United States v.s. Russia?

THE PROBLEM WITH THE US VS. RUSSIA IS THE NUKES. AND I DON'T WANT TO HEAR PEOPLE SAY THAT THEY WILL NOT BE USED. IF RUSSIA HAS THE OPPERTUNITY TO FIRE A NUKE ON THE US THEY WILL...... BUT IF U TAKE NUKES OUT OF THE PICTURE THE US WILL DOMINATE RUSSIA..... END OF STORY.

The US would be crushed in a war with Russia. The reason being, its military is spread way too thin right now. That's all there is to it. End of story.

reply to post by Gazrok


plasma stealth

reply to post by Mokuhadzushi


God said that is Israel's land. Israel has given up a lot of the land it took from tha Palestinians and still they are attacked by rockets. The Arabs can't win. It has already been pre-destined.

I find it interesting that this thread is years old. I was expecting it to be brand new current news given that Sarah Palin recently said that she would support a war against Russia if it becomes 'necessary'.

link

reply to post by 10DeadInside10

reply to post by 10DeadInside10


I am going to answer your question hypothetically using suggestion of some weapons that we may or may not have, I honestly do not know for sure, but for the sake of this post I will assume that at least two of the supposed weapons are real.
As far as I can tell from tv shows on ufo's and footage from nasa's own cameras. I believe that star wars technology is already deployed and functioning. So if Russia does decide to launch and the key word there is launch a ballistic missile then most likely it will be disabled or shot down.
The other weapon is much more powerful but I am not as sure of it's actual existence or functionality. HAARP or the high amplitude aural research project has been reported to have the ability to:
change weather,
completely disrupt communications while using the jamming frequency as our own communication platform,
scramble people mentally,
send up a ultra low frequency beam to bounce off of the electrically charged ionosphere which in turn through the use of simple geometry comes back down as a mega lightening bolt powerful enough to wipe an entire city completely off the map (a nuke without the radiation).
Either country has the ability to detonate a nuke 3-4 miles above the country thus allowing the emp shock wave to effectively send the other country back to the early 1900's and I mean that literally.
If what we reportedly have is true, hands down they have no chance. If not, I think it's a wash and everyone but Europe and Asia loses.

I think we should not even talk about a war between USA and Russia, we both would lose a lot. The last thing this world need is another useless war.

Sure both parties are hot headed in a showdown of power. I doubt that any nukes will be used, too many things at state. The world's climate could be afffected by the nuclear clouds. This will not just affect the US or Russia but the ecosystem and other countries as the climate changes.

That said, I would not underestimate Russia, I have seen them in action and they are a force to reckon with. The US has technological superiority as a saying, it has not been proven so far that Russia was that far behind.

So lets not talk about a face-off,it would be bad for everyone. Isn't the world polluted enough? I say get rid of politics and religion, we'll have world peace

reply to post by Shining Wizard


The russians are very sneeky, in fact, over 90% of all information about russia are just estimations, this includes populations, amount of troops, how much oil they have, etc. 10% is known

Russia is one of the only nations with conscription, in which all troops are fully supplied

The CIA estimate the russians spend up to 300/'400 billion US dollars worth on modernizing there military, who knows the real number.

The russian economy gets 200 billion US on oil sales with Europe

The UN estimates that 12% of known oil sources are russian, The russians are using only 25% of their nations oil, 75% is there but are being unused

The russians are one of the only nations that didn't suffer from the food crisis

The Russian government under President Medenov (Yes vladimer putin is only the prime minister, not the president) encourages the use of Paramilitary forces, in fact, georgia was invaded with a paramilitary division, fully supplied.

Russia is not a communist state anymore, they run under a democratic system!

the Russian military has a very good Logistics corps

Russian industry is one of the greatest just behind USA and China

So you see, the russians are logistically ready

so if a war with america happened, the russians wouldn't get rolled as easily as you predict, but then again, im not saying the americans would get rolled, no nukes would be used, thanks to the American International missile defense system, which targets not any but all nuke,s this include US nukes for some reason.

This will be conventional warfare, both sides are good fighters, both well supplied and both heavily armed, all that matters is the commanders wisdom and the troops determination, thats what wins wars

May i say this, Russia is the largest country in the world
17,000,000 square kilometres
Only 6,000,000 is what we know as Siberia, which is unfertile but has a alot of oil

11,000,000 is fertile, we don't know what the russians are hiding from our eyes.

reply to post by astrocreep

Amen to that. Sometimes I feel like the Lone Ranger. I grow so weary of the Hate Israel group that I could puke. They can't check their history, and instead rely on simplistic rhetoric.

Well spoken, guys.

reply to post by Equinox99


May i say this:
The Fall of the USSR crippled the russians, not to mention the russian economy crisis of 1998

but then again...

