Is the wind alive, a living organism? (speculative)

Originally posted by yourboycal2
reply to post by BBalazs

 

"then i will disprove you, you of so little faith (which i take to mean creativity) :-) "

yea hear that all the time from christians. I see your on the wishful thinking part. No matter few more steps you will get to reason and logic

Idont think you should play the god card, as i am atheist, so you are, again expressing your judgements.

The question is not whether wind has a mind of it's own, but whether Earth has a mind of it's own. And if we are of Earth, what part of our mind belongs to it?

reply to post by BBalazs

Idont think you should play the god card, as i am atheist, so you are, again expressing your judgements

you maybe athiest but you have the mindset that of a fundamental christian when confronted with evidence.

Could've fooled me

The christian refrence to you was the same way they deal wtih evidence , data which contradicts them.

Ignore it , and continue to try and sugar coat bs into daisies

depends what is your definition of wind
its not air - thats correct

there are 3 basic types of energy flow (there are more but whatever x) ):
1. gas - called wind (air is only an example; count in: plasma, gas clouds of jupiter etc)
2. liquid - known as for example ocean currents (water, liquid methane + count the lava in)
3. 'solid' - earthquakes, plate movement and so on

wind depends on temperature (any source), pressure and sorrounding enviroment (mountains, oceans etc)
its nothing more than energy flow - it works the same as boiling water: try using a large flat bowl and heat only one part of it - you can observe the currents (if no then use some paint);
or just in isolated place - lock yourself in kitchen, basement or whatevah - and heat one corner and cool the other
you can observe the currents with a cigarette smoke or (again) whatevah

soz for my eng

edit:
air can be view as a medium - otoh wind doesnt exist without it (on earth)
its basic thermodynamics/conservation of energy

Wind always felt so necessary. So natural. Throughtout life I asked parents, teachers, friends. No one could explain wind to me. It is truly a gifted element. It can carry disease, change ocean tides, and cool us off on a nice summer day. The Earth is the organism of course, and it is a majestic one, cherish it all!

Originally posted by nineix

what is energy? energy creates matter... are you trying to tell me that neutrons, protons and electrons are not alive?

Yup.

As far as sharing the wealth when it comes to information, you could have paid attention in science class and you'd already know this stuff. Please don't blame us for your failure to learn what you should have learned when it was taught in school.

You can also google stuff like:
What is wind?
What is thunder?
What is energy?
What is water?
What is Life?

Just say'n.

Oh come on.... We are trying to discuss something common and try to think out of the box for a bit. Usually this will be very interesting, and maybe get some new things to discuss about... Isn't why you bother to post in this page in the first place? Who knows there are living wind? Ever heard of living rock? If you know everything then don't mind share it here..... Cheers

Originally posted by yourboycal2
reply to post by BBalazs

 

Idont think you should play the god card, as i am atheist, so you are, again expressing your judgements

you maybe athiest but you have the mindset that of a fundamental christian when confronted with evidence.

Could've fooled me

The christian refrence to you was the same way they deal wtih evidence , data which contradicts them.

Ignore it , and continue to try and sugar coat bs into daisies

I think you have a more religious mind then me, as only you have resorted to name calling thus far. And not only name calling, but just read your above statements. It okay to be curious about me. Ask away, thats how its usually done. You have in essence created a preconceived notion of who I am, and now are projecting all over the place. This is why you are missing the whole point.
You may be smart, but you don't understand theory, logic, or the limitations of your human capacity.

Originally posted by heretic013
depends what is your definition of wind
its not air - thats correct

there are 3 basic types of energy flow (there are more but whatever x) ):
1. gas - called wind (air is only an example; count in: plasma, gas clouds of jupiter etc)
2. liquid - known as for example ocean currents (water, liquid methane + count the lava in)
3. 'solid' - earthquakes, plate movement and so on

wind depends on temperature (any source), pressure and sorrounding enviroment (mountains, oceans etc)
its nothing more than energy flow - it works the same as boiling water: try using a large flat bowl and heat only one part of it - you can observe the currents (if no then use some paint);
or just in isolated place - lock yourself in kitchen, basement or whatevah - and heat one corner and cool the other
you can observe the currents with a cigarette smoke or (again) whatevah

soz for my eng

edit:
air can be view as a medium - otoh wind doesnt exist without it (on earth)
its basic thermodynamics/conservation of energy

edit on 21-1-2012 by heretic013 because: (no reason given)

edit on 21-1-2012 by heretic013 because: (no reason given)

since when are currents wind? reread everything I have written.
how would you explain the earth is not flat to someone who thinks it is (you)?
wind propels energy flow. don't you understand?
I have outlined the whole theory.
You just don't want to understand.
Shall I send it to you again (or 1 page back)...

reply to post by yourboycal2


I got to you first line. Not further.
Wind is the byproduct for air.
CAre to share the chemical formula for this process?

