Aristocrats of the Soul

Life is full of hierarchies...there is an aristocracy of wealth and power, defined by family lineage and bloodline. One can also speak of a "natural aristocracy" of those who are born strong, intelligent, and forceful, regardless of whether they have money.

Might there be a spiritual aristocracy as well, generated over many incarnations?

I think so. I think certain people are just more highly evolved on a spiritual level, they have a kind of "glow" that is unmistakable.

I think a lot of people on ATS are aristocrats of the soul. It shine through in their writing.

Are you a spiritual aristocrat?

Originally posted by Indigo Starchild

Are you a spiritual aristocrat?

There certainly seems to be people who are spititualy enlightened.

Would they tell you they are? I don't think so because not tooting your own horn seems to come along with the territoy. People who say they are, are the ones that are not!

reply to post by Indigo Starchild

From all the documentaries I've seen I would have to say that the ultimate spiritual aristocrats are the Buddhist Yogis at this time. I watched The Yogis of Tibet (a documentary) and it was quite fascinating. They exude a peace, compassion and intelligence that no western religious figures I have seen even come close to.

I sure hope so.

Imagine if the elite were the only ones - horror!
I like your thinking and you are probably correct.
It certainly makes sense the more you think about it.

Thank you - intellectually stimulating theory.

Much Peace...

Definitely an interesting concept you bring up.


I think this could correlate with the concept of 'Old Souls' and 'Young Souls' - The older ones being a few steps along from the young ones in the process of enlightenment, due to the cumulation of realisations by the soul as it journeys through many lifetimes.

It is the Old Souls which would be the aristocrats.

reply to post by Indigo Starchild


I know we like to think there should be a spiritual hierarchy, after all, it is part of our nature and that of all living things around us.

But, it is possible the concept of Hierarchy is simply one of the experiences available Here, and that it does not apply, like Duality, in our own Soul levels of awareness.

Also, the Old soul/New soul thing is only another human concept, which is often used to make oneself appear to be more "advanced" than other people. A very human trait that one.

What I see is that some people can "open themselves up" or expand their consciousness to experience more Light and Awareness. Monks do so through many years of training, and then spend many more years practicing in suitable surroundings vastly different to that of westerners who also practice to the same degree. The western experience being far more difficult to maintin balance in, compared to the eastern culture.

For me, all souls are equal. For me all souls experiencing the human condition are equals... so all people are equals despite what their ego and cultural indoctrinations say. All have the same inner ability to awaken, although individuals will need differing approaches depending on the strength of their indoctrinations.

So, no. I don't think a spiritual hierachy exists. I do think the concept is only a human one that fails dismally to explain the reality.

reply to post by Tayesin

Originally posted by Tayesin
reply to post by Indigo Starchild

 

I know we like to think there should be a spiritual hierarchy, after all, it is part of our nature and that of all living things around us.

Spiritually I have no doubt there is a 'hierachy'. I think the OP's use of the word Aristocrat is a little misleading for if we are all one then then ultimately there is no hierachy. But I do not think we completely lose our identity when we die and automatically join that 'one consciousness'. We may well have a much improved perspective, but we still do not have it all.

And beyond the veil of the physical I think we will find entities which are wiser and more poweful, entities which may well never have had an Earthly existence, and maybe ones that are still awaiting to be born into the physical world.

This you could call a 'hierachy' but it would be nothing like an Earthly hierachy.

But, it is possible the concept of Hierarchy is simply one of the experiences available Here, and that it does not apply, like Duality, in our own Soul levels of awareness.

Also, the Old soul/New soul thing is only another human concept, which is often used to make oneself appear to be more "advanced" than other people. A very human trait that one.

So you believe that all human souls entered the world at once and progress back to the Source at an equal pace, ultimately meaning we will all leave this physical plane at the same time?

I strongly believe this concept to be true, and it is to a certain extent reflected in a person's core personality. I have two, one who I would call and Old Soul, and the other seems to be a much younger one. This judgement was based o the personalities each one displayed just hour after they were born, before any environmental factor have come into play. And it has since been reinforced by observing the way each one chooses to respond and discover the world around them. I see it in others around me as well. But far from using it to judge others, it may well serve to explain why they react the way they do in certain situations.

I do agree that these terms are easily abused by those who wish to come across as 'spiritually advanced'. But this then would only prove the are far from what they claim.

