Please don't hate Servicemen.

Originally posted by heelstone
If something happened like that to Corinthas, then people like Ezekial would just call him crazy if he still stuck to his ideals. Much as how people have maligned Nick Berg's father for sticking to his anti-war stance even after having his son decapitated. You cannot win against a warmongering mindset.

[edit on 20-9-2004 by heelstone]

I believe in war as a last resort and I believe that people have a right to stick to their ideals. I was not for going into Iraq and unlike Corithas, I would never liken anyone's death to "a walk in the park." Where is the ideal there?

You can also not win against a warmongering religious fanatic mindset, but you have to try to defend yourself.

I was for Afgahnistan not not Iraq.


[edit on 20-9-2004 by Facefirst]

"Hey i can make a line of pee longer than yours!"
"No, I can piss a box around your piss!"
"No, I can do a triple spiral loop with my piss! So There!"
"Well I can stand bent over and piss backwards between my legs!"

Boys, Boys! Let's all settle down now and come inside for a nice bowl of soup. We wouldn't want those bladders to run dry now would we?

couldn't resist.
.

Originally posted by slank
"Hey i can make a line of pee longer than yours!"
"No, I can piss a box around your piss!"
"No, I can do a triple spiral loop with my piss! So There!"
"Well I can stand bent over and piss backwards between my legs!"

Boys, Boys! Let's all settle down now and come inside for a nice bowl of soup. We wouldn't want those bladders to run dry now would we?

couldn't resist.
.

Hey what do I get if I can do that?

THEY DESERVED IT!

Now you can say I said that Facefirst...

Look if you are going to invent my staements for me i'll just let you POST for me OK?!?

And I am 12?

Originally posted by Corinthas
THEY DESERVED IT!

Now you can say I said that Facefirst...

Look if you are going to invent my staements for me i'll just let you POST for me OK?!?

And I am 12?

No, I think by your statements you are more like 18 with the mental capacity of a 4 year old....

I'd like you to explain how the 3000 innocent individuals, men, women and children from ALL OVER the WORLD deserved to die on 9/11. Let�s have a rational answer instead of an anti-American wildass rant like you have become known for, because we are talking about people from all nations, and of all religious backgrounds...there is your task for the day....


[edit on 21-9-2004 by Affirmative Reaction]

Of course one could argue that the al qaeida people are just doing their job, as instucted by whoever, but everyone on this forum would slit their throats given the chance.

I understand that some people would say that they're instructed by terrorists (who are bad) while the soldiers are given orders by bush etc (good), but that is definitely debatable.
The bottom line is, i feel, it is unacceptable performing any action just because it is your job, we all have a choice between right and wrong

When leaders of not just the US, but of other countries around the world decide to test their testorone levels or debate who has the biggest b#lls, our service men/women are always their for the better intentions (their country, family, freedom, hertitage, culture, good of mankind, etc.).

Just because so called leaders don't always have the better intentions in mind (sometimes they think they do though), our service men/women always do! I will always support them! They lay alot on the line for us - everyone mostly for good intentions (except for the wackos).

I have the upmost respect for our service men/women and I will always support them.

I could never hate them. In their minds the believe they are doing good. What ever good is, or maybe. They have a job, the thing about this job is, that if you just "quit" you are frowned upon. They are following orders.

Originally posted by Corinthas
THEY DESERVED IT!

Now you can say I said that Facefirst...

Look if you are going to invent my staements for me i'll just let you POST for me OK?!?

And I am 12?

Where are my links to the alleged US Greek and Italian Concentration Camps!!!!???
Is you selective memory still kicking in?!!! Or is it because you have nothing to back up your claims?

I will paraphrase myself: I said: "You ESSENTIALLY SAID that they deserved it." No invention there, but your hatefulness was fully felt and was addressed.

I really don't want to waste anymore energy on your inane, childish, revisionist, insipid rants.
(ie. get a life)

WTF do you know about the US? Pretty much nothing. I suggest an education. Highly helpful.

The General offered no apologies.
He said, "The soldiers erred in judgement, they should have hired a hooker."
No Apologies

-Joni Mitchell

As a soldier myself, I'm afraid to say that there are some soldiers, and Generals, and Commanders in Chief worthy of less than our unwavering admiration.

This was a mistake, and it wasn't the grunt's.

[edit on 21-9-2004 by DeltaChaos]

Originally posted by Godsent
When leaders of not just the US, but of other countries around the world decide to test their testorone levels or debate who has the biggest b#lls, our service men/women are always their for the better intentions (their country, family, freedom, hertitage, culture, good of mankind, etc.).

