Iran warns oil blockade if sanctions imposed

Today must have been a "slow" news day. Iran first threatened this blockade 2 weeks ago. Today, Iran reiterated the threat and it's all over the news. Their hollow threat doesn't mean any more today than it meant the first time they made it. Nothing to see here folks...move along.
-cwm

Iran Navy does not have the ability to close the hormuz if they are facing off USN. However Iran can create a lot of headache and terror using asymetrical means like missile boats, shore based artellery, and even anti aircraft guns fired horizontally to blow the oil tankers.

However, additional sanctions on Iran are nonsense and is an attempt to bully a small country into something that is not in norms with international laws. Suppose Iran oil is out of the reach of EU because of sanctions then price of oil will keep going higher and Iran will find ways to sell oil to China and India and other oil hungry nations.

reply to post by JohhnyBGood


I'm aware of that belief and I saw the video. It's called propaganda. First by them and then by us. Not everyone there believes that. They are not all happy with their government either. They got a couple of morons for leaders, some with "hard-line" religious beliefs, and who talk a bunch of crap. That's different from the US how?

You can't go around attacking people because they talk crap. It's the nature of politics. They don't want to seem weak in the eyes of their people or to any of their enemies.

If Iran nuked Israel it wouldn't start some Muslim holy war. A lot of those countries don't like Iran already. We all know it was never ever going to come to that anyways because of our "friends" in Israel. The boogieman in the closet is a scenario that had a slim possibility of ever occurring.

But what if it did? (Sheep voice) I heard on the news that terrorist could attack and knock out electrical grid by hacking it. We should go murder anyone else with that capability. Sure they haven't actually done it but they could! It would be baaaaaaaaaaad.

reply to post by Chewingonmushrooms


Iran isn't threatening to do "something with its own resources", it is threatening to attack ships not belonging to itself, transporting somebody else's cargo to somebody else.

Like if say Iceland and Canada got in a tiff, and Greenland decided it would send out U-boats and sink all cargos on all ships traveling to Europe.


Iran is free to self-blockade and stop exporting oil and gas. It may have some wee financial problems as a consequence.

That is the end point of such an action by Iran, after resistance, other people's cargos would get through, but Iran's would be blocked.

I almost hope this happens because I suspect that ramifications for Iran would be bad. I don't mean war, I'm talking universal scorn--even from its current ostensible allies. First of all, Iran won't endear itself to any of its neighbors by effectively ruining their economies for the sake of political posturing. The west isn't innocent in this matter, but if Iran goes through with this threat then they will have just committed a totally EPIC overreach and miscalculation. Even Russia and China will be all like, "Iran..you're a cute kid. We like you a lot, you got potential. Such a rich heritage, beautiful scenery...BUT you seriously need step back in line you cocky puke, capish? We will not help you slaughter the golden goose, now go play you little scamp, just remember what we told you."

***will have further opinions after I learn a little more about this nascent clusterf!@$k

Originally posted by michael1983l

Originally posted by Firefly_
reply to post by camaro68ss

 

So you are basically saying they cant stand up for themselves? The west are trying to bully them and they are not having it. If the West want to play this game with them, they are saying they can play just as dirty. Or would you just be happy to let them bend over and get shafted up the arse?

As I said in another thread, this world is run by bullies for bullies.

Ok lets seperate out the West vs East, Christians Vs Muslims for a second and take a moment to think in pure and simple logic. Should a regime that is willing to have a woman stoned to death for Adultery be allowed to be in control of nuclear weapons?

What if this regime decides that Christianity is punishable by death, would you want them in charge of nuclear weapons?

I wouldn't

America has been a democracy for what, 300+ years? The Middle East has been set in their ways for thousands of years. What gives us the right to run around the world trying to change their way of living? Trying to push democracy down their throats? We have killed hundreds of thousands of innocent people thru these wars in the Middle East. Can you understand why they are trying to kill us? If the Chinese invaded America and killed a couple hundred thousand American lives, wouldn’t you be going out of your way to kill them? Wouldn’t you be planting IDE’s on the sides of the road? I would. We shoving democracy down these people’s throats aren’t any different than what the Christians did during the crusades. We live in a world where Homo sapiens are nothing but animals. And America is the worst of them all! Makes me sick! How ironic it is, that the more intelligent we become, the more destructive we are.

Where's the proof that iran is building nukes.

That's what this all boils down to.

