A real 9/11 conspiracy:The CIA's concealment of the 9/11 operation

Introduction:

9/11 was the first and only Al Qaeda claimed attack in the US*. The question becomes, why? What happened on and leading up to 9/11 that all of a sudden made it possible to pull off the 9/11 attacks? Ali Soufon, a career FBI agent (at the time of the attacks), and Richard Clark, a Counter Terrorism Adviser (at the time of the attacks) both have come forward with questions about the CIA's role in the 9/11 attacks. How the information that the CIA inexplicably withheld, would of stopped the attacks. By no means, were (the CIA) the only factor in the attacks being successful, not by a long shot, there are definitely more factors that played a role, but the CIA could have almost certainly prevented the attacks from happening. Put it all together though, and we can begin to connect some of the unconnected dots that surround 9/11. I think it is becoming increasingly more apparent why and how this happened, as more time goes by. I will try to explain that theory here, I hope you enjoy.

*Some may claim that the 93 bombing of the north tower was the first AQ attack, but this is highly debatable. Yes, Ramzi Yousef was KSM’s nephew, but either were affiliated with AQ at the time. Yet even if you are among those who believe the 93 bombing was a Al Qaeda attack, it only strengthens this theory. Because by any measure, the 93 bombing was a miserable failure. The plan was to explode the truck bomb, causing the north tower to collapse, which they then calculated that it’s collapse would bring down the south tower. They hoped to kill hundreds of thousands of people, worst case thousands…six people died. Then all but Yousef were arrested, after they decided to return to the Uhaul rental place to pick up their cash deposit on the truck they just exploded.

The 9/11 Operation:

The 9/11 attacks were a massively wide scale, perfectly coordinated, lethal attack. Like nothing Al QaeDa (or any other terrorist) had ever done before, or since. It required at least half a million dollars to undertake (Mind you this is a Government estimate, which I'm betting is a low estimate), the most expensive operation ever undertaken by them, even after all these years. Most amazingly, we are told that they trained eight Al Qaeda guys to fly 757/767 model aircraft's, at various flight schools and simulators, and hand manuals. Then without ever even flying the real aircraft's (757/767’s), they all were able to flawlessly fly their jets. Navigating them from high altitudes, descending through thousands of feet, using the autopilots to also navigate the aircraft, along with hand flying. Then at some of the fastest speeds the aircraft's could fly, they guided them perfectly into their targets. Oddly though, they were unable to use the intercom/radio systems correctly, talking to ATC when they thought they were talking to the passengers.

They did surveillance; they did dry runs on the same or similar cross country flights. They crisscrossed the country, back and forth. Flew back and forth out of the country, visiting terrorist training camps and terrorist "Summits" where they had large planning sessions, like the infamous four day Malaysian meeting. Mind you a lot of them had already fought in wars, and been known terrorists. Back in the states... they had to rent places, open checking accounts, obtain Driver License and State IDs, and pay for everything that you have too just to live. For at least twenty men...all with large sums of most likely totally illicit funds coming from out of the country. Astonishingly, these Al Qaeda attackers never once attempted to hide their identities during this entire process. Apparently, not worried at all about attracting attention, or hiding their apparent hatred for the US. Much of what they did here though is a mystery, or at least has been classified still. But we are told that they essentially conducted this operation in plain sight.

The day of the attacks, you had four teams, all with five members except one that had four members(because finally this hijacker was denied entry into the US). They had to be in position, with all their paperwork and documents ready to board these four aircraft. Not only did they have to make it through the boarding process, and all the security and screening, then they had to smuggle weapons through the check points. Things like knives, box cutters, mace, and possibly real bombs (even though we are supposed to believe it was a fake bomb on F93). Then the flights all had to be hijacked, taken over, then the cockpits and flight controls taken over. And finally they had to fly these aircraft, locate their targets, guide the aircraft's perfectly into their respective targets, while moving at incredible speeds. I believe they planned the order in which each aircraft would crash, the time that would elapse in-between each crash. The more I looked at this, the more it even seems likely that F93 unfolded exactly as that team had planned it, that there are too many anomalies with F93. Enough that you have to wonder if that team was operating under a different plan, as opposed to the other three flights that were flawlessly executed.

