Want to watch it all burn down to the ground

This is so hard to word the way i want it, but what im trying to say is, there is so much going on in the world right now. Everyday more and more people are waking up to the world and the crap system we ALL live in.

Everyday more and more people seem to actually be doing something about it (or at least attempting), whether it be by helping something go viral, or attending an OWS movement. Societys "Voice" is becoming quite loud if you will.

But....even though my stance on the issue is FOR the people and that i wish that we truly could all band together to "take down the system", i still have my personall conclusion on the topic as a whole.

My opinion: The world we live in as per the moment, is based upon a system that is failing and will eventually fail. A system that is based upon PAPER currency, AKA "Monopoly money" The system is currently being stretched out as much as it can, digging its razor sharp claws in as deep as possible, ripping and shredding as much as it can before it goes.

Nothing ever goes quiet. We the people were quiet for so long, and now more and more raise their voice. Put there hands up and say "STOP, this isnt working out". Awesome. Thats really great to hear and im glad in ways. Its finally getting around that things are a little bit jacked up and need to be fixed.

Thats where I hit the dead end. Fact is, we want things fixed. We want things better, but everything we know is based upon the system that worked for 1 and failed 99. I do not believe things can heal unless the current "system" is eradicated.

I see everything like a bank loan right now. The world we live in and the system it's based upon is the loan, and life is the bank trying to collect. We cant afford the loan anymore, and are now realising that it was a pretty bad deal to begin with. We, over time, have had to ask the bank every now and then to get an extension (or a patch) and we last a little bit longer. But now.....now it is end of line.

I dont want to wait anymore. I wish it would just happen already. The crash i mean. Stick it all on the end of a knife and watch it bleed untill it turns pale and cold. Maybe that sounds rough, and a bit unconventional, but so does strecthing a system that we the people already know to be failing.

Whats the point? Why keep the current system? It sucks and i cant deny that. Give me the radical label. I dont care. Im not radical about it really. Im in the military, i cant really be radical on a topic like that and live comfortably. They do talk to us. They do threaten us (In a kind "just to let you know" type of way)

Summarized, i hate the system. I find it illogical to attempt to "save" anything about it.

What else will we do? What other way is there? I dont know the answer to that, but what i do know is that as human beings, we will find a way. Its what we were born to do. Since the beginning.

Thanks for your time.

I have lots of time on my hands. Currently on watch right now. This is when i ever really post anymore.

If anyone wants to ask me anything to clarify what i mean please dont be afraid to ask. I firmly stand by my opinion, so please dont attempt a "mission". Its truthfully one of the more annoying things i see people do. Express your opinion, but dont try to sway. Im opinionated but also open minded.

You're not alone.. It always seems to get worse instead of better..
I try not to worry about it though.. seriously.. in the next few years 'powers' and 'governments' and 'money' wont mean a hell of a lot. They are clinging to what they know, because suddenly nothing is as certain as they thought it was. Historians will look back on this time as the difficult teen years of civilization.
Our Earth will do all the 'cleaning' that needs to be done.. I'm certain of that.
And in three years if I'm wrong.. quote me .

Snf OP..

Originally posted by Deplume
You're not alone.. It always seems to get worse instead of better..
I try not to worry about it though.. seriously.. in the next few years 'powers' and 'governments' and 'money' wont mean a hell of a lot. They are clinging to what they know, because suddenly nothing is as certain as they thought it was. Historians will look back on this time as the difficult teen years of civilization.
Our Earth will do all the 'cleaning' that needs to be done.. I'm certain of that.
And in three years if I'm wrong.. quote me .

Snf OP..

Ha i like that. The "teen" years. I will assure you its not worrying me. I guess you could say that im impatient, awaiting collapse. Happily to be honest.

reply to post by mthgs602


I think I know what you mean. It's hard to see the 99% struggling and things getting worse at a faster pace. I want it to stop spiraling down, but I know that means we hit a bottom and things will get rough for a while. It's really hard to put words to it but I guess what I'm trying to say is I want the change faster than we're getting it. OWS is a good sign but winters coming and I'm sure not as many people are gonna be willing to stick out the cold. Maybe I don't have as much faith in OWS as I should. I remember "waking up" two years ago and not really seeing anyone IRL who was aware of what was going on and now there's the Occupy movement all over the world. I hope a change comes soon and I hope We don't have to completely fall apart before we change the current system. I'm pretty sure everything's gonna fall apart though and waiting for it is like torture.

