Live Stream - Oakland - Tear Gas - Flash Bangs - Rubber bullets

Originally posted by Screwed
reply to post by Vizzle

 

"Attention marchers. you have failed to disperse by the lawful orders of the OPD
You are now under arrest.
SUBMIT to the arrest"

SUBMIT?!?!?!

I think we as a nation have submitted enough already.
"Submitting" is how we got in this mess in the first place!!!!!

Actually not participating in government or stopping big business while they did there thing over the last 100 years got us to where we are now. Voting for American Idol while refusing to vote for government is what got us to this position.

Not knowing the law or the difference between protesting and rioting is what got them to this point in Oakland.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Its run by the line commanders from the Oakland PD and surrounding agency supervisors if there people are present. This is a local matter, not federal and im not even sure how you are making it one. The feds have absolutely no jurisdiction here unless requested by locals for assistance.

Originally posted by Corruption Exposed
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

...however I am getting tired of people who dont take accountability for what they are saying and for lobbing baseless allegations around with nothing to back it up.

Kind of like you're what doing when you claim the protesters went for their gun?

BEing I saw that first hand while watching it. A protester went for an officers sidearm. At what point are you going to read the posts ive referred you to now like 4 different times? Or are you going to do your usual trolling like your doing now?

Wow just watching the live streams...it's now "Occupy the Y" lol really ppl? These people have no idea how to protest or have any kind of movement...

Originally posted by Xcathdra
Not knowing the law or the difference between protesting and rioting is what got them to this point in Oakland.

Odd I saw no riots...

Originally posted by Vizzle
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

Xcat - please keep this in mind when you are talking about the Oakland Police Dept

Oakland Police Face Federal Takeover Due To Excessive Force via Written by Associated Press on January 27, 2012 10:39 am

Keep in mind its under investigation. Its one of the reasons I asked about the rubber bullet issue and if other agencies were present for this encounter. The period the article you linked is when they had multiple agencies present under their respective chains of command.

Secondly any time force is used there is a review. When its on a larger scale other agencies can be assigned to review another agencies force use. The feds are able to investigate ANY time they receive a civil rights violation complaint.

They are obligated to so until their review is done its jsut that, the feds looking into complaints.

Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by Xcathdra
Not knowing the law or the difference between protesting and rioting is what got them to this point in Oakland.

Odd I saw no riots...

Please tell me what the difference is between a riot and a protest.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by sad_eyed_lady
An article from 2 days ago:

America’s performance was even worse. It dropped from 20th to 47th position on the back of heavy-handed police tactics at a string of demonstrations against corporate greed.
A number of journalists – as well as protesters – were arrested as the Occupy movement swept across the country.


Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk...

Just an FYI comment.

Now they are under arrest!!!

Question - Do you think media is exempt from laws while covering events like this? Or any event for that matter? Do you think the people in the crowd with live feeds should be allowed to breach the lines at will and if so why if you dont mind me asking?

The media should only recording the events and talking to people. If they are participating they get what they get. I don't think they should be allowed to breach police lines, wouldn't they be likely to obstruct "justice" by doing so? Why don't you ask somebody besides me? Open at all here, guys.

The guy I'm listening to says a reporter (cartoonist) is in the crowd being arrested.

So I have been watching this for a while, it appeared that they had been somewhat locked in the Oakland park, but broke free through two fences which the police were unprepared to respond to... They then wandered around somewhat aimlessly chanting "!@#$ the police", and they had Pleasanton Police coming in to help, at which point I walked away for a few minutes then came back, and somehow they are all corralled and under arrest.

Have found OakFoSho's stream to be the best in conjunction with ABC Live Heli Cam Feed for maximum coverage.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

Its run by the line commanders from the Oakland PD and surrounding agency supervisors if there people are present. This is a local matter, not federal and im not even sure how you are making it one. The feds have absolutely no jurisdiction here unless requested by locals for assistance.

We actually agree on most of this. I think what I am seeing is sad....and tragic, but necessary and Occupy HAS brought this upon themselves by the choices they've made in how to proceed. They can be a protest or they can push non-violent rioting.....until it turns violent and in the end, they'll be arrested and prosecuted if they choose the latter.

However, having said that......I still have a collection of the stories and material from October and November when I was in Occupy myself and watching this with the interest of someone who may be effected by it, about the Mayors of the major cities with Occupy camps meeting with the DHS about coordinating for future enforcement efforts against Occupy.

It wasn't huge news, but it sure didn't go by un-noticed. There aren't federal agents down there on the street, but the game plan for how this would all play out the next time a confrontation came DID come from those coordination meetings with the feds.


Again...Protest means D.C.. Anything still done in the cities is civil unrest. That definitely isn't productive, and I think we agree there too.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
Please tell me what the difference is between a riot and a protest.