Either way, when you look at the exact timeline of each of the hijackings; they were without question carried out with military precision. I think this is quite evident when you look at the hijacking timeline, it should be noted, the scheduled departure times for each aircraft, and then their actual departure times:

Flight 11-
Scheduled to depart at 7:45am. Departed at 7:59am. +15) Hijacked at 8:14am. +32) Crashed at 8:46am

Flight 175-
Scheduled to depart at 8:00am. Departed at 8:14am. +28) Hijacked at 8:42am. +21) Crashed at 9:03am

Flight 77-
Scheduled to depart at 8:10am. Departed at 8:20am. +31) Hijacked at 8:51am. +47) Crashed at 9:38am

Flight 93-
Scheduled to depart at 8:00am. Departed at 8:42am. +46) Hijacked at 9:28am. +35) Crashed at 10:03am*

*- It also should be noted: that its’ time it took to crash, and actual crash time, would have been much greater had it not crashed prematurely of its alleged target. Probably by another 20 to 30 minutes at least.

They picked the transcontinental flights, on their first trips of the day, so as to have the aircraft's loaded with as much fuel as possible. They also picked Tuesday flights, which we now know, were these flights lowest passenger occupancy levels of the entire week, guaranteeing there would be as few as possible passengers on board. How did they know this? They also managed to pick the Tuesday of a week full of military war games going on. One of them, a NRO drill, where an errant jet from Dulles (where F77 originated) crashed into their building just minutes from the Pentagon. How did they know about these war games? It's obvious nothing was left to chance, so it had to of been part of the overall plan, to ultimately guarantee their success. Finally, as we all know too well, they were a 100% successful. Yes F93 didn't hit its supposed target, but we don't even know if that was really part of the plan for F93. They were 100 % successful in that they managed to get all team members on all flights, breaching security (with weapons (knives, box cutters, mace), bombs (fake or real), boarding, hijacking, taking over the cockpits, and then crashing each aircraft.

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reply to post by PersonalChoice


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They couldn't have done it on their own: The CIA knew.

These known terrorists were somehow able to defeat every safe guard we put it up, at a time when, as they say now "The system was blinking red". Somehow during the mist of all this, this group of people, completed an attack the likes of which has never been seen ...How? These masters of terror, responsible for 9/11 haven't been able to even so much as pull off a single bombing let alone a coordinated attack in the states since 9/11. To argue that the governments guard was down, or they never thought about hijacked planes as missiles is beyond ludicrous. They were on ultra high alert; you had the embassy bombings, the attacks in Saudi Arabia, and the one that really made them mad was the Cole attack. So it's not as if they weren't constantly attacking us, they were. John Oniel one of FBI’s top guys specializing in Al Qaeda told anyone who would listen , that they were going to attack the WTC next. He was so sure, he took a job there as head of security. Their obvious intention, especially after 9/11, but even years before, was to attack in the US. What finally made it all possible, in such a dramatic way on 9/11?


So then you add on the multiple FBI investigations that all would have foiled the attacks had they been aloud to continue them further. The warnings of certain alert citizens that contacted the FBI that were never looked into further. The LT Shaffer case, Abel Danger, and now this amazing statement from Richard Clarke confirming that in fact the CIA Director (no less) Tenet and other high ranking officials were concealing information that even he (Richard Clarke) admits would of foiled the attacks. This information, that Clarke has told us, is basically confirming LT Shaffer’s claims, that the SOCOM Able Danger operation had identified Atta, Mihdhar, Hamzi, and Atta’s right hand man Shehhi. Just like all the others, when they attempted to notify the FBI of this info, they were told they could not. All of this apparently confirming that the CIA was indeed running a secret operation, a illegal one, whereas they were tracking and monitoring targets within the USA. Because of this they were all told not to tell their FBI counterparts about any of it, because doing that would of effectively killed their operation. The US is the FBI’s territory, and the FBI would have put it all together within a couple of days, and arrested all of them.