Not suspicions. We need empirical evidence.

When Japan attacked us, that was empirical.

When we pre-emptively attack, we're preventing a POTENTIAL future.

There's nothing certain about a suspicion or potential future.

Why can't we get inspectors into Iran to watch em 24/7.

Is iran forbidding inspectors? Why? We need answers. NOW.

Are we ready to potentially ignite WW3 so that we can attack Iran based on a suspicion?

Russia and China, along with others, do not want us to attack Iran (yet).

Russia and China are not things to ignore. They're superpowers.

They may allow us to attack, but WW3 could eventually result from it.

Those're the concerns that're on my mind.

We need to work to make a world where we're not hating each other even more.

I would rather have a world with every flavor then all or nothing.

We're setting precedents with every moment.

By attacking Iraq pre-emptively, we set in motion a chain of events.

In 2005, the UN passed RtoP, and not long after, we intervened in Libya.

All of these are precedents.

What's going on now and where might all of this lead.

If the UN decides to intervene in Iran, China and Russia risk losing weight there.

If the UN does not decide to, it could backfire on whoever chooses to.

So many potentials. All of them make me worry. This world is so hard to accept.

there are many and much more honorable ways of promoting democracy to other nations than outright going to war and bombing them inhumanely to 30 years behind. in the process usa is hurting itself also. something the evil minds understand but do not want to accept.

This couldn’t happen at a better time. Just like 911 and the undeclared war with Iraq. It’s the perfect conditions to start war with Iran. We are “itching’ to find a reason to go to war. In all reality, it’s probably a couple fishing boats hanging out on the straight. I don’t believe anything the MSM says. Are you sure Mohammad Reza Rahimi actually said that? I would have to see it come out of his mouth directly.

I wish I had a secret bat plane or some hyper-tech from another dimension. Wish I could make myself invisible and perfectly silent and capable enough to SEE what's going on. I wish I could go over to Iran and comb every inch to see it myself. And then do the same to in every center of power. And know. I've always felt so helpless. So stupid. Completely in the dark. I don't like this.

I always tell myself that I'd commit if I KNEW. But maybe I'm just a coward. Maybe I'm not interested enough. I'm always kind of half-in and half-out in this world. Mostly a dead beat.

Maybe I'll be dead in a year or two and none of it will matter. Maybe I know I will be.

Originally posted by Bearack

Originally posted by Observor
OK. Let me try with another example. German Democratic Republic was wiped off the map in 1989, when it become part of the unified Germany. Similarly Israel can be wiped of the map, by forming a Palestinian state in historic Palestine (that includes Jordan as well) and many other ways that doesn't include killing off the people.

Again, you're comparing apples to oranges here. Your talking of a philosophical demise versus a nation wanting to totally obliterate another.

It is not a "philosphical demise" when a nation ceases to exist. If by "totally obliterate" you mean "wiping it off the map", yes, like GDR. That doesn't worry me.

If you’re fishing for a comparison, maybe look to the Rwanda genocide where the Hutus were nearly successful in eliminating an entire culture. Or even if you wanted to bash the US, you could only look at what we did to the Native Americans and the trail of tears.

What Europeans did to Native Americans is, to a much higher degree, what the European Jews did to the Palestinians, not what Iran is planning against Jews, be they in Israel or elsewhere.

But yeah, I can very well understand psychopaths projecting themselves onto others.

Yes, we know if it's on the internet, it's true..

Yeah, right. If it is on the internet it is false

Are you aware of the 12th Imam and the 12'ers. Well, it's a facinating story and ole Ahmadinejad just happens to be a 12'er.

Ahmadinejad has now said – and I quote – ‘The final move has begun. We are in the middle of a global revolution managed by the dear 12th Imam. A great awakening is unfolding. One can witness the hand of the Imam in the managing of it,’

War is the best thing to hasten the return of the 12th Imam.

If he were a psychopath like Westerners, that would be plausible. I don't find any evidence to his being anything like Westerners. But totally understand you projecting your behaviour onto the others.

It's not just a problem with the resources going west, but those that profit from it. The whole rich man's club on the other side of the gulf. Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Abu Dhabi, UAE, Kuwait... They aren't going to be too happy about what they also consider as their waterway being cut off.

However I doubt those countries would want to get their own hands dirty though. A lot of money flows to Washington from those places, so in the bigger scheme of things it would still end being the U.S. dealing out the smack-down if anything happens. Protection money going to the biggest bouncer they can hire comes in handy that way.