Also, remember, and understand:


IMPORTANT!

Air: Air is the name given to atmosphere used in breathing and photosynthesis
Wind: Wind is the flow of gases on a large scale. On Earth, wind consists of the bulk movement of air.
Excellent.
Now, where does this disporove the possibillity that wind is a living organism, that moves the air?
At best wind is the "flow" of gases (meaning we have no idea), as no model replicates it percectly or eve. Close to perfectly, otherwise we would know when tornadoes etc happen, and could predict.
Anyway what drives the flow (the air)?
Atmospheric pressure?
Ok, so wind is atmopsheric pressure.
Cool.
What drives that?
No idea, right?
Well it could be solar flares.
It could also be that we should examine if the wind is alive, as we have never done that.
I am propsing a new way, a new direction of inquiry.
Most of you are just propsing a circular arguement, that doesnt even disclude that it is alive.
It makes no difference scientifically if the wind is alive.


PS: tenants of greek thinking:
Water: Life giving - disprove that
Earth: Life sustaining, matter (!)
Fire: Energy, think SUN, energy
Wind: Movement
Some in turn attributed these to be living beings.
This has no effect on science at all.
In fact, wind has never been examine in context of being a living thing. Forget about the others, as we are discussing wind here.
So you see, its a system of though.
No system is better or even more precise then the other.
You are infect trying to crush a viewpoint, which makes you very close to inquisitors. So there you go. A free philosophy lesson ofr you.
BTW Gaia is also a theory, it made prediction, most they have come true.
You cannot argue against a theory, esp. one that inccoperates science.
You just don't see the whole picture of this thread. It is a theory of what if the wind is a living being.
Disprove this or Gaia theory.
Good luck.
Or disprove pantheism.
Good luck.
At least you will learn in the process.

reply to post by BBalazs


I'm going to assume this isn't a serious question. The reason being...every single living creature on earth is an organism. That means they consist of biological cells. Wind, from what I have seen...has no discernible cells.

Interesting question, but ultimately futile.

who told you that we dont know what wind is and how it works?
there are to many elements that affect the weather to predict it exactly (+ recent anomalies which are something for a completely different topic)

we know what it will be in few days weeks sometimes months (rarely) there is too much data to predict it 100%
we know what generates wind, how it flows, where it goes and how will behave
there are no 'perfect' conditions to tell you exactly how will it behave but we are close enough and in future when climate stablizes we will be able to forecast it in 99,9% (when computers gonna get good enough to process all the data)

you need to count in:
- temperature (sun, volcano, human impact, ground, water etc and the air itself and make of it quite dense net of whole earth)
- pressure
- obstacles (mountains, hills, forests, cities)
- human impact of any type
- random events
you cant have exact predictions right now but in near future it will change

get some basic knowledge
wind is not a separate entity and is a movement of particles (in this case air) caused by 'inner' and 'outer' conditions which are well known

Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by BBalazs

 

I'm going to assume this isn't a serious question. The reason being...every single living creature on earth is an organism. That means they consist of biological cells. Wind, from what I have seen...has no discernible cells.

Interesting question, but ultimately futile.

This is a theoretical question.
Why do people have trouble understanding this? Including you.
BTW. if you claim something, provide proof.
Where is the proof that wind (not air) doesn't have cells? Not that it needs any to be living, but just out of curiosity.
I said it a living thing. It needs metabolic functions, to be living.
It does need cells to be metabolically living.
Both the theory is speculative.
It cannot be proven here.
The idea is to try to find out,how it could be proven
AND
What everyone thinks about this
AND
if you assume it is a living being, what dos it mean to you.

Originally posted by heretic013
who told you that we dont know what wind is and how it works?
there are to many elements that affect the weather to predict it exactly (+ recent anomalies which are something for a completely different topic)

we know what it will be in few days weeks sometimes months (rarely) there is too much data to predict it 100%
we know what generates wind, how it flows, where it goes and how will behave
there are no 'perfect' conditions to tell you exactly how will it behave but we are close enough and in future when climate stablizes we will be able to forecast it in 99,9% (when computers gonna get good enough to process all the data)

you need to count in:
- temperature (sun, volcano, human impact, ground, water etc and the air itself and make of it quite dense net of whole earth)
- pressure
- obstacles (mountains, hills, forests, cities)
- human impact of any type
- random events
you cant have exact predictions right now but in near future it will change

