Pakistan says U.S. drones in its air space will be shot down

reply to post by milkyway12


The US also causes multiple civilian and non-civilian deaths for the country that of which are terrorist to the US.

dont forget US, you aren't the only one pointing a finger, you are also a terrorist to the country you "invade"! (

You dont see pakistani drones, flying over the US soil, cause i can guarantee you have got terrorists in your own back yard (and NO! not literally).

Also for those of you speaking of the Taliban. Firstly, there are 2 "Taliban's". The Afghanistan Taliban, lead by Mullah Omar. This being the primary and first founded of the two. The Pakistan Taliban came after. Secondly, they do not operate under the same command. They do not have the same primary goals. I can't stress enough the importance of this knowledge. Given the generalization I constantly see in the use of the name.

An the Afghan Taliban was not founded by the ISI. Though it did receive more prominent support from the ISI in it's beginning.

reply to post by milkyway12


Who are "they"? Are you talking about the CIA funded/created group used as a scapegoat? The same ones we put in charge in Libya now?
Are you talking about the man who died sometime back in the early 2000's of kidney failure? (You know, the one who's family are partners/best buddies with the Bush family)

Take off your patriotic blinders and realize who the problem is.

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

 

As i said earlier. We asked pakistan time and time and time again to help us. We cant simply go home... if we do? Guess what. They come back , they rebuild , re organize. I guess you have no idea of warfare.

Guess what. Every time you miss and kill civilians you recruit tenfold against you. Operations in Pakistan are an example of perpetual warfare and should be ended.

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by iamconcerned

 

Considering we could take on the Chinese , we could simply land lock them and bomb their natural resources (Oil) to hell and back.

Considering American Strategic Oil Reserve is estimated to have more than what the middle east has now.

I like the way you think, it's entertaining. Total bollocks fer sure but hey it takes all kinds.

Originally posted by sonicbaz
There are people in this world right now plotting to acquire a nuclear device.

Are there?
Have YOU personally seen the evidence?
I haven't.

The idea that we should blindly trust the opinions of our own governments, after they "got it wrong" so many times before, is ludicrous.
These are governments that attacked Iraq and found no WMD's. The same governments that armed dictators all over the world - and continues to arm them.
These are the same governments that have threatened Iran while ignoring the fact that Israel DOES have nuclear weapons, that no one is allowed to see and document.
These are the same governments who decided to attack specific (oil rich) nations to "defend the people" while they watch their ally Israel use illegal weapons against the people of Gaza.
They're the same governments to see the systematic Human rights abuses in countries like Saudi Arabia and do nothing.

When it comes to credibility and trust, our western governments are void, even amongst their own people. Very few people trust what their government tells them because they've lied, blatantly, so many times. They've been proven to have ulterior motives in almost every single instance. They're hypocritical, turning a blind eye to the actions of some and attacking others when they can make a profit. They routinely lie to their own people through the manipulation of the media, and continue to attack their own people through the systematic removal of rights and freedoms, all while they allow a very wealthy minority of their own "boys club" to continue to fleece the country.

Yeah, I'm likely to trust what your government says, just about as much as I'm willing to trust what my government says.

They've destroyed their credibility and the trust their people have in them. That is why I will never support an attack against another nation unless their troops are at our borders and their weapons trained on us. And even then, my government had better have some genuine evidence that this is the case.

Pakistan has the right to defend itself, just as the USA does. If Pakistan sent anything into American airspace you can bet it would be shot down, so why the double-standard?

America was once a force for good, but since the CIA seems to have taken over in what some are calling the most silent military coup in history, it's no surprise other governments around the world are starting to stand up for themselves.

While some nations might be the bullies in the playground, the American government seems to think it's the global police, the a closed world court and an executioner.

reply to post by milkyway12


Wow, and I thought the last guy I replied to wasnt very smart, but you beat him. First off we shouldnt be over there in the first place as there was no terrorists. Secondly, you really just believe that the US can just go bomb whomever whereever in whoevers airspace they want when ever they want. Wow. Thats amazing. And you wonder why people around the world dont like americans? Wow. Maybe you should watch this and then grow a brain. No offence. www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by intrptr

 

Yes it is Military Industrial though.

You should learn it. You dont win defensive wars.

Are you twelve years old, drunk, or just stupid?

I assume you're not challenging the fact that there exists in Pakistan a fundamental Islamic problem.

I am. Believe it or not Islam adapts well to peace.

It adapts well to war too, hence the reason few will achieve any type of victory in the Middle East.

It's a wasted cause for the west. They would be better addressing their own problems.

Originally posted by milkyway12


Any engagement directed against US military personnel or equipment by Pakistan should be treated with retalitory strikes.

So, by this logic I should be able to send an RC plane over your property and if you were to shoot it down I would have the right to go on your property and burn your house down?

