Maddox- A message to cops article

Maddox is a book writer and usually writes humor articles. Here, he has a message to cops.

"1. When ten of you show up to make one arrest, it makes you look like cowards.

On my way home from a bike ride a few weeks ago, I saw three arrests being made in under an hour in a relatively safe part of the city. At one of the incidents, eight police cruisers responded to make one arrest. The guy who was arrested was ejected for being too drunk in a bar. Just one guy, and he was drunk. He had a stupid moustache, hadn't hurt anyone and was drunkenly walking home when he was tased and tackled by 3 cops before 6 police cruisers showed up in addition to the two that were there, for a total of 8 cruisers and 10 cops. The man was unarmed.

How much backup do you need? It's one guy. If you can't handle one drunk guy by yourself, you shouldn't be a cop. Training tells you otherwise? Well stop being trained by p*ssies.

2. When you tase somebody who isn't trying to escape, it makes you look like lazy cowards.

A taser isn't a remote-control for people. Want to talk to someone? Then walk over to them and talk. Don't tase them and expect them to cooperate. Also, when someone is being tased and is writhing in cardiac arrest on the ground, they aren't "resisting arrest" by not getting on their knees and neatly kowtowing to your demands. They're incapacitated. You look like idiots barking orders at them when they can't move.

Being a cop has certain risks associated with it. If you aren't comfortable with those risks, don't take the job. Always trying to minimize your risk of injury at the expense of others by being a tase-happy dip# makes you look like lazy pussies.

Tasing everyone you see because they might pose a risk to you is like spraying everything with a fire extinguisher so it doesn't catch fire. Part of the problem might be that many cops are overweight and out of shape. If you fatasses can't chase someone down, then you shouldn't be cops. Studies have shown that not being a lardass is just as effective as using a taser.

3. When you set up speed traps, it makes you look like you don't have anything better to do.

I get happy every time I see a speed trap, because I assume it means all criminals have been locked up, you've caught the guys who broke into my car on three separate occasions and my stolen property will be returned shortly, right #heads? Good job guys, take a break and make some scratch for the city. Because why the hell else would you be sitting on your ass in a ditch if that wasn't the case?

People who speed are awesome. The last thing this world needs is more slow drivers. Traffic jams occur because of idiots braking prematurely.

And when you pull people over, how about doing it in a place that doesn't obstruct traffic? You know what's just as "unsafe" as speeding? Having to swerve into another lane because your stupid car is blocking traffic. Every time I pass another cruiser parked in two lanes, backing up traffic for miles, it makes me punch myself in the jaw until I pass out. "

the entire article if you are interested thebestpageintheuniverse.net...


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I think it would be an insurance thing. They train them to not get injured or else they'd be liable I imagine.
and a psychological thing for the drunk guy and everyone at the bar. show up in huge numbers with lights and sirens, the whole show arrives to scare the crap out of everyone and leaves but the effects are still felt

Love It and I entirely agree.

Originally posted by yourmaker
I think it would be an insurance thing. They train them to not get injured or else they'd be liable I imagine.
and a psychological thing for the drunk guy and everyone at the bar. show up in huge numbers with lights and sirens, the whole show arrives to scare the crap out of everyone and leaves but the effects are still felt

That kind of psychological scare tactic crap is a part of the problem. If people fear the police they will NOT cooperate unless forced too. It also widens the line between the citizens and the police and makes citizens resent them.

Maddox is awesome, I'm glad to see he's still around.


The point he makes at the end is priceless: If you can't do a dangerous job without endagering, injuring, and hurting civilians, you don't deserve to have it.

Infact, being hired as a police officer should be VERY difficult process. That would immediately cause respect to be gained. That means sociopaths don't qualify....

oh man, I used to love maddox the butt kicking irate pirate of the internet.

Anyways, they might have just been bored and had nothing better to do, It kinda sucks chilling in a squad car waiting for someone to blow through a stop sign. Every now and then you gotta get out stretch your legs and wrestle with a drunk to get the blood pumping... gotta stay in shape ya know

reply to post by ReadyPower


Is this Maddox as in THE BEST PAGE IN THE UNIVERSE? Love that guy.

maddox.xmission.com...

reply to post by Swills


Yeah, it is him. he posted this a couple days ago.

reply to post by ReadyPower


Law requires Law Enforcement use the least amount of force neccissary and must deescalate the situation as quickly as possible.