Not sure what Iran is thinking. I know they have their complaints (some of which may be legit despite how crap-tastic their own gov't is), but this doesn't seem like the brightest strategy for them to try at the moment. Whether they managed to get nukes or not, such action that interferes with trade will simply make a very convenient excuse for other countries to actively "intervene" over there.

Originally posted by Foppezao
reply to post by Observor

 

One of the main purposes of the sanctions act, and the sanctions to follow, is not solely to boycot Iranian crude oil but also to prohibit companies from selling refined oil products to Iran.

OK.

I just red that Iran is one of the most energy intensive countries of the world per capita, even more then Japan en the EU, mostly because it is very inefficient.Interesting note is that in Iran, of the refined oil they consume, 40% is imported from India, more of an ally then say China or Pakistan.If it comes to a dramatic halt of refined exports to Iran, they're all dried up and if bombs start falling on petrochemical industries, their fancy flying boats aren't even able to start their engines let alone train in those things..Even before then internal turmoil may increase when Iranians can't fuel their cars, can't get food supplies or warm their houses etc..

India imports 11% of its oil from Iran and that accounts for more than the oil products India sells Iran. Not sure India can afford to cut off trade with Iran to please the West.

But if they do and no one else steps in to fill the gap, then Iran will know a Western bombing of their country is imminent. All kinds of interesting things can happen when someone becomes aware of certain destruction. Can Iran hurt the West to the same degree the West can hurt Iran? Of course, not! But they sure as hell have enough to make life extremely interesting for everyone and I sincerely hope they take that opportunity.

Originally posted by pauljs75
Not sure what Iran is thinking.

Nor does it make sense for them to completely reveal their hand

I know they have their complaints (some of which may be legit despite how crap-tastic their own gov't is), but this doesn't seem like the brightest strategy for them to try at the moment. Whether they managed to get nukes or not, such action that interferes with trade will simply make a very convenient excuse for other countries to actively "intervene" over there.

They won't be giving any excuse, that human beings (not psychopaths) cannot condone, for intervention, but sure as hell will make good on in response to an intervention. Put them in a little to lose situation and you will know how much you can lose too

Originally posted by Chewingonmushrooms
I bet those that believe a country or countries taking another's resources is perfectly fine are the first to throw the book at someone caught stealing an apple from a store out of starvation.

What is the population of Iran? 70 million? We aren't talking about a video game here where wiping someone out gives you an achievement icon. Iran has every right to do anything it wants with its own resources, just like we have a right to do anything with ours. By putting in more sanctions they have a right to react, just like they have the right to build their own defenses. Who are we or anyone to tell them otherwise?

Well for one Iran is the one who made the agreements that they are not upholding. No one forced their hand in agreeing with their treaties.

They know that they have made agreements they know that there are consequences if they don't hold to their end of the agreement. If they suffer the consequences then that's on them.

All they have to do is do what they said they were going to do in the first place and everything will be just fine.

-Alien

Originally posted by Observor

Originally posted by pauljs75
Not sure what Iran is thinking.

Nor does it make sense for them to completely reveal their hand

I know they have their complaints (some of which may be legit despite how crap-tastic their own gov't is), but this doesn't seem like the brightest strategy for them to try at the moment. Whether they managed to get nukes or not, such action that interferes with trade will simply make a very convenient excuse for other countries to actively "intervene" over there.

They won't be giving any excuse, that human beings (not psychopaths) cannot condone, for intervention, but sure as hell will make good on in response to an intervention. Put them in a little to lose situation and you will know how much you can lose too

If they stopped all of their oil flow it would devastate their own country far worse than ours they couldn't handle it its a bluff all the way.

-Alien

Originally posted by Observor

Originally posted by Foppezao
reply to post by Observor

 

One of the main purposes of the sanctions act, and the sanctions to follow, is not solely to boycot Iranian crude oil but also to prohibit companies from selling refined oil products to Iran.

OK.

I just red that Iran is one of the most energy intensive countries of the world per capita, even more then Japan en the EU, mostly because it is very inefficient.Interesting note is that in Iran, of the refined oil they consume, 40% is imported from India, more of an ally then say China or Pakistan.If it comes to a dramatic halt of refined exports to Iran, they're all dried up and if bombs start falling on petrochemical industries, their fancy flying boats aren't even able to start their engines let alone train in those things..Even before then internal turmoil may increase when Iranians can't fuel their cars, can't get food supplies or warm their houses etc..