get some basic knowledge
wind is not a separate entity and is a movement of particles (in this case air) caused by 'inner' and 'outer' conditions which are well known

exactly. let me quote you:
"is a movement of particles (in this case air) caused by 'inner' and 'outer' conditions which are well known"
and before: not a separate entity"
care to back that up with proof?
We can in effect breed goldfish, and knowing inner and outer conditions, we know the result. does that make the goldfish dead, or not-entitites.
you are being ridiculous.
think harder.
hahahaha so if we understand plants and fungi, they are no longer entities
you haven't given this enough though my friend.
I guess you will not be making a return, because of embarrassment.
Again, for weak minded: Just because you know what something usually does, doesn't have implications of it being a non-living entity. THINK BACTERIA!

reply to post by BBalazs


what I meant was, I'm going to assume you haven't been going around saying, "Don't spit! You'll make the wind angry...no, I'm serious! It's alive!"

As I said, I am not judging you. I'm simply hoping you did your research instead of thinking of this and running with it. It truly is an interesting question...these are the sort of questions people should ask more often.

In the world of Alice in Wonderland (Tim Burton version) : "Believe in 10 impossible things every morning."

It's a refreshing and imaginative exercise.

Originally posted by Starchild23
reply to post by BBalazs

 

what I meant was, I'm going to assume you haven't been going around saying, "Don't spit! You'll make the wind angry...no, I'm serious! It's alive!"

As I said, I am not judging you. I'm simply hoping you did your research instead of thinking of this and running with it. It truly is an interesting question...these are the sort of questions people should ask more often.

In the world of Alice in Wonderland (Tim Burton version) : "Believe in 10 impossible things every morning."

It's a refreshing and imaginative exercise.

why does this have to be about belief?
I never once mentioned that.
I asked because it is an interesting question.
I don't believe it it, I also don't disbelieve.
Its a question.
Its a theory.
Thats all.
Why does it take 4 pages to understand this?
Not everything is about belief.

But at least you are finally starting to understand the question. Star for you

And also, in case you missed my edit:
Again, for weak minded: Just because you know what something usually does, doesn't have implications of it being a non-living entity. THINK BACTERIA!

As a landscaper for 20 years I can tell you it most certainly is alive. And it is a mean, vindictive creature. I have spent a great deal of my life fighting it. It has moods and loves to frustrate one. If I fly a kite it stops. If I fly my model airplane it starts. If I am blowing leaves in one direction it will go the opposite way. If I change direction to go with it it will change back the other way. Yes, it is alive, and it is cruel and mean.

reply to post by BBalazs


Also...cells require physical matter. The only physical matter in the air is all of the gases and pollutions and various atomic materials that get blown around every day.

The wind consists of precisely this: shifting temperatures. If that is all that's required to consider something a living creature, then the science books need to be rewritten pronto. What make it feel solid is the shifting temperatures, much like a current in a stream, will create a ripple in the air that affect the myriad of atomic particles from various sources, resulting in a "wave", or wind.

None of those materials will combine to create a cell capable of a metabolic process. If such could happen, strange creatures would form from thin air all the time.

As I said, interesting question...but there are no experiments needed to prove anything here. Simple science and established fact will state, with very clear evidence, that wind is not alive in the biological sense. Metaphors are a different matter entirely.

Thanks for the discussion.

OMFG...
yes - I will just shut up xD
its pointless
what does understanding how something works have to do with it beign alive?
I just replied cause you wrote we (or scientists) dont know what wind is and thats BS
nevermind though

have you ever tried studying a little about it? what do they teach you in schools?
cmon lol

Sorry if this has been answered already but I'm not up for reading 4 pages of replies on this. Very early on in this thread the OP asked where the wind comes from or what is the source of the wind....elementary my dear. The source of the wind is the sun. The suns rays strike the earth near the equator at more optimum angles so the air in those tropical regions is heated more than the air around the poles. The effect is movement of air due to changes in its density and pressure, ie: wind.

reply to post by heretic013


In a vacuum, there is no matter. Thus, there is no imbalance in temperature. Heat and cold are much more effective when they have particles to transfer the energy or lack thereof. Because of all this, there is no wind. No particles = no temperature imbalance, and no temperature imbalance = no wind.

I'm going to have a crack at playing along with this. What if wind was alive? Based on my previous posts, it is safe to say that living things (invisible or otherwise) would pop out of the air spontaneously all the time. Our reactions to such a thing? Similar to UFO's.

As for the effect on our world...well, depends on whether the creatures were friendly or not, yes?