What we already knew about religion and the church

If the church truly was acting on behalf of God then explain why it hordes billions while millions starve every day

God need a new boat so rattle the collection tin!!

www.youtube.com...

Where it is easy to jump in and beleive everything you see read or hear, I dont automatically beleive everything in the above link. However there is much that we do know for sure and that alone is more than ebough to wonder....

This is why I cant bring myself to beleive in God

There are a couple of parts to your post, one is that the Church is sitting on billions of dollars and wasting the collection money. I don't think that's accurate, but that's the smaller part of your post.

What concerns me more is your position that 1) the Catholic Church isn't acting on behalf of God and 2) that you don't believe in God. If there isn't any God, then who is the Church not acting on behalf of?

Were you expecting the Catholics, or any other religion, to act on behalf of God? Why were you expecting that? You have high expectations of a group that you claim can't even get the question of "Is there a God?" right.

Why are you letting some other group determine for you whether God exists?

I'm not attacking, just letting you know why I'm confused.

Well for one thing you should not have to pay to be a member , that I think is what has been upsetting the church and their drop in followers . Charging user fees for their increased life style just adds to the dismay of people when they are taken away from the herd . They can actually see it for what it really is , a for profit organisation . The profits are not spread out evenly but it should be . Your not alone in your disbelief .

They wear rose colored glasses almost , behind locked doors , secret passages . If it is supposed to be a free religion , then ? Not unlike the fine print at the bottom of a contract which no one ever cares to look at , but you never signed . Compare it to all the ads in the media and see the similarities between them .

The double standards are so obvious , but not to them they do not really care . Sorry we are closed come back when we are open and we will try to answer you questions then . Do as they say not as they do , what kind of rational is that . Imagine your self outside the church with the same tin collecting to survive , how fast would you be considered as taking from God . Wasn't aware of any non competition clause in the contract .

Begging to survive and begging for selfish profit and greed , isn't that suppose to be wrong ( Greed ) as far as the church goes ? Inquiring minds want to know , answers not coming any time soon .

Forgive me, watchdog8110, what religion are you speaking of?

Well for one thing you should not have to pay to be a member , that I think is what has been upsetting the church and their drop in followers . Charging user fees for their increased life style just adds to the dismay of people when they are taken away from the herd .

Charging to be a member? User fees? You can't be talking about the Catholic Church.

They can actually see it for what it really is , a for profit organisation . The profits are not spread out evenly but it should be .

You mean they've managed to fool the money hungry IRS and their auditors all these years?

They wear rose colored glasses almost , behind locked doors , secret passages . If it is supposed to be a free religion , then ? Not unlike the fine print at the bottom of a contract which no one ever cares to look at , but you never signed . Compare it to all the ads in the media and see the similarities between them .

I don't understand your point here at all. Could you try explaining it in a different way?

The double standards are so obvious , but not to them they do not really care . Sorry we are closed come back when we are open and we will try to answer you questions then . Do as they say not as they do , what kind of rational is that .

Are you asking why the Church doesn't hire priests to sit in the Church 24/7? A priest is almost always available in case of emergency.

Imagine your self outside the church with the same tin collecting to survive , how fast would you be considered as taking from God .

Churches give money and support to the poor, I've been involved in it myself.

Wasn't aware of any non competition clause in the contract .

What contract? What clause?

Begging to survive and begging for selfish profit and greed , isn't that suppose to be wrong ( Greed ) as far as the church goes ? Inquiring minds want to know , answers not coming any time soon .

Yes the Church has to beg to survive, why is that greed?

Lets see , depending on the religion and lets say you go into the church wearing the same clothes as Jesus wore because that is the only clothes on your back , what would your expectations be from the members . Now do it and see what takes place there is a test and a lesson learned from those who would think nothing of it . Those that would whisper and gossip after , would they be lacking in your scriptures teachings . More teachings for them because they just don't get it ?

Religions , no matter what the belief need more followers to make them more recognized and have a higher status among the masses to be a ruling religion . Popularity contest of , my religion is right and yours is wrong . Convert or suffer gods wrath . Religious wars still go on because of lack of respect for your brothers and sisters .

When a person does not pray with the rest of the huddled masses for prayer and does it on what they believe is holy ground since it is all supposed to be holy right . Explain to me why it is seen as better to be in a specific building on a certain day for that religion to be validated .

How many times does a person need to read their scriptures before they figure out what is right and what is wrong when treating each other ? Ask yourself if you EVER were opposed to another belief and saw your religion as the only one that should be recognized and why others have not chosen as you have . Then look through their eyes and wonder if they are doing the same .

Dear watchdog8110,

A pleasure to hear from you again. I hope you don't mind if I offer my opinions on these new points you've raised.

Lets see , depending on the religion and lets say you go into the church wearing the same clothes as Jesus wore because that is the only clothes on your back , what would your expectations be from the members . Now do it and see what takes place there is a test and a lesson learned from those who would think nothing of it . Those that would whisper and gossip after , would they be lacking in your scriptures teachings . More teachings for them because they just don't get it ?

If I understand you correctly, then you are right. Of course there's going to be comments if someone walks in dressed as Jesus, the same would happen if they came in dressed as Lady Gaga. But if they saw that person as lesser, then yeah, they would need more work in humility and improper judging. We're only humans though, trying to become holy. We'll screw up daily.