Originally posted by xthe11thdoctorx
reply to post by mthgs602

 

I think I know what you mean. It's hard to see the 99% struggling and things getting worse at a faster pace. I want it to stop spiraling down, but I know that means we hit a bottom and things will get rough for a while. It's really hard to put words to it but I guess what I'm trying to say is I want the change faster than we're getting it. OWS is a good sign but winters coming and I'm sure not as many people are gonna be willing to stick out the cold. Maybe I don't have as much faith in OWS as I should. I remember "waking up" two years ago and not really seeing anyone IRL who was aware of what was going on and now there's the Occupy movement all over the world. I hope a change comes soon and I hope We don't have to completely fall apart before we change the current system. I'm pretty sure everything's gonna fall apart though and waiting for it is like torture.

Torture hits the nail on the head. I enjoy getting on ATS and checking the new stories, crossing my fingers, hoping that just maybe its happening today. Im done with awaiting revolution. When does it all break down?

It's not in me to find fault in another persons opinion based on their own experiences. But for my own part it is sometimes better to live happy in your own world than to live fear in this one.

My daughter asked me the other day if I wanted her to go to college when she got older. I told her that it was something that we had plenty of time to think about it. (she was nine at the time). She than said to me in a tone of pure confience, "if the world iis going to end next year, why if I thought the world was going to end next year would need to save and plan for college. That we should just be more mellow.

After the end of her long speech of all that is wrong in this world, I looked at her and said; "Whether you follow someone down the road of life or your leading the way for others. Your actions, whether the be just or unjust, they are in fact YOUR OWN".

How you treat yourself and others around will stick with you no matter what happens in this worl. And to give up on this world is basically saying your giving up your family and friends. Create your own world within the rules.

reply to post by mthgs602

Fact is, we want things fixed. We want things better, but everything we know is based upon the system that worked for 1 and failed 99. I do not believe things can heal unless the current "system" is eradicated.

Which system are you referring to?

IT sounds to me like you are blaming civilization itself for the crimes and malfeasance of the current, predatory incarnation of the system that we inhabit....

And I assure you, that the vast majority of the civilization is functioning perfectly well, with good intentions, and prosperity for all.


It's just the Tip-Top of the pyramid that is corrupt, so to speak.

Or, as an analogy.... If our civilization is A car... you don't scrap the Entire car because it is swerving in and out of traffic, hitting pedestrians, and causing property damage....

You take the driver to Jail.

I see everything like a bank loan right now. The world we live in and the system it's based upon is the loan, and life is the bank trying to collect. We cant afford the loan anymore, and are now realising that it was a pretty bad deal to begin with. We, over time, have had to ask the bank every now and then to get an extension (or a patch) and we last a little bit longer. But now.....now it is end of line.

I'm sorry, but your analogy is somewhat flawed.

Civilization is inherently progressive for all participants, otherwise we never would have started it in the first place.

It has become corrupted over time, yes, I grant you that... and actually agree wholeheartedly....

But to claim that civilization is BASED upon the destruction of humanity, or whatever is a base assertion fallacy, it's just not true.


We have an Economic system that basically screws over everyone in attendance except a few ultra rich people that profit from the sweat, blood, and tears of the majority.... but that's not inherent in the Civilization... that's just the result of clever sabotage.

Whats the point? Why keep the current system? It sucks and i cant deny that.

Honestly, It really depends completely on what you mean by "The System"

Because there are alot of gradients that you are not specifying.

The BANKING system?

Yeah, sure.... End the Fed... I'm with you 100 percent...


End Agriculture based Society?

No... I don't think so.

End industrial Society?

No, of course not.

End Technological Advancement?

Heavens NO.


