A Test On Socialism

I received this in my email the other day and wanted to share it with ATS. It shows just what the effects of Socialism has. It says....

A TEST ON SOCIALISM

An economics professor at a local college made a statement that he had never failed a single student before, but had recently failed an entire class. That class had insisted that Obama's socialism worked and that no one would be poor and no one would be rich, a great equalizer.

The professor then said, "OK, we will have an experiment in this class on Obama's plan".. All grade...s will be averaged and everyone will receive the same grade so no one will fail and no one will receive an A.... (substituting grades for dollars - something closer to home and more readily understood by all).

After the first test, the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy. As the second test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too so they studied little.

The second test average was a D! No one was happy.
When the 3rd test rolled around, the average was an F.

As the tests proceeded, the scores never increased as bickering, blame and name-calling all resulted in hard feelings and no one would study for the benefit of anyone else.

To their great surprise, ALL FAILED and the professor told them that socialism would also ultimately fail because when the reward is great, the effort to succeed is great, but when government takes all the reward away, no one will try or want to succeed.

Could not be any simpler than that. END

America was founded as a Republic and a Republic is what it should be restored to. It wasn't founded on Socialism and will never succeed as such IMO. I thought this email was a good example of just how it would work.

Okay, all you socialists, flame away....

reply to post by kennylee


Oh, you'll get your flames...count on it. I posted the exact same story in a reply yesterday and everyone crawled out of the woodwork to tell me the flaws.

I also like these sayings:

1. You can't legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity.

2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.

3. The government can't give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from someone else.

4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.

5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work, because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work, because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is teh beginning of the end of any nation.

But the more I thought about the content of the email and how normally intelligent people believed it, the more I realized this was a fictional story in need of a rewrite. After all, if we're going to engage in overly simplistic generalizations, we should at least make sure the foundation for those generalizations is correct.

If people are going to believe this urban legend, they should at least read one that isn't full of crap.

The professor pointed to one student and said, "In addition to attending class, you will have unlimited access to ask me questions, discuss concepts, and fill in any gaps from class time."

Selecting another four students, the professor continued. "The four of you will meet with me once a week for a study session over lunch. ...

The professor looked around the hall before pointing to ten different students. "The ten of you will have the option of meeting with me during office hours for an hour after each class."

Not missing a beat, the professor selected another five students. "The five of you will have the option of meeting with me outside of class twice during the semester for ten minutes total."

The professor paused for a moment. "As for the eighty students remaining, you will not be allowed to meet with me outside of class or ask questions during class. At the end of the semester, all one hundred of you will be given the same exam. Your grade on that exam will determine your grade in this class."

Several students raised their hands. A handful said that it wasn't fair and went against university policy. Most stared at the professor in shock. The professor chuckled. "Calm down. Now, this is an economics class. And in order to study economics, you need to understand the power implicit within our economic system. You see, the breakdown just given reflects the distribution of wealth in the United States. For most of us, such statistics translate very little into our daily life. We know some people are rich and some people are poor. And within a capitalist system, we recognize that rewarding success and initiative helps society as a whole. The question is, at what point does such a distribution limit success?"

Much more at link. Rewritten to be More Accurate

reply to post by GeorgiaGirl


And here is my response to your post:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by kennylee


This sounds just like the us-government incl. congress and white house. Bickering, blocking etc..

reply to post by GeorgiaGirl


I like those quotes also. I see that Im already starting to feel heat. LOL I got those in the same email, which fits perfectly. I just forgot to add them. Thanks for adding them!

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


To me, Your Urban Legend is much harder to believe.

I cant understand what is wrong with the concept to work hard for what you get. Working and earning your money is not a bad thing. Why do Socialists think that they should be given everything that others have worked for? I just dont get it.

Originally posted by kennylee
I see that Im already starting to feel heat.

Heat? You consider someone presenting the other side of the story that you purposely excluded as "heat"? How very interesting!

And here I thought ATSers were supposed to look at the WHOLE picture instead of picking what suits their agenda... I guess that was the old ATS...

Originally posted by kennylee
Why do Socialists think that they should be given everything that others have worked for? I just dont get it.

It's very clear that you don't get it. It's clear that you don't get what Socialism is... Most people here who argue against it are ignorant of it. I am not a socialist by any means. But I do know what it is.

reply to post by kennylee
Socialists hate to have their failed ideology thrown in their faces.

I personally like the one; if socialists owned the Gobi Dessert, they'd run out of sand.

Good luck, OP.

Of course the OP experiment in flawed.

Where are the grades coming from ? What is really rewarded here ?

This experiment makes me think of someone who is trying to play soccer with the rules of basketball, and then he realises that it doesn't work.

Like someone said, try to understand what socialism really is before trying to test it.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by kennylee
I see that Im already starting to feel heat.

Heat? You consider someone presenting the other side of the story that you purposely excluded as "heat"? How very interesting!

And here I thought ATSers were supposed to look at the WHOLE picture instead of picking what suits their agenda... I guess that was the old ATS...

Originally posted by kennylee
Why do Socialists think that they should be given everything that others have worked for? I just dont get it.

It's very clear that you don't get it. It's clear that you don't get what Socialism is... Most people here who argue against it are ignorant of it. I am not a socialist by any means. But I do know what it is.

I really dont see where you are presenting the other side of the story. You called my story an urban legend, then produced your own.

And instead of telling me how ignorant I am of it, why dont you fill me in on what you believe that socialism is.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by kennylee

 

Socialists hate to have their failed ideology thrown in their faces.

I personally like the one; if socialists owned the Gobi Dessert, they'd run out of sand.