Then there is the Ali Soufon story, A FBI agent who was a lead investigator on the Cole attacks. He was actually in Yemen on 9/11. Take a guess who were the prime suspects and were being hunted by the FBI...Mihdhar and Hamzi. One major problem, the FBI thought they were anywhere BUT the US. They had no idea they were in the US. This is what makes the CIA's concealment of their knowledge, that these terrorists were already in the USA, that much more suspicious. There were CIA agents on his team of investigators also, so imagine his amazement when on 9/12 Soufon gets a report from the CIA, not only telling him that the two suspects they were hunting, for the Cole bombing, were on Flight 77...But also that the CIA had this information and had failed to share it (at that time he's told it was supposedly do to bureaucracy incompetence). Soufon said he literally ran to the bathroom and threw up. Ali Soufon talks about this in his new book. Another very interesting thing involving Soufons disclosure of this information was that Soufon, remember, an employee of the FBI, had to submit his book for a review to see if anything should be redacted/or blacked out. The FBI didn’t redact the book at all. The book was set to print, when the CIA contacted Soufon and required that they also be able to review the book. The CIA redacted/or blacked out 2% of his book, oddly a lot of what they redacted was public information things like videotaped Senate hearings and 9/11 Commission report information, most likely pertaining to Mihdhar and Hamzi. Soufon says they are doing this to "shape the current narrative". The book is called "The Black Banners. The inside story of 9/11 and the war against Alqaeda" by Ali Soufon.


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reply to post by PersonalChoice


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Then you have the "Kamikaze Pilots" Case, which was a FBI informant who warned the FBI that OBL had a group already in the states planning for a multi state terrorist attack. He also told them that the US Government knew about this plot already. The FBI agents who discovered this information, passed it to their superiors, they were completely ignored. What's now interesting about this case, in light of all the new information coming out about the CIA's knowledge of the attacks, is the fact that this informant actually told the FBI agents to go to the CIA about the entire plot, because they (the CIA) knew all about it. He also says that the ISI also knew about the entire 9/11 plot. At the time he said this, he told the agents that the plot was 1 to 2 months from completion. I posted a thread with the entire story here: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Another factor pointing to CIA involvement, are the Anthrax attacks, as I explained in my latest thread on the Anthrax attacks here: www.abovetopsecret.com... I believe the Anthrax attacks had to of been planned in conjunction with the 9/11 attacks. I think there is a considerable amount of evidence that points to this conclusion. The most important one being that Bruce Ivins is most likely totally innocent of what he has been accused of doing. But going by the official story, Ivins, by total coincidence, began making the attack anthrax powder while the 9/11 attacks were in there last planning stages (basically right around the time they bought 19 tickets in august), and he was able to finish it up seven days after the attacks, when he mailed the first letter out. Via writings on the letters, the perpetrators attempt to pin it on Al Qaeda. The fact that the spores were weaponized with a brand new technique, made two of the letters extremely dangerous. Those two letters spores were coated with a tin silicone mixture, to make them extremely dangerous. Ivins own boss says no one would of known how to do that, nor did they have the particular machines needed to do it at USAMRIDS. Things pointing to CIA involvement: The Ames anthrax spores could of come from Dugway proving grounds , where a CIA bio weapons testing facility is located. Where they could have easily made the attack anthrax, and easily coated the spores with the tin/silicone outside layer. It seems that some of the hijackers may of been infected with anthrax, if this panned out to be true, it would make perfect sense, in that the perpetrators of the Anthrax attacks attempted to first pin this on Al Qaeda. What better way to do that than infect some of the soon to be dead hijackers with the same anthrax about to be used in the Anthrax attacks. All available information seems to point to the fact that who ever perpetrated the anthrax attacks had picked out Hatfill and Ivins as fall guys, if their first pick Al Qaeda, wasn't accepted. The top suspect who would of been able to easily obtain all of the information needed to frame these two guys or Al Qaeda, is without question, the CIA.