It is safer to have 10 officers show up and only need 2 than have 2 officers present and need 8 more. As far as deploying a Taser goes most departments place the use of a Taser at the same level as pepper spray, which is low on the subject resistance control continuum.

A tasers primary goal, after communication fails, is to take a potentionally escalatable offense, and to end it early. A deployed taser will incapacitate an individual for a 5 second cycle. It can be stopped there, ended prior to the 5seconds but hitting the button, an officer can hold the trigger down to go beyond the 5 seconds. When a taser is deployed and active, so long as an officer does not touch the wires or places his hand inbetween where the probes hit, they will not be affected, and can take the person into custody without resistence.

If 10 officers are present and the individual wants to fight, that should be a red flag that they either have a death wish (suicide by cop) or they are possibly on drugs. The ability of an officer to exercise force is based on totality of circumstances (there is no one set path to go from bottom to deadly force encounter, its situation specific).

If a 6'4 200 pound muscle guy confronts an officer, it will depend on the level of agressiveness of that person, as well as the level of training / other criteria for the officer. If a drunk guy that is 5'6 130 pounds confronts police and during the encounter makes the comment he is a master in martial arts, its irrelevant if its actually true. Once the guy makes the statement, he will be treated as if he is telling the truth, which creates a quick rise in the use of force.

As far as speed traps go, many people will view it as a money maker but that is not always the case. Even if an officer doesnt write any citations, its not a loss. The presence of the patrol vehicle alone could have been enough to slow people down, there by reducing the number of accidents. If warnings are issued its a simple reminder that we want people to get home safe, and to be a bit more conscious when driving. It can also help take drunks off the road, etc etc etc.

Contrary to most opinions on this site, our goal is to educate the public and not harass them. A lot of times a verbal warning can and will go a loat farther that a citation.

Stereotyping / making a blanket statement doesnt help much in this area. Its going to take communication on both sides, Law Enforcement - Government with the community and citizens they serve to get past some of these hangups.

When in doubt and situation appropriate - ask questions.

reply to post by Xcathdra


Please explain why we NEED 10 cops to arrest one man?? Are all our cops out of shape idiots who cannot handle one man alone???

If you get any MMA fighter and make them a cop they can handle any body ALONE... yet all these cops need to call 10 back up officers

Originally posted by ReadyPower
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

Please explain why we NEED 10 cops to arrest one man?? Are all our cops out of shape idiots who cannot handle one man alone???

If you get any MMA fighter and make them a cop they can handle any body ALONE... yet all these cops need to call 10 back up officers

Its obviously going to depend on whats going on (situation specific). When a person drives down the road and sees 10 cops dealing with someone, they arent always getting the full story as they drive by. Shift change / multiple agencies present (city / county / highway patrol / state police) / misidentified / misreported information to 911 toned out as a high priority call, etc etc etc.

When I worked in a small city back in the day we got reports of gunshots in a neighborhood at 1AM. Multiple people called it in, all reporting the gunshots as well as some reporting yelling and screaming. My town had 2 officers on, County sent another 3 and we hate State and a neighboring city responding.

When we arrived on scene it turned out it was a fight or gunshots. It turned out the guy was drunk, standing by his truck in the driveway trying to figure out how to use his phone. He got pissed, started yelling at his cell phone and punched the side of his truck 2or 3 times.

The officers showed up and were immediately released. Had it been real, we would have needed them for a perimeter / evacuation.

Point being until you know all the facts, complaining about 10 officers being present is kind of a blanket assumption that might not be correct. Also, if a person is intoxicated / on drugs / mental, it adds another element to the encounter. As an example if one or 2 officers are present, and things go downhill fast, the ability of those 2 officers to justify lethal force is higher than if 10 officers were present, where the threshold for use of deadly force would be lower.

A lot of departments actually will restrict the deployment of certain items (OC / Pepper Spry / Taser / Bean Bag rounds / etc) if their are sufficient number of officers present. Most agencies prohibit the use of a taser unless that officer has a backup who can exercise dealy force. Some agencies require the use of OC or a Taser before they attempt to go hands on to cut down on officer / subject injuries.

As for the comment about being out of shape and not being able to handle one man alone, that again is a blanket generalization that is not true of all law enforcement. What you see on tv is not how the real world works. A LOT of factors are considered when going into a situation, and to assume otherwise is ust naieve to be honest.

