Southwest Airlines Plane Nearly Clips Learjet at Chicago's Midway Airport

www.myfoxchicago.com...

Chicago - A Southwest Airlines plane and a small jet nearly collided last month on a runway at Midway Airport, the National Transportation Safety Administration reported Monday. The Southwest Boeing 737 had just landed at Midway on Dec. 1, 2011, and was about to cross another runway when “the first officer … yelled for the captain, who was at the controls, to stop,” according to an NTSB report. The captain stopped short of the runway edge as a Learjet took off 287 feet laterally and 62 feet vertically from the larger plane plane, the report said. Prior to the incident, air traffic control did not cancel the takeoff clearance of the Learjet, nor direct the Southwest plane to hold short of the runway, according to the report. The Southwest pilot alleged the Learjet over-flew his aircraft, the report said. None of the 85 people onboard either plane were injured, according to the report.

The real issue about this story, isn't just that the incident happened, but that they didn't release this news until yesterday. I suspect that they wanted to wait until the Holiday Flying Season was over, so as not to hurt profits. The second issue, of course, concerns the lack of diligence regarding the Control Tower, and their relative lack of concern regarding this. Fox News just covered this, and when the video becomes available, I will post it.

So what you telling us is that two plane did not hit each other while one was taxying!! Wooow! and you upset because this was not headline news??

I am lost honestly I am.
As someone who works in aviation I would be more concerned that this NEAR incident. (as there was not incident) was more likely caused by tired over stretched pilots. No one in a control tower can stop two planes from wing clipping, and believe me it is NOT as uncommon as you may think


One of many REAL incidents.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus

The real issue about this story, isn't just that the incident happened, but that they didn't release this news until yesterday.

This type of thing happens everyday. They never release it to the press, they just publish it in their typical reports. It really isn't news until someone dies.

Still very scary, and if people knew how often runway incursions were actually happening, they would probably never fly! I know coming into Atlanta one night, they lined up a plane on approach with our plane, and I could see the passengers in the other plane looking out their windows at us! That can't be safe!

I could also see a line of the FAA lights behind the other plane, and assumed there was a line similar behind our own plane. It's both comforting and frightening at the same time. Thinking of all those hundreds of planes taking off and landing every hour of every day without incidence, but also to think of all those close quarters and close calls happening day in and day out with dire consequences at the slightest miscalculation.

Runway Incursion Statistics for your reading and entertainment.

reply to post by getreadyalready


Atlanta has four parallel runways. When I went into the the other day we were landing the other day in a 767-400, we where just behind an ERJ on approach on the next runway. Quite safe at that stage. If a go-around happens there are routes of escape set out on the Jeppesen maps and established by the ATC. if all else fails there is still TCAS.

But is it spectacular to see.

reply to post by JakiusFogg


Did you not READ the article. The Lear Jet was at FULL SPEED taking off, not taxying. Furthermore, the SW plane had been cleared for that runway. 65 feet is all that separated almost 100 people from being killed, NOT "wing clipping" as you stated.

Then why POST "CLIP" in your title

Maybe it should have said. SW Airlines 65 feet from catastrophic "Tenerife" accident replay?

Not clipping.

FULL SPEED eh? Well I wouldn't say thats true!. I would say probably more like VMO +10kts

But that is why you have two pilots in the cockpit. and the system worked, The aircraft stopped. I don't need to read some slow news day article to know that this happens everyday around the world.

But if this s news to you then good for you. Just don;t expect too much of a hue and cry about it.

Oh hows this for an example. You are standing at a crossing. the light says green to cross. Do you cross without looking?

in 1980, it all got more congested and the safety was dropped.....I dropped out of that career choice because we were taught safety first. it was 1 mile and 1 minute seperation.....when I saw that go, I dropped right the hail out. I could see me starting as a co-captain on a 727 back then....and arguing safety with the captain, and being layed-off....
just what the post two up said....600 feet off each others wingtips on final.....and officially it was still one mile lateral seperation... hasn't been addressed to this day.