So, what are you speaking of when you refer to the "System"?

Because there is A LOT here that is worth saving, actually.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


You seem im talking about the system that runs all the "systems" you were attempting to figure out. Read the OP. Everything is interconnceted by one large system.

If you want to use a slightly off example, then use this.

Bush drove the USA to hell. He was voted for twice.

Now, we have another driver.....who is also driving us further into hell. Bad example, but im just following yours.

reply to post by mthgs602


I dont like the system either. I think it causes a lot or worldwide wide problems. But I dont just want to see it destroyed a lot of people are supported by the system. We have to tred with care...
Nice Post...)

Originally posted by purplemer
reply to post by mthgs602

 

I dont like the system either. I think it causes a lot or worldwide wide problems. But I dont just want to see it destroyed a lot of people are supported by the system. We have to tred with care...
Nice Post...)

I understand that. i understand that it would be very tough for some. But i also beleive if you want humans to band together truly, we must take away the system we all so heavily rely upon.

But you are right. I do not want to see it like that either but i beleive there are two ways to all of it now. continue the spiralling downwardness, or make it stop at its current all time crapfest before we hit lava bottom.

Good Morning boys and girls...time for some historical perspective...

We are not anywhere we have never been before. Go look up the Great Depression, and please use something besides YouTube and Wikipedia... they are called books...libraries full of them.

Look up the riots of the Great Depression, read the Grapes of Wrath, look up Bonus Army, or Huey Long and All the King's Men

Go and listen to the songs, the music of the day....

Hell, if you can find someone still alive, talk to someone that lived through the Great Depression.

Then go and read The Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire

Folks, we have seen far worse than what we are going through now. The system we have is not ideal, but it is the best in town so far. BUT we better have a system ready and in place before we bring the whole house down upon our heads... because what may take it's place will be far worse.

There are a lot of young people here...that's good. But go and read and see the old Soviet Union and the old Communist China...this is where all the class warfare talk will take us. I remember seeing people fighting over the limited food available in their stores... the limits on freedom and expression. Does anybody here remember Tainniman Square?

As far as the protests go... they may sem pivotal to many of you... go and lookup some archives on the VietNam War protests or the Civil Rights Marches... OWS pales in comparison. I remember seeing in person the Washington Mall between the memorials filled with people and spilling out into the streets....and the movement was everywhere... not just a few dozen in Potunk Illinois...and a few hundred in San Francisco...but thousands and in the big cities, it was tens of thousands. I remember the Chicagop Democratic Convention of 1968.... thousands marching and protesting and city blocks on fire and cops were literally beating and shooting their way through crowds... The world really looked like it was falling apart.

Or the world "crisis" in Europe... it's happened before and that is why it is so dangerous. What will rise out of the abyss...last time it was Hitler and Stalin and Hirohito.

And be careful of all the talk of the "People's Movement" or "Worker's Movement"...these are the words of Marxist. Look at Russia about 1914-1920... the White Party and the Red party and all the class warfare talk ave way to Communist Russia and Lenin...You think you have no rights now? You just wait.... That government dictated what you could buy, when you could buy, what you could plant, and when you could plant...even if it smacked of insanity... they dictated to that end.

As for the USa being on par with the Roman Empire...I say it's a valid argument.

The Romans were brought down by (1)an overbearing government that destroyed the middle class by over taxation, (2)an over extension of borders it could maintain, an over extension of armies it could support, and an over extension of political influence, and (3) the influx of peoples and immigrants that reaped the rewards of Roman Civilization without any loyalty, assimilation, and substantial contribution back to that civilization.

Sound familiar?

Further, if you have not succeeded in the US... it really is your own fault. I have risen and fallen twice in my life. For the third time, I am back... and I am enjoying a decent life from my hard work. To make it in the world is hard work. It requires hours and weeks and years of toil, learning new concepts, adapting, sacrificing, scrimping and saving, investing, night school, late nights followed by early mornings....but you can succeed.

I think the biggest obstacle for so many people younger than 30 is they were taught in their young and formualtive years that everyone is a winner... everybody gets on the team... nobody is a loser... everyone has equal opportunity and equal ability... no matter what you strive for, you always get the cookie and gold star... we are all champions with minimal effort.