So if your counting, that’s three times, in three separate situations, in the lead up to the 9/11 attacks, that the CIA deliberately withheld information about these 9/11 hijackers: 1. Clarke (White House), 2. Lt. Shaffer (Able Danger), and Ali Soufon (Cole Investigation). Plus, the two FBI agents that were told that the CIA knew about the Kamikaze Pilots case, incidentally, they put together a report and forwarded to their superiors and were ignored. This is just the tip of the iceberg in the list of things pointing to the fact that their had to of been certain key CIA officials that were well aware that there was a major operation under way, involving 9/11 attacks were going to happen, along with the FBI.

What did the CIA (and others that participated) stand to gain?

In all of these attacks the death toll of murdered US military/government people continued to grow. The only people that weren't on high alert was the citizens of USA, and you better believe the CIA, and military brass, and every other high up on the totem pole official were more than well aware of this, it was a constant thorn in their side. They felt their hands were tied, there was zero public support for their efforts, and the White House was breathing down their necks. Just read the PNAC report from 2000. There was basically zero support for the military all through the nineties, even though they were constantly taking hits from this Al Qaeda terrorist group. They wanted to take the fight to them, they wanted to increase all military(CIA) defense budgets. This was a considerable problem. Something had to be done.

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reply to post by PersonalChoice


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So you add all of this up, and you can really only come to a couple conclusions. Either a very secret surveillance/ get one or more of them to be a informant- operation was being conducted by people who were in key positions in the CIA, and with the blessing of a couple of very high up FBI agents who would suppress any low level agents trying to investigate the hijackers and other players in the attacks. They were likely triple crossed and/or duped(by one or more informants) into not stopping the attacks before they happened. Or the second scenario, the unthinkable one for some, the attacks were knowingly allowed to happen, by people who were in a few key positions in the CIA, and FBI, under the same guise as the first, except that their goal was to let them succeed. People like Tenet were/are professionals at using bureaucracy as a way of controlling how a situation is handled, achieving a certain outcome, without actually being involved. Still this was all very unthinkable to a average agent, not to mention illegal. Therefore, some of the participators did it unknowingly, at least that is till the attacks happened, at which time I'm sure the vast majority of this level of participator put two and two together. Like Clarke said, you could water board them now and they would never admit to it.

At least one other foreign intelligence group, were key participators in the planning, preparing, and funding for these attacks. Their involvement helps explains how 9/11 was pulled off with seemingly such ease, flawlessly. This is where the planning and expert coordination/management, of all of the participants in the 9/11 operation came from. Particularly the funding, documents, and coordination…. These people had experience and know how, in large scale secret operations. I am not saying that the US officials were aware that this intelligence group was facilitating the attacks, although I'm sure the ones in the CIA and FBI that concealed their presence here in the states had to of known.

These rogue CIA officials wanted to push their agenda at any cost, they wanted the attacks to take place, they needed them to take place. Because they did succeed, the CIA particularly, is stronger than it ever has been in it's entire history. I doubt that anyone in the White house was aware, this is how they were able to get away with it. Anyone that did put it together afterwards, ultimately decided that the ends justified the means. This is why no one was reprimanded or fired, or arrested. This is why none of the conspirators could ever be brought to trial, why Bin Laden had to be killed(that is the people actually blamed for the attacks, the people in Guantanamo, the people that have been executed ). Why Bush and Cheney refused to testify under oath or on the record, why they waited till 2004 to start a investigation. Why all of a sudden whistle blowing made you a enemy of the state.

Summary:

I don't believe for a second that Al Qaeda had finally gotten their stuff together, and all of a sudden turned itself into some elite terrorist force with the skills of international intelligence Agencies. Able to seemingly, easily completely dupe all of Americas defenses against an attack like this. I am convinced they were being heavily helped and directed by at least one foreign Intelligence agency. I think this is one of the most closely guarded secrets of 9/11. That is, that those two countries intelligence agencies, and especially one of them in particular, were a lot more involved. I don't think the top officials that knew this was being planned, had any idea at all of the scale of help, or of any help they (the hijackers) were receiving from those two countries. And keep in mind these foreign officials that were involved are all rogue their selves, not representative of the entire military/government in power.



