for other men, or intercession or taking anyone as a leader in order to reach God. Whereas with the advent of the Trinity in Christianity, the basis for creating organizations led by men, to control men, have been put forward in the past and very few Christians recognize the problem for what it is.

What difference are u talking about?

Does this mean a moslem could freely consume pork, or drink alcohol in a islamic country, without getting punished, or are u just bubble talking?

Does this mean when someone is stealing, he wont get his hand choped, but instead sent to jail? Are u trying to be funny?

And are u talking on behalf of all the christian sects? Not just from the catholics point of view?

reply to post by coyote66


The hierarchy system of high class, middle class, low class, or those at the top of the pyrimid the middle or the bottom, this is a very primitive system.

Originally posted by nusnus

Am I a liberal Muslim? No, I'm simply a Muslim who tries to see what the current world needs, and projects that in there to create balance. A lot of Muslims would not be able to pull so much information out and place them in great sentences. But a lot of people are very average minded, who do not wish to go deeper and deeper and study their religion. They just want to perform the tenets and live the way thats easier to live.

edit on 10-2-2012 by nusnus because: (no reason given)

Can i call u a moderate moslem, he that is okay with u?

I agree with u in this. Most of the people don't even really care about biblical/quranic nonsense. It is actually more entertaining as a movie script.

But thats what exactly distinguish the sheeple and the ruling elite. They have else in mind. Their mind is nothing simple like the most of the people. Thats why i said religion is a tool of control. Because the ignorant sheeple don't even know they are being used and manipulated, to be nice and cought in stagnancy. Happy and mediocre, as they like it.

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by Starchild23

 

Nope religion is about control. Its a Us vs. Them mechanism, and its been at work for a long time. Hypothetically, ancient humans would have used these tactics to band together against neanderthals and taking them out, now we group together by race, by religion, by sexual orientation, but we forget how we have more similarities than differences. As long as we hace an Us vs. Them mentality there will never be peace, end of story.

So are u saying humans created different belief systems, or competing god(s) created many religions?

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by coyote66

 

The hierarchy system of high class, middle class, low class, or those at the top of the pyrimid the middle or the bottom, this is a very primitive system.

That is the simple version, I'm afraid. Way to simple and ignorant to explain the complex nature of how the world works and men, IMHO.

Religion IS a tool used for the CONTROL of the commoners created by the wealthy and powerful scum of old.

And its EASY to see this if one looks into it...

Religion brainwashes the masses into [color=gold]accepting a world of scumbag privileged big-shots who make life a hardship for commoners by making them think that the scum will go to "hell" one day as a punishment. Therefore it keeps them passive free from tremendous outrage.

It also keeps them [color=gold]accepting a peasant slave life full of let-downs and struggle by making them believe that they will be here for only a short period and then have some "heavenly paradise" for eternity for their struggle and misery.

[color=gold]And those 10 commandments seem to be EXACTLY what wealthy and powerful folks who CREATED them would WANT its masses to abide by. Where is a commandment such as one that states thou shall not abuse a child? Or one that says thou shall not rape anyone? Or thou shall not torture anyone? The wealthy and powerful of old who created religion had NO use for such commandments but they certainly didnt wish for you, a peasant, to STEAL from them or KILL them...

And by the "sweat of your brow" we are all to SLAVE throughout our lives because we are "sinners. WHAT??? HUH?? [color=gold]Translation: be good obedient SLAVES to your powerful wealthy SLAVE-OWNERS for it is YOUR FAULT that you have to be a slave. But be good and turn your cheek to them cause you'll be playing a harp on a cloud in heaven one day praising some bearded guy all day, everyday.

There are dozens of more examples.

RELIGION

reply to post by coyote66



Dude you have way too many questions LOL

Okay, ofcourse I don't speak on behalf of the masses. That would be weird : /

I simply speak of the tenets of a particular religion compared to the tenets of another. Christians need intercession. Catholics take this literally, so they have the Pope system. Whereas the rest might not take it so literally but only believe they need intercession from Jesus to do so. But even the Protestant churches and the rest, any member of a church that goes to a particular church usually feels compelled to do what the church ministers tell them to do yes? Why? because they don't have the time or the necessary means to study the Bible themselves, so they depend on the ministers to explain everything to them.

A similar case may be made to Muslims when they go to Friday prayers in the mosque. But consider this, is there any verse in the Bible that says: Read, learning is a must for you etc? While there is in the Quran. The very first verse that was revealed to Muhammad says:

" Read in the name of your Lord , Who created-
96:2
Created man, out of a (mere) clot of congealed blood:
96:3 Read! And thy Lord is Most honourable,-
96:4 He Who taught (the use of) the pen,-
96:5 Taught man that which he knew not."

So learning and educated has been made mandatory for Muslims. To learn the Quran and read it by yourself is mandatory. You cannot simply go to a mosque and expect the Imam to teach you everything if you're an adult. And if you do, youll have to deal with the consequences of being ignorant of your own religion.

How can I speak on behalf of the masses of Muslims out there? I can't. Because what is written in the Quran is different and what they do is something else. So I can only speak of what is MEANT to happen.

And as long as such verses exist, people like me will come out and defend them, in the face of those who chose to be ignorant of their own religion and just live like they're the best examples there are.

You can call me whatever you wish, but know this, Islam is not a religion of peace, but a religion of moderacy. It abhors anything extreme. Even extreme religion. There are many stories of how a man who lived his entire life in sin and died doing one good, went to heaven compared to a man who lived his entire life in the mountains praying. Because prayer and religion alone does not get you places.

reply to post by coyote66


It wasn't to explain that. It was to show that we still live in a very primitive system, where there are alphas. We see it in monkeys today. We still show the same behavior, even though we have done tests and experiments, particularly in business where there is no "boss" and they happen to turn to be extremely efficent.