Obviously none... to a jack booted thug :shk:

They are now shouting "This is a hostage situation" to the police. I guess they plan on arresting all of them.

reply to post by sad_eyed_lady


You posted the link / story about the media portion, and the question jumped to my mind because of the "citizen journalists" who were recording what was going on during this latest event.

Wasn't calling you out or anything.. Was just curious and asked the question

I tend to agree with your position. Personally speaking if its truly independent journalism and there only action is recording the events while staying out of the way, then im ok with them moving between the lines so long as that action doesn't incite others.

The people recording in this case, at least to me, appeared as nothing more than wanting to be present to record the "after effect" or in other words wanting to catch the police after the initial incident so it appears as if the police are being overly aggressive / in the wrong.

Like the still shot of the officer pointing his "riot control gun". What occurred before that move is conveniently left out, painting a completely different picture than what actually occurred.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
Like the still shot of the officer pointing his "riot control gun". What occurred before that move is conveniently left out, painting a completely different picture than what actually occurred.

I'm rather confused by this. I saw the stills later, but I was watching live video of either that exact scene or one going on about the same time and it was more than one officer pointing the shotguns up at head level and panning the area in front of them. I noticed they never 'lased' the camera people with the muzzles, but they swept the area in front of them at various times while raising and lowering the guns in other directions.

Anyone have any idea what the deal is with that?? I first saw that happen in Los Angeles last month and I figured it was a scared rookie, as LAPD seems to love putting rookies on the front line. This makes the second time though....so is basic muzzle discipline just not taught in California law enforcement these days or is there some other reason for doing this?

I'd note that neither situation was getting wild...and no one was particularly confrontational. What I watched with the raising and poitning/sweeping was almost casual.

reply to post by Xcathdra


From the looks of the number of your posts it appears you basically own this thread and have taken charge.
Whatever you say goes cheif.
Have fun.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


I am all for people exercising their right to protest and seek a redress of grievances against the government - at any level.

My point though was the actions we are seeing serve no purpose - at all.

Its not protesting when you block streets, over turn dumpsters, while destroying public and private property. Its not protesting when they decided to storm the Israeli embassy in Washington DC either.

As far as coordination with the federal government. That came around during Katrina when people realized that the bulk of police / medical personnel were not covered by any state law. As an example medical staff from outside of Louisiana technically violated LA laws since they never met the state criteria to perform medical services in the state. The same held for other law enforcement, although that one was corrected a lot quicker and at the state level.

The medical side resolved it by making responding medical staff federalized, thereby falling under federal laws, which covered everyone from a legal aspect.

The Joplin tornado saw law enforcement from all over Missouri, as well as surrounding states and federal police respond. The mutual aid agreements in place now are worded to the extent that if you are requested to respond, you are operating with th4e same authority as a local officer, regardless if you are local, county state or federal.

When you have protests that become extremely large, hell when you have major sports events, you will find people from agencies all over assisting. In situations like that I can see a need for a larger centralized communication and control / command center, especially if the feds are running the show.

Just because coordination between agencies / government has increased, doesn't necessarily make it sinister, which is my ultimate point. People have a tendency to fear the unknown, and it becomes worse when they dont know the law and are always paranoid of the government or police.

Instead of asking questions to learn and understand, they just make accusations and refuse to listen to anything that doesn't support that point of view.

Communication... Government... Law Enforcement... all require back and forth / give and take. It requires to people to be a part of that process. To be active at all times and not just elections.

Sadly that point is missed by people.

reply to post by zorgon


It only starts to look like a "riot" when cops haul off and start using excessive force. Oakland PD is a scourge on this Earth and they will have to answer for it.

And, to the 'Resident Thug' , Xcat, please stop to think about this, please: Anyone who joins a force that exists to enforce the laws of MAN has got to answer for his decision, too. I'm serious. Think about it. The laws of Man are not God's laws and oppressors need to remember they are not God. It can do severe damage to your soul to not understand this.

Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by Xcathdra
Please tell me what the difference is between a riot and a protest.

Obviously none... to a jack booted thug :shk:

Ignorance for the win...

Thank you for proving my point.

REgards.

Originally posted by Screwed
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

From the looks of the number of your posts it appears you basically own this thread and have taken charge.
Whatever you say goes cheif.
Have fun.

edit on 28-1-2012 by Screwed because: (no reason given)

Just doing my best to counter the ignorant anti police masses that would rather embrace ignorance than learn and deny it. Since there are so many people who like to just blame the police and forget the rest, yes it looks like im dominating the thread. However, as I pointed out, its because there are so many running off about the police and only me and a few others that see it from a different angle.

But like you said, whatever goes corky.


By the way feel free to join in the actual conversation.. Maybe answer some of the questions I asked?

reply to post by Xcathdra


T&C jackboot. Calling other people ignorant does not help your chances for getting into Heaven, friend. I would be appalled, if I though there was no chance for you. I'm hoping you'll see the error of your ways.