Virginia Tech Says Shots Fired on Campus

www.huffingtonpost.com...-offi
6:22pm local time  CollegiateTimes : Slain Virginia Tech officer identified as Deriek W. Crouse, a 49 year old of Christiansburg.

I wonder if this guy was a poster on ATS

I read on Ninemsn this morning (about 14 hours ago, I'm in Sydney) that yesterday, VT began its appeal to over $50,000 in fines in regard to the 2007 shooting.

Do you think this has anything to do with it?

reply to post by getreadyalready


Regardless if they are idiots, when you make contact with a LEO in any way...you are obliged to immediatley inform him/her that you are CCW and have a weapon on your person. I'm just trying to help you out, if they are idiots and napoleonic types wanting to cuff you for bumping a stupid rustly pole, better believe they will enter a place I call "imagination land" to make something out of nothing, usually in order to make themselves look like big boys. They probably have a tad bit of inferiority complex anyway being Campus Police.

www.boston.com...
The news release said clothing found inside a discarded backpack recovered by Blacksburg police seemed to match that of the male subject in the officer's video.

So their dead 'suspect' wasn't dressed like the gunman. Did he shoot the cop, find someplace to change his clothes(indicating an intent to escape from the scene), and then shoot himself after he was confronted by more police? No witnesses say they saw the suspect shoot himself. Why would he hang around with his gun if his intention was to leave the scene? Note they haven't said where the backpack was found.

forum.prisonplanet.com...
Quote from: Nailer on December 08, 2011, 01:38:55 PM
The rest area on I-81 northbound in the Radford area has been closed due to reports of a subject fitting the description of the shooter stopping and changing clothes before departing.

It would be awkward for the police to say they found the discarded clothing off campus, and then maintain their shooter came back to campus to shoot himself.

Police now claim the backpack was found on campus:

www.newsplex.com...
Later Thursday afternoon, Blacksburg Police recovered a discarded backpack at the Greenhouses on the Virginia Tech campus. The clothing found inside the backpack is similar to the clothing worn by the male subject in the officer's video.

reply to post by paearmor


I usually hand my CCW license alongside my Driver's License. In this case they hadn't even asked for my driver's license yet, because the conversation went awry so quickly.

As far as I know, and I can't find any law or statute that says otherwise, I am not required to reveal my weapon to anyone, including the cops, unless they specifically ask.

Florida Dept. of Ag licensure

Florida Statute 790.06, the Jack Haglar Self-Defens Act

BTW, we have a suspicious package event at a Books-A-Million going on right now in Tallahassee. A bearded man in a van dropped off a package at the doorstep and left. Authorities are on the scene. It will probably turn out to be a Christmas Donation, but they are treating it like a bomb.

Link

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by AngryAlien

 

Yep. Right here on ATS from an ex-officer...

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
reply to post by silo13

 

Can't say this enough:

--“Citizens may resist unlawful arrest to the point of taking an arresting officer's life if necessary.” Plummer v. State, 136 Ind. 306. This premise was upheld by the Supreme Court of the United States in the case: John Bad Elk v. U.S., 177 U.S. 529. The Court stated: “Where the officer is killed in the course of the disorder which naturally accompanies an attempted arrest that is resisted, the law looks with very different eyes upon the transaction, when the officer had the right to make the arrest, from what it does if the officer had no right. What may be murder in the first case might be nothing more than manslaughter in the other, or the facts might show that no offense had been committed.”

www.dailypaul.com...

edit on Thu Jul 28 2011 by DontTreadOnMe because: IMPORTANT: Using Content From Other Websites on ATS

Post

I've read through some of those cases, and not one that I read cites a case where a civillian took the life of an officer in self defense. Additionally, I could not even find the quotes that were allegedly taken from the case files (in the referenced case files). So I would still like to know if there is a case in the US, where a person has been found innocent after killing a cop by resisting an "unlawful arrest".

reply to post by capone1


I don't think so.

reply to post by AngryAlien


I'm not a legal researcher or a lawyer, and I don't plan on shooting any police officers, and if the unthinkable ever did happen, I wouldn't try my luck in court, but all that said, with just a little bit of googling I found....

9 rulings in favor of citizens vs. police. I didn't read the details on all 9, but if you are truly interested, there is information out there.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by AngryAlien

 

I'm not a legal researcher or a lawyer, and I don't plan on shooting any police officers, and if the unthinkable ever did happen, I wouldn't try my luck in court, but all that said, with just a little bit of googling I found....

9 rulings in favor of citizens vs. police. I didn't read the details on all 9, but if you are truly interested, there is information out there.

I'm very interested. I did find a couple where the killing of an officer was justified. I must say though, that the quotes from the case files are often taken out of context. I'm just trying to prevent people from taking those little quotes, from pages and pages of a case file, and going on that alone. I strongly suggest that people avoid killing a police officer in self defense (because your odds are very slim). Do your reasearch before you resist a cop with force, people

reply to post by AngryAlien


I agree.

First of all, your odds are very slim of even surviving the attempt. The police officer typically has a vest, and a lot more training, and a lot more expectation of using force. It is doubtful that anyone would be successful in their resistance.

Next, it is very doubtful that you will survive your arrest. If you beat the first cop, the others are not going to be gentle in your handling, and any excuse to put you down will be jumped upon.