India imports 11% of its oil from Iran and that accounts for more than the oil products India sells Iran. Not sure India can afford to cut off trade with Iran to please the West.

But if they do and no one else steps in to fill the gap, then Iran will know a Western bombing of their country is imminent. All kinds of interesting things can happen when someone becomes aware of certain destruction. Can Iran hurt the West to the same degree the West can hurt Iran? Of course, not! But they sure as hell have enough to make life extremely interesting for everyone and I sincerely hope they take that opportunity.

edit on 29-12-2011 by Observor because: (no reason given)

So you are FOR Iran obtaining nuclear weapons? They agreed NOT to obtain nuclear weapons we are trying to hold them to their agreement for a reason.

I mean where would YOU draw the line? If it were up to YOU would YOU just let every country in the world obtain nuclear weapons? Can you imagine what kind of world that would be? How long do you think our very existence would last in that situation?

-Alien

Originally posted by michael1983l

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
empty threat

the us EXPORTED more oil than it imported this year, and we get a lot more of it from canada, venezuela than we do the middle east

this would be wonderful, the average citizen might come to realize we don't need them

edit on 27-12-2011 by syrinx high priest because: (no reason given)

You do get alot from Saudi you are right however you fail to see that blocking the homouz straight would stop you buying said oil from Saudi arabia.

Question also begs, that if the US exports more oil than it needs, then why buy oil off of all said nations?

Even if they put their entire navy at that straight in an attempt to stop us it would be obliterated within a matter of about one day after the United states President gives the go-ahead.



-Alien

Originally posted by Alien Abduct

Originally posted by michael1983l

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
empty threat

the us EXPORTED more oil than it imported this year, and we get a lot more of it from canada, venezuela than we do the middle east

this would be wonderful, the average citizen might come to realize we don't need them

edit on 27-12-2011 by syrinx high priest because: (no reason given)

You do get alot from Saudi you are right however you fail to see that blocking the homouz straight would stop you buying said oil from Saudi arabia.

Question also begs, that if the US exports more oil than it needs, then why buy oil off of all said nations?

Even if they put their entire navy at that straight in an attempt to stop us it would be obliterated within a matter of about one day after the United states President gives the go-ahead.



-Alien

its congress who is supposed to send us to war, not the president. many people seem to have forgotten that fact after afghanistan and iraq

Originally posted by Alien Abduct

Originally posted by Observor

Originally posted by Foppezao
reply to post by Observor

 

One of the main purposes of the sanctions act, and the sanctions to follow, is not solely to boycot Iranian crude oil but also to prohibit companies from selling refined oil products to Iran.

OK.

I just red that Iran is one of the most energy intensive countries of the world per capita, even more then Japan en the EU, mostly because it is very inefficient.Interesting note is that in Iran, of the refined oil they consume, 40% is imported from India, more of an ally then say China or Pakistan.If it comes to a dramatic halt of refined exports to Iran, they're all dried up and if bombs start falling on petrochemical industries, their fancy flying boats aren't even able to start their engines let alone train in those things..Even before then internal turmoil may increase when Iranians can't fuel their cars, can't get food supplies or warm their houses etc..

India imports 11% of its oil from Iran and that accounts for more than the oil products India sells Iran. Not sure India can afford to cut off trade with Iran to please the West.

But if they do and no one else steps in to fill the gap, then Iran will know a Western bombing of their country is imminent. All kinds of interesting things can happen when someone becomes aware of certain destruction. Can Iran hurt the West to the same degree the West can hurt Iran? Of course, not! But they sure as hell have enough to make life extremely interesting for everyone and I sincerely hope they take that opportunity.

edit on 29-12-2011 by Observor because: (no reason given)

So you are FOR Iran obtaining nuclear weapons? They agreed NOT to obtain nuclear weapons we are trying to hold them to their agreement for a reason.

I mean where would YOU draw the line? If it were up to YOU would YOU just let every country in the world obtain nuclear weapons? Can you imagine what kind of world that would be? How long do you think our very existence would last in that situation?

-Alien

actually no nation should have nuclear weapons. including the 'always the good guy' united states. do you not realize that the rest of this world views the u.s. as one of the biggest threats to world peace? so yeah, thats where the line is - no one gets them.