As far as the MMA comment goes, you are wrong. What you and others fail to realize is some departments are prohibited by state law or policies from using a means of detention (like MMA) when its not an authorized or approved system. MMA is designed to leave one person standing using essentially offensive brute force IE high damage to gain submission.

Most Law Enforcement trainging is geard towards quick reolution using the least amount of force neccissary, and a lot of our techniques are going to be somewhat defensive in nature (targeting of pressure points / muscle groups etc). Our stuff is designed to "change the persons channel" (distract them) with one action followed up with the detention / subduing.

Also, with all the issues with cameras lately some agencies want more than one or 2 officers present on a scene to record (some agencies do what London Metro does - Officer records with a cam) / witness whats going on. Other agencies have shifted to a model where if a line officer is going to end up pissing someone off, they have to call a supervisor (rank of Cpl or higher) to actually piss the person off. The supervisor has more time in service, knows policies / procedures / state law in depth, etc.

Hope these clear up some of your questions / comments. Any others just ask. And keep in mind this stuff is based on my experiences. There are other officers on this site who have a completely different set than I do, so their answers will vary.

Thanks

reply to post by Xcathdra


thank you for your reply, man. Insightful.

Originally posted by ReadyPower
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

thank you for your reply, man. Insightful.

You are more than welcome. Its going to take conversations like these for law enforcement to start to regain the publics trust. Both sides have a tendancy to be paranoid of each other and because of that communications break down. Its certainly a habbit both sides need to break.

Never be afraid to ask questions if you have them. Just make sure they are time and place appropriate. Im not sure where you live but if your in the states check with your local police agency and see if they allow ride alongs. I encourage people to take advantage of those ( You get to ride with an officer for part of / all of their shift). Depending on agency, policy and call type, its a good way to get a basic idea of some of the stuff that comes rolling through and the complexities of dealing with those encounters.

All I ask is dont do the 100 meter rush to judgment and try not to make the blanket statements. We never make the news when something goes right.

reply to post by ReadyPower



Well, I do have a story. Rather funny considering the cops. When I was in highschool, and one Friday night a bunch of us were at the local hangout. Police would cruise by making sure everything was alright, usually nothing really happened. This one kid, 17, I think he was at the time was usually in sort of trouble. This one cop that always seemed to keep an eye on him, stopped and walked over to this kid. At this moment the kid was doing nothing wrong except standing there talking to several of his friends.

We saw the cop approaching and the cop had his hand on his gun but still in the holster, and was very aggressive in his approach to the kid. The kid noticed this and put himself in a defensive position and was basically telling the kid that he had to leave, but every one else could stay. The kid refused, after all it was not fair that the rest of us could stay but not him. A few of us started shouting back at the officer that he was not being fair and what not, and the cop just told everyone to mind their own business. On and on, the kid refused to leave. The officer grabbed the kid, and that was the cops first mistake. Within a blink of an eye, when that officer put his hand on the kid, the next thing we all saw, was an officer laying on his ass.

Next, as the officer was gathering himself up, two more officers arrived. The kid remained on scene and simply returned to talking to his friends as if nothing occurred. So all three officers approach this kid which was still not really being a threat and not one of the officers said a word to the kid, but just reached out and grabbed his arm. Obviously, this officer did not take the advice of the other officer. Within 30 seconds, this kid had all 3 officers on their ass.

By then, we could hear the sirens coming, and it sounded like the whole force on the way. He was eventually taken into custody when he realized that he was certainly outnumbered.

I am not going to form an opinion on this but thought I would tell the story.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by ReadyPower

 

Law requires Law Enforcement use the least amount of force neccissary and must deescalate the situation as quickly as possible.

It is safer to have 10 officers show up and only need 2 than have 2 officers present and need 8 more. As far as deploying a Taser goes most departments place the use of a Taser at the same level as pepper spray, which is low on the subject resistance control continuum.

No wonder cops have to fabricate charges to boost crime rates for funding.
20 man hours of work to arrest a drunk who'll pay a max $200 fine? wastefull pu**ies.

A tasers primary goal, after communication fails, is to take a potentionally escalatable offense, and to end it early. A deployed taser will incapacitate an individual for a 5 second cycle. It can be stopped there, ended prior to the 5seconds but hitting the button, an officer can hold the trigger down to go beyond the 5 seconds. When a taser is deployed and active, so long as an officer does not touch the wires or places his hand inbetween where the probes hit, they will not be affected, and can take the person into custody without resistence.