What I see is that some people can "open themselves up" or expand their consciousness to experience more Light and Awareness. Monks do so through many years of training, and then spend many more years practicing in suitable surroundings vastly different to that of westerners who also practice to the same degree. The western experience being far more difficult to maintin balance in, compared to the eastern culture.

And you completely discount that this process may happen over many lifetimes?

For me, all souls are equal. For me all souls experiencing the human condition are equals... so all people are equals despite what their ego and cultural indoctrinations say. All have the same inner ability to awaken, although individuals will need differing approaches depending on the strength of their indoctrinations.

Completely agree

So, no. I don't think a spiritual hierachy exists. I do think the concept is only a human one that fails dismally to explain the reality.

Dismally.....quite a strong word. What reality exactly does it fail to explain?

reply to post by Indigo Starchild



So are there those among us who are more "spiritually advanced" as a result of their own unique journey over many lifetimes? I would say yes. However, I strongly believe that irregardless of any measure of "spiritual attainment" each one of us is both teacher and student.

It is my experience that the more spiritually developed and aware one is, the less likely they are to make this claim on their own behalf. I remember reading a story once about how, when asked about their own ability, a Spiritual Master would never acknowledge their own achievements. Instead, they would make a comment about the attainment of the Master who had taught them. It is my belief that this characteristic flows from a humility born of Truth.

Edit to add: After reading an addition post, I see that this has already been commented on beautifully by a previous post:

Originally posted by 1littlewolf
reply to post by Tayesin

 

I do agree that these terms are easily abused by those who wish to come across as 'spiritually advanced'. But this then would only prove the are far from what they claim.

Well. I'll add that there is a hieracrchy of existence, all evolving towards the source of which is unimaginably divine and probably infinite in nature. We can connect to and communicate with these higher levels of existence through our emotions.

Originally posted by 1littlewolf

But, it is possible the concept of Hierarchy is simply one of the experiences available Here, and that it does not apply, like Duality, in our own Soul levels of awareness.

Also, the Old soul/New soul thing is only another human concept, which is often used to make oneself appear to be more "advanced" than other people. A very human trait that one.

So you believe that all human souls entered the world at once and progress back to the Source at an equal pace, ultimately meaning we will all leave this physical plane at the same time?

I strongly believe this concept to be true, and it is to a certain extent reflected in a person's core personality. I have two *, one who I would call and Old Soul, and the other seems to be a much younger one. This judgement was based o the personalities each one displayed just hour after they were born, before any environmental factor have come into play. And it has since been reinforced by observing the way each one chooses to respond and discover the world around them. I see it in others around me as well. But far from using it to judge others, it may well serve to explain why they react the way they do in certain situations.

I do agree that these terms are easily abused by those who wish to come across as 'spiritually advanced'. But this then would only prove the are far from what they claim.

Sorry all, I've just reread one of my answers and realise I left out quite an important word.

Where the large asterix is *, plese insert the word 'children'. I have two children....one of whom I believe to be an Old Soul, the other appears to be quite a young one....

Originally posted by 1littlewolf
reply to post by Tayesin

 

Spiritually I have no doubt there is a 'hierachy'. I think the OP's use of the word Aristocrat is a little misleading for if we are all one then then ultimately there is no hierachy. But I do not think we completely lose our identity when we die and automatically join that 'one consciousness'. We may well have a much improved perspective, but we still do not have it all.

And beyond the veil of the physical I think we will find entities which are wiser and more poweful, entities which may well never have had an Earthly existence, and maybe ones that are still awaiting to be born into the physical world.

This you could call a 'hierachy' but it would be nothing like an Earthly hierachy.

Based on my work with thelong term and newly-dead, I would have to disagree with the concept of automatically joining the One Consciousness.. as most manage to only wake-up to their soul levels of awareness.. as I have observed for many years... awhich is still a very long way from 're-expanding' to the immense awareness of the One.

Honestly, I doubt that there are wiser and more powerful beings. My experiences show me the Soul is massive and powerful already, perfect, and active in every layer of awareness beyond the 'astral' and the 'higher' soul levels.

Those who have not had life experience here do not have any understanding of the human condition as experienced Here. I found myself having to 'renegotiate' a 'contract' because the initial plans lacked any understanding and needed to be more aligned with my experience of Here. It's the old saying about not truly knowing a thing without having the direct experience of it yourself.