Whether or not anyone agrees that spying on Pakistan with drones is right or wrong, come on now, if Pakistan catches us they should have the right to shoot it down over their airspace. Our bad for getting caught. Have to step up our game.

Originally posted by DigitalSea

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by DigitalSea

What the US is doing is deliberately starting a heated discussion with Pakistan without any solid evidence whatsoever that Pakistan is a place that provides a safe harbour for terrorists.

Never heard of the Swat Valley, I take it.

the "heated discussion" this round seems to have been started with folks flinging bullets at US soldiers across a border.

Apparently they didn't like the answer they got to that. Bummer.

So what you're saying is because someone was shooting at US soldiers from across the Pakistan border that there must be terrorists and Pakistan must be behind them? It's like I shooting across from Australia to another equally bordering country like New Zealand and then New Zealand coming out and saying, "Australia is firing upon us, there must be terrorists there and Australia must be providing a safe harbour for them"

No.

That's not what I said.

Read it again, for comprehension this time.

I've seen nothing but blatant lies and misinformation in this thread.

I've noticed some of that myself, and I've called it out.

The bottom line is the US doesn't like the thought of another country potentially building weapons and means to protect itself from countries like the US. It's perfectly okay for the US to build secretive nuclear programs, weapons and develop technologies that would give them an unfair advantage in any war, whilst single-handedly telling other countries they can't do the same thing.

Could you please be more specific, and explain exactly what in the devil you're talking about, so that I don't have to make assumptions when I shred that argument? Well, shred it if you're trying to say what I THINK you are, that is.

Has India said anything since all of this began?

I could see the Americans trying to get India to do some of their dirty work.

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by Swills

 

Maybe the US is tired of Pakistan harboring terrorist?

Forgot to place the word "Fictional" in that sentence?

You see, the thing is, there really are no terrorists in Pakistan. This all comes down to the definition of "terrorism".
www.google.com...

The USG are murdering Pakistani civilians for the sake of political gains. Un-sanctioned assassinations with no basis or reason is terrorism if you ask me. The US does this everywhere they go, in an attempt to claim "you need protection from the terrorists" followed by fabricated concerns, in which they try to establish yet another middle eastern base for troops, fighter jets, etc, etc. They do this because the current agenda at the whitehouse is power hungry murderers. The US thinks it can do whatever it wants:

"do as we say, but not as we do".

Nothing but double-standards and hypocrisy at its finest.

Don't build nukes, but don't tell us to stop making them.
Don't fly in our airspace, but don't tell us to leave yours.
Don't censor the internet, but don't tell us we can't censor it.
Don't abuse human rights, but don't tell us to stop abusing it.

.....few of the many double standards that come out of the whitehouse very often.

The USG has been playing the protection-racket scandal for long enough. Pakistan should be acting more aggressive over this, and its taken long enough for them to come out with a simple warning as it is. I also think it would be pathetic if washington comes out and says "no more aid for you"... because humanitarian aid for starving/homeless people has nothing to do with "let us kill your civilians in exchange for aid". Its truly sickening if that is the case.

I have no idea what the political situation is between Iran and Pakistan... but i would really like to see Iran's methods of disabling these murdering machines traded to the Pakistani military. Lots of innocent lives would be saved.

P.S
As anti-american as my reply may seem... that is not the case, i do not hate america in any way at all. Although have a serious problem with the way the american government creates bucket loads of fairy tales so it can do as it pleases. It really needs to stop. The biggest terrorist organization on this planet gets its commands from the whitehouse. While people suck up to _everything_ their president comes out with. such as the "grave concerns" we all know to love & hate .... it makes things even worse by believing it, and only makes the lies more powerful.

Originally posted by buster2010

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by Swills

 

Maybe the US is tired of Pakistan harboring terrorist?

One persons terrorist is another persons freedom fighter. Their country is being illegally invaded their innocent civilians are being killed they have every right to fight back. If we really wanted to end this "war on terror" then we need to go after the countries that started and helped set up these terrorist/ freedom fighters. But then we couldn't do that can we? Because Israel created Hamas and the US created the Taliban and Al-Qaeda.

Can't speak for Israel, but no, the US created neither the Taliban nor AQ.

Originally posted by Babbleman

I assume you're not challenging the fact that there exists in Pakistan a fundamental Islamic problem.

I am. Believe it or not Islam adapts well to peace.

It adapts well to war too, hence the reason few will achieve any type of victory in the Middle East.

It's a wasted cause for the west. They would be better addressing their own problems.

I distinguish between a moderate peaceful Islam and a fundamentalist version which does not talk about peace, it only talks about destroying the West. To be specific it wants the return to Sharia Law with a pan-Islamic model. This with the desire to acquire nuclear weapons is a global problem and threatens millions of people including Muslims.