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reply to post by PersonalChoice


Page 5(last)
After everything I have read over the years, it is clear that Al Qaeda is not capable of attacks seen on 9/11, on their own. Not before 9/11 , on 9/11, or after 9/11. This is why we haven’t, and we won't see anything even close to this type of attack occurring in the future by Al Qaeda. They will continue to make bombs that don't work, or get caught in the planning process. It should be said also, that America was fully capable pre 9/11 of stopping the attacks, even with the help they received. They didn't need to create this gigantic security/ intelligence state here in America. Our intelligence agencies, mainly the CIA and FBI could have stopped the attacks. I think this is becoming more and more apparent to most that truly are looking into it from this angle. This angle begins to finally answer more questions than it creates, which over the past decade has been a rare thing when researching how it was even possible for these attacks (and the Anthrax attacks) to happen in the US. This needs to be the first issue addressed and resolved, because it may finally open up the other doors to all of the other questions and coincidences that surround 9/11.

Yes, a new version of the old LIHOP theory, but not so much the entire government, but certain very high placed heads of military and alphabet agency(FBI, CIA) that could completely hide an operation like 9/11 from others around them looking to root these precise ops out. Stalling operations, closing down others, and even hiding information under the guise of a secret operation to penetrate the very operation they wanted to succeed. Replacing, or removing certain officials from key positions on 9/11. Then ultimately chalking it all up to massive amounts of red tape, bureaucracy, and complete incompetence, or coincidence. Afterwards, everyone gets a promotion, the commission puts together a nice simple narrative. They get exactly what they wanted, massive defense spending, they get a global war, with a global enemy called Al Qaeda (aka Muslim terrorists), who is seemingly impossible to exterminate completely. They get to crush Saddam Hussein, and take the fight to anyone who we please, and it all continues to this day. As this past decade has developed, I sometimes try to imagine how this past decade would of unfolded without the 9/11 attacks taking place. Possibly no Iraq and Afghanistan wars, and no secret everything (and not so secret things) that 9/11 brought (Intelligence Industrial Complex). But more importantly where would this country be financially as a whole, would the recession of been a massive depression? What would of all the people who have been employed in this global war on terror here in this country be doing? Would unemployment be 40 percent? Or higher?

In the movie "Three days of the condor" www.youtube.com... the evil government agent tells the lowly innocent agent (ironically basically in the shadow of the WTC towers) that the reason they had to do this purely evil operation, was because it was ultimately being done to save Americas future. That basically, the country would be thrown into a unthinkable situation (in the movie it was needing more oil from the Middle East), the kind that could bring the country to its knees and that the country (fellow Americans) would understand and expect us to do whatever was needed to save the country (get that oil). And that, this task basically fell on to the shoulders of the evil government agents (CIA) to do this. I think that many of the people (in regards to 9/11) who were in the know, looked at it this way, they felt there was no other way to wake the citizens up to the emerging serious threat that they were calling Al Qaeda. BUT...It is apparent now that Al Qaeda was just the excuse, it wasn’t the real reason why it was allowed to happen, they knew one thing though, that Americans would not go to war with anyone absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event....like 9/11. And that's exactly what they did with the American support, they used it to start the Global War on Terror, and at least two other official wars, probably a couple other off the books wars as well. And these 9/11 wars have never ended, Bin Laden has finally been declared dead, anyone stupid enough to claim Al Qaeda colors has been killed, or is rotting in a room somewhere on the planet waiting to die...Yet now, Americans with too big of a hairdo, will have to have it searched to make sure we (USA citizens) aren't carrying explosives on board? Drone fleets, and drone strikes in whatever country we please, are expanding? Yet we are lead to believe that all of this is because of the 9/11 attacks... that should have never happened in the first place, by a group of people who could of never have pulled it off by them selves.

Interestingly enough i tend to agree with your conclusions generally. and well laid out i might add(it the nature of the beast to have to get so lengthy)
The Mena airport where the 9/11 guys trained ....was a major dope smuggling center for coke from S America,(the CIAs black ops cash crop they say.....
I have heard the FBI was also involved with assisting a couple of the hijackers on the west coast as well....

That was an absolutely brilliant post. You are absolutely correct in your statement that analyzing the attacks from that angle answers more questions than it raises, which IS unique regarding anything having to do with this subject. I personally believe that most people could not even begin to understand exactly how these attacks were pulled off, so they just assumed that what they were being told was the truth.

