Reserve Corporal Could Face Discipline After Paul Rally, but Candidate's Support Within Military Is

reply to post by Vardoger


First and foremost the ACU uniform is a war time uniform really not to be worn off the post...at one time it was against regulation to even stop at a local store in the BDU uniform but today because of a ten year war that regulation was changed and it is the officially duty uniform.

As for why its wrong...because this gentleman does not speak for everyone in the military...the apperance of him in uniform at a political rally puts the idea in peoples mind that he is an official speaking on behalf of the military itself...many do not like Mr. Obama but many do...and many suport Mr. paul but many do not...its like subliminal advertising...stick a guy in uniform up on the stage and make it appear that the military is behind a certain party or certain person....we are allowed opinions and can participate in these type of affairs but only as a civilian in civilian attire who just happens to be in the military. To do otherwise is a violation of regulations...this comes down to disobying an order which you cannot allow in a military...a lawful order anyway.

I do not believe that Mr Paul intentionally did this in an attempt to show that the whole military supports him but I do believe this Corporal (or use to be Corporal) did it intentionally...disobyed an order a lawful order. As I stated above he is a reservist who unless it was his weekend to be at the center then he is not authorized to even be in the uniform. Perhaps he is a full time member of the guard or reserves I do not know his staus but it does not matter....the unifrom is not authorized at a political rally.

I just found some new information. I cannot back the source, as I don't know much about it. Also, I don't know what the implications of him being in "reserve" status vs. "active duty".

U.S. Army Reserve Major Angel Wallace confirmed that Cpl. Thorsen is not on active duty:

He is not active, he has been confirmed in reserve status as of this afternoon. We got that information, he was not in an active status as of yesterday when he did those interviews. He was in a reserve status all along and the last time he’s been on orders was back in October so he was in his traditional reserve status. There is a potential violation. It depends on your MOS because some MOS’s have a larger ability for upward promotion so on that you’d have to draw your own conclusion. He was with the National Guard prior to joining the national reserve. He works with an engineer unit. We have him in a currently combat engineer position, it would be groundwork level. We’re trying to give the command their time necessary to figure out how they want to manage the issue, giving them the time to have dialogue.

Can one of you veterans please clarify the policy that has been discussed.

Would it be okay for him to support Paul in uniform if he was in reserve status?

Source

reply to post by freakjive


. Basically means he definitely screwed up he was not authorized to be there in uniform. They will not discipline him until his command has a chance to speak with him. Something like this will probably be minor in his records that is my opinion. I commanded troops not as an officer as an NCO and if he was a good soldier you may just get extra duty or something of the sorts.
It is a situation I have never had to deal with. We used to go out sometimes in uniform off base and even went out drinking sometimes. I am not sure what the punishment for this would be. He could receive what is called an article 15 but there are different grades of that.
The fact that they're going to give him the opportunity to speak for him self is a good sign. I have served both as active duty and I also served in the National Guard. National Guard soldiers sometimes have lapses in judgment such as his.
I believe if he has been a good soldier then his punishment will be minimal. He may lose his corporal status and be a specialist which would be adequate in my opinion. That would also be something he could recover from and recover his rank back in a timely manner.
I always hated disciplining troops. I am sure we will find out more at a later date. It also depends on how the media covers it or if they cover it. Ron Paul could actually use some of his power to ease the burden after all he did call him up there a second time. This is all my opinion but I do not think some far off. Just hope his commander isn't a serious a whole.

Well it would probably not escalate past an article 15 (nonjudicial punishment) either way, it'll all depend on his chain of command, how much pressure comes from above to discipline him, and how it disseminates down through the commanders involved. If a higher up has a talk with his unit commander, he will probably see that article 15 happen. It's not that big of a deal either way, and there's likely only a small chance he will serve time (up to 30 days I think). Like Grimpachi said, we'll have to wait and see what they decide but I'm willing to bet he does not have much to worry about.

reply to post by Grimpachi

Originally posted by Sek82

Thanks for all the information in your posts. Stars for that. It's good to hear about these things from folks who have experience.

I'm still curious whether this was because it was support for Paul vs. someone who actually wants more war like a Santorum. The only thing we can do is speculate on that though. Unless it happens.

Cheers!

This is so idiotic...you know that these same people praising this idiot would be condemning him if he was for anyone else.

Ron Paul uses this guy for political gain and everyone praises how different he is from other politicians.