Just because so called leaders don't always have the better intentions in mind (sometimes they think they do though), our service men/women always do! I will always support them! They lay alot on the line for us - everyone mostly for good intentions (except for the wackos).

I have the upmost respect for our service men/women and I will always support them.

Thanks, we need more people like you in the world.

Originally posted by sal88
Of course one could argue that the al qaeida people are just doing their job, as instucted by whoever, but everyone on this forum would slit their throats given the chance.

I understand that some people would say that they're instructed by terrorists (who are bad) while the soldiers are given orders by bush etc (good), but that is definitely debatable.
The bottom line is, i feel, it is unacceptable performing any action just because it is your job, we all have a choice between right and wrong

Spitting on the military�.nah, not yet, just another hater getting his justifications ready. do I hear a down with the baby killers�.come on you can do it.


[edit on 22-9-2004 by keholmes]

question: Who is the only couctry to be found guilty of international terrorism by the world court?

Answer: ??? We all know who it is right?


If you dont...look it up

might=right
might=right
might=right
might=right


There is no enemy anywhere - Lao Tse

Pardon my laziness, Ihaven't read the entire thread here, but, I think that a majority of the people who oppose the war are not protesting against our servicemen, but against the war. There is a huge difference there.

We are Servicemen, we served for our country, we put our bodies on the line for our country. Simple as that.

Originally posted by Ezekial
We are Servicemen, we served for our country, we put our bodies on the line for our country. Simple as that.

Verily I say unto you, there is no greater gift than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

Jesus knew what you sacrifice for me and everyone else.

It never fails to amaze me that people who've never put on a uniform in their life feel like they somehow know exactly what goes on in the military. The only thing they know about the military is what they get from Hollywood.
And it sadden and sickens me to hear this same liberal chant of "we're against the war but we support the troops". How long do we have to listen to this hypocrisy? I've been putting up with this drivel since the Gulf War. It's like saying "I support doctors but I'm against curing diseases". Listen, if you're against the war, then you want our troops to lose. If you want them to lose, then you're not going to help them win, are you?
Let me rant about the "illegal war". The notion that this war is illegal is about as wrong as two boys holding hands in church. C'mon...what would make this war "legal"? Is this whining because the UN didn't approve the use of force? Give me a break. The UN is finished. They have gone the way of the League of Nations becuase of their own inaction. Besides, trying to say the US needs the approval of a body that was hip-deep in the oil for food scandal is a load of bull. The UN's word is no longer binding. Their resolutions carry no weight. They're done.
As for our "allies" in europe....there are plenty of them. In fact, the only governments that officially oppose this war seem to be, by an amazing coincidence, the same ones who were pocketing BILLIONS from illegally (yes, using their own beloved UN as the benchmark of the term "legal") doing business with Saddam Hussein. Wow...couldn't have seen that coming. I also find it a little sad that the European opponents of this war are the biggest beneficiaries of American generosity. Let's face it...if not for the USA they'd all be speaking German right now. You'd think that these clowns would understand the price of appeasing dictators more than any other country on earth. Hmm...guess not.
Another statement about WMD. They'll be found. Maybe not for years or even decades. But where there's smoke, there's a fire. What do you think Saddam was doing with those mobile chemical laboratories? Making pesticides? Ha! Yeah right...and Teddy Kennedy will admit to Chappaquiddik! So Saddam didn't have a nuke yet. That means we were right on schedule! I guess our liberal friends would prefer to wait until some city is glowing before they do anything about it. Well...our President was about to take the chance that that might be an American city glowing. Europe can open its doors to terrorists all it wants.

Does it not occur to anyone that the liberals have consistently been on the wrong side of history?

Wow is all that I can say. You have made yourself look dumb a couple of times.

For starters,

"Being against the war and for the troops is like supporting the doctors and being against curing diseases." These two are not alike, because all wars are not the same. We have good wars and bad wars. Legal wars and illegal wars. (Not referencing our current one either) Some are for defense. Some are for friends. Some are even to expand your own borders. Some even take place without a shot being fired. The only thing they have in common is the name "war". But most diseases are alike. All adversely affect your health. Some are milder than others, but all the same principal. After all, I have yet to run into a mutually beneficial disease. Or at least I can't think of any "good" diseases.

Also, yes you can be against the war and for the troops. Why? Because I am pretty sure everyone is ready for them to come home safely...every last one of them. Would that not be "being for the troops?" It beats the heck out of wanting them all to end up lying face first in the ditch.

