OWS opinion from a Brit

I'm not really for this occupy wall street nonsense, first of all do you guys know how much it's costing the tax payer to just police this "occupation"?? Then there is loss of business as people cant get to work, putting more strain on the economy.

What are you trying to achieve? Do you think the US government are going to say, "Ok guys we don't need money anymore, lets fire all the bankers, destroy the economy and start all over again"??

That's madness.

Or is it all about shoving one to the man, the elite, the powers that be and there evil intent? Any evidence to back that up? You live in a society where you get world class healthcare, age of death is high, food and water is always available, heated homes, running water!

Go try and live in some parts of Africa,where you not worried about not having a job, or the cost of bread has gone up, your worried that you cant feed your children, or see the doctor because there isn't one when your baby is dying in your arms. In the western world all you have to do is dial 911 (depending what country your in) and a highly trained medical team is there in minutes.

What do i suggest?

Go home and write a CV, go and volunteer in a homeless shelter, you can volunteer in lots of places, its experience. Or do you think your too good to volunteer?

Step up to the plate and stop moaning, you make your own future. Dreaming of ridiculous ideas that a people revolution is going to oust the US government is ludicrous. All your doing is making more mess and more cost for the tax payer to pick up the bill.

You know what makes your thread different from all the other anti-ows threads?


Absolutely nothing. Thank you for sharing your opinion, but there are probably 100 other threads this could have gone in.

reply to post by QUANTUMGR4V17Y


Glad to know others share my opinion

reply to post by godofme


Well said and it's good to hear a new opinions from across the pond! I guess England had it's own experience recently with how even well intentioned protest (still fuzzy on how all that first began there) can spin wildly out of hand into nation wide unrest and rioting. Ugh... I think that is what many of us are hoping against hope is not an outcome with our troubles here. It seems to be close to it for specific cities some nights.

I am so with you (from THIS side of the pond!) Thanks for your perspective.

All of this whining about how bad it is here and we are all slaves. It's pathetic. We have one of the highest standards of living in the world, and we still complain about how crappy everything is.

Of course, what do I know? I've obviously been brainwashed by TPTB.

reply to post by godofme

What are you trying to achieve?

They've clearly expressed that, and it is posted in way too many threads to count.

anyways, I agree with your last statement about volunteering and helping the less fortunate, that just goes without saying.

Interesting to see a view point from "over there" on this as you guys have had your share of protests and riots.

reply to post by phishyblankwaters


Our riots were not about the government, it was mass hysteria, mainly organised by unemployed youth (with criminal records) just snatching and grabbing.

People got so fed up we set up militias to combat rioters and protect local businesses.

reply to post by GeorgiaGirl

All of this whining about how bad it is here and we are all slaves. It's pathetic. We have one of the highest standards of living in the world, and we still complain about how crappy everything is.

oh really?

On comprehensive measures such as the UN Human Development Index the United States is always in the top twenty, currently ranking 4th. On the Human Poverty Index the United States ranked 17th, one rank below the United Kingdom and one rank above Ireland.[4] On the Economist's quality-of-life index the United States ranked 13th, in between Finland and Canada, scoring 7.6 out of a possible 10. The highest given score of 8.3 was applied to Ireland. This particular index takes into account a variety of socio-economic variables including GDP per capita, life expectancy, political stability, family life, community life, gender equality, and job security.[5] The homeownership rate is relatively high compared to other post-industrial nations. In 2005, 69% of Americans resided in their own homes, roughly the same percentage as in the United Kingdom, Belgium, Israel and Canada.[6][7][8] Residents of the United States also enjoy a high access to consumer goods. Americans enjoy more cars and radios per capita than any other nation[9] and more televisions and personal computers per capita than any other large nation.[10][11]

The United States has one of the widest rich-poor gaps of any high-income nation today, and that gap continues to grow.[16] In recent times, some prominent economists including Alan Greenspan have warned that the widening rich-poor gap in the U.S. population is a problem that could undermine and destabilize the country's economy and standard of living stating that "The income gap between the rich and the rest of the US population has become so wide, and is growing so fast, that it might eventually threaten the stability of democratic capitalism itself".[17]

Index Rank
Human Development Index 4th out of 172
GDP (PPP) per capita 7th out of 183
GDP (nominal) per capita 9th out of 183
Quality-of-life Index 13th out of 111
Human Poverty Index 17th out of 19