Lastly, the court system, even in a best-case scenario is unreliable and verdicts often make no sense whatsoever.

I sure wouldn't risk it!

www.wtvr.com...
Police ID 22-year-old Radford student as Tech gunman
A 22-year-old Spotsylvania County man is responsible for Thursday's murder-suicide on Virginia Tech's campus, according to Virginia State Police.
Investigators said Ross Truett Ashley, of Partlow, Virginia, shot himself about a half-hour after fatally shooting a Virginia Tech Police Officer. Ashley is a part-time student at Radford University, and is suspected of robbing a car the previous day at a real estate office.

The unanswered questions of this strange case:


--There is no such thing as a motiveless crime. So what is the motive here?

--A half hour to an hour after the shooter allegedly committed suicide, there are numerous reports of a flurry of gunshots at about 2pm. Why?

--Before police found the discarded clothing in a backpack near the tennis courts, there was a report of a witness who had seen someone change and discard clothes at a rest stop on I-81 near Radford. Was this the real shooter?

--Why was the shooter only a quarter mile to a half mile away where allegedly shot himself, when he had at least one half hour to flee the scene?

--How is it that both the FBI and DEA were there as first responders? Did they get the tipoff?

Too many questions, if you ask me.

(delete--double post]

The alleged shooter is supposed to have been a student at Radford University, about 15 miles away from VTech. Interestingly, the week before(11-30-11) there was a pro gun rally at Radford U:

www.kwgn.com...
The Virginia Citizens Defense League(VCDL) protested at Radford University on Wednesday.
It's just the latest pro-gun protest the organization's held recently. Three weeks ago, the organization held a rally at Virgina Tech. ...

I wonder if Pruett was at the rally or if he was a member of VCDL? "Domestic extremist," anyone? They were about to legalize concealed carry in Colorado when Columbine happened back in '99. Hmmm...

More questions:

news.yahoo.com...
...he walked up to officer Deriek W. Crouse after noon on Thursday and shot him to death as the patrolman sat in his unmarked cruiser during a traffic stop.

[Why was this cop driving an unmarked car?  Was the cop in or out of uniform?]


abclocal.go.com.../national_world&id=8460692
After the shooting, he fled on foot to the greenhouses, where he left some of his clothes and his ID.

[Either this guy is a total bonehead or the ID is an obvious plant.]


usnews.msnbc.msn.com...
Mandy Adams, a Radford grad student, said Ashley had recently shaved his head.

[Was Ashley a military recruit? (He graduated Radford U three months previously)]

... Ashley's parents' home in Spotsylvania County, along the Interstate 95 corridor between Richmond and Washington... 

[Are Ashley's parents government employees?]


www.huffingtonpost.com...
J.D. Muller, 22, said he and Ashley kept in touch through social media...

[Where is the record of his online presence?]


In addition to the FBI and DEA, the BATF also responded to the scene:
usnews.msnbc.msn.com...


The synchronicity:

www.collegiatetimes.com...
The Tartan(Radford U news rag) publishes once a week on Wednesdays. Its last issue of the semester had hit stands the day before Ashley allegedly shot Crouse. Its front page story features a large image of a gun with coverage of a pro-gun protest from the Citizens Defense League that happened on Wednesday.

i find it rather strange that people at tech universities are being shot.
my mind always thinks that people are being killed because of what they have
invented or the path they are which may lead to the discovery of something world changing
tech which might take down oil companies or special interest groups.
I have the idea that they then find someone who is low profile and presure them to be a hitman
and kill that person who is a threath to there wealth and power.
you can presure people by saying that you are going to hurt there friends or family ect and that person
will do anything even murder someone who might be the new einstein .
so if someone is being killed on campus find out what they were working on because that might be the reason they
are being murdered .

reply to post by starviego


Thank you for your contribution, these are serious points that need to be addressed. Namely, the clear lack of any motive, the strange behavior of the alleged perpetrator, i.e. leaving ID, killing himself when he could have easily fled, etc.

I am, quite frankly, sick and tired of all the "irrational gunman with no motive" stories. They reek of BS and something dark, to be honest. Contrary to the popular mass-media belief, there is not a prevalence of super-crazies waiting in bushes ready to shoot unsuspecting people for no reason whatsoever. Whenever a story surfaces where an obscene crime is committed, and they release the info of the shooter immediately, like everything is laid out for them... "found ID of someone... oh, looks like that someone shot himself, how convenient for our story", then I have a million red flags go off.

The media works in mysterious ways, doesn't it? Recently I've had the Penn State Sandusky case in my periphery, and I have to say, they really are putting Sandusky to the fire on the media, but strangely they never talk about the conspiracy behind it all, which is the MUCH LARGER and MORE SERIOUS story. Nope. Roast the celebrity, bury the story.

What's my point? Well, they've already found someone to roast, and they lack any sort of plausible explanation. If I was a journalist, I'd call that a bogus story, and if I was an editor then I wouldn't let the story on my desk.

Biggest indicators that I'm going to further look into, as you pointed out:

Planted ID
Reports of Firefight
Federal Agencies as First Responders

What will see on the media instead of real investigative journalism, is emotional speculation with no bearing in reality. Bullcrap like, "What does this mean for the nation?", "Should schools be safer?", etc. Problem, Reaction, Solution. We are seeing a desperate syndicate failing to setup their "PRS" properly, and moving too fast.