So you believe that all human souls entered the world at once and progress back to the Source at an equal pace, ultimately meaning we will all leave this physical plane at the same time?

I strongly believe this concept to be true, and it is to a certain extent reflected in a person's core personality. I have two, one who I would call and Old Soul, and the other seems to be a much younger one. This judgement was based o the personalities each one displayed just hour after they were born, before any environmental factor have come into play. And it has since been reinforced by observing the way each one chooses to respond and discover the world around them. I see it in others around me as well. But far from using it to judge others, it may well serve to explain why they react the way they do in certain situations.

No.. I don't Believe anything. I base my offerings only on my own experiences gained from not having attachment to any Belifes or human concepts... which Limit our ability to experience outside this dense construction we call Here.

My perception is that all Souls were brought into being at the same time, as portions of the whole/One. And we all experience various worlds offering experiences for "Life", and that over time we rise out of them and seek out other opportunities. So I think we all volunteered for this experience series. Some came here a long time ago, and some are just arriving here.. in which case the only way a soul could possibly be New, is to be new to this experience offering. In which case we may see some who struggle with the human condition on their first few rounds here.

I do agree that these terms are easily abused by those who wish to come across as 'spiritually advanced'. But this then would only prove the are far from what they claim.

Totally agreed friend. Part of the human condition is coming to realise that none of us are more advanced souls than any other, and that we all have something of value to share in the awakening of mankind to it's higher reality.

And you completely discount that this process may happen over many lifetimes?

No. But I do not think awakening follows a linear pattern in our life experiences. I see that we have been many things in life already, and in some of those we may have been an enlightened being in human form, while in the next round we may have chosen to be a bum in the gutter with no spiritual understanding.. because it offers a unique experience.

Dismally.....quite a strong word. What reality exactly does it fail to explain?

Yes it is. My perception is that bigger picture reality is the "real life" and we minimize ourselves in order to have experience in the flesh.

While in the flesh we are Indoctrinated with all the social mores, all the cultural expectations that are modelled by everyone who ever came before us and all those around us as we grow to adulthood. So it is no wonder we struggle to perceive beyond our Indoctrinations, that we think and BELIEVE the human concepts to be higher Truth, and yet those 'truths' pale into total Insignificance when standing in the Light.

Be well

Excellent question and replies. Not much else to add only that yes all souls are equal. There are some "people" that have attained a higher spiritual awareness in this life or throughout many lives. Our ultimate purpose is to search for the truth of who we are. Once realized, it is to live within the higher aspect in all words and actions. If everyone was to do that....we would co-create the "heaven on earth".

Theres this idea that kabbalahist have, I think is the kabbalahist. They believe that at any time on earth there are 36 people that have some sort of mystic import in humanity. If any of them die before their time the world will end. Very fancy stuff there.

reply to post by Indigo Starchild

And so they started arguing amongst themselves as to who was the greatest, and Jesus (probably laughing at them) exclaimed "the greatest among you will be the servant of all."

The higher always and forever comes to serve the more lowly, to raise up what is low to increasingly higher heights.

They are known by their fruits.

Originally posted by Tayesin
Based on my work with thelong term and newly-dead, I would have to disagree with the concept of automatically joining the One Consciousness.. as most manage to only wake-up to their soul levels of awareness.. as I have observed for many years... awhich is still a very long way from 're-expanding' to the immense awareness of the One.

Honestly, I doubt that there are wiser and more powerful beings. My experiences show me the Soul is massive and powerful already, perfect, and active in every layer of awareness beyond the 'astral' and the 'higher' soul levels.

I agree with you about the nature of the soul, but I myself have perceived intelligent entities which I do believe to be real and individuated outside of myself. Some are very minor, others truly magnificent. So here I will have to disagree until I learn more.

Those who have not had life experience here do not have any understanding of the human condition as experienced Here. I found myself having to 'renegotiate' a 'contract' because the initial plans lacked any understanding and needed to be more aligned with my experience of Here. It's the old saying about not truly knowing a thing without having the direct experience of it yourself.

Sorry but I’m not quite sure what you are saying here.

So you believe that all human souls entered the world at once and progress back to the Source at an equal pace, ultimately meaning we will all leave this physical plane at the same time?