That's very vague.. "any escalatable offense" is a blanket statment that can cover anything deemed POSSIBLY ESCALATABLE by the officer on the scene.
Zero oversight, written with allowance for zero oversight.

Taser are not pepper spray. They are ballistic projectile weapons ( fire arms under the description listed in federal law). The electrical charge is secondary.
Only an idiot would deem a Taser a safe as pepperspray.

The barbed "probes" are like straight fish hooks. Needle sharp darts with barbs that are " professionally removed" by an officer who grabs the barb and rips it from your flesh.

If 10 officers are present and the individual wants to fight, that should be a red flag that they either have a death wish (suicide by cop) or they are possibly on drugs. The ability of an officer to exercise force is based on totality of circumstances (there is no one set path to go from bottom to deadly force encounter, its situation specific).

Prison guards are then obviously better trained and better cops than cops, because they never seem to need 10 cops for one sloppy drunk guy.
Says alot about cops doesn't it?

If a 6'4 200 pound muscle guy confronts an officer, it will depend on the level of agressiveness of that person, as well as the level of training / other criteria for the officer. If a drunk guy that is 5'6 130 pounds confronts police and during the encounter makes the comment he is a master in martial arts, its irrelevant if its actually true. Once the guy makes the statement, he will be treated as if he is telling the truth, which creates a quick rise in the use of force.

Okay I have experience here with the federal law enforcement training center where I did some work as an "instructor" of sorts ( I was never a LEO..lets be clear).
Officers recieve training, and are encouraged to continue training. some departments even give bonuses for continued training. They have the tools to handle any hand to hand confrontation with very minimal risk to the arresting officer.
Some of these techniques have been utilized by LEO for over 100 years.
If cops are too lazy to use the tools they are given they should be fired.
There is RARELY a situation where 10 officers need respond to a single dunk at a bar.

As far as speed traps go, many people will view it as a money maker but that is not always the case. Even if an officer doesnt write any citations, its not a loss. The presence of the patrol vehicle alone could have been enough to slow people down, there by reducing the number of accidents. If warnings are issued its a simple reminder that we want people to get home safe, and to be a bit more conscious when driving. It can also help take drunks off the road, etc etc etc.

In Florida, they park not -in-use patrol cars with "fake cops" inside. It does work.
However, there are more relevant crimes being committed, and more relevant areas of prevention a patrol car could be in rather than parked behind a dumpster with a GEICO bought radar gun helping insurance companies out . Go park in a high crime area for once.
Yup.. insurance companies lobby to ban radar detectors, and PAID to develop Radar guns as well as LIDAR gun technology.

So WHO do you cops work for? Think about it.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by ReadyPower
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

thank you for your reply, man. Insightful.

You are more than welcome. Its going to take conversations like these for law enforcement to start to regain the publics trust. Both sides have a tendancy to be paranoid of each other and because of that communications break down. Its certainly a habbit both sides need to break.

Never be afraid to ask questions if you have them. Just make sure they are time and place appropriate. Im not sure where you live but if your in the states check with your local police agency and see if they allow ride alongs. I encourage people to take advantage of those ( You get to ride with an officer for part of / all of their shift). Depending on agency, policy and call type, its a good way to get a basic idea of some of the stuff that comes rolling through and the complexities of dealing with those encounters.

All I ask is dont do the 100 meter rush to judgment and try not to make the blanket statements. We never make the news when something goes right.

I'm placing you under citizens arrest, sir.

Originally posted by BadNinja68
No wonder cops have to fabricate charges ..snip

Nothing like stereotypical ignorance for the win. I guess you have to go with what works.

Originally posted by BadNinja68
That's very vague.. "any escalatable offense" ...snip.

Because an escalatable offense is unique. However you dont seem to understand that there is oversight through both levels of government (local / state and federal). A person walking down the street with a holstered gun on their hip is different than a person walking down the street holding the gun in their hand is different than a person walking down the street pointing a gun at people.

A person doing 80mph in a 45mph zone to get to their destination is different than a perosn doing 80mph in a 45mph zone in order to get to the hospital because a loved one is dieing, is different than a person doing 80mph in a 45 mph zone trying to get themselves to the hospital because of a serious injury.

If the ability to be able to interpret actions and intent is disgarded, then you will ahve what you dont want - a true police state. A few terms to be familiar with - letter of the law, spirit of the law, Totality of circumstances, Use of force criteria, justification, articulable actions, Federal government and State / local government, Law enforcement is not black and white, and cannot be black and white.