Religions , no matter what the belief need more followers to make them more recognized and have a higher status among the masses to be a ruling religion . Popularity contest of , my religion is right and yours is wrong . Convert or suffer gods wrath . Religious wars still go on because of lack of respect for your brothers and sisters .

You're right again that a lack of respect is a terrible thing and a sin. I don't think you're quite correct on the rest of the paragraph though.

When a person does not pray with the rest of the huddled masses for prayer and does it on what they believe is holy ground since it is all supposed to be holy right . Explain to me why it is seen as better to be in a specific building on a certain day for that religion to be validated .

Praying anywhere and anytime is a wonderful thing and the Church applauds it. Why get together once a week? To keep from getting isolated, to remind ourselves that we are part of a community who share a belief in God, and to have communal prayer.

How many times does a person need to read their scriptures before they figure out what is right and what is wrong when treating each other ? Ask yourself if you EVER were opposed to another belief and saw your religion as the only one that should be recognized and why others have not chosen as you have . Then look through their eyes and wonder if they are doing the same .

I think we know what is right and wrong in our dealings with others, even without poring over every word the Bible. As far as other religions, they're not my beliefs, and I know why they're not, but only some religions have forced conversions. (I've heard the Muslims do in some circumstances.)

Anyway, I hope I'm making some sense.

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by charles1952


almost all religious people I have ever talked to think that God is acting through them or they are acting through God. If something bad happens then its put down to God working in mysterious ways.

anyway thw main point about my thread is that if the pope truly BELEIVED that there is a god and he would go to heven for all eternity and all he had to do to get there was spend other peoples money (church goers) to help the starving, then I think the vaticans vaults would be empty.....END OF!

reply to post by Scott495


Scott495,

I assume that when you finished your last post with END OF, you were saying you were finished with the conversation. OK, it's your call. Be well.

Charles1952

Originally posted by Scott495
reply to post by charles1952

 

almost all religious people I have ever talked to think that God is acting through them or they are acting through God. If something bad happens then its put down to God working in mysterious ways.

Ugh, I wish I could argue that point. I HATE that about the church (I'm a Christian, btw, and a churchgoer). There are so many people out there who seem to think that because they go to church, or because they've read the Bible, they somehow have some "inside track" when it comes to God; that they are instruments of His, and beyond reproach.

That's so untrue, and so unscriptural. More often than not it seems like God's will is done despite us, not because of us... the Bible itself offers numerous examples of this. Moses didn't want to talk to Pharaoh; Jonah didn't want to preach to Nineveh; David preferred Bathsheba (the mother of Solomon) to the wife he already had, and murdered to get her; even the greatest example, Israel rejected her own Messiah!

With that said though... God DOES use His people to do His will... and there are many good, humble people out there who silently go about their business helping the poor, preaching God's Word, and reaching out to their communities without seeking their own glory or honour. And THAT is the kind of person that God's Word calls Christians to be... not self-inflated 'Christians' who get their kicks out of claiming some kind of spiritual supremacy over the rest of us.

anyway thw main point about my thread is that if the pope truly BELEIVED that there is a god and he would go to heven for all eternity and all he had to do to get there was spend other peoples money (church goers) to help the starving, then I think the vaticans vaults would be empty.....END OF!

I agree wholeheartedly with this statement. Churches should not ever have spare cash. That simple. If they're truly doing God's Work, than any income they receive (as gifts/tithes from their congregations) should almost immediately go back OUT of the church in order to help those in need. The Blble presents a really clear picture of exactly that happening in the opening chapters of Acts. People were selling their land, even, and giving the proceeds to the church... and the church was putting that money straight back into the community, taking care of widows and the poor etc.

If the church did that today (and some do) in the way that we are commanded to, the world would have a much higher opinion of the church than it currently does.

...but then, humility and servitude never was very popular, was it.

"Because i found the devil here i know this is GODS country"dmx
That's one of my favorite quotes and i think it fits here.

Scott495
First I think it is most important to realize the Church of God and His Christ is not the great cathedral or any denomination but is where two of three are gathered together in His Name and He is present in the midst.

It isn't the way to follow the majority that Christ speaks of. He said. - -
Mt 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Mt 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Mt 7:15 ¶ Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

False teachers, prophets abound today. The right way is to get out His Word the KJV Bible is my pick of all of them and follow Him. Today what is preached is a feel good religion that all are saved in their sins. Not so, just read the word, He came to dwell in you and then you are empowered to walk as He walked upon this earth. I personally find that all denominational churches so called have gone back into Babylon the Great that the reform movement brought about and yet even then no complete reform in all points where accomplished by any as all began to take in false teachings and men's words over His Word.

Today the call is to come out of her, Babylon the Great, my people and I tell to all, that all the denominational churches as they all have joined in this "emerging church" theology which is a one world religion thrust that puts all into a deeper apostasy than any have ever been into.

Best Choice be a Home church persons as Jesus and the disciples were in that day when the church was desperately corrupt. Get into His Word and follow Him and only Him is the only safe path, that straight and narrow way that but a very, very few will find today. Sibbs.

honestly I a bit taken aback by the great posts here. very interesting and made me think