They threatened to nuke beijing because the chinese wanted some of their newly discovered oil on the Russo-Chinese border

The russians closed the border with china, executing any illegal immigrants, to remind anyone what happens to you if you [SNIP] if the russians

The CIA estimate that the russian are spending over 350/400 billion US dollars to modernize and increase their military, the rea lnumber is unknown

The current economy crisis has affected the world, unless your china or russia

The chinese dollar increased by 5%

The russian dollar increased by 11%

In fact, the russian economy with the Chinese economy are on frequent rise, why, because the west still buys russian oil

200 billion US dollars worth to be precise

The russians have something to be proud of.

UN are a bunch of pussies who'll sit on the sidelines

The EU can't bypass the russian-supporting eastern europe

If the war is fought without nukes, it would be even, because the russian military is waiting for real competertor, chechnya and georgia were practise runs,
the US is a real fight

They'll be evenally matched, only the commanders wisdom and soldiers moral will win

Oh the war will be conventinoal, no nukes attached, why cause of the US anti missile system which targets all nukes, even US ones!!!, which is stupid.

but in reality, Europe needs Russia's oil, America needs a strong ally

One things for all readers who are so stupid, two things

One Russia is deomcratic, so stop calling them commies [SNIP]

Secondly, Vladimer Putin is not the leader of russia, Dmitry Medenov is, Putins just the prime minister



From the T&C's

1b.) Profanity: You will not use profanity in our forums, and will neither post with language or content that is obscene, sexually oriented, or sexually suggestive nor link to sites that contain such content.


[edit on 12/10/08 by masqua]

reply to post by dooper


Your [SNIP] if you believe what U.S patriot posted, for many reasons

One, russia doesn't want to be involved with the muslim nations, especially Iran, why. because Russian find the muslims sub-human, they wiped them out in chechnya and they'll do it again

Second, Israel is simply a beachhead for a U.S strike on Muslim oil fields. No cares about Israel, They have conquered Palestine like any modern nation wants to

Thirdly, Russia's eyes are on europe, they want europe becuase thats were power is

Ironically America supplies egypt with M1 Abrams tank (not M1A1 or M1A2's abrams, just regular M1's, the ones with the 105mm cannon)

Israel is [SNIP], they gonig to get what they disserve



From the T&C's

1b.) Profanity: You will not use profanity in our forums, and will neither post with language or content that is obscene, sexually oriented, or sexually suggestive nor link to sites that contain such content.

-and-

2) Behavior: You will not behave in an abusive, hateful and/or racist manner, and will not harass, threaten, nor attack anyone.

[edit on 12/10/08 by masqua]

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
The CIA estimate the russians spend up to 300/'400 billion US dollars worth on modernizing there military, who knows the real number.

Where did you get that from? I am fairly sure that it is nowhere near that high. More realistically it is in the $50-$75 billion range. But you have to keep in mind that even the newest Russian equipment is far less expensive than Western counterparts. So if you figure in this "inflation" to compare it with US military budget, you could say that Russia is in the $120-$160 billion range.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
The UN estimates that 12% of known oil sources are russian, The russians are using only 25% of their nations oil, 75% is there but are being unused

Haven't seen that estimate by any source. And what does "using 25% mean"? Russian oil exploitation is near capacity right now, with the exception of the still undrilled fields near Sakhalin and Lake Baikal. Fact is that Russian oil production is predicted to decline in the next decade.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
The russians are one of the only nations that didn't suffer from the food crisis

What food crisis are you talking about? Are you aware of the Soviet-Union-wide food crisis of the 20's and 30's? Millions died in Russia, Ukraine, and other Soviet nations.

Currently Russia does have extensive agricultural potential, but much of it remains unexploited and unexplored.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
The Russian government under President Medenov (Yes vladimer putin is only the prime minister, not the president) encourages the use of Paramilitary forces, in fact, georgia was invaded with a paramilitary division, fully supplied.

What paramilitary division would that be? Chechen Vostok and Zapad battalions are part of the Russian army, and are not considered paramilitary. Other than that it was the 58th army that took part in the action.

The only reason Vostok and Zapad were used was their proximity to the action.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Russia is not a communist state anymore, they run under a democratic system!

Well at least someone gets it. Sadly much of the US and posters here on ATS are stuck with the Cold War mentality, which they refuse to abandon at any cost, and which clouds their judgement to all issues concerning Russia.

reply to post by magicmushroom


I'll try to answer your question. What developed was two separate stages in the war in Iraq, and the second stage was completely unanticipated.

In the first stage, the military to military conflict, the US and Britain defeated the Iraqi military in very short order, when I believe statistically, Iraq had the fourth largest military in the world. So much for statistics.

The war was won. Quickly.

Then it became apparent that elements within Iraq basically wanted a civil war, and were unprepared to unite under one government. This second part, basically an "occupation" is like jumping into a fight between two brothers. They'll both jump you.

Our (US) general staff have forgotten the basics of warfare. They have forgotten their responsibilities. They have forgotten the principles of warfare. They cheat on wargames necessary for promotion, and this last few years is the payoff.

The US against Russia? Hopefully, the Russian generals will be just as damned stupid as American generals. The problem with having stupid generals who don't know their trade is that rarely do the generals pay for their errors. Their charges (our soldiers) pay with their blood.