Source

The overall financial position of the United States as of 2009 includes $50.7 trillion of debt owed by US households, businesses, and governments, representing more than 3.5 times the annual gross domestic product of the United States.[25] As of the first quarter of 2010, domestic financial assetsA totaled $131 trillion and domestic financial liabilities $106 trillion.[28] Tangible assets in 2008 (such as real estate and equipment) for selected sectorsB totaled an additional $56.3 trillion.[99]

Source

Poverty and family status According to the US Census, in 2007 5.8% of all people in married families lived in poverty,[23] as did 26.6% of all persons in single parent households [23] and 19.1% of all persons living alone.[23] [edit] By race/ethnicity and family status Among married families: 5.8% lived in poverty.[23] This number varied by ethnicity with 5.4% of white persons,[24] 8.3% of black persons,[25] and 14.9% of Hispanic persons (of any nationality) [26] living in poverty. Among single parent families: 26.6% lived in poverty.[23] This number varied by ethnicity with 30% of white persons,[24] 40% of black persons,[25] and 30% of Hispanic persons (of any nationality) [26] living in poverty. Among unrelated individuals living alone: 19.1% lived in poverty.[23] This number varied by ethnicity with 18% of white persons [27] 27.9% of black persons [26] and 27% of Hispanic persons (of any nationality) [28] living in poverty [edit] Poverty and race The US Census declared that in 2010 15.1% of the general population lived in poverty:[29] 9.9% of all non-Hispanic white persons 12.1% of all Asian persons 26.6% of all Hispanic persons (of any nationality) 27.4% of all black persons. About half of those living in poverty are non-Hispanic white (19.6 million in 2010),[29] but poverty rates are much higher for blacks and hispanics. Non-Hispanic white children comprised 57% of all poor rural children.[30] [edit] Poverty and age The US Census declared that in 2010 15.1% of the general population lived in poverty: 22% of all people under age 18 13.7% of all people 19-64, and 9% of all people ages 65 and older[29]

Source
Yup, nothing wrong with the system at all. Then again, those must be made up socialist leftist statistics right?

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
reply to post by godofme

 

What are you trying to achieve?

They've clearly expressed that, and it is posted in way too many threads to count.

They????? Who exactly is in charge? There is no clear definition yet, to this day! That is part of the problem. As far as them clearly expressing it in any thread here on ATS, I beg to differ with you! There have been numerous poop lists of what people WANT, and no clear cut definitions as to how "They" plan to go about accomplishing getting any of it.

While I am not completely adverse to these movements, that's about all they are. Movements that are seeming more and more each day like backwards movements!

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
reply to post by godofme

 

What are you trying to achieve?

They've clearly expressed that, and it is posted in way too many threads to count.

anyways, I agree with your last statement about volunteering and helping the less fortunate, that just goes without saying.

Interesting to see a view point from "over there" on this as you guys have had your share of protests and riots.

OWS Leadership cadres have expressed it by written declarations and consensus statements. I think the public problem remains that asking any random person in an OWS camp still gets a discombobulated and generally confused range of answers it's hard to get any cohesive meaning out of.

When even the protesters can articulate the purpose and goals of the protest...and that means ANY protester asked at random....then OWS is getting somewhere for unity and cohesion. Just my thoughts....

It has lost its way, originally it was a call to end corruption in the financial business and politics, which i cant see anyone disaggreing with. Then the news started calling it "anti-capitalist" for whatever reason, and then a load of other people came who where just annoyed that they couldn't afford their pourche or what not.

The news tended to interview these people, or the other people who are anti-capitalists and where calling a complete end and restart to what we use as a system.

End corruption in politics, call in the bailout money from the banks to give back to the tax payer, and give parliament a shake up and sack all of those guilty of fraud (another term for the tax expenses scandal, which WAS fraud, nothing different). That's what they wanted to bring attention too, not all the crap you read/hear about in the news.

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
reply to post by GeorgiaGirl

 

All of this whining about how bad it is here and we are all slaves. It's pathetic. We have one of the highest standards of living in the world, and we still complain about how crappy everything is.

oh really?

Index Rank
Human Development Index 4th out of 172
GDP (PPP) per capita 7th out of 183
GDP (nominal) per capita 9th out of 183
Quality-of-life Index 13th out of 111
Human Poverty Index 17th out of 19

Source

Source
Yup, nothing wrong with the system at all. Then again, those must be made up socialist leftist statistics right?

edit on 18-11-2011 by phishyblankwaters because: (no reason given)

Sorry--those stats don't paint as bleak of a picture to me as they obviously do to you. We will ALWAYS have poverty. Even Jesus said, "the poor will always be with you". Times haven't changed in the past 2000 years... But other than the Human Poverty Index, we're not looking too bad at all on those other ones.