Please see references below re: the rise of religious fundamentalism in Pakistan.

www.foreignpolicydigest.org...
www.economist.com...
idsa.in...

Maybe someday soon we will get to see Pakistan's drones flying over the American airspace?

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL

 

You have presented 0 facts.

Are you saying that the 1991 gulf war didn't happen? This is one of the reasons 911 happened. The USA struck first. I presented only the facts. Please show me which statement of mine us not a fact. Showe which statement otherwise you must concede defeat as you have shown no facts. I asked you how are Pakistanis threatening your way of life. Now show me otherwise take your zero facts elsewhere

Originally posted by InsideYourMind

Originally posted by milkyway12
reply to post by Swills

 

Maybe the US is tired of Pakistan harboring terrorist?

Forgot to place the word "Fictional" in that sentence?

You see, the thing is, there really are no terrorists in Pakistan.

The Blind trying to lead the Naive...

Pakistan's ISI has been known for decades in their support of Extremist groups. Not just in the ME or against the West but pretty much against the whole region. India, China and Afghanistan.

India demands Pakistan action against Mumbai attackers

NEW DELHI: India told Pakistan Saturday it was awaiting “decisive” action against the perpetrators of the 2008 Mumbai attacks as the country marked the third anniversary of the carnage that claimed 166 lives.

The 2008 attacks in Mumbai saw 10 heavily armed gunmen storm a host of targets including luxury hotels, a Jewish centre and a train station.

“We are still waiting for Pakistan to act decisively to bring to justice the perpetrators of the mindless violence that was unleashed on Mumbai,” Indian Foreign Minister SM Krishna told reporters in New Delhi.

Afghan leader: Toll from attacks on Shiites now 80

Hamid Karzai said during a speech in Kabul that the Dec. 6 bombings were carried out by people seeking to undermine peace and stability. An extremist group in neighboring Pakistan has claimed responsibility for the deadliest of the attacks, a suicide bombing that targeted Shiite crowds gathered around a shrine in Kabul....

The Pakistani extremist group Lashkar-e-Jhangvi says it carried out the Kabul bombing, raising fears it was trying to stoke Shiite-Sunni tensions in Afghanistan. The group is blamed for many attacks on Shiites in its own country.

China rushes thousands of police to restive Xinjiang

BEIJING: China has rushed thousands of special police forces to Urumqi, capital city of northwestern Xinjiang province, where it is battling to contain separatist East Turkestan militants, some of them trained in neighbouring Pakistan.

Thousands of special policemen have been transferred to Urumqi from the regional public security department, state-run Xinhua news agency reported without specifying the reasons for the deployment.

The fresh deployment would be in addition to stationing of Snow Leopards, China best known anti-terrorism unit in Urmuqi as well as in the border town of Kashghar, located close to the Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (POK).

Taliban commanders say Pakistan intelligence helps them

(Reuters) - Pakistan's security service provides weapons and training to Taliban insurgents fighting U.S. and British troops in Afghanistan, despite official denials, Taliban commanders say, in allegations that could worsen tensions between Pakistan and the United States.

A number of middle-ranking Taliban commanders revealed the extent of Pakistani support in interviews for a BBC Two documentary series, "Secret Pakistan," the first part of which was being broadcast on Wednesday.

China says Xinjiang attack linked to Pakistan

old.news.yahoo.com...
BEIJING (AFP) – A deadly weekend attack in China's restive Xinjiang region was masterminded by "terrorists" trained in Pakistan, the local government said Monday....

Fourteen people were killed in two attacks at the weekend in the ancient Silk Road city of Kashgar, and five alleged attackers were in turn shot dead by police in the wave of violence.

Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

Originally posted by nenothtu
We did not create them. Pakistani ISI did. we should have never given Pakistan any money in the first place after they did that. Pak ISI created them, harbors them, and now apparently fights with them. You expect a man to harbor and defend his children, and that is precisely what Pakistan is doing in regards to the Taliban.

Did you just try to pass the buck on the fact that the CIA created Al Qaeda?

No.

I am flat out denying it.

Read "Ghost Wars" by Steve Coll. Brzeninski also happened to be the American foreign policy "advisor" who directed the whole operation under the idea that backing a bunch of ragtag rebels in Afghanistan would break the Soviet Union. It worked.

I really can't think of anything I can possibly read, written by some guy after the facts, that will counter what I already know.

What do you know of Brzezinski? He was a dick. So was Casey. That in no way supports a US creation of AQ. Neither does what you say here about US support for the Muj. None of those things are related. You're trying to connect dots in minds by making "suggestions" without without being specific about what you are trying to say, or bringing any fact to the table.

Just innuendo.

.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Way to go for quoting me out of context