I strongly believe this concept to be true, and it is to a certain extent reflected in a person's core personality. I have two, one who I would call and Old Soul, and the other seems to be a much younger one. This judgement was based o the personalities each one displayed just hour after they were born, before any environmental factor have come into play. And it has since been reinforced by observing the way each one chooses to respond and discover the world around them. I see it in others around me as well. But far from using it to judge others, it may well serve to explain why they react the way they do in certain situations.

No.. I don't Believe anything. I base my offerings only on my own experiences gained from not having attachment to any Belifes or human concepts... which Limit our ability to experience outside this dense construction we call Here.

My perception is that all Souls were brought into being at the same time, as portions of the whole/One. And we all experience various worlds offering experiences for "Life", and that over time we rise out of them and seek out other opportunities. So I think we all volunteered for this experience series. Some came here a long time ago, and some are just arriving here.. in which case the only way a soul could possibly be New, is to be new to this experience offering. In which case we may see some who struggle with the human condition on their first few rounds here.

Having attachments to beliefs and having beliefs themselves are two different things. I have many beliefs, some of which I am probably a little more attached to than I should be. But overall if you have an open mind I do not think beliefs will hold you back.

The question here related to old souls and new souls. This is merely a concept I learned, and has since been backed up through my observations both with my children and with others around me. If I find a better explanation to what I observe then I will (I assume change my beliefs regarding those observations.

No. But I do not think awakening follows a linear pattern in our life experiences. I see that we have been many things in life already, and in some of those we may have been an enlightened being in human form, while in the next round we may have chosen to be a bum in the gutter with no spiritual understanding.. because it offers a unique experience.

I would not doubt an enlightened being may wish to incarnate as a drunken bum in the next life, but ultimately each lifetime I brings with it many realizations. These realizations (I believe) do produce ‘changes’ within the soul which in turn are one of the few things which are carried on from one lifetime to another.

But I do agree that reincarnation is not linear in the way we would understand it. Maybe it goes both forwards and backwards in time. Maybe there is only one soul and there are no individuated parcels of consciousness from the Source. Maybe we are all manifestations of this one soul reincarnated concurrently in this one time period?
I guess in the long term it doesn’t really matter though.

Yes it is. My perception is that bigger picture reality is the "real life" and we minimize ourselves in order to have experience in the flesh.
While in the flesh we are Indoctrinated with all the social mores, all the cultural expectations that are modelled by everyone who ever came before us and all those around us as we grow to adulthood. So it is no wonder we struggle to perceive beyond our Indoctrinations, that we think and BELIEVE the human concepts to be higher Truth, and yet those

These are my feelings as well, but at this present point in time we have no real way of knowing except through our subjective beliefs, so I do not think a little speculation over the ‘mechanics’ of it all is a bad thing. As long as like you said we do not become too attached to whatever we think we’ve discovered.

Peace brother

reply to post by 1littlewolf

Thank you for your excellent reply friend.

Yes, you are correct that other mightily intelligent beings can be found 'out there'.. but we must not forget that in our own larger reality we are equals to them. Our own higher-self appears to be something amazing, powerful and beyond our understanding.. until we spend time working with 'it', and eventually merge again with it. After which it is recognised merely as ourselves.

Thank you again, and please keep up your good work.

PS.. I might not have known what I was talking about in that sentence either

I suspect there might be, in a sense, a spiritual hierarchy of sorts.
There may be souls which have evolved further along the path of awareness than others.

This does not mean they are not all, in essence, equal!
We have hierachies in the physical world and our society- in a work situation we have hierarchies, with some that have more experience, therefore hold a position of more power and responsibility than others.
But they are still equal in value as human beings!
In a school, there are kids who are older, have learned more knowledge, than others,
And yet they are all equal in value as human beings!

It could very possibly be the same with souls, at least at some level.

“Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, 'Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous?' Actually, who are you not to be? You are a child of God. Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you. We are all meant to shine, as children do. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us. It's not just in some of us; it's in everyone. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others.”
~ Marianne Williamson

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by Indigo Starchild

 

And so they started arguing amongst themselves as to who was the greatest, and Jesus (probably laughing at them) exclaimed "the greatest among you will be the servant of all."

The higher always and forever comes to serve the more lowly, to raise up what is low to increasingly higher heights.

They are known by their fruits.

The enlightened amoung you...you will recognize as servants.

Nice festive avatar NAM! That's the spirit....