Good luck, OP.

You are 100% correct my friend. And that is a very funny but accurate example of socialism...

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by kennylee

 

Socialists hate to have their failed ideology thrown in their faces.

I personally like the one; if socialists owned the Gobi Dessert, they'd run out of sand.

Good luck, OP.

I could also say that in capitalist hands, the sand would be owned 80% by a handful of people and the 20% of sand that is left would be to the 80% left of people to share.

What country is actually "true socialist" as you OBVIOUSLY assume?
Name one.

There is no question that "hardcore communism" as in the former (!) soviet union, cuba, former (!!) eastern Germany etc. failed - but no one is talking about turning America (or Europe for that matter) into communism anyway.

So..tell me..what's the point of your very childish and naive chain email-thingy there - trying to serve as an explanation what socialism is?

Again..name ONE country where socialism is practiced..in the same way as you describe with "the government taking away rights" etc.. fantasies. For me this sounds like a bunch of 3-5 year olds debating politics - or simply VERY naive and idiotic "fear mongering" and creating panic about supposed "socialism" coming to America.

It's actually sad to see that you Americans are so stubborn and YES, also ignorant that you seriously think any NECESSARY! change in your politics which is somewhat more left than what you were used to would SUPPOSEDLY equal socialism, ending all individual rights and basically turn America into a new "red china" or something. It's just incredible dumb.

but when government takes all the reward away, no one will try or want to succeed.

Which obviously is a picture-book example for classic communism...but again...what has that to do with anything, Obama or the future of your country? You seriously believe America will be communist pretty soon? (Because we all saw how great it worked in the Soviet Union and Eastern Germany? /SARCASM)

Originally posted by gosseyn

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by kennylee

 

Socialists hate to have their failed ideology thrown in their faces.

I personally like the one; if socialists owned the Gobi Dessert, they'd run out of sand.

Good luck, OP.

I could also say that in capitalist hands, the sand would be owned 80% by a handful of people and the 20% of sand that is left would be to the 80% left of people to share.

I agree. It would be owned by the 80% of people that were willing to work 40plus hours a week to obtain it and the other 20% would be left for the 80% of people who didnt want to work and who wanted a free ride.

Socialism that is experience in the World today can no way be construed as a “leveling” system for the population. Socialism today is just another form of a control system.

However,

The Corporatism that we experience in the United States is no better.

Ill-gained wealth should be confiscated by the populace and returned to those who it was stolen from.

Capitalism’s philosophy operates on the premise of a “fair” market.

”Fair” for ALL.

No Americans alive today have ever experience a “fair” market place. The deck has always been staked in the favor of the wealthy. Laws in the United States have been constructed to “favor” those who have influence and connections.

Moral of the Story.

No control system is any better than another, they are ALL control.

Originally posted by flexy123
What country is actually "true socialist" as you OBVIOUSLY assume?
Name one.

There is no question that "hardcore communism" as in the former (!) soviet union, cuba, former (!!) eastern Germany etc. failed - but no one is talking about turning America (or Europe for that matter) into communism anyway.

So..tell me..what's the point of your very childish and naive chain email-thingy there - trying to serve as an explanation what socialism is?

Again..name ONE country where socialism is practiced..in the same way as you describe with "the government taking away rights" etc.. fantasies. For me this sounds like a bunch of 3-5 year olds debating politics - or simply VERY naive and idiotic "fear mongering" and creating panic about supposed "socialism" coming to America.

It's actually sad to see that you Americans are so stubborn and YES, also ignorant that you seriously think any NECESSARY! change in your politics which is somewhat more left than what you were used to would SUPPOSEDLY equal socialism, ending all individual rights and basically turn America into a new "red china" or something. It's just incredible dumb.

edit on 16-11-2011 by flexy123 because: (no reason given)

The Soviet Union, Cuba, and China weren't/aren't even communist in the slightest. They were/are just totalitarian despot states that used the name and idea of communism to falsely lure a good portion of the population under their control so they could seize power.

Originally posted by kennylee

Originally posted by gosseyn

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by kennylee

 

Socialists hate to have their failed ideology thrown in their faces.

I personally like the one; if socialists owned the Gobi Dessert, they'd run out of sand.

Good luck, OP.

I could also say that in capitalist hands, the sand would be owned 80% by a handful of people and the 20% of sand that is left would be to the 80% left of people to share.

I agree. It would be owned by the 80% of people that were willing to work 40plus hours a week to obtain it and the other 20% would be left for the 80% of people who didnt want to work and who wanted a free ride.

I'm sure that the people who use wage slaves and children to do their production in foreign countries, pay zero taxes at all, exploit loopholes, and bribe politicians have really earned their wealth.

The number one problem in any economical system is scarcity. We should not talk about any economical system without first talking about the scientific and technological level of that particular society.

Today, science tells us that we can technically overcome scarcity for a large number of human needs. Only the fear of change is holding us back.

Everything else is ideological BS.

reply to post by brokedown

Capitalism’s philosophy operates on the premise of a “fair” market.

”Fair” for ALL.

No Americans alive today have ever experience a “fair” market place. The deck has always been staked in the favor of the wealthy.

This is a true statement because the deck is stacked in favor of the wealthy, even though Capitalism is supposed to be Fair for everyone. But at the same time, how many of the wealthy have literally earned their wealth by working everyday of the week and working long hours?

I really dont have any answers on how to solve this dilemma. Capitalism IMO is the best way to go, although it needs some fine tuning to make it work like it was intended to work. I was raised that if you worked hard you could get what you want and/or need. Thats all Im saying. Hard work never hurt anyone.