Even if they suspected that they might have been lied to, it didn't matter, because it could be justified by saying that NO American in a powerful position would EVER let this happen to American citizens, much less orchestrate the attacks themselves.

There is a bit of fresh info in your post that I hadn't heard before, and it will be interesting to check out. When you have government agents, on top of all the other professionals who have spoken out against the official story, telling you something isn't right, you better believe it, since they are the ones tasked with keeping you safe at night.

Starred and Flagged...Excellent write-up, and I enjoyed it immensely.

reply to post by JiggyPotamus


Thanks JP, I really appreciate that, I put a lot of time into this post. I also couldn't agree more with you, the connections to the CIA are so vast, that I literally just tried to stick to the ones that were overt. But they creep up every where, in multiple researchers works. Up till now they have always been labeled as coincidental, or suspicious. But in light of the new information coming out lately from very credible people(like Clarke, and Soufon, it begins to paint a more vivid picture of how they were either controlling, or attempting to control the 9/11 operation through proxies and secrecy.

reply to post by PersonalChoice


I have long felt that it was a sort of hubris within the Agency, and the ever-present and long-known inter-departmental rivalries that contributed to the CIA's failure on 9/11. And any of the other intelligences divisions tasked with ferreting out and containing internal plots of terrorism. Information sharing was spotty at best, due to the aforementioned rivalries between agencies.

This is likely the major reason that a hint of something being withheld has fueled all the "conspiracy" frenzy, to great detriment of actually knowing and learning the full details.

Seems reasonable to conjecture that CIA had whiff of the plan that was spear-headed by Atta here in the U.S., but they might have felt it was not as close to implementation as it turned out to be....they got caught flat-footed, with pants down, and they knew it, in the echelons that were privy to the operation and unit monitoring Atta and Co.'s activities.


So, I'm on that page with you, keep investigating on those lines....because, it was a blunder of epic proportions, and as I said, the hubris factor cannot be discounted. Visions of "heroism" possibly, and the false sense of "pride" would have been theirs, had they stopped the plot...which was likely their thinking. It slipped through their fingers, and spiraled out of their control.

Reading your posts, though....I have to quibble on some assertions drawn re: the flying aspect. The training we know, but conclusions about the presumed "difficulty" of actually flying the airplanes are not warranted. I can expand on that, and how it may appear to be more "precision" than it actually is, in practice. It was very good planning on their (hijackers') part, but even so the delay that United 93 incurred in Newark was unexpected, and foiled at least that portion of their plan. To our everlasting benefit.

I realize it's technical, and really the focus here should be the look into what was "behind the scenes" at CIA, what they knew, and how much and when, etc.

One more thing....the "drills". Most likely explanation for that is pure coincidence. In fact, the "drills" influence on events that morning has been exaggerated. Based on countless claims from many "conspiracy sites" that abound on the Web.

reply to post by ProudBird
If that screed of yours was the best you could come up with against 5 pages of blistering logic, then my guess is you don't care about the truth. Your post has about the same chance of being a coincidence, as the 'drills' on 9/11.

It's now official- there isn't a single human being on the planet who's not a secret gov't agent.

"These rogue CIA officials wanted to push their agenda at any cost, they wanted the attacks to take place, they needed them to take place....I doubt that anyone in the White house was aware, this is how they were able to get away with it. Anyone that did put it together afterwards, ultimately decided that the ends justified the means. This is why no one was reprimanded or fired, or arrested. This is why none of the conspirators could ever be brought to trial, why Bin Laden had to be killed(that is the people actually blamed for the attacks, the people in Guantanamo, the people that have been executed ). Why Bush and Cheney refused to testify under oath or on the record, why they waited till 2004 to start a investigation. Why all of a sudden whistle blowing made you a enemy of the state."