And no, by being against the war does not mean you want them to lose. I'm pretty sure everyone can remember Vietnam. Did you personally like that war? I didn't and I see only two reasons to have fought it...both of which were kinda foolish in retrospect. But even if you hate that war, wouldn't you love to see our men and women accomplish their mission quickly and get home safe? After all, if the government is committed to a war, they aren't going to run after the first few losses. It will take the losses getting to a point to where it is more effective to cut and run. But them accomplishing their mission speedily would allow them to return much sooner than the other option.

Also, I have never put on a uniform in my life. But guess what, I have a rather decent understanding of what happens in the military. I do of course have the internet for some of my sources. "OX, but you never know if that is real what you read on the internet." Which is very true. The internet is not exactly known for its accuracy. I also have other sources. I am an avid reader. And I have read up on all of the post-graduation options I have. (Already graduated high school...but there is also the college one.) One of which is OCS. I have talked to a number of recruiters and military men. And, I am seriously thinking about it. And I do have other sources for my information on the military. How about my big brother in my Fraternity? He is a man who once belonged to the service. He tells me many things about how things operate. Also, I have several brothers and friends who have joined the military. I have a friend who I talk to every once and a while who is in the Navy. My best friend at work is a retired officer from the Army. I can form a rather decent opinion of how things work and the way things are based on what people have told me. Not to mention that I have asked them specifically what military life is like because I am considering it. So, yeah...I can form opinions on it...even outside of the realm of Hollywood.

And then you talk about "American Generosity"...and how Europeans would be goose-stepping singing Deutchland if it wasn't for us. Which is highly innaccurate and also extremely snotty of you. For starters, even if we did save their butts from the German War machine, do you think they are eternally indebted to us? Also, do not ever think it was only America. In fact, I would even go as far as crediting Russia more for saving Europe from Hitler. Do you think we would have rolled over them as easily had Hitler not stopped caring about the West? You see, once Hitler neutralized Britain and took over France, he set his sights on Russia. He planned to take out Russia. And what happened next only crippled Hitler's army. You see, the Russians kept on retreating. Then, the stormy season came and hindered the tank and troop movement. It also hurt the supply lines too. The Russians were also adapted to moving in that type of terrain. So they could still manuever around. But why were they retreating? They must have been waiting on something! And it finally came. The Russians are famous for having some of the harshest winters ever and that year a doozy happened. And it only worked in the advantage of the Russians. Soon, the Russians dominated and defeated Hitler's army. And since Hitler stuffed his "basket" with as many "eggs" that he could, he lost the entire army that marched into Russia. Thus, suffering his worst loss in the entire war.

And liberals have not been on the wrong side every time. You do know that it is conservative ideals that allowed slavery. In a completely free market, it is perfectly alright to own slaves. Wanna try public education? Want to go to the New Deal...you know the thing that pulled our butts of a recession? How about safety regulations? Building codes?

But liberals are not always right. AA, anyone? Conservatives have been correct a number of times, themselves. A blatant blanket statement is not only wrong, but intellectually dishonest and you know it.

But other than those, your post was mighty right fine, guy.

Originally posted by Ezekial
During this current time with the war on terorism I worry greatly for the soldiers and veterans of various wars.

If you are going to protest against the war, don't protest to the soldier, he/she is only doing their job for their country. Instead focus your feelings on the government.

I don't want the same thing to happen to returned servicemen that happened ater Vietnam - the thankless war. As a RS I too already feel guilt just from seeing protesters abuse the war and everything to do with it.

Dur it was the soldier's choice to join up with the military and then the soldier's choice to go fight in the war. It's still the soldier's choice to continue fighting. It was all their decisions. If they did a sit-down strike in Iraq, the war would be over. They carry out the war. Following orders is not an excuse. Being an American, of course I hold it against them.

Opposing an unjust war is supporting the troops.
The troops have no say in what wars they fight, they simply go where they are ordered.

As citizens, it is not just our right but our duty to raise our voices when their fealty and willingness to serve are cynically abused, as I believe they are being abused in Iraq.

My father, a retired US Naval officer & quintessential Cold Warrior, put on his dress whites and joined tens of thousands of servicemen, mostly returned Vietnam veterans, in protests against the Vietnam War.

I am sure there are plenty of armchair warriors & proto-fascists out there who consider this treasonous, as they consider any dissent from the official line treasonous, but these people are the real traitors, for they would destroy the very democracy our troops are sworn to protect.

"My country right or wrong" is an attitude that has no place in a democratic society. It is the duty of the people to keep their government in line, and this includes stopping the government from throwing away the lives of our soldiers in unjust and futile wars.