Also--I actually think that some of our poverty statistics are skewed because of unreported income. For example, I know a lady who cleans houses. She gets paid in cash and earns a bundle. She also doesn't report ANY of it as income. I'm pretty sure according to her tax forms she lives in poverty. But in actuality, she drives a really nice car and lives pretty well.

EDIT: I did want to add two things:
1. I am clearly an optimist. The glass is always half full to me. For that reason, I think people could rise above their circumstances if they just tried to.

2. I really don't think some people in America CARE if they are in poverty. My mother, for example. She has always been an artist of sorts, and never made a lot of money. She doesn't care. She NEVER made decisions that would help her provide for herself financially. She just lived the life she wanted to live and to heck with the rest. Right now she is on social security and medicaid. When she hurt herself and had a broken bone, she didn't have enough money and the excess medical bills were "forgiven". Now, she just qualified for some sort of free cell phone from the government (I guess it was the state). So she has enough money for the basics, food stamps, a free cell phone...yet she definitely fits the definition of "poverty". But she doesn't care to do any better than she does. And guess what...she is perfectly happy!

I admit I was perplexed when OWS got going - it looked like Sorros and co, attempting to start a popular revolution. t One that was obviously doomed to failure, I figured there was no way he could be so off on this that there had to be another angle to it.

This is probably all about getting Obama re-elected - by focusing the public imagination on bankers etc as the cause of all the troubles - 'the great enemy of the people'. Instead of Obama fighting a campaign with huge unemployment, depression, debt etc which he is most unlikely to win - he can posture as the one with the greatest antipathy to big money interests. When in truth it is the Dems who actually get most of the big money political donations.

reply to post by godofme


hey Brit from America, first movement here in decades, how many over on you side in past two years, and we don't even burn down areas here its mostly peaceful, what because we are slaves we can't revolt, I say bullsht

reply to post by godofme


And all this coming from a person whose capital city, London has more cameras per square foot than any other place on the planet.

Now, let me ask you kind sir...............and I am partly of English descent, but here's my Irish, Scotch and Welsh blood boiling over..........how much did Prince Charles and Prince William's wedding cost and the police security to boot?

You know who footed the bill don't you?

Now, consider what's down in the Queen's vault...........the jewels, some rubies, diamonds and sapphires that are so large they don't cut them that big anymore.

Ahhhhhhhhhh belongs to the people along with the upkeep and security of Windsor and Balmoral Castle who also foots the bill...............and what does her royal highness do to earn this?

If all this wealth belongs to "the people" let's see you ask the queen to borrow Balmoral Castle for your daughter's wedding............

Wash your own laundry before you tend to ours and bugger off.

Seems to me, England's also having some riots of her own - and it's about bloody time!

This has now become a global issue.

Queen Elizabeth II is the legal owner of about 6,600 million acres of land, one sixth of the earth's non-ocean surface. Source: www.chacha.com...

OWS isn't just about Wall Street America....................got news for ya chap, this may be the beginning of our second American Revolution and progress to the first World Revolution with any luck.

The Queen is clearly one of the 1%.



And if my understanding is correct, your taxes and unemployment rate is higher than ours.

Now as far as helping, yes I volunteer two nights a month at a homeless shelter, have helped out cleaning up and feeding animals at a shelter, taken some old people shopping and given money to various charities although we are on a limited budget and my job was outsourced to India.

Wake up and smell the tea.

Maybe many of you English will keep bowing to HRH but me, I would rather die on my feet fighting than serve on my knees.

reply to post by godofme


The only reason the police are eating up the money for this thing is because the Govt wants to show what is it and who it works for. Nobody is causing them turn this into a total police state action.

The whole arguement that ows is costing the taxpayers money because the cops have to be paid overtime is somewhat true I will agree. But the amount of money it is costing to have these cops work overtime is not even comparible to the amount of taxpayer dollars that went to bail these banks out....It is miniscuel in comparison.

reply to post by llmacgregor

The whole arguement that ows is costing the taxpayers money because the cops have to be paid overtime is somewhat true I will agree. But the amount of money it is costing is not even comparible to the amount of taxpayer dollars that went to bail these banks out....

THIS.

reply to post by godofme


very well said.


i'd like to add more, but it'd only involve insulting the occupiers.

The Queen owns the U.S.A. google it and find the official documents, her name is mentioned in a few of them including the one that talks about Social Security. I'm not making this up and lots of people know about this but don't know what to do and are afraid to discuss it. She is the biggest part of the 1%, before you call me crazy, please research it, I can't link frm my phone.