We should have learned in Viet Nam that you can never, ever depend on others to do a damned thing, and that includes those things necessary for their own betterment. Never, ever, rely on anyone else to do a damned thing - even for themselves!

If you want to know what's wrong with the US military, and believe me, our leadership absolutely, positively, suck, then I highly recommend a book entitled "Edicts of Ares" Thirteen Absolute Rules of Warfare by Michael Riggs. You want to know what it takes to win every battle, campaign, and war? To follow these thirteen rules, not a single battle, campaign, or war has been lost since 1479 BC!

And even the greatest of generals lost when they abandoned one of these rules - Napolean, Lee, Hannibal Barca. As great as they were, they lost the moment they abandoned one of these rules, that previously, they had used to great success.

The US against Russia? The SOB's that follow these thirteen rules to the letter!

reply to post by masqua


Look, the russian government and the US government are building a bridge across the Aluetians surprisingly.

So after thats built in 2009, the russians will have all there new stuff and will overwhelme the unexpecting americans

also the russian fleet is new and advanced with over 30 aircraft carriers to be completed by 2010/2012, only another four years [SNIP].



From the T&C's

2) Behavior: You will not behave in an abusive, hateful and/or racist manner, and will not harass, threaten, nor attack anyone.

[edit on 12/10/08 by masqua]

Originally posted by Freedom_Fighter117
One, russia doesn't want to be involved with the muslim nations, especially Iran, why. because Russian find the muslims sub-human, they wiped them out in chechnya and they'll do it again

I'd say that you are completely wrong, but I think it will be useless. The only sub-humans are those that view others as such. Your view on Russians' opinions of the Muslim World is extremely naive.

Originally posted by Freedom_Fighter117
Second, Israel is simply a beachhead for a U.S strike on Muslim oil fields.

Beachhead? What do you think this is - WW2? Muslim oil fields? Saudi Arabia is a US ally. Iran is nowhere near Israel. And Iraq is more of a "beachhead" than anyone would need for this purpose. Why bring Israel into every discussion?

Originally posted by Freedom_Fighter117
Thirdly, Russia's eyes are on europe, they want europe becuase thats were power is

Huh? What the hell would Russia need to occupy Europe for? And what power is in Europe? You are talking as if this is the colonial-imperialist era of the late 19th century.

Originally posted by Freedom_Fighter117
Ironically America supplies egypt with M1 Abrams tank

Egypt = this discussion how?

reply to post by maloy


While a few of this guys statistics are off, like the food thing and the spendature of russia's military he has got a point

Russia isn't a push over, it isn't going to backdown and it can wack a punch to any modern military

I also knowthat russia, by 2015 will have more oil than the saudi's, this is a CIA fact, or at least i think it is, nevertheless the russians have a lot of oil and they get alot of money from it as well.

And yeah, you and him are soem of the only who know that russia isn't commie, good work

reply to post by Freedom_Fighter117


[SNIP]

The Russians don't want Europe. They would certainly like a warm water port though, I'm certain.

Actually, if the Russians don't care for Muslims, then I suppose that isn't so bad. If Russians can get past their natural suspicion of other nations of the West, and join up, we could do a hell of a good job where everyone could do better for their nations.

And Israel is not flush with oil, nor is the immediate territory next to Israel flush with oil. It's actually quite a walk away.

And finally, the man was just quoting prophesy, which a few years ago looked impossible, but thanks to world events, looks more and more like it will go down just as prophesied.

You must remember that Muhammed was illiterate, and his grasp of the Jewish Torah and the Christian beliefs were based on heresay. Thus his bastardization of his "new" religion by selling an ignorant people a polished version of their pagan moon-god Allah.

This has all been done before. [SNIP]



From the T&C's

2) Behavior: You will not behave in an abusive, hateful and/or racist manner, and will not harass, threaten, nor attack anyone.


[edit on 12/10/08 by masqua]

reply to post by maloy


They do, the russians hate islam, they had three wars with them in the past, don't think there going to be friendly with them you think, like sending captive muslims to gulags in siberia, a friendly touch.

Secondly, i was using beachhead as a metophorical statement, true that you had me on this one, but the US are withdrawing from Iraq, well not exactly, but they are eventully going to evac. Besides that, they used Israel and Saudi arabia to attack Kuwait in 91' they used israel, Saudi land and Kuwait to attack in 2003

Thirdly, Yes iran is far away from israel, but iranians and syrians and jordinans cross the iraqi border to fight the US.

Yes, saudi's are allies to the US, but you think by forcing western workers into westerner camps is gonig to help the relatinoship with US and Saudi's

...at one point, the saudis didn't give the US any oil, they had negoicate

I used eygpt because eygpt is an enemy of israel, why would the US help both sides.

The russians supply europe with oil, yes, i may said it in a 19th century POV, and i apologize, but the russians want europe, end of story

Look, i was trying to say that don't refer to the bible for real world sources