Folks, that is a LIE. Not everyone can be the winner, and we all don't get the Barbie Fantasy Mansion with the Barbie Fantasy Mobile. No matter how hard we try, not everyone will be CEO and President of the company...and Life is NOT fair... sometimes, Shht happens...sometimes bad things happen to good people. That is life.

The question is "What can you do with your life?" What really makes you happy? Are you willing to work... I mean work and get dirt for what you want? Are you able to pick yourself up from failure and get back in the game?

After you have read the above books, I suggest some reading on people that tried and failed and then succeeded... that's right...Heroes. A good ol' fashioned hero. Heck...you could start with something easy...say Willie Nelson, then maybe Eisenhower, then George Washington or Sam Houston.

Go visit a VA Hospital or retirement Home to be humbled and inspired.

OK... I am done now.

reply to post by AlreadyGone



So you just basically said what people are sick of and i dont think realise it. Clearly stated many accounts where the current system fails then rises, fails then rises. The system spits out men who are smart enough to figure out the system, and then take advantage of it and the people within it. We are playing a huge game of monopoly. Always have thus far.

I dont care to yet again "fix" the system. Its already been patched a thousand times. What that tells me is that we already know, before we put that patch on, that its going to fail again anyways.

Its truly sad because of the dependancy.

And further more, i never said i failed, or am unsuccesful. I live a plenty happy life right now. But only RIGHT NOW. There are NEVER gaurantees that things will work, even if you try hard. Not everyone can be rich.

Why? Because the rich like it that way. If the system were truly that great, everyone would drive a ferrari, and have indoor pools and bla bla. We are in a controlled environment. Thats just the way the system is.

I fear the change, and I look forward to it. I've never been "happy within the system" even though I only Really woke up just a few years ago. I understand what's going to happen better than most, and have literally spent my entire adult life getting to know "people" better. I have talked to so many thousands of people from all over the world that I feel I truly have more of a dial in on people than most.

I have kept my cool, I have learned a lot by listening, and I have learned more by asking the right questions.

The time is coming soon enough OP, remember it was the Banks, and that the government wont be there to help ever again. You'll have to mass with the rabble for any chance. I could blend in to any group. I mean that. It sounds like a boast, but you're just gonna have to trust me I guess.

I imagine I will do well if I choose to. I wish you all the best. Good luck people. Pucker time is about here.

reply to post by mthgs602


Your response has to do with the nature of man. You can never "fix" man... even Jesus said "the poor will always be with us."

As for systems...there have been countless systems besides capitalism... the 2 weak legs in everyone of those systems goes back to two things:

Everyone is to be equal. Everyone shares equally in the work and in the rewards... sounds good. But, (1) does everyone put forth equal effort? (2) Who administers the equallity and for how long?

Not everone puts forth equall effort... by choice or ability. If you are suppose to work in a field growing cabbages... You have 2 rows a day to work..just like everybody else. JoeBlow does 1 and 1/2.. but still gets paid for 2... you do 3, but still get paid for 2... How long are you gonna keep doing 3 rows a day?

Eventually, production will go to just 2 rows a day...maybe. There goes innovation, there goes surplus production... there goes initiative...good bye.

As for distribution and administering equallity...Who does it? Once we pick who... will they distribute equallity equally...Or will favors and kickbacks come to fruition and some get the "more equal parts" than others? In other words...everybody gets chicken for dinner...who gets the chicken feet and gizzards... who gets the breast?

And how long will the administrators of equallity continue to distribute equallity? Since utopia is never reached, the administrators will always be in power... thus becoming the new ruling class...look at the old Soviet Union... the chairmen always had the best of equality... everyone got free housing...they just got the free housing that was lake front... everyone got chicken...they just always got the breast. And when everyone ate chicken... they ate the steak that someone bribed them with to get part of the chicken breast.

If you don't believe it.. look to some of the problems arising in OWS...squabbles in OWS about finaces and needs and how they are divided up... Who gets to do laundry first? Everyone gets showers...Who gets to use the hot water and who gets lukewarm?