Originally posted by BadNinja68
Taser are not pepper ..snip

And only an idiot would use federal law in this manner. Since law enforcement at the state and local levels arent covered under federal law / guidelines, aside from 42 usc 1983. My departments policy on taser use is not federal.

Originally posted by BadNinja68
The barbed "probes" ...snip.

Yup... and when the unit hits and cycle, the probe entrance is cauterized.

Originally posted by BadNinja68
Prison guards are then obviously better trained and better cops ...

Since cops and corrections officers dont do the same job, it says a lot about your level of knowledge on this topic. You should do some research on jail SRT teams and the manner they remove noncompliant prisoners from thier cells.

To assist you in your quest for knowledge, you should also learn that intoxication dulls the sense, including pain compliance, audio / visual exclusion. Going one on one with a drunk can result in severe injuries to the officer or the drunk. 10 officers present could be a visual deterrent to the drunk, in addition to being able to end the encounter quicker and safer than 1 officer could. You also leave out the drunks background - is he on anything else? former military? former police? suicidal?

Fact being we dont even know if the drunk is drunk, and neither do you. Its better to have 10 present and need only 2, than have 2 present and need 10.

Originally posted by BadNinja68
Okay I have experience here with the federal law enforcement ....

And yet you call them pu**ies for using the tools they have. You call them idiots for using a taser and you question their ability and compare them to corrections. As ive stated before, there are major differences between local and federal law enforcement. Secondly you need to understand that the first things officers do, is make contact with the individual. Its up to the individual on whether they comply or not, not law enforcement. Im not sure what type of instructor you are, but if its in this area, respectuflly you need to go back and learn about it.

a drunk in a bar...lol Law Enforcement will generally never respond to a drunk person at a bar by themselves. Drunk people like thier liquid courage, and chances are if it starts out with one drunk person, it wont remain at just one person. As I said before, totality of cirumstances. If one cop goes into that bar, and things go down hill, his ability to use deadly forced is greater than if 10 were present.

As far as speed traps go, ...snip.

I wasnt aware we had a bureau of future crimes. We cant act if no crime was committed. We do patrol high crime areas and high crime label doesnt mean is because of lack of law enforcement. Law Enforcement investigates crimes, we dont prosecute them. Your issue is with the PA in this case, not the police.

Originally posted by BadNinja68
So WHO do you cops ....snip.

Well, if you took the time to read my response you would see the answer to this question.

Law enforcement works for and answers to the people. If people continue to be lazy and apathetic about theit government and how it works, the blame is on them. They are not prevented from voicing their concerns at city council meetings, to their reps, or to the police department.

The lack of communication that is present results in incorrect assumptions. Your responses are an examample of that.

Originally posted by v1rtu0s0
I'm placing you under citizens arrest, sir.

I will inject some more humor -

Terrorist Interview - NSFW - Language and stereotyping


Police Interview with criminal - NSFW - may cause loud laughter, tiping your boss off that you arent doing work.

Never once in my life have I been happy to see a cop and I've never needed one, it's up to me to be able to defend myslef and my property. I never got the idea of expecting a stranger to come save the day; even if it's his job. I'm just not that trusting and all cops done from own personal experience is break the trust. And until we're able to get a martial arts infused in schools so bullies can no longer be and so everyone has the strength to stnd for whts right, cops will be nothing but bullies...

nice avatar op

reply to post by agentofchaos


Not all cops have broken the publics trust. As long as we continue stereotyping each other to longer the paranoia / irritation / lack of trust will last.

As far as my Avatar it was made by Agarta.

Originally posted by Xcathdra


Law enforcement works for and answers to the people. If people continue to be lazy and apathetic about theit government and how it works, the blame is on them. They are not prevented from voicing their concerns at city council meetings, to their reps, or to the police department.

the first part of that statement Is simply false, It may be their official statement that they "work for the people" but we all know that's not true, they work for the state and for themselves, their main priority know Is making money for the state and for themselves. the second part of that statement Is partly false, yes people are allowed to voice their concern to an extent but they are rarely listened too and many times jailed for trying, especially when there concern Is the police.

"If people continue to be lazy and apathetic about theit government and how it works, the blame is on them"

Is this what goes through your mind when your clubbing some guy with a knee in his back? since your obviously a Jack booted thug...I mean a cop.