I couldn't agree more, but, and this is a big BUT, I do believe the office of the President may have had intelligence of the hijacker's plans. I don't think they really expected them to pull it off, or maybe didn't know what exactly the plan was, but they were counting on it. Bush needed a reason to invade Iraq. He needed his war. Just like LJB promised the CIA, "I'll give you your war." They tried anything to go to war previously. They lied about WMD's. They sat idly by and waited for AQ to make their move. And at the time, Americans were too riddled with vengeance to notice what was really going on. Not to my knowledge, were any of the hijackers Iraqi, or had been trained in Iraq. They were Saudis and Egyptians. No one noticed the veil of lies that was being fed to them.

Outstanding post and excellently put together. S&F my friend!

reply to post by PersonalChoice

They had to be in position, with all their paperwork and documents ready to board these four aircraft.

All that means is that 19 guys had to buy plane tickets and go to the airport. Big Deal. Happens about 400,000 times a day in the US. Not exactly Operation Overlord.

Same with the rest of this. This was one of the simplest operations in history. Only involved a few people and 4 commercial aircraft. All the info they needed about the flights was widely available on the internet. Still is. Flight schools are private enterprises in the US. Anyone with money can go. The reason they were able to pilot the planes is because they went to flight schools. The reason there are flight schools is because you can learn how to successfully fly a plane. Not a big mystery.

Noting of course all the safegaurds in place since 9/11, there is nothing in the world to stop one from reproducing all the steps needed to repeat 9/11 and none of them require assistance from the CIA.

Thank you for this - one of the best posts I've had the pleasure to read in a while. I have often wondered why Al Qaeda have not exercised the power and precision in their own country against enemies on their own soil, like the power and precision they (supposedly) exercised on 9/11. It would have been a hundred times more difficult to pull this off on foreign soil, and yet, all you hear about over there are car bombs, IED's and suicide bombers. An organization with the power to pull off 9/11 on foreign soil SURELY would have beaten their enemies by now on their own, no??

reply to post by Cosmic911
You make an excellent point Cosmic, that there are dozens of different scenarios possible that would explain what happened that day. I get so pissed off everytime one of the 'talking heads' on tv, reject ALL conspiracies because they say there's no way Bush knew about it. You've explained how it's possible for that to be true, and still be covered up. The corruption is so bad and so deep, ( just look at the debunkers here) that the only thing impossible that day, IS the official story.

reply to post by GoodOlDave


Why the F@#$ do you add nothing to the conversation but to put this OP down? obviously a lot of effort went into it, so either add something constructive or STFU!

Thanks for putting this info together OP. I'm still suprized to this day that I run into people that dont even know what building seven was, let alone info the likes of what you have shared here. Keep passing it along and the people like moronDave can't do anything to stop you but cry like little babies.

Shame on you Dave. I'm truly considering trolling every thread you make from now on to give you a taste of your own medicine.

reply to post by Tasty Canadian


Not really:

It would have been a hundred times more difficult to pull this off on foreign soil...

If there were specific intent, and sufficient money available for the plotting and preparations, it could be easily attempted again.

I have often wondered why Al Qaeda have not exercised the power and precision in their own country against enemies on their own soil...

Which targets, and which "soil"? It is a bit different from mounting a successful strike to the underbelly of the most hated "enemy" on their own soil, purely from a revenge and *satisfaction* (for them) standpoint.


You may not like to hear this, but outside of U.S. airlines and the procedures implemented since 9/11...many, many other airlines that do not operate in or out of the USA don't follow the same protocols.

I was personally onboard an SAS domestic flight in Europe just two years ago.....and watched as the Flight Attendants interacted with the pilots in the cockpit, bringing them beverages and meals. It was exactly the same cavalier manner we used to have, before 9/11. The cockpit door stood wide open for several minutes, as the F/A busied herself in the galley, then carried the items in.

In the U.S., not only are the cockpit doors different (re-inforced, newly designed locking mechanisms and procedures), but any time the door must be opened, it is monitored carefully, and opening when required is kept to the bare minimum.

Witness, if you heard about it, that Japanese airline Boeing 737 event last month. This shows that on domestic flights within Japan, they are not using any enhanced cockpit security procedures, but doing business same as usual.