I have these same feelings at times... Usually when I think too long about things and become angry at the whole messed up situation. Or when I see people who haven't got a clue, worried about what movie to see, what new this or that to buy, etc when they don't really have the money to be spending anyway. When people want to talk about the Kardashians, and I want to talk about the economy.

I have a feeling that it won't be much longer, in fact I'm fairly sure we'll have our answer as to how it all goes down by the end of next year. Things are gaining momentum right now... More and more each day.

I figure a year isn't so long to wait. I just keep hoping that history doesn't repeat itself and that something major happens that changes the whole paradigm. It's wishful thinking, but it's about all the hope I have left.

Originally posted by SilverStarGazer
I have these same feelings at times... Usually when I think too long about things and become angry at the whole messed up situation. Or when I see people who haven't got a clue, worried about what movie to see, what new this or that to buy, etc when they don't really have the money to be spending anyway. When people want to talk about the Kardashians, and I want to talk about the economy.

I have a feeling that it won't be much longer, in fact I'm fairly sure we'll have our answer as to how it all goes down by the end of next year. Things are gaining momentum right now... More and more each day.

I figure a year isn't so long to wait. I just keep hoping that history doesn't repeat itself and that something major happens that changes the whole paradigm. It's wishful thinking, but it's about all the hope I have left.

Ahh thank you. You bring up a great point in this mess. I too also find that more people want to talk about T.V. shows, and etc. Ill talk about things that are the real time and people think im a nerd/geek/acivist (by mainstream def)/conspiracy theorist (even when im spitting fact)

Exactly. I have stopped talking about most things I'm interested in bc I'm tired of being attacked or considered nuts. It's sad that many people even look down on me bc I'd rather be learning and researching things than watching TV. I have a couple friends IRL that I can talk to about real topics which keeps me sane. Over the last couple years I have increasingly spent more time alone as I tend to prefer it over being around these clueless people. I feel like I've totally lost my patience with these people and find myself becoming annoyed and agitated when I'm forced to be around them. I've even had to distance myself from my family. My grandfather died earlier this year and he was the only voice of reason, even if he didn't always agree with me, he at least respected my opinions and would listen without judging or dismissing me. That's over now, and I miss him so much, but I'm not sad he's gone bc he was suffering from his 3rd bout with cancer, and I didn't want him to be in pain anymore. I've been shunned by family for my beliefs on death as well... Apparently there's something wrong with me bc I don't cry and I am happy he died. I'm not happy he died but that's how they see it.

Anyway, I'm just glad that there is a large group of people that share my beliefs online and I think it really helps to get things out on this site and others. It's good to feel that we're not alone, and that more people are waking up all the time.

reply to post by mthgs602


Ok, excellent... then we are on the same page.

You seem im talking about the system that runs all the "systems" you were attempting to figure out. Read the OP. Everything is interconnceted by one large system.

Yes, generally speaking, this system that you are talking about is the interconnected Economic, and Industrial Civilization of the planet earth, that is interconnected on a global scale.

If you want to use a slightly off example, then use this.

Bush drove the USA to hell. He was voted for twice.

Now, we have another driver.....who is also driving us further into hell. Bad example, but im just following yours.

Yes, Metaphorically I agree with you, in that the system is currently being used for the destruction of civilization, and economic stability, for the purpose of raising a small group of people up above everyone else, at the expense of the majority of the planet.

My only point of contention, is that the SYSTEM, is actually working Frighteningly well.

The only reason that the people who are currently in control of the system (Read: Not the president of the united states, but the people who own the banks, and media) are able to profit, is because the system works so darn well.

And I feel that the best, most efficient, and timely solution to the problems that the System is causing, is to take back control OF that system, and use it instead to HELP the people of the world, and civilization, and the planet, instead of just dismantling it wholesale.

Then, instead of the system working to make a handful of people obscenely wealthy, it can be used to lift humanity up to greater heights than have ever been known before in human history.

And you know what? It would be amazingly efficient towards that end.