Then why POST "CLIP" in your title

reply to post by JakiusFogg

I posted the title AS IT APPEARED in the article, as per ATS guidelines.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


That's only if you are on breaking news. and don't be so soft. Even for an "academic" such as yourself you will know that a plane hitting another at during a take off roll would be more than a "clip"

it would be a big freaking smashing screaming burning hell of a mess! catering all over the runway. coffee spilled. nor chance of a second glass of wine!

But you know what. That is what scares me. You should see some of the things I have seen. ,.... well, you just have to have faith in the system. that worked in this case. so .... happy days.

By the way. you are 100% wrong on one assumption.

Airlines DO NOT make HUGE profits. they never have! they make enough to get by and only exists because people love the job they do. would you stand out at 2am in the middle of winter waiting for a plane to return just so you can check if everything is good for the next morning. I have.

reply to post by JakiusFogg


Right, Airlines survive on government subsidy, and they operate on skeleton systems at all times due to their anemic revenues. That is another scary part of flying!

There is no real budget for an airline, they operate at a loss at all times, and then depend on subsidies to exist. Wasn't JetBlue the only airline to turn a profit for a few years, maybe Southwest did a couple of times, but now even both of them are operating in the Red.

Airlines DO NOT make HUGE profits.

reply to post by JakiusFogg

The only person on this thread that mentioned the word "huge" was you. Furthermore, I understand that they do not make "huge" profits. What I do not understand, is your obvious antagonism about everything I say. Furthermore, although I AM a retired professor, as those moderators who know me personally can attest, I NEVER considered myself to be what you so nonchalantly called me, an "academic". I spent over 30 years in business and industry, and took a tenured position as a Professor at the end of my career. My students would absolutely die laughing if anyone called me an "academic".

reply to post by getreadyalready


and maybe Ryanair too!

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


You are!!? AWESOME good for you.

Well I am an active aviation engineer with almost 20 years experience.

OK look at it is this way.

You have taken the approach to this that is typical of the MSM. you assume that there is something being hidden because a report of a "near miss" would have presumably. an affect on profits during the holidays, becuase it was not reported immediiately. That is untrue. if people want to fly they will, accident or no. And in all honesty this is just not that important.

Also why would you assume there is a video of it, that as soon as it becomes available you will post. who cares?

The Air France A330 that fell into the Atlantic did not stop people flying. just as this runway incursion would not.

The bottom line to what I object is the way that non aviation people, nonchalantly assume untruths about the way aviation works, just as I nonchalantly assumed you were an academic from you ProfEmeritus name and cloaked motar boarded avatar. Maybe you were fooled by the MSM article the same way I was fooled by your avatar. It is portrays an imaging that is (by your admission) untrue. and in the end video or no. late report or no. Airlines DO NOT need incidenst to go bankrupt. and loose talk does not help what is already a struggling industry.

But I will give you credit that you said hurt profits, and not huge profits, which is what I saw.

In the end. I simply wonder to what benefit is there, or what your motivation you have, in posting this?the delay of which is clearly, as a business person you will appreciate, standard procedure and regulation.



_________________________
I added cool smileys to this message... if you don't see them go to: s.exps.me...

reply to post by JakiusFogg


Did I not read on this site once someone say, might is right??

Also why would you assume there is a video of it, that as soon as it becomes available you will post. who cares?

reply to post by JakiusFogg

Actually, what I meant was that as soon as Fox News posted their video feeds of their shows, I would post what Fox News anchor, Megyn Kelly, said, as it was fairly extensive. I think what has happened here on both side is what was said in "Cool Hand Luke":

What we've got here is (a) failure to communicate

It is portrays an imaging that is (by your admission) untrue.

No, I held the title of Professor, and the degrees to go with it. However, in some circles, including the ones I associate with, "academic" carries a derogatory meaning, namely someone who assumed his position of Professor straight out of grad school, without ever having experienced how the real world, outside academia, works.


It's no ones fault. I think we both made some assumptions that were not true.

Peace.

My opinion...Pilot error.
The plane isn't being towed, so you cant blame that guy, though if it was the pilot still could have put on his brakes.

And eek to think of the damage caused to the lil plane, all the under carage, landing gear, frame structure the list goes on and on.

love and harmony
Whateva