This just showed me that he is exactly the same as others and just says what people want to hear.

All I have to say is SUCKERS...

reply to post by Vardoger


Fashion fascists?.. its a fashion police state now..lol

If he's lucky, they'll kick him out.. wouldn't that be an ironic twist if breaking fashionista rules ended up actually saving his life?..lol then RP fans can say.. "Hey military guys, supporting Ron Paul really can save your life!"

He'll be harshed on to set an example.. send that all important message.

Honestly I believe you'll probably get extra duty may be busted down the ranks and forfeiture of pay for a small amount of time considering this is National Guard. I think that is as far as it will go. The question of the double standard go is I believe it doesn't matter whether it would be for Rick Santorum or Newt Gingrich or any of the other candidates. When the rules are broken it doesn't matter who you support politically the punishment will come down evenly. The fault lies with the soldier if he plays a little dumb but owns up to it and acts like a man accepts whatever punishment they decide he will come out of it by I believe. I'd say the company gradet article 15, extra duty the loss of pay and maybe the loss of rank that can be earned back will be more than sufficient.

Hell he may get a new nickname out of this. If he was in my company I would start calling him Hollywood.

Oh my my.. he broke the rules. Heaven have mercy, he wore his uniform, how dare he.

He probably shouldn't have been in uniform, then again, I absolutely guarantee there wouldn't be such a scandal if he didn't take such an anti-war, anti-interventionist stance. If he had 'endorsed' Perry, then FOX would have picked it up for being something patriotic. If for some reason his CO decided to bust him down for it, I guarantee they wouldn't air the news, or they would spin it.

It's like we have literally gone nowhere and it's only gotten worse. More and more fascism. The same amount of apologists, the same amount of war hawks. It never ends.

Also, to those of you saying the RP supporters would be railing on him if he supported Perry... well you are damn right they would rail on him, because he would be taking a pro-war, pro-interventionist, psychotic, bigoted, paranoid stance. The stance that causes untold suffering to millions on a global scale.

What's your excuse?

So anyway, I say good for him, I say he's setting a good example to his peers and to any of the younger enlisted under him.

IMHO....the fact that he was not active at the time means it was a planned and blatant violation of regulations and will bring a heavier [unishment upon him...I agree with the others that it is minor and he certainly will not do any time.....it could go counseling statement...Letter of reprimand....loss of NCO status..ie goodbye CPL and back to SPC or perhaps moore loss of rank but I doubt it.

It not that big of deal but still is wrong for someone to wear the uniform and imply the endorsement of all military members...I like Dr. Paul but so don't...and I am sure it would not make a difference what caniadate he choose the result would be the same...as far as the military is concerned...what the press would do...well you are right they would most likely spin it in a different way but the results would be the same as far as punishment.

Active is different from reserve but I see some hard moments ahead of him...career ending....doubt it but then again with the President announcing the cut of 500,000 troops....the CPL could find himself without a place in the military but I still doubt it...he screwed up and as long as he accepts that it will be easy to recover. What ever happens it will be between him and his chain of command

Originally posted by SyphonX
Oh my my.. he broke the rules. Heaven have mercy, he wore his uniform, how dare he.

He probably shouldn't have been in uniform, then again, I absolutely guarantee there wouldn't be such a scandal if he didn't take such an anti-war, anti-interventionist stance. If he had 'endorsed' Perry, then FOX would have picked it up for being something patriotic. If for some reason his CO decided to bust him down for it, I guarantee they wouldn't air the news, or they would spin it.

It's like we have literally gone nowhere and it's only gotten worse. More and more fascism. The same amount of apologists, the same amount of war hawks. It never ends.

Also, to those of you saying the RP supporters would be railing on him if he supported Perry... well you are damn right they would rail on him, because he would be taking a pro-war, pro-interventionist, psychotic, bigoted, paranoid stance. The stance that causes untold suffering to millions on a global scale.

What's your excuse?

So anyway, I say good for him, I say he's setting a good example to his peers and to any of the younger enlisted under him.

edit on 6-1-2012 by SyphonX because: (no reason given)

Surely for someone who tosses the word facism around you can see the danger in the military taking a more active role in politics. If this was another canidate the cult of Ron Paul would be going nuts claiming that TPTB or the MSM had it set it up to make it look like the military backed that canidate because they are afraid of Ron Paul. Honestly if the people who support Ron Paul are a reflection of Ron Paul no wonder nobody is going to vote for him.