The Captain had left to use the lavatory, and rang on the Interphone to be let back in. The only person in the cockpit was the First Officer. [In the U.S., it is now forbidden for any one person to be alone on the Flight Deck. This is a change post-9/11].

The F/O was either new, or just careless....because instead of the (smaller) knob that is rotated to unlock the cockpit door electrically by remote, he had hold of the rudder trim knob....which is located nearby, but about four inches away and is significantly bigger (about 2 1/2 to 3 inches in diameter, compared to about 1 inch for the door control). We know this happened, because of what occurred next....the autopilot disconnected because of his activation of rudder trim, and that rudder deflection caused the airplane to roll suddenly to nearly inverted.

Point is, if desired there is little doubt that foreign, non-U.S. airliners could still be hijacked in ways seen on 9/11.

Of course, now the passengers and crew will not react to a hijacking in the way previously. But, only because of history, and the realization of what a potential hijacker might have in mind, today...compared to the pre-9/11 era, when hijackers did not want to die, they did it for other reasons.

Thanks for the thread, a lot of effort there.

The thing that bothers me about this scenario, is all those unsuspecting underlings in CIA and FBI. You would think that the penny would have dropped by 9/12 at the latest, but there really has not been all that much in the way of whistleblowing from either organisation, unless of course they all have suffered the same fate as OBL at some time. People like Richard Clarke by nature of their work, can be easily passed off as disgruntled in some way or another, and should be disregarded, and that's exactly what Bush and Co did. Clarke was at war with Bush and Co from the off, and his precepts were that all in the intelligence groups knew something very big was going to happen, hence his apology to victims families for government failure at the 9/11 commision hearings, (the only one to do so, including the two administrations) What you are saying goes way beyond Clarke at that time. So, if for instance, Clarke has much bigger meat to put on the table, then he should do so now.

Good Post OP !



A very good reference to the background of the entire 911 operation and ties to the CIA/FBI can be found in Webster Griffin Tarpley's book "9/11 Synthetic Terror"

For example even though Atta was on CIA-FBI-INS a watch list, he not only gained entry into the US on several occasions travelling between the US and Germany...but when arrested for driving without a license in FL, he walked away after posting bail.

Atta’s name had been on the CIA-FBI-INS watch list for many years, since an older person with the same name bombed an Israeli bus in the occupied territories of the West Bank on October 12, 1986. (Hopsicker 144-145) This indicates that the name was flagged with a national security override to allow him to enter the country. Atta was stopped by police for a traffic violation in Broward County, Florida on the night of April 26, 2001; he was even arrested for not having a drivers license. But he was soon released on bail – presumably the national security override again.

A similar case is the CIA cable announcing the presence of accused hijacker Al Hazmi in the US in March 2000, which was marked “Action Required: None.” (JICI, September 20, 2002)

And to add insult to injury, the INS even forwarded documentation to Atta's flight school owner for an extension of their Visas to remain in the the USA in March of 2002. More govt. bureacracy at work.

On March 6, 2002 the US Immigration and Naturalization Service sent Dekkers letters telling him that Atta and Shehhi – now allegedly deceased – had met the necessary requirements and were now eligible to apply for extensions of their visas in to stay in the US. How had the INS made this blunder in two of the best-known cases having to do with 9/11? “The error seemed particularly difficult to explain, sniffed the New York Times, because Mr. Atta and Mr. Shehhi were among the most infamous of the 19 hijackers.” Media coverage focused on the “troubled” INS, but this incident totally consistent with the hypothesis that the names of Atta and Shehhi had been flagged in government computers with national security overrides, which had served to make them virtually immune from watch lists, criminal checks, and the like. A lazy mole had evidently neglected to remove the override when the usefulness of these two patsies had come to an end, and so the posthumous visa approval forms were sent out.

I am certain that Bin Laden must've broken into the INS computers to carry this out with his Satellite Phone !

reply to post by PersonalChoice


Perhaps what you are looking for is the CIA 9/11 Papers like the Pentagon Papers
years ago as the man who wrote the papers went into the vault days on end, copied
them and had them published. He published his own papers on the Pentagon activities.
He was the source and came clean. I don't see any Mr. Cleans around with so many
conspiracies lying low these days.